Duschia=
ILE (ENTp)
SEI (ISFp)
ESE (ESFj)
LII (INTj)
SLE (ESTp)
IEI (INFp)
EIE (ENFj)
LSI (ISTj)
SEE (ESFp)
ILI (INTp)
LIE (ENTj)
ESI (ISFj)
IEE (ENFp)
SLI (ISTp)
LSE (ESTj)
EII (INFj)
Duschia=
@Duschia, when I first stated that I thought Trump was SLE, it was because I didn't think he was LIE, which was another popular opinion being advanced. Trump's lies about his business skills were not widely known then, and a lot of people associate business skills with LIE, when Trump's skills extend only to playing a successful businessman on a highly scripted TV program. At the time, I think I said that he had zero Ni.
I have since reconsidered my original SLE opinion in light of my knowing more SLE's and SEE's better in real life, and I now think he's an SEE who is really, really unhealthy.
I'm unlikely to change my opinion again, since Trump has such good relations with ILI's Barr and Kim Jong Un.
But yeah, I have changed my mind about the sociotype of some people whom I've known for a long time, as more evidence comes in and my first impressions were shown to be incorrect.
I think it's interesting that self-typed SEEs have little to say about Trump. Does that mean they silently agree or do they disagree and don't see it worth talking about? Curious...usually when people relate with something, even if it's bad, they like to point it out.
When I see LIE's behaving badly, I am shocked and dismayed at the depths to which my sociotype can sink. I am aware that my sociotype has certain inherent characteristics which, when amplified by circumstance or poor ethical preparation or awareness, can lead to incredibly toxic and disappointing behavior.
I doubt if I'm alone in those feelings.
This is why many descriptions of the types distinguish between various "health levels".
This forum is indeed funny. Poeple who type themselves as Fi Quadras and claim Fe is the source of conformity are the only ones I have seen use census as an argument that something is correct. "See? The majority agrees!" or the "the T types agree". For the record I don't think any Quadra is at fault. It's just individuals. I just think it's hypocritical to claim something for yourself for no reason and still fail to live up to your own hype.
This is directed at both Duschia and Tommy, just to clear any confusion.
Typical SEE reactive stuff from him IM(NotHumble)O. He just does it worse than most SEE's. Anyway it is funny how I relate to his "train of thought" from super ego perspective although "thought" is here used very loosely. This is Reinin symmetry related. Let's say that his role Ne tricks him a lot.
MOTTO: NEVER TRUST IN REALITY
Winning is for losers
Sincerely yours,
idiosyncratic type
Life is a joke but do you have a life?
Joinif you dare https://matrix.to/#/#The16Types:matrix.org
@Duschia, "No" to the bolded part. I can attest to the fact that I held my Supervisors in very high regard. Still do, when they are the correct (Te) sub-type. When not, they are just pains in the ass, but otherwise I see them as very positive people who can help me a lot in many ways.
I've also dated my Supervisees (IEI's) and they seem to be quite fond of me. Unreasonably so, IMO.
Yeah. So I'm hypothetically Te. That means I don't make sense, I make sense out of things. Actively. This is empirically verifiable, as I do make mistakes all the time in internal logic. Trump is probably Fe, as he makes mistakes in empirical reasoning. Or in short, he doesn't check things like I do. I check everything. And when I mean everything, I mean everything. I could be Sherlock, and my friends have said it before, however I think I am Trump's Lookalike, M. I don't know anyone else like me. I could very well be INTp, and I do fit the stereotype. However, I get tired alone, and not tired with friends. Like the way the forum is set up is incredibly deactivating for me, which causes negative thoughts to occur. I hope that is reasonable to understand.
Trump is still decisive, but self sacrifice does not seem his type. He's not Gamma. He's Beta. Along with his other friend who wrote his racist and inhumane policy, who is likely Fi polr. Steve Miller. Two fer 1. He's the guy who is responsible for the damnable state of illegal immigrants right now.
But yeah, to make a group that includes self sacrifice as a trait, and include Trump inside of it, that is rich.
But enough of politics. I'm definitely alienating a bunch of people right now, however I have been passively getting more and more furious with this stuff.
I hope you understand.
Maybe you guys will think I'm SEE or something stupid.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phrenology
An optimist - does not get discouraged under any circumstances. Life upheavals and stressful events only toughen him and make more confident. He likes to laugh and entertain people. Enters contact with someone by involving him with a humorous remark. His humor is often sly and contain hints and double meanings. Easily enters into arguments and bets, especially if he is challenged. When arguing his points is often ironic, ridicules the views of his opponent. His irritability and hot temper may be unpleasant to others. However, he himself is not perceptive of this and believes that he is simply exchanging opinions.
http://www.wikisocion.net/en/index.php?title=LIE_Profile_by_Gulenko
SLE-Se
Last edited by eiemo; 07-06-2021 at 07:46 PM.
Trump does not operate through a structured impersonal system (military, gang, syndicate, cell) or through an aristocratic spearhead (vanguard, elite special forces) of competent "war-tested" advisors.
Trump operates through family, connections, and image. He leverages his interpersonal skills and understanding of the base values of the american right and silent middle. He undressed the media for what it is, and wrapped the republican party around his finger. With zero political experience, he made seasoned snakes in politics and journalism look impotent.
If an SLE could spend 50 years in real estate, a few appearances on scripted TV, then run circles around people who live in these shark infested waters for a living, there would be no need for IEI advisement on relations.
He prefers hot aggressive like/dislike judgements and deal-making, to cold aggressive cause-effect analysis and instructing/mobilizing.
He married a woman dubbed the "Ice Queen," and let her live in an entirely different city the first months of his presidency.
He put an ESI Jared Kushner in his inner circle.
He bowed before Putin, literally and relationally.
His values are image, money, ambition, energy, hustle, family, and rubbing elbows with achievers.
His politics are pro-business deregulation and disbandment of watchdog agencies, privatization of collective safety nets, and kickbacks to his loyalists.
1 or 2 of these in isolation, would be one thing, but summed together, this is not an SLE.
This forum has a warped view of Fe, Fi, Fe mob and Fi PoLR
Excellent points, @inaLim.
I may have replied to this thread before but I'm just going to say it again if I already have. The dude's a Gamma. Probably of the extroverted variant but hey, plenty of introverts who can "fake it until you make it" as it were.
I can, if I feel I must. Don't like it, feels wrong and makes my skin crawl, but I can friggin' do it if required. This is also the argument of how and why Good>Evil by the by. "Good" people can "get" the evil one no matter the other variables and even ape them if need be for a short duration ceterus paribus (e.g. not needing to murder/rape a baby to maintain the façade after week 3 despite the ability to say "Praise Moloch" in a chat). Evil guy literally can't for any significant amount of time on an ontological level. Good has "imagination" as its sole advantage according to many. Given the current state of "mainstream" fiction, I'm very inclined to agree that it truly is a transcendent advantage (i.e. it gives you the ability to be several steps ahead of your adversary). I mean hell, they're making mistakes Gobbels himself would chew them out for. It's not that they can't meme, it's that they refuse to even try to learn how to do so on the most basic of levels.
Post a lefty "meme" in response to this charge. I shall dissect how it fails on multiple levels easily. First and foremost of which is the usual wall of text. A good meme needs but an image and a single sentence at most. If you need more than that to get your intent/message across you've already failed!
Typing Donald Trump is a good test for separating the Socionics sheep from the MBTI goats. The socionicists will see that he has 4D valued and 1D unvalued and type him as Caesar, but Myers-Briggists will either type him ENTj (because MBists always think that any gamma quadra = ENTj) or ESTp (because "being tactical" is MB's Ti or whatever, even though is logical consistency, comparing of ratios, and correctness, none of which DJT is good at or cares about).
Last edited by CosmicCat; 06-29-2021 at 08:55 AM.
(My name is Yon Yonson,
I live in Wisconsin.
I work in a lumber yard there.
The people I meet as
I walk down the street,
They say "Hello!"
I say "Hello!"
They say "What's your name?"
I say: (My name is Yon Yonson...
All posts licensed under the GNU General Public License. Some rights reserved.
Textbook Fi-polr. It’s a no-brainer. He always says the most subtly sociopathic, off-color things even from my perspective as an ESI with a decent sense of humor who doesn’t have a hate-boner for him. He’s incapable of sincerely matching the gravity of sensitive situations and saying what I consider to be the correct human/empathetic thing.
Last edited by Averroes; 06-29-2021 at 11:41 AM.
The decisive thing is not the reality of the object, but the reality of the subjective factor, i.e. the primordial images, which in their totality represent a psychic mirror-world. It is a mirror, however, with the peculiar capacity of representing the present contents of consciousness not in their known and customary form but in a certain sense sub specie aeternitatis, somewhat as a million-year old consciousness might see them.
(Jung on Si)
I know a lot of people hate him but I think he’s hilarious. I doubt we’d have bad ITR if that says anything. I think he’s SEE-D tbh. I see why People think he’s SLE, but being abrasive isn’t exactly Fi PoLR. He seems pretty solidified in his opinions about things that I don’t think an SLE would be.
Oh yeah and I used to think he was SLE too but now I’m heavily leaning on the SEE side of the fence
People who think that Trump is hilarious or a great leader for our country haven't lived with a narcissist. Just take a look at how his kids turned out. He'd do that to you, too. Barr is his Dual and Trump turned on him, just as he does with everyone who ever helped him. As for leading the country, take a look at the condition of his businesses.
FWIW, I know some perfectly nice and admirable SEEs and SLEs, but they are all healthy. Trump is not healthy.
One last comment. We work with a company that has a troubled division, and they just handed control of that division over to an ESE and an SEE. Both of these guys are relatively healthy, but they remain their types. At first, an ILI who works there said he loves the SEE, but the SEE removed the ILI from meetings because he kept warning of disasters. In the months since then, chaos has ensued. Absolute chaos. The place is burning through money and it has no results.
Last edited by Adam Strange; 06-29-2021 at 01:10 PM.
@Adam Strange, what’s wrong with Trumps kids? And what do you think of Hunter Biden in comparison
Last edited by RBRS; 06-30-2021 at 12:45 PM.
He got Covid and asked the public to not fear it and remain strong -clues
-
Dual type (as per tcaudilllg)
Enneagram 5 (wings either 4 or 6)?
I'm constantly looking to align the real with the ideal.I've been more oriented toward being overly idealistic by expecting the real to match the ideal. My thinking side is dominent. The result is that sometimes I can be overly impersonal or self-centered in my approach, not being understanding of others in the process and simply thinking "you should do this" or "everyone should follor this rule"..."regardless of how they feel or where they're coming from"which just isn't a good attitude to have. It is a way, though, to give oneself an artificial sense of self-justification. LSE
Best description of functions:
http://socionicsstudy.blogspot.com/2...functions.html
For some reason I think SLE.
LIE
Sometimes you don't have motivation because you lack purpose.
Sometimes you don't have purpose, because you lack self-knowledge
Sometimes you don't have self-knowledge because you lack love
Sometimes you don't have love because you lack self-love
Sometimes you don't have self-love because you lack guess what? Ask Gulenko!!
Forum members still have not been able to figure out President Trump's type.
This made the INTP woman below very angry.
Cancel Culture Forever
This is the comment you are looking for
i'm back to SEE and maybe i'll never return to SLE again
SLE
But SEE have cautious Fi while SLE has bold Fe. If socionics is on par with Jung's descriptions then Fi doesn't usually externalize value judgements so often and when it does it comes out in a weird neurotic way (there is for Fi lead on ego at least). Perhaps it helps to figure what type is Rosie O'donnel. They both seem to be of conflicting quadras
SEE have the demo Fe that is heaps stronger and more energetic than the Fe HA that is fairly low-energy and mostly activated by trolling others for reactions. Continuously boldly making bold and contradictory claims just because you feel like it and because it’s politically effective is in the realm of SEE. Logical types will actually try to use logic instead of rhetoric to back their claims, especially demo Te that are very strong in it. 4D Fe politicians are probably more common than all the logical types combined which says something about what works in practice.Originally Posted by Lincatrope
Changed again. EIE-Fe and enneagram 3 sp/so.
He is definitely not Te-valuing. He did the 'I have a piece of paper about an agreement and measures but I can't tell you more' thing several times that is kind of lacking of professional attitude; I don't think he's SEE or any Te valuer. What's on the paper? He just told he made a "long agreement", but it's holding on one page, which he keeps keep in his inner jacket pocket? It makes him look a bit like a schoolboy showing he did his homework to the press, which definitely sounds like 'role(playing) Te' to me.
Then he goes on about "so-and-so told me that important guy so-and-so told them that I couldn't blablebliblem so I told them blurbliblurblur" aristocratic Fe. Some people say he doesn't care about Ti, which is wrong imo because he definitely thinks his vision of the world makes sense. It's not based on some Fi values. It's just that with 1D Ti he might need a lot of help in having a consistent view of the world. The whole capitol affair, with his instigation of mischief and his barely concealed call to violence, seem very Se HA Fe-dom too. However, I must say that it is difficult to distinguish between what belongs to the type and what belongs to the narcissistic side of the particular individual(I don't think EIEs in general are more narcissistic than any other type, but Trumps expression of his narcissism seems EIE).
Last edited by lkdhf qkb; 09-25-2021 at 06:48 PM.
SEE 7w8 sp/so
SEE D
Jester-maxed SLE
I think he is SEE. Strong narcissistic personality traits can get SEE confused for SLE.