myers-briggs vs. socionics? HELP!!!!
i'm new to this site. i happened to stumble upon it while i was looking for something online(cant recall what it was) but basically i keep reading about how the myers-briggs and socionics profile might not be the same. as in I'm an ENTP according to the myers-briggs. i took the socionics test and it said i was either ENTp or ENTj. i just need help understanding this. If anyone could help. that'd be great.
You're an ENTJ.
why do you say that? and u mean entj on socionics? b/c on mb ive always been entp. it threw me off to be told i could possibly be entj.
Well learn socionics then. It's not MBTI.
thats what im trying to do. but thanks anyway.
Good. Keep trying. This forum is full of insightful crap, crappy insight, and some really good articles.
Read some of the type descriptions here: Category:Type descriptions - Wikisocion
ENTp = ILE = intuitive logical extrovert:
http://wikisocion.org/en/index.php?title=ILE
ENTj = LIE = logical intuitive extrovert:
http://wikisocion.org/en/index.php?title=LIE
awesome. ill be sure to check it out. i'd never even heard of socionics until tonight and im trying to give myself a crash course in a pd of about two hours. not working as well i thought it would.
You sound like someone who will just accept the first "public" article that comes their way. You sound arrogant too. My advice would be to just give up trying to learn something like this. It's of no interest to you in the long run.
Cool. There are a lot of different thoughts and ideas on the forums, some of them from people who know and some who don't know what they're talking about, it's kinda up to you to decide that which you think makes sense.Originally Posted by dm1323
Socionics in the West is also a good site to learn the theory.
*cough* there seems to be a game of good cop, bad cop going on in this thread...
where exactly does he sound arrogant??
anyway, you can try searching for Joy's(i think) posts on the duality descriptions to see which relationship you prefer, they're not bad.
INTp
sx/sp
It's just a hunch. People like this come to the forums every now and then asking for a simple explanation on a theory, and then forget all about it in a week or so. Many of these people are arrogant and want to learn everything, because they think they can understand things very quickly, and they're just BSing themselves.
Heaven forbid that people think us arrogant!
We're arrogant because we're at home
People like that ^ don't know where they stand.
I think it's kinda refreshing in a way if some people learn something about socionics but don't become "hard core" forum posters for instance, it's possible that someone like that can spread socionics to other people, so it's a sort of viral marketing type thing.
Anyway, maybe we take it all a bit too seriously, heh
You're right. Some of us do, and all of us do at some point or another. But I doubt this simpleton is going to market Socionics like Sergei Ganin does. It's really not a hard theory to learn, if you're focused. Much of the time people don't have the focus to remain objective however. People like dm1323 probably won't want to learn much about this theory because it assumes too much to begin with, and they can't handle that in the long run.Anyway, maybe we take it all a bit too seriously, heh
I'd rather one be sanely perceptive than dismissive of thought, or how should I say, lack imagination and conceptualization? People like this make me nervous to be around, and I feel sorry for them because they can't get deep. They don't mind living plastic lives and spreading BS wherever as they please, but I mind a great deal when these kinds of situations come up. I try to put a lot of care into what I think, and I think applying Socionics is more beneficial than not applying it. Some people are less conceptual about things and prefer a sort of "yes or no" model to their lives. It can be horrid to witness (process and end result). They less often actually see the big picture of every day phenomenon, because they're too urgent to find simplicity within the details. This always seems to be where BS is born. That goes for anyone. It's not about following a model, placing people into boxes every time you talk to them. It is about being open to learn something intricate as it comes along, which people don't invest time into doing. You're not experienced like you think you are. You have not been there, and done that. I hear people say it all the time, and it is BS.
This somehow reminds me of topgun when iceman tells maverick he is dangerous and arrogant.... except its with socionics and polikujm is calling the new guy "arrogant" about his understanding of personality typologies. The fact is everyone on this forum seems arrogant with a few exceptions, some are just attention whores, your garden variety online forum bunch.... except the theme is socionics! Just remember to praise the socionics gods and the priests and priestesses of this forum will not have to show their zeal in the form of dispensing a reply onto your post. The last thing you want to do is anger the socionics gods and its prophet augusta.
Man what am I even talking about?
Gul is cool, he is just really zany/fun and hardly serious....
Brilliand imo is one of the most intelligent people I've met on this forum
BulletsandDove the most interesting character (he unloads huge rants about personal issues)
Oh and check out the forum member pictures, there are alot of attractive people
I forgot to mention Bionicgoat, he always pops in to say one or two things.
Avoid Expat... He'll pimp slap you with logic if you talk smack on Model A.
If I forgot to mention anyone, its not because they aren't important!
Gilly looks like Jesus in RL.
It's one of the more interesting theoretical applications I've come across, and it certainly is better than MBTI, in all sense of the word better.
Then again, I'm just into psychology.
Lol I don't think socionics is bad either... I mean if I had a point in what I said earlier it would have been that some people take it too seriously. They don't bother to "think critically" about socionics, remembering that its an application of the science of psychology... instead they embrace it as some sort of divine revelation of truth and knowledge given by the gods and they "believe in" socionics and will fiercely defend it. That's what annoys me. Of course try telling someone this and they will just end up saying, "you want to think critically because your a thinking type ... I have the right to believe in socionics because I am not a thinking type"... which just amplifies the annoyance....
Moral of the story -- I think socionics is a good theory, but just take it with a spoonful of skepticism, its psychology, not a religion.
you just haven't met your dual.
That's fine, but once you start dating, socionics will become a huge part of your life.
Good post, in a theme. I feel the same way when using Socionics.
allright im going to start off by saying that i am female. I'm not being arrogant which i can be at times. i won't deny that. but if i'm arrogant for thinking that i can learn all of this in one day then yes i agree. it's definitely more in depth than i originally thought. but you're arrogant because you think that you're better than me simply because you've been doing this for, how many years? exactly. All that says is that you have more knowledge of the subject. and if i were you i would use that knowledge to help people understand it. instead of immediately tagging them as arrogant, BSers, and uninterested. that being said, i really do appreciate the people that are sending me links to read up on. thanks.
maybe he did it so that you'd take it more seriously to prove him wrong. It's how some people are better converted.
i figured as much. im just visiting different sites and comparing and contrasting what they are saying. trying to get a feel for it.
that may be true. if it is i suppose it worked. but i get a feeling that wasnt the case at all.
Basically ENTp and ENTj are quasi-identical. They have the mental and vital rings mirrored.
Socionic Model of the Psyche
Read about the "Romance Styles"...
Romance styles - Wikisocion
Maybe this will shed more light on the issue. I think that the difference between an Infantile (ENTp) and a Victim (ENTj) might hint to what your type might be.
For example, I might behave in an infantile manner but I would not choose that as a long time "career"
"What is love?"
"The total absence of fear," said the Master.
"What is it we fear?"
"Love," said the Master.
I chose Love
I wish you good luck. I gave you my advice. You are in search of a guide, though if you guide yourself, you will find plenty of gems and keep no rocks.
Or you could be like me and mine for no gems or rocks, but rather for ore... consuming it with a fiery concentration and putting my will to it like a hammer within the forge of my mind, shaping the once useless facts into knowledge, forming an iron structure of understanding.... YOUR GEMS CANT DO THAT SIRRRRRR, they just look perty.
Socionics and MBTI are based off of Jung's theory of psychological types. The systems attempt to HELP a person determine their psychological type.
But psychological type and psychological functions are THEORY, NOT FACT. The tests are meant as an AID in determining your PREFERENCES. Many people take these tests and get differing results because everyone is unique.
You likely test as ENTX because you are not quite as sure of your preference of P or J(though there is not statistic confirmation that confirms that J preference is completely exclusive of P and vice versa). Often J or P are measured as separate from N-S and T-F, in tests, though they are supposed to be the same thing. Since they measure J and P separate from N-S and T-F they create a fourth dichotomy and therefore muddle the whole theory.
Just another reason not to buy into type theory.
Last edited by Waddlesworth; 10-25-2009 at 11:33 PM.
It's never the answer. It's always the question. The question is what keeps you going. Always question things!
I like user defined socionics, the articles written by professionals are people who don't understand people subjectively well enough, so you get things like IEIs as 'being too daydreamy' and that's actually true, I do that TONS! But also it's not as nuanced and understood as it can be when people with non-professional interests delve deep into your psyche. It also doesn't feel as violating for me, because none of you have an authority relationship over me. I also don't have to pay you to talk about my feelings and problems, all therapy can be done for free on the internet. ;p
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