INFps and romance

[Darklord]

If men are supposed to initiate any relationship, I guess I'm damned. When it comes to matters like that, if I'm involved, it screws up my "feeling radar" completely. No way to know whether a girl is interested or ust playing a cruel joke. Or even not interested, just me imagining things. I'd never actually take the first step. If I envision such a situation, with me taking the first step, I usually imagine the girl getting offended, creeped out or seeing it as "leverage" to make me do her wish. She would have to take the first step, and explicitly, before I would ever dare taking part in any relationship. This is part of my "shell", and it has to be broken through before I can feel comfortable. I wouldn't have any wish of control over where it was all going. In fact, I'd be overjoyed if she took the responsibility. I'd feel that I lucked out, I found somebody who actually wants to take care of it.

[Darklord]

Talk to me, and I'll talk back. If you've reached that stage, I will let you know, although probably not overtly, how I feel.

[Topaz]

If men are supposed to initiate any relationship, I guess I'm damned. When it comes to matters like that, if I'm involved, it screws up my "feeling radar" completely. No way to know whether a girl is interested or ust playing a cruel joke. Or even not interested, just me imagining things. I'd never actually take the first step. If I envision such a situation, with me taking the first step, I usually imagine the girl getting offended, creeped out or seeing it as "leverage" to make me do her wish. She would have to take the first step, and explicitly, before I would ever dare taking part in any relationship. This is part of my "shell", and it has to be broken through before I can feel comfortable. I wouldn't have any wish of control over where it was all going. In fact, I'd be overjoyed if she took the responsibility. I'd feel that I lucked out, I found somebody who actually wants to take care of it.

This might be why I couldn't rule out INFj before. I guess I'm female but I totally relate to that sentiment -- sometimes to the point where I wonder if I don't actually have a PDD/etc., but I guess I'm just an "ultra-introvert" or something.

Interesting. I used to wonder if I was perhaps infp or infj. But looking at my own behavior and also hearing all the introverts on this forum Im quite certain Im a good ol' chilly enfp I like to draw out introverts, especially the innocent looking ones Sometimes I have to restrain myself so as not to frighten them off or overwhelm them. This would be expecially the case with istps. They can be very sensitve too.

[Megan]

People, people, can we perhaps seek to avoid personal and emotional attacks on others we disagree with?

@Joy

I think I understand your concerns about what I have written and I thought a bit before writing it because I suspect that a lot of people would not quite agree with it. I truly believe that there must be long-term, successful, healthy relationships out there that have been initiated and sustained by women "chasing" after men. I don't know of any personally. I rather enjoy "hunting" and I think I have somewhat of a feminist mindset so the situation does not actually please me either.

Please understand that I speak generally from my own experience and those around me, your experience might be different. My experience is that guys that you have to practically force to be activated and interested in you, by and large, tend to stay largely inactivated for the whole life of the relationship. I have also experienced that men keep a sharper eye on certain things than I first thought. Men and women are different psychologically and I don't think women always understand that the way we view things is not exactly the way they view things and nothing might be really wrong with the difference.

For example, we might call a guy on the telephone very often because we like talking to him and miss him, but after about a month or two, a lot of guys will move from initially being flattered, to start viewing us as desperate and needy(which in most guys minds are very unattractive qualities to have). I have spoken to several guys (relatives and friends) who have mostly told me the same thing. That in theory, they quite like a girl persistently pursuing them but when it happens, after a while, they sort of lose "something" for her (even a few "desperate" guys have told me this :wink: ). I am not inclined to negatively judge males who think like this. I hope that with time less of them might do so.

To have a whole group of mostly women say this is not true/true and its wrong/right or whatever is great, but males views are great too. I think we generally need to listen to males and their experiences more without judging them. I would like to hear more reflective, non-politically correct views of males about this issue, particularly males who have actually been persistently and actively pursued by females more than just a few times. Yes, I have heard that it is flattering and such a girl is great especially if she is willing to have sex, but in reality (not theory, this might quite different), when this has happened, how did you come to think of her eventually, and how did the relationship progress?

[Topaz]

Well since you asked....
I like to be the pursuer. I like it when the female is responsive though. Ive always liked girls that were smart and funny but a little reserved. Thats just me though. If she seems open and asks me questions about myself then I will definitely take notice of that. If she teases me a little, she gets another point. If after we have gotten to know each other a bit and we seem like we are hitting it off and she grabbs my arm or lightly hits me when I tease her then she gets more points. Teasing and playfulness are very good qualities as long as I am confident she knows how far to take it and are backed by a solid sense of realism and ethics.
Women who like and respect themselves and make others feel good about who they are, are a turn on IMO.

[Topaz]

Well since you asked....
I like to be the pursuer. I like it when the female is responsive though. Ive always liked girls that were smart and funny but a little reserved. Thats just me though. If she seems open and asks me questions about myself then I will definitely take notice of that. If she teases me a little, she gets another point. If after we have gotten to know each other a bit and we seem like we are hitting it off and she grabbs my arm or lightly hits me when I tease her then she gets more points. Teasing and playfulness are very good qualities as long as I am confident she knows how far to take it and are backed by a solid sense of realism and ethics.
Women who like and respect themselves and make others feel good about who they are, are a turn on IMO.

Hmmm after re-reading this it sounds like Im the one being pursued Nevertheless, I usually am the one that will be more assertive in all this. I like it when the girl will not allow too much intimacy, until she has checked me out thoughly, but at the same time gives encouragment. Even if this takes some time it builds my confidence in her Does that make sense to you?

[Joy]

I HATE hot and cold. People accuse me of being a flirt or even a tease, but at least I'm consistent. I don't want to be flirted at and be touched and all one day and not at all the next day. I get really paranoid and confused and that makes me sad. Why can't we all just say it like it is?
Damn heartache...

LOL never date an ENTp!

[Expat]

For example, we might call a guy on the telephone very often because we like talking to him and miss him, but after about a month or two, a lot of guys will move from initially being flattered, to start viewing us as desperate and needy(which in most guys minds are very unattractive qualities to have). I have spoken to several guys (relatives and friends) who have mostly told me the same thing. That in theory, they quite like a girl persistently pursuing them but when it happens, after a while, they sort of lose "something" for her (even a few "desperate" guys have told me this :wink: ). I am not inclined to negatively judge males who think like this. I hope that with time less of them might do so.

I'm not sure of the cause-and-effect relation you are describing. If I'm also very interested in a girl, I'm very pleased if she likes to talk to me, misses me and calls me very often, and I won't view her as desperate or needy because of that. I think that what you're describing are situations where the guys weren't that interested anyway, however much they might have been flattered at first.

I would like to hear more reflective, non-politically correct views of males about this issue, particularly males who have actually been persistently and actively pursued by females more than just a few times. Yes, I have heard that it is flattering and such a girl is great especially if she is willing to have sex, but in reality (not theory, this might quite different), when this has happened, how did you come to think of her eventually, and how did the relationship progress?

Megan, I think that the lack of responses is an indication that it happens rather rarely, at least in comparison to the reverse situation.

I myself haven't been "persistently and actively pursued by females more than just a few times" and I suspect this is true for most men. I have been in a couple of situations where the girl was more active in the pursuing than I was. In neither case did the relationship progress much. However, it had more to do with my own personal circumstances (including emotional ones) than with the fact that they were doing the pursuing. That certainly did not make me think of them as needy or desperate.

For me personally the situation does not really apply. If a girl starts to pursue me and I'm interested in her, then I'll reciprocate rather than let her do all the pursuing.

[Joy]

Yeah, when I spoke of initiating relationships, I didn't mean stalking people. If someone isn't interested I move on.

[Creepy-Kioshi]

A father of a friend once told me that he saw me as a father sees a child. He would speak to me as a father speaks to a child. Then I would look at him like his grandfather looked at him when he was a child. And I would speak to him as his grandfather spoke to him as a child. He said he was never sure how to approach me. I told him to approach me as a friend.

I want to cooperate with others. I get what I want from others by inspiring their confidence. I'm not totally incompetent in this area. And, there are certain things one does not do. Forcing disclosure is one of them. So I sit quietly. I observe. And, I wait patiently for people to reveal themselves to me. I am not shy.

Approach me. Even the most timid children and animals approach me with ease. Adults tend to get psychotic. They can't seem to distinguish between what is real and what is imaginary. They don't approach me for who I am, but for who they would have me be. They get disturbed when I don't respond, as they would have me respond. It seems that being who they would have me be is the only way to inspire their confidence. But that's not really confidence, is it?

I dance my own dance. People are free to join in if they like. Those who do are my friends. My best friends are those who dance with me. They express themselves by creating variations on my themes. I express myself by creating variations on theirs. Those who sit on the sidelines waiting for me to call on them are not my friends. If they were, they'd have accepted the open invitation.

There are two successful approach strategies girls have used with me.

Girls have sat down next to me and commented on a subject I was studying. The topic-comment format follows the natural flow of my thoughts and allows me to respond automatically (uncritically). These girls were confident, observant, and knew how to inspire confidence in others. The potential for classical (romantic) friendship was there from the start.

Girls have also invited me to study them. These types of relationships were triggered by infatuation. One girl studied me as I studied others. When our eyes met, she studied me studying her. (Those quiet observant types are really cute.) Two girls gave themselves to me. The first gave without any resistance. The second wanted to give and take. But everything she wanted was circumstantial. I told her I was real, she could take it or leave it. She left. Several minutes later she approached me again. She introduced a topic, my feelings. I expressed uncertainty certain sensations. She expressed uncertainty regarding a sensation. I found I felt the same and agreed. Then she gave herself to me.

It didn't matter what we did. We didn't even have to be doing the same thing. We just needed to be near each other when we did it. Proximity allowed for spontaneous interaction and thus opportunities for intimacy. Intimacy is the substance of friendship. And if I was nothing else, I was always their best friend.

[Artemis]

That was beautiful, Kioshi. I was very much in love with and had a long term relationship with a man just like you. Sadly he is deceased from lung cancer. I miss him. You are very special. My lover brought out the best in me. It's obvious you do the same to those around you.

And because he was such as he was, I gave myself to him the very first time I met him. I think women expect guys to try and when they don't it gets real confusing. I think this is what happened to me. He was just waiting.

[Joy]

Kim! Put your hands in the air and step away from the INFp!

[mike_INTJ]

It's wrong when a women pursues in hope of reciprocation, but can never be sure if it's there. I have been there. I have always been a women ready to initiate, but I have been through so many situations in which (like with this INFp, also with the INTj and with others) I desperately look for signs, tiptoe around them, don't want to hurt their feelings and lose myself in the process. And that is what Megan was trying to tell me here, I think. She is basically asking me why I would want to convince someone who is reluctant and not sure? Why would he be sure once he is convinced? We are not talking about a male-female thing per se here. This is about me (and others) wanting to be loved by people who might or might not love us back. Once you realize that your attempts are perhaps a bit desperate and not healthy, it might be time to sit back and let those who perhaps truly love you do their share. I have gone out of my way more than once and what I read in Megan's statement is that dammit, it they want to be with me, they have to quit being so freakin' precious and get their act together. Or they might never get it together.

personally i would love to have a girl want me. one has in the past, but it turned out she is a hollow flirt who is married and has no interest in me at all, besides something to do at work. the signs she put out did not reflect that she liked me, she was all talk, yet she convinced other girls that she did have a thing for me (for those that don't look for subtle behaviors like i do). she pushed many away because of this, i finally yelled at her.

ideally as an intj, i can't speak for the others, but i my N and T are between 50-70% and i can switch depending on the situation, i think i can feel what's going on here in this conversation.

if a you came up to me and told me she liked me - i personally would not believe you. i mostly don't trust anyone. howver knowing this, i would be activily be checking if you were looking at me, or have behavior that would suggest you were telling the truth. further i would be checking to see that the inflection i heard in your voice, the way you looked at me, - how that reflects on what you do with everyone. did you come up to me super happy and excited? do you do that with everyone? if so, you go down a notch on the great ladder. did you seem nice? are you nice to everyone? do you seem to flirt with everyone?

the list goes on for miles and miles. i will then acertain if you have qualities that i'm looking for - cooking, computers, geek stuff, trek stuff, etc. i personally want someone who doesn't mind huge silent gaps in conversation, i'm a master at this. then i have to figure out if you would fit in a grand master plan of life, from dating, to marriage, to kids, to retirement. what would we do together, talk about, what sort of things would you likely try doing in the future... etc.

from there i will deicde if i trust you enough to share something of me back to you. a gift, maybe talking (unless we have something to talk about). i'll see how you respond. many get gifts, gush over them, then cast them aside. will you do something with the gift? show it off? admire it? use it? will it collect dust? if you keep it safe, i'll admire that...

as a whole i suck as a decent comunicator, and hope that a girl will help in this department. i've found, i think, an ISFJ but it's just a guess. she's real quiet, i'm real quiet, i don't see how this will ever work - but maybe she could do the first step... i need a positive action. after all if a guy touches a girl - it's harrasment. if a girl touches a guy, it's ok. i don't like taking chances like that - which is probably why i'll be alone forever.

[mike_INTJ]

If men are supposed to initiate any relationship, I guess I'm damned. When it comes to matters like that, if I'm involved, it screws up my "feeling radar" completely. No way to know whether a girl is interested or ust playing a cruel joke. Or even not interested, just me imagining things. I'd never actually take the first step. If I envision such a situation, with me taking the first step, I usually imagine the girl getting offended, creeped out or seeing it as "leverage" to make me do her wish. She would have to take the first step, and explicitly, before I would ever dare taking part in any relationship. This is part of my "shell", and it has to be broken through before I can feel comfortable. I wouldn't have any wish of control over where it was all going. In fact, I'd be overjoyed if she took the responsibility. I'd feel that I lucked out, I found somebody who actually wants to take care of it.

i can understand this. while i can sense, read, feel what the other peson is thinking, based on voice inflection, body movements, how it was said, speed, etc, eye movement and the like. when it comes to knowing if someone likes me, i have no idea. or maybe i do know, but as it doesn't happen that often, i don't believe it. or that you don't want to take a chance and make a fool of yourself, really need to know how they feel about me in anyway to take a chance.

the only thing i've been able to do is to give some kind of toy on a holiday. it's a little more innocent then - but it's each month on one person. i'm trying something larger at christmas, and hope it doesn't backfire. but frankly if she asked me out - i wouldn't have any idea of what to do and i would have no idea of what to say....

[mike_INTJ]

You know, when I really like someone, I know if he is shy and perhaps to shy to make the first step. And I will happily do it, but it's an effort for me, too, and I'm afraid of rejection, too. So all I'm asking is to engange in the conversation when it's brought up. When I tell you that I really like you or are in love with you, then please make an effort to tell me how you feel. I'm not asking shy guys to come running after me, just help me out a little...

if you said you liked me - i would probably want to know why - a specific thing i might have actually been doing right. if you said you loved me, i wouldn't believe you - as love takes time and understanding, i never liked it when people used it all willy-nilly.

chances are if you ask how i felt about you - i would say OK - and that's it. as i might not even know how i'm feeling. i don't share my emotions that much - this board - is about as open as i'm getting. shy guys are incapable of sharing more - if we did, we wouldn't be shy.

I just don't want to put myself out there anymore to get a confusing answer or signals...It's frustrating to chase after something when you don't even know how the other person really feels...

And I cannot help but be attracted to shy and quiet guys...

you'll get confusion by going up to a person and telling them they like you. it's like someone coming up to you and telling you that you've won the lottery. even though you never entered - would you believe them? what would your reaction be? awe? confusion? it's something like that. instead of talking about liking and loving, maybe - a remark about cute, or something physical. personally, i'm just trying to form a natural looking smile when i dont' feel like smiling.

[mike_INTJ]

To have a whole group of mostly women say this is not true/true and its wrong/right or whatever is great, but males views are great too. I think we generally need to listen to males and their experiences more without judging them. I would like to hear more reflective, non-politically correct views of males about this issue, particularly males who have actually been persistently and actively pursued by females more than just a few times. Yes, I have heard that it is flattering and such a girl is great especially if she is willing to have sex, but in reality (not theory, this might quite different), when this has happened, how did you come to think of her eventually, and how did the relationship progress?

i've mentioned this one person in the past in other things i've written. basically a girl i worked with persued me in about 10 different way. each in a 2 month span, taking a few weeks off to reset as i blew her off. her sincerity was not convicing me.

she tried down and dirty, singing nasty songs and getting right to the XXX version. told other's (and still does), that she's jealous, and she doesn't want anyone talking to me. she possibly nuked any chances i had with anyone in ear shot, i still cannot forgive her.

she tried very hard in different ways, she had a kid, no ring, never said she was married. no one around her said she was married, they all speak mostly spanish. every now and then they would leak out that she's married, but it was so fast it was almost subliminal. i tried to figure out why she had a kid, i assumed she was easy. i decided, after many simulations that it can be possible for us to be together. and since this never happened to me, i decided to open the gate and let some emotion come out.

at the very least i wanted to know if she really did like me or not. i mostly knew it wasn't real, because she never did the little things, like sit near me, look at me, try talking to me for real, give gifts (even on real occasions), etc - never did any of those things. only big stuff, no small stuff. never came on to me when she was alone, only an audience would do. i thought it was a support thing - it was more of a spanish soap opera to them.

so i wanted to see if it was for real, and for experimental purposes, see what i could do, and see what her reactions were. i'm using some of these methods on someone else now.

in the end, she dropped off my ladder of trust, floating in the infinite void. i ignore her totally, don't trust any of her friends - they all kept it hidden from me. it closed my emotional gates, and made it harder for other's to get to me. i don't and won't ever forgive her.

mostly i want someone to find me attractive and to persue me, i never had that many friends as a kid. so it would me a lot to me if someone did persue me. but it doesn't happen that often, so when it does, i will always tread carefully. my emotional level is like a volcano ready to burst. or a raging ocean ontop of a very fragile dam, ready to break and destroy the town.

i don't want to be the dominant one. it's hard to do that, and shouldn't be expected. i don't care if other's perceive me as weak - i think most people are stupid anyway. i'd just like to know what happiness is.

[mike_INTJ]

Well since you asked....
I like to be the pursuer. I like it when the female is responsive though. Ive always liked girls that were smart and funny but a little reserved. Thats just me though. If she seems open and asks me questions about myself then I will definitely take notice of that. If she teases me a little, she gets another point. If after we have gotten to know each other a bit and we seem like we are hitting it off and she grabbs my arm or lightly hits me when I tease her then she gets more points. Teasing and playfulness are very good qualities as long as I am confident she knows how far to take it and are backed by a solid sense of realism and ethics.
Women who like and respect themselves and make others feel good about who they are, are a turn on IMO.

teasing is something i want to know more about. what kind of teasing? i was always teased by kids in school as a child - so i don't like it as an adult. i assume it's a different kind of teasing, and i've read about it. but what does it mean exactly? thanks

[Kim]

mike, since I just this year met an INTj who I really feel for, I have seen a lot of what you posted. I very much enjoy being friends with him and although I wish it could have been taken further, I can see why he is hesitant.

He went out of his way during the phase of getting to know each other (e-mail and telephone) by writing every day. I know that was a huge effort. It was a strain on him. Now that we are friends, he still keeps in touch although he would rather just be on his own 24/7 and not have to cater to other people.

What I'm trying to say is that everyone will have to try and meet the other person somewhere in the middle. It can be a strain and it can be a risk, but it will let the other person know that you truly care enough to try. The INTj rarely told me just how much he cares about me, but I knew because of how he acted.

I think I'm growing a bit weary of the romantic to-do-lists for the types (although I have initiated many of them). With the INTj, I started to get paranoid: Oh, I can't tell him how much I like him, I can't do this, I can't do that. Same with the INFp.

With the INTj, I threw it all overboard when I decided to not actively pursue romance anymore and it's been a very nice friendship. With the INFp, I just talk about things that puzzle me and we take it from there.

I really get paranoid and wound up with American Dating System + Types and Romantic Behavior. Too much!

[Creepy-Kioshi]

SIS: What do you want?
BRO: I don't know. What are you having?
SIS: Why do I always have to decide? You decide this time.
BRO: OK. I'll leave it up to you.

(Most of what follows are just my thoughts at the moment. Trying to understand myself in relation to my ENFP sister is an ongoing effort.)

My sister and I just interfere with each other if we try to solve problems together. We are just there for each other. Even when I distance myself psychologically, it's comforting to feel her presence. And when she needs a sounding board, I am there to listen.

When I am trying to manage a problem my sister tends to switch into play mode. I think, for her, my problem management comes off as problem solving in a dark mood. So she tries to lighten the mood and helps me solve the problem. I tend to do the same for her.

[Creepy-Kioshi]

My ENFP sister loves to make to-do lists as well. She seldom follows her lists. But she loves to make them.

[Creepy-Kioshi]

How do we resolve problems relating to role ambiguities, role conflicts, and role incompatibilities? This is the question role theories try to answer.

How do we create supportve environments for a diverse range of experiences? This is the question personality theories try to answer.

To develop a productive relationship with my sister, I want to understand myself in relation to her and how this role supports her. It doesn't take a long list.

Rule One: When my sister is trying to solve a problem, just be an active listener. Don't interefere.

Rule Two: When my sister is trying to manage a problem, distract her and guide her through the problem.

Rule Three: Don't worry so much about rules one and two. Most of it comes naturally. Just play with her and try not to interfere.

[mike_INTJ]

My ENFP sister loves to make to-do lists as well. She seldom follows her lists. But she loves to make them.

i find that many ENFP people are dreamers - not do'ers. i know one person, her whole financial plan rests on winning the lottery. or other's that say they will buy a new car, go to hawaii, go on a cruise - talk about it endlessly, then never go. it was just a dream...

[Topaz]

My ENFP sister loves to make to-do lists as well. She seldom follows her lists. But she loves to make them.

i find that many ENFP people are dreamers - not do'ers. i know one person, her whole financial plan rests on winning the lottery. or other's that say they will buy a new car, go to hawaii, go on a cruise - talk about it endlessly, then never go. it was just a dream...

This is somewhat true. ENFPs are dreaming away hoping that someone will listen and say 'OK lets go'. All I need is just a little support and I will do just about anything but without it everything drags and takes forever. The only problem is that the enfps dual istp takes soooo much to convince.

[Topaz]

My ENFP sister loves to make to-do lists as well. She seldom follows her lists. But she loves to make them.

i find that many ENFP people are dreamers - not do'ers. i know one person, her whole financial plan rests on winning the lottery. or other's that say they will buy a new car, go to hawaii, go on a cruise - talk about it endlessly, then never go. it was just a dream...

This is somewhat true. ENFPs are dreaming away hoping that someone will listen and say 'OK lets go'. All I need is just a little support and I will do just about anything but without it everything drags and takes forever. The only problem is that the enfps dual istp takes soooo much to convince.

[Creepy-]

I think women expect guys to try and when they don't it gets real confusing.

She had all the qualities I look for in a friend. As I approached her group, I attempted to make visual contact with the leader. She was watching my approach. He seemed oblivious. As I neared, he jumped in my path and started posturing. My mistake, I had taken him for a leader. I turned my attention to her, and continued my approach. He backed down.

She was tense, but started to relax. Our eyes met. She smiled. I looked at her gently and made a gesture, yielding to her. She seemed delighted and started to speak. Then she stopped. She looked at her friends playing. She seemed confused. She looked back at me. Then she looked away. She seemed to struggle with a thought. And then she resigned. She turned to me with a look of apology and looked down. I continued on my way.

I try.

I wish we had met in a ballroom. The rules there are so simple. A look. A smile. A bow. Take her hand if she offers it, and escort her onto the floor. A look. A smile. A touch. Who needs words?

I give them an open invitation. What more can I do?

[Artemis]

My ENFP sister loves to make to-do lists as well. She seldom follows her lists. But she loves to make them.

i find that many ENFP people are dreamers - not do'ers. i know one person, her whole financial plan rests on winning the lottery. or other's that say they will buy a new car, go to hawaii, go on a cruise - talk about it endlessly, then never go. it was just a dream...

So I'm really ENFp and not INFp?

[Artemis]

I think women expect guys to try and when they don't it gets real confusing.

She had all the qualities I look for in a friend. As I approached her group, I attempted to make visual contact with the leader. She was watching my approach. He seemed oblivious. As I neared, he jumped in my path and started posturing. My mistake, I had taken him for a leader. I turned my attention to her, and continued my approach. He backed down.

She was tense, but started to relax. Our eyes met. She smiled. I looked at her gently and made a gesture, yielding to her. She seemed delighted and started to speak. Then she stopped. She looked at her friends playing. She seemed confused. She looked back at me. Then she looked away. She seemed to struggle with a thought. And then she resigned. She turned to me with a look of apology and looked down. I continued on my way.

I try.

I wish we had met in a ballroom. The rules there are so simple. A look. A smile. A bow. Take her hand if she offers it, and escort her onto the floor. A look. A smile. A touch. Who needs words?

I give them an open invitation. What more can I do?

This is exactly how I imagine FDG. Maybe it's the Italian reputation.

[Kim]

My ENFP sister loves to make to-do lists as well. She seldom follows her lists. But she loves to make them.

i find that many ENFP people are dreamers - not do'ers. i know one person, her whole financial plan rests on winning the lottery. or other's that say they will buy a new car, go to hawaii, go on a cruise - talk about it endlessly, then never go. it was just a dream...

So I'm really ENFp and not INFp?

nah, you are not ENFp.

And some ENFps do follow through with things.

[Creepy-Kioshi]

Type theories deal with form (context), not content or intent.

ENFP is nothing more than the form (context) in which my sister works.

Whether or not she follows through is a question of intent, not form. She doesn't make lists for the purpose of following them through. Making lists is just another way for her to sound off.