Originally Posted by
unefille
I read consentingadult's post about moralism and Fi dramatism a little differently, I think. To me, the overall gist of the post was that Fi can get offended and can and does express that offense drawing upon demonstrative Fe, and he does not see that strong sense of Fi being expressed in Tereg in any form. I think I intuitively filled in something that were left unsaid (mostly because I think it was written from an ENFp perspective, rather than a general perspective - I think I have an awful temper and am often rude, but I doubt an outside observer from a more 'aggressive' quadra would note the same qualities in me - an SEE friend, if I've typed her correctly, often thinks I'm too even-keeled and polite.)
As I read it, I have some things to add because what was missing was an explanation of when Fi is offended sufficiently in an IEE to produce an Fe 'burn down' (a burn down probably would require some Se as well, as opposed to an Fi+Fe moral rant - which is also something that I don't think is alien to IEE, though it might not be somewhere IEEs frequent often.)
JuJu mentioned getting angry when people were grossly and unapologetically incompetent. I have to say, to the extent that that is linked to Te, incompetence is a bit of a bug-bear for me. However, whilst incompetence will definitely provoke to annoyance and irritation (and something that can only be described as mock rage - I am producing the Fe for the rage in that it sounds and looks like how someone might act if angry, but there is no real aggression, no real anger, no Se being drawn upon - and if you mock me for it, or just stare at me long enough, I will start laughing in the middle of the 'rage'), it never really produces anger.
Also, I agree with Slackermom that NeFi has quite an 'elastic' sense of ethics in the sense that even if you do something which offends my personal ethics or ideals, I am unlikely to hold it against you severely, because I recognise that what you violated are MY ethics, which are not UNIVERSAL principles, and thus, whilst I can private miffed inside, there is no basis upon which I am entitled to get shitty at you. I simply recognise that you and I are different people and to some extent, that there is no one right standard. If the ethical breach is HUGE, I might decide that I can't really trust you anymore, though nothing may change too much outwardly - I certainly won't shut you out of my life and it is unlikely I will try to do too much to change you, or force you to see the wrongness of your ways. Of course, this becomes much more complicated when we bring in 3rd party interests or a professional/legal context, because I have to not only act with respect to the breach of my private standards, but possibly your breach of an objective or external standard.
However, that doesn't mean that I never get angry, that my Fi is never sufficiently offended to create 'burn down'. When does it happen? Well first, it is VERY UNLIKELY to ever be directed at strangers or people I am not very close to. You are too far outside of my world for me to feel that I am in anyway entitled to lecture or explode at you. With closeness however comes responsibility and respect and thus, your affairs are entangled with mine sufficiently that I do feel I can extend some sense of private right and wrong toward you. Second, it would have to be a repeated breach. I can rationalise away the first breach - I'm still tentative about making a judgement about you from one violation - but repetition will confirm my suspicions about your character. Third, it will require you to seek to engage me in some way, particularly if it's related to whatever shitty thing it is I think you do. Te general rule is - if you leave me alone, I leave you alone. Don't bother me and I can pretend you don't exist. I would never seek out someone to yell at them or tell them off - only if they come find me first. And last, I would probably have to be a situation where I cannot leave or get away from your easily - if I am trapped in an enclosed space with you, that is probably a very bad thing, especially if there's no way to escape if you try engaging me.
To summarise - my conditions for what CA called a 'Burn Down':
1. Close relationship
2. Repeated offence
3. You attempt to engage me
4. Enclosed spaces/situations
When all these conditions are met, I will basically snap 'ENOUGH' and yes, I can yell both loudly and articulately and there will be fireworks.
But as I said elsewhere, I've only gone to this very angry, aggressive and moralistic place with one person in my life thus far. It's rare, but explosive.