Meeting Your Identicals Stories

[Hot Scalding Gayser]

Intimidated by my identicals? No way. It's just we end up being intensely attracted to each other but nobody ever does anything about it. Hence how duals are people just like you but with the balls to fuck you. XP And nobody really wants to have sex with themselves, so we're afraid we'll clash deep down but in actuality we really wouldn't. But it doesn't matter because we won't even try. My identicals help me realize how charming and sexy I am. And if you don't think your identical is sexy, then you don't think YOURSELF as sexy, and that's a problem even your dual won't be able to fix. 'Cause hello- they're just like you being an identical and all.

So chances are if you think you clash with your identical, work on yourself more- and it will help them change what you want to change about them. You still won't feel 'OMG' like you do your dual but you will at least become great friends and get over that 'Identical awkward' stage people are talking about.

This probably only applies to introverted identicals btw. Dunno about extroverted identicals....but I guess it would be the same? I dunno.

Remember, Identicals shouldn't feel that awkward for very long. People are descirbing them they're like just boring or in the middle with no energy- but that is not true at all! If that's happening too much and you love yourself, chances are that isn't your Identity. They're only ONE BELOW the greatness of Duals, guys. Personally being homo, I think they're better than duals in many ways.

Please STOP having low self-esteem and think that somebody is going to save you. I only noticed people that I was compatible with when I worked on myself more and learned to love and save myself first. Everybody talks about that, but it's so true. And then once that happened I could have my prince charming that rescued me from burning buildings. =p

[JuJu]

Please STOP having low self-esteem and think that somebody is going to save you. I only noticed people that I was compatible with when I worked on myself more and learned to love and save myself first. Everybody talks about that, but it's so true. And then once that happened I could have my prince charming that rescued me from burning buildings. =p

I agree with the sentiment behind your post, (i.e. love yourself.) I'll be honest though--not getting along (in a romantic sense) with my identity had nothing to do with low self-esteem on either of our parts.

Simply put, there wasn't much mystery there--we had very similar ways of seeing the world. We had fun when hanging out, (it wasn't bland,) but there was none of the mutual striving that make certain romantic relationships seem meaningful.

Perhaps it was just that particular relationship, (the only romantic one I've had with another ENFp,) but it sounds like a typical scenario.

[meatburger]

So chances are if you think you clash with your identical, work on yourself more- and it will help them change what you want to change about them. You still won't feel 'OMG' like you do your dual but you will at least become great friends and get over that 'Identical awkward' stage people are talking about.

I like your idea about loving your identical = loving yourself but im not so sure about this. What if you are simply a highly stable person and all the identicals you meet are not as far along the personal growth chain as yourself. Just as i may be higher along the chain than some, there will also be some that look at me and my habits and can see how much work i have to do aswell.

I certianlly get on with Identicals but i dont subscribe at all to them being good partners in relationships. Two people with very similar weaknesses does not gel with me.

[Rubicon]

I like your idea about loving your identical = loving yourself but im not so sure about this. What if you are simply a highly stable person and all the identicals you meet are not as far along the personal growth chain as yourself. Just as i may be higher along the chain than some, there will also be some that look at me and my habits and can see how much work i have to do aswell.

+100

[redbaron]

Two of my closest friends are my identicals. But they are different both from me and from each other. I think there's quite a range within any type. I love them both and we totally understand each other. The three of us had dinner the other night and talked and talked. I believe in subtypes and/or dual type theory too so I think that whatever one's second type is has a lot to do with how they come across even as that particular type.

[Ms. Kensington]

i don't think ive had any close friends who were INTjs, just a few coworkers who very much irritated me and whose weaknesses were very glaring to me. I have one friend whom I always assumed was beta NF but I am reconsidering her type as INTj.. we had been close in middle/high school and grew apart. When I see mental deficiency in INTjs i run the other way because i want someone I can look up too. In case anyone thinks I might not be INTj i usually think this way about other types too (see their weaknesses and run)

its true though that my beahvior can be described as someone who is trying to better herself.

[Blaze]

there was this star trek/next generation episode some years back about riker...somehow he had gotten replicated by the transporter so there were two rikers and they couldn't stand each other. talk about identicals. anyway, at the time that i saw the episode, i kinda thought, yeah, that's what would happen.

i think the same thing about socionics identicals. you kind of connect socially but really you see their weakness, glaringly so, and get irritated with them. i don't really think identical would be a good relationship for romance.

[Slacker]

I get along very well with other ENFps. But I can't count on them. They flake out as much as I do! I really need someone I can rely on.

I have dated ENFps and for just fun, it's great. But as far as marriage goes, I really do need to be able to count on someone to take care of things.

[Blaze]

You're all so skeptical.

Seriously, so far I've enjoyed every moment of it (a romantic relationship with my identical). Sure, you both have similar weaknesses. In our case, it's glaringly obvious that we're both infantile. What's magic is that you have the same strengths too. There's something exciting about having someone who understands exactly where you're coming from. They're a soulmate who can stimulate you to improve and take the strengths you have to even greater heights, and who understands your incomprehension concerning something that you're naturally weak in. Like, it's not always possible to exercise your Ti and have theoretical, INTj-style, mind-masturbating debates with an ESFj just for the hell of it. They do approach things differently and regularly would prefer to be doing something else instead. I find that my boyfriend and I are constantly teaching each other new TiNe-related things though. He'll introduce me to a new book; I'll offer him a new perspective on something he's been thinking about, etc.

So ... what I'm saying is, sure I've met other INTjs too with whom a romantic relationship would never work (simply because I wasn't attracted to them in that way and/or vice versa). But given two people who are attracted to each other, then I think that an identical relationship has just a good a chance at working as any others do.

well this sounds like it's working really well for you then. why question it? if you are attracted to each other mentally and physically, go for it. just for myself, i've been in relationship with my identity or lookalike depending on what type i am, and even though there was a lot of sexual attraction in the beginning, it waned over time and became a very mental relationship rather than a restorative relationship.

[marooned]

there was this star trek/next generation episode some years back about riker...somehow he had gotten replicated by the transporter so there were two rikers and they couldn't stand each other. talk about identicals. anyway, at the time that i saw the episode, i kinda thought, yeah, that's what would happen.

I had thought about mentioning that, but then I became hesitant.

[Creepy-Diana]

.

[Elro]

Elro! Have you made that clone army yet? I'd like to see what having a few me's around would really be like.

Working on it. Still having trouble getting the flour:water ratio right.

[Creepy-Diana]

.

[Jarno]

Identicals are usually to boring, to meet them again.

I don't know if this also applies to the ones of opposite gender.

[jessica129]

I don't necessarily find them boring. Quite the opposite actually. But i could see how the relationship could go stale after a certain period of time.

[Park]

ISTP/INTP/ISTJ/ESTP

You seem to have too many identicals.

[iAnnAu]

I think I've only met two identicals IRL. One was an asshole, which I learned after dating him, but I think that had more to do with immaturity than type. One was an alcoholic nymphomaniac. I got along with him a lot better ;p.

[The Ineffable]

I continue another thread here because it became too specific.

Do you feel conflict/competition with them? Do you feel attracted to them? Do you get along with them? Do you find them boring? Is it a good relationship to have, one with an identical?

I just had a conflict with my Identical yesterday... I was so angry, I had those feelings of helplessness in dealing with him comparable to those when I broke-up with my exes or when I qualified others as "useless"/never to approach them again. However, I did not cut all ties with him, rather only concerning several activities.

First of all, I don't feel competition with ILEs, in fact when I see valuable ones, I identify with them and I'm very happy - eventually taking them as temporary models. I guess this is not necessarily the case for all types (eg Se-Base?). However I take as a rule of thumb that I should not live in the same place with someone like me (regardless of type, if applicable), the same strengths, in fact I rejected a suggestion of an ILE to try to get hired at his workpace, after we admired each other for inquisitiveness and wonderful ideas. He agreed after thinking, he was just excited by our collaboration, nothing more than that. Our collaboration was fruitful but for a very short period of time, the time necessary to dump what we already knew to each other, but we were not sensitive to the other's special needs on the long run: he asked me to develop some code of mine - which he was enthusiastic about - to meet some new necessities, though that was a bit difficult for me and was busy with something else, I said something like "I'll se what I can do" and although I was really wanting to please him, the wish quickly faded away when I got emerged in my other usual interests.
---

Now the ILE I had problems with... I'm 100% certain he is one. We relate to an enormous number of common things, personality-wise, and a bit in interests. We differ in respect of life experience, I'm older and also have much more experience with people and other stuff + a more clear mind and defined short term goals. I got mad on him for what I perceive to be a passive-aggressive attitude and perhaps rudeness, especially when he is clearly wasting my time, although being begged to avoid doing so. He is a real timewaster, although I don't judge him by that, I would bring forward the fact that he's 25 or so and still lives a parasitic life - I'd say - on his parents. This may probably be one cause for our conflict, I think he does not give the necessary respect to people who help him, not in that people "are required" to be respected for helping him, but because this is a fucking logical conclusion: if you don't try to make the life of those who help you easier, they will tell you to fuck off, sooner or later. He complains actually that he often pisses people off - to me he comes accross much like HLD, though not interested in human/moral stuff, neither projecting or fearing bad intentions - and that he's procrastinating, and he's failing, though he doesn't seem to have *the slightest* intention to do something about it! It makes no sense to acknowledge your problems and their solutions, but wait for them to get solved by themselves... "You know, I'm not doing what I should do..." so fucking what, what is the point in proclaiming such thing? He wanted to do math, then physics, then history, then philosophy, then programming, now what?

His parents are IEI (father) and SLI (mother) and has a LSE brother, who I know personally and a sister, apparently SEI.
---

Now, he pissed me off actually for three times. The first time was actually two identical incidents (so four in total, IIRC), discussions on the same subject. I was needing from him to learn some philosophy stuff and to have his opinion on a theory of mine. The guy read a lot and has a good knowledge of these things, especially notions, definitions, and various authors hypotheses in different problems (eg necessity). HOWEVER... although having a good knowledge, he is in a never-ending waiting for conclusions, he doesn't spend time to actually make use of it, I don't mean practical use, but to make something out of that. Not only that he's indecisive, but he is not strict enough with his thoughts, and basically does nothing to think for himself, just joggles with ideas waithing for something to happen.

I think part of the problem is that he likes this romantic idea of "thinkers" who spend an infinite amount of time in "intellectual discussions". I guess someone has to provide us with tea and snacks, and tobacco for me. "I prefer a mild and aromatic american blend, thank you. You may leave us alone now, John, I'll call you when we need something else". I like the idea though, but not when it makes part of a fictional scenario.

He clarified to me some parts of the theory of relativity, though that was actually not his direct merit, but I could see the mistakes in his reasoning, or rather in explaining things. I'm still not sure whether his understanding is genuine or he just learned those things by heart... He is a bit dogmatic and has a rather mathematical/formal/mental masturbating/dreaming approach on the subjects - he's a math university dropout, btw, used to talk only about math years ago. Instead of providing me with clear, *real* answers, he was just quoting different and meaningless definitions, like "speed is relative to the reference frame". WTF? I can read that shit on Wikipedia, I'm interested in a demonstration, an explanation, not these esoteric sayings that make some erroneously believe we can travel back in time or that phenomenae depend on our POV (like "What The Blip Do We Know", LOL). Because of such bullshit I was skeptical about relativity for a long time, I was expecting of something else from him, allegedly a similar mind... The guy was repeatedly dragging the discussions into irrelevant that he exasperated me, apparently having no intention to clarify something to me.
---

Anyway, I'll jump over the details, the last time (yesterday) he pissed me off, really hard, was when I was instructing him to do some things, at his request - software-related. An ordeal! Most importantly he was not giving me proper feedback, although I was instructing him online and I had no idea what happens on his computer. How dumb to be to not realize that the other person has no idea of your status if you don't tell him what you do? To avoid such things, I began installing the same thing as him in a virtual space, precisely to be able to understand what's going on there and be more precise with my instructions. He was only required to tell me what actions he performed and what status his machine was in. When I was telling him "when you do that, what happens?" he was answering like "it doesn't work". Part of the passive-aggressive I was talking about... How do you know it doesn't work? What doesn't work? What happens? What are the error messages? I could not write very fast because he was slow and was not updating me with his status, often I was believing he accomplished all steps, just to find out that he was far behind... Sometimes he was actually ahead of me, but to explain how this could possibly happen means to enter many speculations. He was literally spending minutes in order to press the Enter key, counted by me .

At one operation, I made a desperate attempt to solve it with writing the required steps, key-by-key, and told him that it *should work* and I have nothing else to tell him, I'll only answer him when he was successful. Of course, he reported "it didn't work"; "fine, you didn't follow the instructions exactly, start it over". I felt like a LSI or something, the good part is that I realized that strict discipline is sometimes necessary, one should not reject it as a rule. In this case it was the only way to solve that problem while I could do something useful instead of dealing with his bullshit indefinitely. One of the most annoying thing he was repeatedly doing was to ask me what I just wrote to him 2-3 lines above

Note that the guy was not upset on me at all, even if I freaked out and sweared for several times, I could describe his attitude by: insensitive, clueless, mendacious and obstinate. I will though check on him today or tomorrow, maybe he decided to be more reasonable meantime.

Edit: I was asking him relevant questions and he was not answering, virtually every I had to repeat.

[Variant]

I don't have that much experience dealing with identicals but man i feel sorry for you. I had to work with an EIE once on a project and dam it took so fricking long, i can't tell you how much we just stood there to think of 1 thing + if it was relevant to our topic. Tangents, can't focus on one topic, can't start it, and doubting makes it so much harder...

I'm gonna reconsider working with my identical-unless it's a girl (which probably ain't a good idea). Social wise, they're pretty fun to be with

[Creepy-Snaps]

Haven't read really any of the thread, but just reminding quickly that people in your own quadra, even duals, you may not necessarily get along with. I reserve the right to give a more specific opinion after reading this thread.

[Ningyo]

Sounds familiar. I know this IEI I was friends with for YEARS who is much older than I am, and every time we fought it felt like we were breaking up.

I have fond feelings for identicals but ultimately start to feel like they need to go. To be perfectly honest, once we're done chatting about our shared interest, it just feels like them being there constantly prevents me from being able to celebrate and appreciate who -I- am. When they say what I was thinking, sometimes it's awesome but most of the time it feels more like listening to someone who is actually trying to be like you. The worst part is that being an IEI makes me feel AWFUL about thinking this way, and it's really difficult to get your space and identity back without creating distance. I always feel guilty for what feels like avoiding my identical in a way I've never felt bad about avoiding ANYONE, but I've read that identicals often do avoid each other in many settings, as you mentioned avoiding working or living with yours.

For all of the good that comes with it, it really is such a mindfuck. I prefer the company of my ILI friend on days when he's not being an asshole.

[Aquagraph]

What are you not pissed about?

[mu4]

IEE not ILE imo

[Absurd]

Holy crap, I made past second sentence. I'm making progress. Anyhow, don't get down due to it, it's not death, yet. You're ging to find plenty of conflictors/identicals to conflict with.

[Phthalate]

Haha.... us ILEs can be such dipshits.

[The Ineffable]

IEE not ILE imo

The one in the OP? If so, I have countless reasons to believe he is ILE, including huge number of guesses I made about him which he confirmed - including tricky questions & stuff that I used to avoid him trying to give me "the right answer" (sometimes he had to answer negatively or differently than hinted), IIRC. And virtually no doubt. I don't know, everything about him is ILE, except perhaps annoying me for no apparent reasons, lacking (IMO) constructive goals, which I don't find very ILE-ish . He pretty much introduced me to areas in philosophy and astrophysics, and unlike perhaps all Deltas I know, he has genuine interest in science and philosophy - the way I see this, he lacks those social or interest-related purposes when it comes to it. He is so much interested in knowledge for the sake of it that he kinda neglects his social life or career pursuits. We talked a lot, he understands Socionics quite well nowdays, IMO.

His father is IEI and he told me that they argue a lot - his father argues about everything as a sport- FTR, his father VIs like some Beta NF "old fox" style, like David Carradine or Iggy Pop. I think he is pretty funny, but I never met him so far.

His LSE brother, although younger, was very controlling and was ordering him what to do - you know, the proper thing to do, listen to the parents, what to spend his money on, etc. I met other Alpha/Beta Irrationals who had such character in their family and who were similarily avoidant and passive-aggressive (including my Fe-Creative ex). I think this might be an explanation.

[mu4]

The one in the OP? If so, I have countless reasons to believe he is ILE, including huge number of guesses I made about him which he confirmed - including tricky questions & stuff that I used to avoid him trying to give me "the right answer" (sometimes he had to answer negatively or differently than hinted), IIRC. And virtually no doubt. I don't know, everything about him is ILE, except perhaps annoying me for no apparent reasons, lacking (IMO) constructive goals, which I don't find very ILE-ish . He pretty much introduced me to areas in philosophy and astrophysics, and unlike perhaps all Deltas I know, he has genuine interest in science and philosophy - the way I see this, he lacks those social or interest-related purposes when it comes to it. He is so much interested in knowledge for the sake of it that he kinda neglects his social life or career pursuits. We talked a lot, he understands Socionics quite well nowdays, IMO.

His father is IEI and he told me that they argue a lot - his father argues about everything as a sport- FTR, his father VIs like some Beta NF "old fox" style, like David Carradine or Iggy Pop. I think he is pretty funny, but I never met him so far.

His LSE brother, although younger, was very controlling and was ordering him what to do - you know, the proper thing to do, listen to the parents, what to spend his money on, etc. I met other Alpha/Beta Irrationals who had such character in their family and who were similarily avoidant and passive-aggressive (including my Fe-Creative ex). I think this might be an explanation.

He is probably ego, and I think ego is pretty good for this individual, but given his weakness in dealing with your instructions and such, I'm not sure if he's ILE.

I would say I wouldn't judge someone's type based on their interests or ability to socially integrate with others, I'm generally better professionally than most IEE's I know and ethical types are not any less likely to encounter social conflict in life, but how one deals with it is different.

Let's not forget that one ILE individual was intensely interested in relationships, a area of the PoLR. It's quite common in my opinion for individuals to be quite invested in their PoLR and spend a lot of time on this, however when forced to act based on the PoLR, their abilities can be blocked and/or stressful.

[Saberstorm]

The Ineffable seems like somebody who is eay to rub the wrong way. I cannot see why he would be put in a whack by this behavior. The dude is just anouther stooge. Why concern yourself with him? Why is the Ineffable invested in this relationship?

[The Ineffable]

The Ineffable seems like somebody who is eay to rub the wrong way. I cannot see why he would be put in a whack by this behavior. The dude is just anouther stooge. Why concern yourself with him? Why is the Ineffable invested in this relationship?

Hmm I think it is normal to be invested. We can avoid/ignore or we can work on things; there is no clear rule where I should apply one or the other. It is pretty much the same question of how much in this world we should accept because "it is how it is" and how much we should try to change. I generally prefer to get involved, especially in trying to change the things that I don't find "natural" [1], even becoming assertive, but it is not that I think this is the proper way to go, it is just a choice, I guess.

I cannot accept his quirky character - involved or not - because it has no reason to be manifested that I can understand, such behavior is simply absurd. Maybe this answers your questions about my attitude, not sure what the point is, though...
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[1] - fallacious, but such fallacies are IMO the only way of generating personal guides, rules of thumb.

[Saberstorm]

What is your trade? I thought you were some kind of astronomer - an academic of some kind, but now this seems fuzzy to me. (If you do not mind me asking..)

[The Ineffable]

What is your trade? I thought you were some kind of astronomer - an academic of some kind, but now this seems fuzzy to me. (If you do not mind me asking..)

No, astrophysics and philosphy are currently just hobbies to me (although pretty serious). This guy is into it, but changes his mind often, quitting his studies - I think he went for math, history, at one point he was preparing to apply for physics (not sure if it happened) and currently he prepares for philosophy.