A Metaphor for Fe

[Krig the Viking]

A while before joining this forum, I discovered Expat's metaphorical descriptions of the information elements, as experienced by their base types. I found them very helpful in getting a 'sense' of the elements (thanks, Expat! ).

However, as time went on and I thought about it some more, the Fe metaphor of "fog" started to feel less and less satisfying. It felt more like a Fi-valuer's description of Fe, for some inexplicable reason ( ). Anyway, long story short, I had an epiphany at work today, and have an idea for a better description of Fe.

Let us take Expat's excellent description of Fi as a starting point. Laser beams representing relationships connect everybody; when the relationship is good, the laser beam is blue, when it's bad, it's red.

Expat went on to describe Fe as a sort of coloured fog filling the spaces between people, emitted by the people themselves who 'smoke'. The fog reveals the lasers and helps them to be seen. I don't think this is quite accurate. Fe is described as "internal dynamics of objects", and this fog seems more like a description of some kind of dynamic field.

Here is how I would describe Fe:

While everyone is walking around with these laser beams connecting them, they also have another light source: a sort of internal 'glow', which is Fe. Like the laser beams, this glow can be different colours: blue for positive emotions, red for negative emotions, etc. Unlike the laser beams, however, this light is constantly shifting and changing: now I'm blue and happy, now I'm red and angry, etc.

For base Fe types, this light is very bright. You often hear ESEs, for example, described as "lighting up the room" when they enter (at least by those who value Fe ). Base Fe types are very good at revealing and controlling this light, hiding their unpleasant red light when necessary and revealing their fun blue light when appropriate. They're also very good at seeing the light emitted by others. When an Fe type enters a room, they see the combined glow emitted by everyone there; this is where the sense of Fe being the "mood of the room" comes from.

Fe valuing types love being around people emitting 'blue' light. The colour of the laser beams is not seen as being as important as the colour of a person's Fe glow. Being connected by blue laser beams with people simply means that those people will be more likely to emit blue light when they're around, which is all Fe valuers are really after anyway. When red light appears, they feel the cause of it should be rooted out with Ti, and dealt with. Then the fun blue light can return.

Types weak in Fe have a harder time seeing and displaying this light. They can't always tell the difference between genuine light and fake light. Fe-PoLR types find strong Fe light unpleasant, and avoid it ("It burns us!"). They also mask any light they might have inside, closing it off from the world. This confuses Fe base types, who assume that they must simply be hiding a bunch of angry red light.

Fi valuers see the Fe glow simply as one way to determine the status of the laser beam between them: if one person consistantly reacts to another person with genuine blue light, then the laser beam between them must be blue, and vice versa. However, the Fe light is fickle and ever-changing, so they don't find it to be very reliable.

So that was my idea. What are everyone's thoughts on it, especially base Fe types?

[Brilliand]

I think this is good, and an improvement on Expat's description. I've course, I'm one of those who can mistake yellow construction paper for the sun.

Let's see... extending this to and a la Ti... is boxes. The boxes contain stuff; they're organized and stacked on top of each other, and when enough stuff is put in boxes, empty spaces start to stand out where we don't have any boxes yet. creatives will deal will pack the empty spaces with properly labeled empty boxes, in anticipation of finding the thing that goes there. Sometimes we'll talk as though we've already found it, because we know that it exists - the box is there, isn't it?

*Not talking about myself from here down, or anyone I've observed very closely - might be wrong*

creatives will look at the empty spaces and say "Those spaces are empty"; they'll mark the floor maybe, and certainly not put anything there that doesn't belong there, but they won't mark any boxes until they've found the thing to put in the box.

On the other hand, is a busy warehouse; things are constantly going in and out, and organization is based on how the things will be used. is a warehouse for long-term storage and cataloging; space efficiency is important here. is a warehouse for constant use, with no dusty corners. Retrieval efficiency, not space efficiency, is the important thing.

[Aiss]

I think this is good, and an improvement on Expat's description. I've course, I'm one of those who can mistake yellow construction paper for the sun.

Let's see... extending this to and a la Ti... is boxes. The boxes contain stuff; they're organized and stacked on top of each other, and when enough stuff is put in boxes, empty spaces start to stand out where we don't have any boxes yet. creatives will deal will pack the empty spaces with properly labeled empty boxes, in anticipation of finding the thing that goes there. Sometimes we'll talk as though we've already found it, because we know that it exists - the box is there, isn't it?

*Not talking about myself from here down, or anyone I've observed very closely - might be wrong*

creatives will look at the empty spaces and say "Those spaces are empty"; they'll mark the floor maybe, and certainly not put anything there that doesn't belong there, but they won't mark any boxes until they've found the thing to put in the box.

On the other hand, is a busy warehouse; things are constantly going in and out, and organization is based on how the things will be used. is a warehouse for long-term storage and cataloging; space efficiency is important here. is a warehouse for constant use, with no dusty corners. Retrieval efficiency, not space efficiency, is the important thing.

IDK about your idea of Ne+Ti and Se+Ti, but I like the last paragraph. And yes I realize this thread is ancient, but it still seems this forum haven't progressed much if at all since then.

[Cat King Cole]

If you like integral types, I think it's because we've basically passed into the phase of refining the theory and connecting it up to other things (like labcoat's work). There's not really a lot of or activity.

[717495]

This is good. Though I must say, when Fe and Fi is defined in these abstract terms, I tend to relate to both of them.

The most relatable Fe descriptions tend to be when they are colored in terms of IEIs.

[Nico1e]

You already know all this but I'm in 'lecture mode' today, sorry, just tune it out. This is one of those days when I am writing too much and telling everyone things they already know.

Every ethical type is able to do both Fe and Fi. They're able to see it, understand it, and do it themselves, as necessary.

Same for all of them: N, S, F, and T. If you are strong in extraverted thinking, you're also strong in introverted thinking. If you're strong in extraverted feeling, you're strong in introverted feeling too. And same for sensing and intuition.

So yeah, you'll be able to relate to both Fe and Fi. That's why it is so difficult to type anyone. People can relate to, and recognize, and use, the things that are down at the bottom of Model A, in the 'id block,' the bottom row of squares. People are actually good at doing four functions, not just the top two functions in the ego block.

It would be easier to type people if they just absolutely couldn't use the opposite elements at all, like if somebody were really good at Fe but they absolutely couldn't use Fi at all.

And yeah, I'm thinking about this a lot because of actually trying to type people now. It is very hard to choose a type for someone because they're actually good at four different functions, not just two. So for instance I see someone seeming to use Ne at one moment, and seeming to use Ni at another moment, and I don't know which one they prefer most.

I wish that I could explain how I type people, but it really does seem to involve my Ti demonstrative function, because it's going on subconsciously and it's hard to verbalize. I know it but I don't put it into words. So everything in the id block at the bottom row will be like that - you know it internally but you don't put it into words.

[Logos]

A while before joining this forum, I discovered Expat's metaphorical descriptions of the information elements, as experienced by their base types. I found them very helpful in getting a 'sense' of the elements (thanks, Expat! ).

However, as time went on and I thought about it some more, the Fe metaphor of "fog" started to feel less and less satisfying. It felt more like a Fi-valuer's description of Fe, for some inexplicable reason ( ). Anyway, long story short, I had an epiphany at work today, and have an idea for a better description of Fe.

Let's face it. Fog is not as cool as laser beams. But the description sounds good. I may expand upon it later.

[Warlord]

You often hear ESEs, for example, described as "lighting up the room" when they enter (at least by those who value Fe ).

You just can't entrust them with matches.

Fe PoLRs are the gremlins?

A black hole emitting a gamma-ray burst


I had a neighbor who suspected I was a vampire for real. He asked me questions like:"you must not like garlic?" etc., and I mean out nowhere, I have never said anything at all about garlic.

EDIT: I just noticed that the picture was made by a guy called Garlick, hidden connections everywhere!

[Currere]

A while before joining this forum, I discovered Expat's metaphorical descriptions of the information elements, as experienced by their base types. I found them very helpful in getting a 'sense' of the elements (thanks, Expat! ).

However, as time went on and I thought about it some more, the Fe metaphor of "fog" started to feel less and less satisfying. It felt more like a Fi-valuer's description of Fe, for some inexplicable reason ( ). Anyway, long story short, I had an epiphany at work today, and have an idea for a better description of Fe.

Let us take Expat's excellent description of Fi as a starting point. Laser beams representing relationships connect everybody; when the relationship is good, the laser beam is blue, when it's bad, it's red.

Expat went on to describe Fe as a sort of coloured fog filling the spaces between people, emitted by the people themselves who 'smoke'. The fog reveals the lasers and helps them to be seen. I don't think this is quite accurate. Fe is described as "internal dynamics of objects", and this fog seems more like a description of some kind of dynamic field.

Here is how I would describe Fe:

While everyone is walking around with these laser beams connecting them, they also have another light source: a sort of internal 'glow', which is Fe. Like the laser beams, this glow can be different colours: blue for positive emotions, red for negative emotions, etc. Unlike the laser beams, however, this light is constantly shifting and changing: now I'm blue and happy, now I'm red and angry, etc.

For base Fe types, this light is very bright. You often hear ESEs, for example, described as "lighting up the room" when they enter (at least by those who value Fe ). Base Fe types are very good at revealing and controlling this light, hiding their unpleasant red light when necessary and revealing their fun blue light when appropriate. They're also very good at seeing the light emitted by others. When an Fe type enters a room, they see the combined glow emitted by everyone there; this is where the sense of Fe being the "mood of the room" comes from.

Fe valuing types love being around people emitting 'blue' light. The colour of the laser beams is not seen as being as important as the colour of a person's Fe glow. Being connected by blue laser beams with people simply means that those people will be more likely to emit blue light when they're around, which is all Fe valuers are really after anyway. When red light appears, they feel the cause of it should be rooted out with Ti, and dealt with. Then the fun blue light can return.

Types weak in Fe have a harder time seeing and displaying this light. They can't always tell the difference between genuine light and fake light. Fe-PoLR types find strong Fe light unpleasant, and avoid it ("It burns us!"). They also mask any light they might have inside, closing it off from the world. This confuses Fe base types, who assume that they must simply be hiding a bunch of angry red light.

Fi valuers see the Fe glow simply as one way to determine the status of the laser beam between them: if one person consistantly reacts to another person with genuine blue light, then the laser beam between them must be blue, and vice versa. However, the Fe light is fickle and ever-changing, so they don't find it to be very reliable.

So that was my idea. What are everyone's thoughts on it, especially base Fe types?

So basically Fe-leading types have "emotional infrared".

[Nico1e]

bumping an ancient thread from the distant past.

[Gilly]

A while before joining this forum, I discovered Expat's metaphorical descriptions of the information elements, as experienced by their base types. I found them very helpful in getting a 'sense' of the elements (thanks, Expat! ).

However, as time went on and I thought about it some more, the Fe metaphor of "fog" started to feel less and less satisfying. It felt more like a Fi-valuer's description of Fe, for some inexplicable reason ( ). Anyway, long story short, I had an epiphany at work today, and have an idea for a better description of Fe.

Let us take Expat's excellent description of Fi as a starting point. Laser beams representing relationships connect everybody; when the relationship is good, the laser beam is blue, when it's bad, it's red.

Expat went on to describe Fe as a sort of coloured fog filling the spaces between people, emitted by the people themselves who 'smoke'. The fog reveals the lasers and helps them to be seen. I don't think this is quite accurate. Fe is described as "internal dynamics of objects", and this fog seems more like a description of some kind of dynamic field.

Here is how I would describe Fe:

While everyone is walking around with these laser beams connecting them, they also have another light source: a sort of internal 'glow', which is Fe. Like the laser beams, this glow can be different colours: blue for positive emotions, red for negative emotions, etc. Unlike the laser beams, however, this light is constantly shifting and changing: now I'm blue and happy, now I'm red and angry, etc.

For base Fe types, this light is very bright. You often hear ESEs, for example, described as "lighting up the room" when they enter (at least by those who value Fe ). Base Fe types are very good at revealing and controlling this light, hiding their unpleasant red light when necessary and revealing their fun blue light when appropriate. They're also very good at seeing the light emitted by others. When an Fe type enters a room, they see the combined glow emitted by everyone there; this is where the sense of Fe being the "mood of the room" comes from.

Fe valuing types love being around people emitting 'blue' light. The colour of the laser beams is not seen as being as important as the colour of a person's Fe glow. Being connected by blue laser beams with people simply means that those people will be more likely to emit blue light when they're around, which is all Fe valuers are really after anyway. When red light appears, they feel the cause of it should be rooted out with Ti, and dealt with. Then the fun blue light can return.

Types weak in Fe have a harder time seeing and displaying this light. They can't always tell the difference between genuine light and fake light. Fe-PoLR types find strong Fe light unpleasant, and avoid it ("It burns us!"). They also mask any light they might have inside, closing it off from the world. This confuses Fe base types, who assume that they must simply be hiding a bunch of angry red light.

Fi valuers see the Fe glow simply as one way to determine the status of the laser beam between them: if one person consistantly reacts to another person with genuine blue light, then the laser beam between them must be blue, and vice versa. However, the Fe light is fickle and ever-changing, so they don't find it to be very reliable.

So that was my idea. What are everyone's thoughts on it, especially base Fe types?

So basically Fe-leading types have "emotional infrared".

Actually, yeah.