Serious, unanswered question about me
Seriously, can someone please explain to me why there is so much tendency to type me as LSE.
I don't want to know why I am LSE or SLE. I know my type, and I don't need someone else to tell me. I want to know why it is that there are a large number of people that type me as LSE, or even see it as a possibility.
Why LSE? Why not IEE? Or LIE? Or SEI? What is it about LSE that is connected with SLE, which these other types simply don't have? Why are people primarily cut between SLE and LSE?
You could just check the links located in your sig.
Let not your heart be troubled Ezra. Now that you have created this thread, more than enough of your internet friends will soon arrive to reassure you that "you're NOT LSE Ezra, lol". And all will be right in the world again.
Somebody tell Cracka to feed me.
-
It's Binky bitch.
See not the unsmiling lips and icy eyes,
And hear not the silence after.
Look instead as the mime hypnotizes
And listen to the laughter.
Because you're definitely ESTx, and who can figure out that blasted j/p dichotomy anyway?
Thus, LSE is the easiest type to push you into when you're "too nice" to be Beta or some such thing (haven't read the arguments, just guessing as to why people might call you LSE).
LII-Ne
"Come to think of it, there are already a million monkeys on a million typewriters, and the Usenet is NOTHING like Shakespeare!"
- Blair Houghton
Johari
No that's not why Brilliand.
And Ezra the reason is because there is a bloc of people who dont "get" socionics basing things on trivial behavioral traits like "Being forceful" and sowing seeds of misconception.
You have become one of these people unfortunately.
People say you're LSE not based on ignorance or dislike of you, but on how you display the IME's.
The end is nigh
The moron strikes again.Originally Posted by ArchonAlarion
...the human race will disappear. Other races will appear and disappear in turn. The sky will become icy and void, pierced by the feeble light of half-dead stars. Which will also disappear. Everything will disappear. And what human beings do is just as free of sense as the free motion of elementary particles. Good, evil, morality, feelings? Pure 'Victorian fictions'.
INTp
.
Yep. And I think this is more true of some people than others. I think JuJu is the same - it's hard to see from the outside whether he's Beta or Delta. You have to look at which functions are valued, and not just whether you see a function used. Like, would you give up comfort to get something you wanted, or would you let something you wanted go in order to maintain comfort? Would you take a high-paying job somewhere if you'd have to have a small uncomfortable noisy apartment? Or would you rather have a job that doesn't pay well but live somewhere spacious and restful and lovely? (This is a real-life choice my husband and I had to make, and we chose less money/more comfort.)It's the club similarities. Both types have strong Se and Si, Te and Ti. It's the same reason that gamma NTs and alpha NTs get typed as the other, or beta NFs and delta NFs. I also know of SEIs who have considered ESI, and to figure out which they were, we looked at which type most complements them. Things that most annoy me about ILEs, were the things they most appreciated about them!
It ain't what you don't know that gets you into trouble. It's what you know for sure that just ain't so.-Mark Twain
You can't wake a person who is pretending to be asleep.
Because "ESTx" ... And they haven't learned about inter-type/IM elements well enough to know what's beta and what's delta... And their 4 friends say the last letter is "j..." So "j."
Same reason Steve types me ENFp.
i can over-simplify positions too!
You put "action philosopher" and "plato smash" in your avatar so that we would think you have a hard uncompromising attitude about philosophy and say "oh so that's how Se egos address philosophical matters!" The other theory is that it's just your way of expressing your frustration about your sexuality. In either case, such posturing will get you no where.
lol
Ezra, people like deante say you are lse because 1. Deante is lsi and feels that you share some traits 2. Many people envision sles as super active, typically like some kind of jock or sleezy business uber capitalist or meth head punk with a bad attitude 3. You appear very controlled and level headed, which some people who are used to mbti equate with j 4. You seem relatively open minded which some may epuate to ne valuing if they are newish 5. You sometimes appear to be posturing rather "obviously" which some people equate to you "trying to be sle" when in reality its just poor fe+ni.
Yet I'm "too soft" to be an IEI. Interesting double-standard.
this is why, Ezra.
I mean soft in VI. Hey at least my stereotype has some merit, but yeah that was unfortunately vague, sorry.
The end is nigh
Doesn't matter what the observation is based on. The statement I quoted contradicts this and you continue to contradict yourself here. You're against people using things like this to type people, yet you do it then justify it by saying that your doing it has merit. So, if it's not okay for others, why is it okay for you?
except that I never said I was against typing people by behavioral traits. However, I HAVE said that you need to understand what causes those traits, which obviously I believe I do.
I don't feel Im being contradictory at all.
The end is nigh
Everyone thinks their own stereotypes have merit.
It ain't what you don't know that gets you into trouble. It's what you know for sure that just ain't so.-Mark Twain
You can't wake a person who is pretending to be asleep.
Gul, saying that jake uses a composite system is as vindicating as excusing a guy playing baseball for disputing rules of the game because he is trying to spice things up by mixing in rules from cricket.
K, true.
But I'm trying to avoid more bitterness here.
Yake, Gilly and Diana are absolutely right, though. And it's not just you. We have all of these people referring to completely different "socionics"-es. And it gets confusing. And people also get mad, because of all of the Gammas and Betas on the forum who are super serious.
I always assumed you were SLE because I believed you had typed yourself as an SLE (I could be wrong here) and I saw no compelling evidence against that. So until either (a) you say you're a specific type other than SLE, or (b) I see strong evidence correlated to a specific type other than SLE, I will continue believing you are an SLE. That's that.
sociotype.com
LII
Just for the record, I never said Ezra was LSE. I only said that after reading DeAnte's post that it made sense why he could be LSE. However, I think I've already said a few times that I can easily seebeing valued, as I value it myself, which likely means that he does not value
.
I also see logic as a strength versus feeling, and most people would agree that he's extroverted, which I would say it's sometimes hard to tell with the things he says. He can be quite subjective at times. So who's not to say he has an introverted subtype? There you have it. 2 types left. He's either an SLE or a LIE, and I really don't know the guy that well. That and my subjective "intuition" about the two logic functions are a bit out of wack, having "creative" logic as an ILI. I do see Ezra often commenting on things making sense, and that seems like athing to do, so my best guess is SLE. That and he thinks he's an SLE.
After the first four posts of the exact shite I referenced as that which I was not looking for, Diana was spot on. Then all her other comments just baked a multi-layered cake. Her response to ArchonAlarion's pile of crap was the icing.
lol, nice.
lol +1
"Actual" being skewered Ashton-inspired, senseless bollocks?
Waheyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy, brilliant. Best post award.
Those you cited as being right are right because they follow the variation of socionics which we discuss here - the good old Augustan variation. If you stick to this, you can separate rubbish (what people who say "classic socionics sucks ass" promote) from truth.
And you're doing yourself no favours by including yourself in the group of those who have no idea what they are.
The only reason I can see for calling me an LSE is what Diana said - I am strong in Se, Si, Te and Ti.
That is why I don't understand people typing me as a Gamma but unknowing of why. Yes I am a Gamma, but in their eyes I could be an SEE or ESI just because I value. It is an effete presumption.
I love how Jake pretends to be disdainful of "people who dont understand IMEs" while saying stuff like "idk, internal statics of objects sounds too space agey." lmfao.
All elements can see power, and this is the point that Jake is attempting to make.
Se and Ne, for example, are dissection elements. They see objects and continually divide them into ever-smaller objects. This is what Object Statics (OS) do. Se does this by way of particle, and Ne does this by way of concept. Each OS element is, like all the elements, incomplete; it only shows half of the puzzle. The complementary elements which accompany each OS element (the Dynamic Field or DF elements) summate objects back together. Ni does this through an intrinsic sense of being (the summation of all particles as a single, internal flow), and Si views the interweaving physical processes as one, combined thing.
Se/Ni sees things as intrinsically connected units of thing, and thus sees power as an aphysical force emanating from/as an aura around an object.
Ne/Si sees things as physically connected concepts, and thus sees power in objects as a summation of physical processes. These combined processes make a level of power for each conceptual object.
Te/Fi and Fe/Ti work in a similar fashion: Fi dissects internal hierarchies while Te summates the framework through physical implementation; Ti dissects external hierarchies while Fe flows into the system (obviously this is quite brief and not fully explanatory, but hopefully you get the point). Each of these element pairs see power as a measure of fit into such a framework.
Power is what you see it as.
Wond'ring aloud, How we feel today. Last night sipped the sunset, My hand in her hair. We are our own saviours, As we start both our hearts, Beating life Into each other. ~Ian Anderson
I think that associations between "power" and "Se" is referring to a particular sort of power, or using the word "power" to get at something about Se. It doesn't mean power itself (as in the general definition) is Se or anything like that.
I'm too lazy to go look... but wasn't Se likened to "kinetic energy" and Ne to "potential energy" by Augusta? It's a sort of analogy to general physics. Ne can't see "kinetic energy" because it only sees the internal statics of the object. Se, however, seeing the external static properties can identify "willpower" as one of these properties, e.g. "how much get up and go does this object have?" or "how well can this object push the other external objects". It's because the Se ego, thriving in its universe of external static objects, finds it can push and prod these objects and it's just one big play ground... and it notices that some of these objects push really easily and others resist being pushed more, and others push back... so on and so forth. (yes, there is humor in this paragraph.)
Anyway, my point is that "power" needn't be taken so precisely or something.
Sure, and thats probably what Tom is saying.
The end is nigh
The last part, certainly.
Sort of? for the rest of it.
Wond'ring aloud, How we feel today. Last night sipped the sunset, My hand in her hair. We are our own saviours, As we start both our hearts, Beating life Into each other. ~Ian Anderson
If so, then that's what we're all saying... but when people write about Se they might just say "willpower" or "power" sometimes because they don't want to have to write a big long paragraph every time they mention an IM element. At least to me, these things are all concepts, I see the concept in my mind in a naked form... but as soon as I try to put words to it to try to communicate it, that's where things get messy.
Though I think it will be taken so precisely by a lot of people simply due to the fact that their vocabulary is very limited.
Dude I was being sarcastic lol. I was half making fun of the term because its does sound arcane, even if I use it frequently as a term.
The end is nigh
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