Conflict relations: ENTp Tom Green vs ISFj

[Gilly]

Actually on second thought, I think there is a great comparison to be had between Clay and Sylvester Stallone. So maybe Se-SEE is the better bet.

[JuJu]

For a Se-ESTp vs. Se-ESFp comparison:

Mike Tyson, Se-ESTp


Johnny Knoxville, Se-ESTp:


vs.

Sylvester Stallone


David Lee Roth (interview starts at 1:00, being interviewed by his dual, who's lovin' it)

[Blaze]

But every type can think like that come on, its not just FI leading type, I would have done the same as well. If anything I would put that as Beta's Se but so than Gamma's Se.

ethically oriented types are likely to pick up on this, not logicals. isn't this one of the main themes of socionics? that different types with different leading functions manage different kinds of information better than other kinds of information?

I think you're over anlaysing a simple situation to claim that he is a Ne polr.

maybe so. but that green pin thing is over the top Ne. totally random. it goes over with ADC like a lead balloon. i'm surprised you can't see that.

I feel like you are using information element up and matching it with reality here...
I think Information element is a good way to indicate a type but not when you put every situation and categorized it by IE. A simply "you are so nice", is what Fi, Fe, even Si? you can't type things like that by IE.

i'm using a whole chain of statements, an entire 5 minute interaction, not one statement or sentence. how do you think one should interpret interactions socionically? for myself, i think it's a pretty dynamic theory, given that a major component of it is relationships.

Not at all would a conflicting relationship conflict like that.

did you mean to say not all conflictor relations look like that? if so, i agree. this one seems to me to be ESI-ILE specifically.

[Blaze]

JuJu: nice videos. i think it's fair to say that ADC is not an SLE. they're much calmer than he.

My question--based on my point of disagreement--is: Why do you attribute Andrew Dice Clay's behavior to Fi leading..?

because of how he takes tom green touching him. he totally overreacts and misinterprets tom green's intentions, which are to smooth things over. it is hard to type an introverted function based on just a video clip, so i guess i just try to deduce why ADC would misinterpret. the only answer is that he doesn't like tom green and he doesn't want him touching him. how can he possibly know in such a short time span that he doesn't like tom green? i offer he must know because he's Fi leading...my Fi polr mind imagines that Fi leading people pick up on attraction-repulsion kind of instantaneously, just like Ne leading picks up on possibilities instantaneously. make sense?

regarding SEE, not sure about that. i mean, it makes theoretical sense, because he does seem to be using more Se than Fi. on the other hand, to me, ADC seems more rigid, more rational than SEE's who are really loose, erratic, and and chaotic. i just don't sense that from ADC. he seems more like an immovable rock or something.

there's a guy i work with who i thought was SEE for awhile since he was constantly talking and interacting with people, and mostly what came off him was Se. we got to talking one day and MBTI came up...he told me his type of ISFJ. suddenly it all made sense. the fact that we couldnt' get along, couldnt' communicate, would constantly take each other the wrong way. i experience him exactly the same way as ADC (although i'm nowhere near as gimpy as tom green, lol) at any rate, it made me think about how gender can influence type expression a lot more. also how introverts get trained to extravert and how that makes it hard to type them.

funny we just hired a new staff, an IEE. it's quite hilarious how she supervises him.

[silverchris9]

...maybe SEE. ISFj would be my guess as well, though. They are working things for comedy, but they don't get each other. You can tell that they don't get each other, because every time Tom Green goes for the sort of humor he would default to, he gets rejected, and so he has to act in a way that's outside of his comfort zone. Even if they are both acting for comedy's sake, they're doing so in incompatible ways. Comedians have to "read" or "flow" with each other, and they are totally out of sync in that regard. Tom Green just looks confused the whole interview, which is not what I would expect from SLE-ILE interactions. It seems to me that that guy is projecting something like Se very heavily, but it doesn't feel the same as SLE Se to my mind.

I don't get an SLE vibe from him. It could be that he is a "kind" of SLE that I don't have experience with/understanding of. But yeah, I don't get SLE from him.

"I don't care if you hit me... Don't fuckin' lie to me."

How does this convey Se? (Genuine curiosity here). I felt like the way he kept emphasizing "out of line" and such seemed Fi, but I could be off there. I'd like your opinion on that, Juju.

Also, I love Charlie Rose! I can totally buy ILI for him. I've watched all of his interviews with Harold Bloom, and they seem like the ILI-IEI interactions between me and my ILI friends. The dumb grin Charlie Rose has on his face in the David Lee Roth interview is hilarious.

[crazedrat]

he's a static type. he's rational he's exactly like allie. he's ISFj. .

[717495]

He's not like specifically like allie. It's hard to make a comparison to a mixed bag, but I agree, he's kind of like allie in that he seems to hold a Beta methodology, and especially an irrational one.

I don't really consider SEE, because SEEs are usually much more kind and careful, while wearing their hearts on their sleeves. Gammas aren't really aggressive, hostile, or really "jerkish" at all, or especially try to impose their feelings on someone like that. I can see a similarity in methodology to Mike Tyson, but obviously this guy comes across much more wimpy, it's kind of sad I guess, but whatever.

As far as Green being "out of line" and "I'm the one doing the fucking." This guy is obviously a goof, trying to mess with him, and thinks he is "badass." Which in this sense is a Beta manifestation of Fe and Se valuing, which does not appear like that in Gamma. He's not serious at all, in the socionics Fi/Te sense. Seriously though, you might want to think about it for a while.

[krieger]

I second the ESFp suggestion.