oops rmcnew
oops rmcnew
Some people just want to gripe, and there are some disagreements; it is all part of life.Originally Posted by ms k
I see something about the VI page not being substantiated with explanations, and then just saying that you have a bad attitude about your expertise?
it looks like a fair chunk of this dispute regards what goes on on this forum, not on your site.
as long as its clear what your experience is and where you're getting things you've used as sources on your site, I don't see what's wrong with making a website about your assessments or even compilations of other's work.
Newcomers to this forum and to your site should just know the extent your studies and can decide for themselves whether its worth accepting or not, yeah? Personally I think it's stated in your site, if not in this forum.
i for one don't really take anything online as the end all authority on socionic theory because everything in eglish is rather new and done by amateurs? right?
my point is, i don't think reuben's site is any different than any other blog or source which information should be examined and scrunized. I don't think people need to prove themselves to criticize whats out there online, nor do i think that people should criticize unless they've got something substantial to say!
Way back on Sept 11th after my first test result (INFP) Reuben mentioned the following...
Pretty damn close, considering my results said INFP. I mean, it said right in the test results in type by attribute that that isn't necessarily your "actual type". Even a dumbass newb like myself can read that, take pause and go "oh, you mean there's more to it than that?" and then seek out the necessary help on the forums he linked in the test results which is exactly what he did.
On Sept 28th he mentioned...
Finally, on November 2nd I come to that conclusion myself. Not bad, especially considering that the large bold font letters in his test never once said I was an ENTj. He used his knowledge and his tools and figured out my type accurately long before I or anyone else did. Others here (Rocky, Hugo, etc) have linked me to their mini-tests also, and you know what? They all missed it too.Does that mean they're idiots too? No. The point is, there's no foolproof test (yet) and testing is merely one tool as far as helping determining types go. Not once have I taken a test where it actually said ENTj and believe me I've taken a lot of tests. The test I gave my wife (not mcnew's) also missed her too. She's definitely ISFj, not ESTj. Profiles are also important, as is seeing how you interact with other people, and what sort of relationships you have, etc, blah blah blah you guys know that already....
Yeah, I don't think he ever claimed to be. In fact, a month or so ago i sent Reuben a PM asking him what his background was, just to see what his true qualifications were. No, he's not a professional, but his background was "good enough" for me. He was correct on my type too, but it didn't stop me from seeking out the opinions of others here as well.
Speaking of which, I would still LOVE to see any counter-arguments here as per my type if somebody thinks I'm not ENTj. You've all been too busy spamming up my thread with flames about what a clown McNew surely is to even bother though, nevermind the fact that he came damn close 2 months ago, and pretty much nailed it a month and a half ago. If you guys are so friggin smart and mcnew is such a moron, then why the hell did he get it when he did and not you guys? Good grief, grow the hell up.
Anyways, thanks for all the "help". Credit goes mostly to Reuben though, no matter what anybody thinks of him here. Will stick around and would love to hear comments about my type conclusion, but as for this lame ass little Internet pissing match I'm done.
/Peace out.
Steve
How do you expect to be typed when we know nothing about you?
I have been scanning through some of these posts here and I guess it gets pretty volatile and sometimes I get mentioned here and there.
Alright, this is how I see all of this:
Socionics is a sort of "field" of study. I see it as a science, some here don't see it that way, whatever. Truth is that from any reputable person's perspective we are a bunch of amateurs and really don't know what we are talking about. We have an idea, but we really don't fully know.
Now why don't we know what we are talking about?
Well, first off, we don't speak Russian, so what we know is limited to online translations and intuitive speculation. We also think like Westerners, the connotations of every word are very different, so even though it looks like we know what we are talking about chances are we are a bit lost. We just can't quite grasp where the original socionists were coming from. That's going to take time, experience, education and translations.
Also, too many people pretend they have all of the answers and don't ask enough questions. That's what I feel my advantage is over Reuben McNew and alot of other fellow amateurs. I am not trying to win a name for myself, I am trying to win understanding because that is what is most important to me and I am wholley unsatisfied with what is being offered. I am not a bullshitter but have come to a point where I feel uncomfortable saying what I do know because I sort of feel like my insights can feed someone else's reputation(which is stupid).
My hope is that what IS legitimately accepted by practicing socionists can be published as high quality translations. I know some people say "well, who decides what a socionist is?" In my opinion I consider a socionist someone that has had before them structured, well written information before them and communication with other people that have had the same. Age and experience in sociology or psychology would also be a plus.
Also, due to many of my insights i have realized that this stuff takes alot of time to really understand. you ABSOLUTELY DO NOT learn it over the course of a few nights. It comes one epiphany at a time and comes much sooner with the help of those with a better background(I'll admit I've had a hand recently). That's how learning any science is, I suppose. Takes alot of integration and contemplation in order to put meaning behind those symbols.
As for all of this "well, what are you contributing to socionics? Huh?!?" sorta talk directed at me and some people that are critical of all of the showmanship, well, I think that I am contributing my share. I think that people listen to what I have to say and I hope that they get the point that I don't claim to have all of the answers. I usually make that pretty clear. Why should I feel like I have to make a website in order to criticize what I feel is potentially deceptive information? I never said that RMcNew was wrong about everything, I'm sure he has some insights, but for the most part he seems to try to disguise his ignorance. He acts too certain about what he talks about but I doubt he can discuss any overarching themes relating to socionics. Hey, maybe I'm wrong, but I have always gotten the impression that he is worrying more about making a name for himself than actually figuring this stuff out. Not that he isn't trying to figure it out, but he seems to be putting this stuff together as he goes along. It just seems cheap to me. I'm not saying he's a bad guy, but socionics isn't MBTI, it's more specific than that and there ARE pretty strict definitions for what functions are. He seems to take more of an MBTI sort of approach, which is vague and equivocal. Socionics has structure underlying it, and I don't see that reflected in any type profile listed on his site. Basically, it IS NOT SOCIONICS, it is MBTI with a socionics twist. I'm not wrong about that. He should have a disclaimer for visitors because it IS deceptive and he isn't qualified to pass himself off as an authority. If he had access to firsthand sources, then yeah, maybe, but he doesn't even have that. I'm playing fair now people.
But as for me not giving people credit, well, I owe Sergei Ganin credit, he has given me a few insights. As for not appreciating other forum members, I really don't know where that comes from. If I think someone is making an interesting point I'll say so but for the most part I think that I have crossed a point most forum members have not yet crossed. Sorry.
I agree with the disclaimer part and I told rmcnew this.
Entp
ILE
I propose this as Rueben new disclaimer...
WARNING: I am an amatuer and I have no clue what I'm talking about. Do not take me seriously.
First off, I would like to say that while I may often disagree at times, I still value what other people say and I do keep things in consideration. And I have to say, that this is probably one of the better things I have heard from waddles. Atleast I am no longer getting the impression of threatened notions and putdown attempts, which was my general impression beforehand.Also, too many people pretend they have all of the answers and don't ask enough questions. That's what I feel my advantage is over Reuben McNew and alot of other fellow amateurs. I am not trying to win a name for myself, I am trying to win understanding because that is what is most important to me and I am wholley unsatisfied with what is being offered. I am not a bullshitter but have come to a point where I feel uncomfortable saying what I do know because I sort of feel like my insights can feed someone else's reputation(which is stupid).
Why should I feel like I have to make a website in order to criticize what I feel is potentially deceptive information? I never said that RMcNew was wrong about everything, I'm sure he has some insights, but for the most part he seems to try to disguise his ignorance. He acts too certain about what he talks about but I doubt he can discuss any overarching themes
relating to socionics. Hey, maybe I'm wrong, but I have always gotten the impression that he is worrying more about making a name for himself than actually figuring this stuff out. Not that he isn't trying to figure it out, but he seems to be putting this stuff together as he goes along. It just seems cheap to me. I'm not saying he's a bad guy, but socionics isn't MBTI, it's more specific than that and there ARE pretty strict definitions for what functions are. He seems to take more of an MBTI sort of approach, which is vague and equivocal. Socionics has structure underlying it, and I don't see that reflected in any type profile listed on his site. Basically, it IS NOT SOCIONICS, it is MBTI with a socionics twist. I'm not wrong about that.
He should have a disclaimer for visitors because it IS deceptive and he isn't qualified to pass himself off as an authority. If he had access to firsthand sources, then yeah, maybe, but he doesn't even have that. I'm playing fair now people.
I do have a few things to say in my defense, however ...
From what I have gathered, atleast 6 base assumptions are gathered here against me ...
1.) That I am seeking to make a name for myself over actually understanding the information
2.) That I am trying to bullshit my way into making people believe I am someone I am not
3.) That I am trying to disguise my ignorance make others believe that I am intelligent
4.) That I am just slapping things together as I go along haphazardly
5.) That I am intentionally deceiving people into believing I am an authority
6.) That what I am doing is not socionics, and probably something else
In a way, I do not agree with waddlesworth either. I disagree about taking a strict structured view towards socionics, as I believe that looking at things with too much structure and too much rigidity is probably not a good thing. Yeah, there are 16 types and some 14 relationships, but who is to say that in doing that everybody fits 100% into one type and everyone knows not even every relationship is 100% alike. There also needs to be some fluency there with that structure. But, I would also say looking at things in an extremly vague way is just as bad. Do not get me wrong, but I think there needs to be a balance between those extremes. Heck, I am not perfect. I have my flaws just like everyone else. Although, it really does not do much in the way of justice to claim that I have taken an MBTI approach to things, taking the awarerness that in the usage of socionics in other countries and in other languages there is just as much varying opinions within the theory as there is in MBTI or any other accepted psychological theory. In this regards, to say that I am not a strict follower of the socionic theory is obsurd, since even among perceived authorities there is debate over that supposed strictness. With such varied concensus, who is able to point fingers? Should I be considered any less because I might have my own theories and my own agenda? If the answer is yes, I can only say that I have only witnessed another closeminded attempt to discredit me, my efforts, and unwillingness to learn from mistakes. If the answer is no, then I would say that is a decent fair opinion and a sign of openminded willingness to learn, just as I am willing to learn mistake or no mistake.
It should also be noted that often times I am more of an experimenter than I am a philosopher, and I have absolutly no problem making my own experimentations in sight of my critics and in sight of those who do not understand or appreciate my efforts, and sometimes even in front of those who may even attempt to use that as a means to discredit my efforts of to do harm to my reputation and my works. I really am not one to sit to just one standard and to be forced into accepting whatever is at hand. I need something fresh and new, I like to combine ideas and to make things that other people can use to make things easier for people. And most improtantly, I like to surround myself with as many ideas and concepts as I possibly can. I can see no better way to do this than to create my own website and to have active participants in my studies who also may be benefiting from my work. But in the end, there may be a chance that my efforts may actually discover something that indefinatelly works, while the rest fiddle around in the darkness with theories that may be prone to randomness and some innacuracy. Instead, why not attempt to change things for the better. That is my effort afterall ...
Taking this, I will say in defense of Dmitri Lytov that we are very similar in our motives. Some people have said that Dmitri should not be taken seriously on account of the fact that most of the material on his websites are not of his own origion, and I believe that to be a false assumption. You see, just like me he also finds interest in the same material and seeks to surround himself with the same sort of beliefs and ideas. I seriously doubt he has any more of a drive to look like an authority than I do. But, to say that he is not much of a socionist and should not be take seriously on account of his based incentive for the collection of ideas is something I just do not agree with. You see, by compiling a collection of these, he is also considering them and leaving them to the consideration of others. And I am doing the same, whether you accept what is made available or not is not any concern of ours.
The only other thing I will say is that many of the baseline assumptions others have about me are totally false. I am not trying to look like an authority, I am not trying to bullshit my way into looking like somone I am not, I am not trying to disguise my ignorance, I am not trying to deceive people, and I am not trying to undermine the theory of socionics. But, it is no secret that I do have my own ideas about things and my own agenda that may conflict with some interest of others and I totally expect that. Just do not expect me to change my mind by insulting my intelligence, spreading false rumors, and basically self-victimizing yourselves with paranoia. My advice to my critics is to put your energy into something more useful than worrying about what I am doing. In any case, do not expect me to change on account of that ...
Someone needs a tissue.
Would you like some cheese with your whine? hehe
Someone needs a tissue.
Would you like some cheese with your whine? hehe
Aren't ENTP's supposed to be original?
Cry more.Someone needs a tissue.
Would you like some cheese with your whine? hehe
Aren't ENTP's supposed to be original?
Good one?
I mean, if youre gonna come at me...atleast have some half decent material. I'm dissapointed that I'm being dissed by an ENTP and all he can come up with is C Level sitcom material. I thought ENTPs were funny. Please stop kid. Your ruining my image of ENTPs.
Did I mention Larceny is only a young adult, IE in his late teens early twenties and has been lying about his age the whole time, as I'm sure you've all realized by now?
http://www.enneagraminstitute.com/fo...06&whichpage=1
Read.
"To become is just like falling asleep. You never know exactly when it happens, the transition, the magic, and you think, if you could only recall that exact moment of crossing the line then you would understand everything; you would see it all"
"Angels dancing on the head of a pin dissolve into nothingness at the bedside of a dying child."
I dont recall ever saying how old I am here, so how have I been lying?
The only time I've mentioned age is when I said "I'm old enough to be your father", which is probably true.
No, you're either a little younger or the same age as McNew, whom I believe is in his early twenties.
"To become is just like falling asleep. You never know exactly when it happens, the transition, the magic, and you think, if you could only recall that exact moment of crossing the line then you would understand everything; you would see it all"
"Angels dancing on the head of a pin dissolve into nothingness at the bedside of a dying child."
that isn't lev, is it?
Nope.
"To become is just like falling asleep. You never know exactly when it happens, the transition, the magic, and you think, if you could only recall that exact moment of crossing the line then you would understand everything; you would see it all"
"Angels dancing on the head of a pin dissolve into nothingness at the bedside of a dying child."
I've also refered to posters at that forum as "son" when theyre probably twice my age.
Why would I lie? I have nothing to hide. I've posted my pic numerous times at different forums and always stated my real age.
You're reaching a little too far on this one, bucko.
"I've also refered to posters at that forum as "son" when theyre probably twice my age.
Why would I lie? I have nothing to hide. I've posted my pic numerous times at different forums and always stated my real age.
You're reaching a little too far on this one, bucko."
No I'm not, you've stated that you're probably "twice his age", or something along those lines.
"To become is just like falling asleep. You never know exactly when it happens, the transition, the magic, and you think, if you could only recall that exact moment of crossing the line then you would understand everything; you would see it all"
"Angels dancing on the head of a pin dissolve into nothingness at the bedside of a dying child."
1 - I dont know how old anyone here is.
2 - I am probably twice his age. In IQ years.
Damn INTj moderators and their weak Se.
Ban someone already!!!!!!
Binary or dichotomous systems, although regulated by a principle, are among the most artificial arrangements that have ever been invented. -- William Swainson, A Treatise on the Geography and Classification of Animals (1835)
It's getting a little silly now. Nothing constructive is being said anymore so I just suggest everyone give it a rest. But I don't see any need to ban anyone.
That's because Se is your role function.
Binary or dichotomous systems, although regulated by a principle, are among the most artificial arrangements that have ever been invented. -- William Swainson, A Treatise on the Geography and Classification of Animals (1835)
I think this forum is sometimes a bit too politically correct and agreeably though I confess it is rather very civilised and should remain that way. If someone has a different and vastly unpopular view it is actually quite refreshing for me to hear it( I may be alone on this). I find the constant agreeing echo far more annoying and possibly inauthentic.
I don't think any ban is necessary, people who want to share ther views and are more concerned with that than wanting to appear "nice" could at least be tolerated or ignored. However, If a post is truly disrespectful then it might be best to delete it.
Ban who? The guy who is already posting as a guest? Or McNew? Or maybe Mystic should ban himself??
Clue: Moderators don't have the ability to ban anyone, only the admin does.
"To become is just like falling asleep. You never know exactly when it happens, the transition, the magic, and you think, if you could only recall that exact moment of crossing the line then you would understand everything; you would see it all"
"Angels dancing on the head of a pin dissolve into nothingness at the bedside of a dying child."
I'll be honest, you're not worth the time. You come off as a little asshole who likes to pick fights behind the anonymity of the internet, probably because you were molested by one of your parents growing up. There's a whole list of things wrong with your character, that I am actually going to go ahead and make, so that we're all clear on how much of a fool you are.
Here you made a blanket assertion in a mature discussion, and heavily laced it with derisiveness. Anyone practiced in the simple art of politeness will tell you that doing this will cause people to rightfully hate you, because A. it shows that you're a rude piece of garbage with no sense of decency, and B. that you lack the intelligence to get people to like you. I feel really bad for you, honestly. These are horrible personality traits that NO ONE likes.I propose this as Rueben new disclaimer...
WARNING: I am an amatuer and I have no clue what I'm talking about. Do not take me seriously.
Here of course you assume that I actually care what you think. To be fair, I technically do, but not because you're anything along the lines of formidable, or competent. Rather, I an concerned with your well-being. You are obviously afflicted by severe egomania, and narcissism. These are traits that unfortunately reveal your true intentions to people behind your back. For instance, when you say something like:I mean, if youre gonna come at me...atleast have some half decent material. I'm dissapointed that I'm being dissed by an ENTP and all he can come up with is C Level sitcom material. I thought ENTPs were funny. Please stop kid. Your ruining my image of ENTPs.
People actually see:I am probably twice his age. In IQ years.
OrMy dick is about the size of a sundried anchovy. dotn look plz.
People read:All youve done is sit back and taken cyber-bitch-slaps.
Also, there is a whole collection of statements that I find troubling:I hate myself. Please touch my anus anyway.
Here it becomes completely obvious to me, and everyone else reading, that you have NO. FUCKING. IDEA. what you're talking about. Just... none. You pull these statements out of your ass, (and I'm sure you get much pleasure storing them there) and then you act all self-important, like you're the center of attention. But I digress. Let us look at these "intelligent observations" individually, to further compound the truth of the matter.LOL! There's another thing....ENTPs are supposedly VERY open minded. You are not open minded at all.
ENTPs view things from all angles. You just view things from your own narrow point of view.
Nothing logical about this guy at all.
ENTPs love being put on the spot. They react quickly to it too! You do not.
Heck, even your profile on ENTPs make it seem like you are looking for SYMPATHY. Not very logical.
I dont know if youre an ENFP. But I DO KNOW ONE THING, and it's that youre not an ENTP.
Hmm, brilliant use of Euclidean logic there, "son." (I say "son" because it makes me feel more intelligent, because in my imagination I belittle people my pretending they are children) ENTps are defined by their cognitive functions, which do not necessarily imply any sort of mindedness. You leapt to that conclusion because you are a dumbass.LOL! There's another thing....ENTPs are supposedly VERY open minded. You are not open minded at all.
BRAVO. You are the first person in existence to be able to deduce (or perhaps induce?) someone's reasoning methods via non-self-revealing written text. Other people use hokey methods that are primitive at best, such as "actually knowing the person" and "not being a dick."ENTPs view things from all angles. You just view things from your own narrow point of view.
Oh no, an ambiguous insult! Whatever could you mean by that? That he does things based off of a random number generator that functions on irrational principles that are popped into existence in another dimension? Hmm, maybe you mean his body exists in some odd physical state that we cannot comprehend, thus making your use of the word "guy" deceptively literal (or "disingenuous"....hahahaha). Or maybe you meant that "this guy" is actually a methaphor for "my life" and "logical" is code for "not pointless." You are truly a man of the ages. Every word you use is encased with depth and everything profound.Nothing logical about this guy at all.
Yes, because when you make an idiot of yourself on the internet and fling arrows at someone you do not know baselessly, and they ignore you, they're just being slow to react. Sorry son, what they're actually doing is just that, ignoring you.ENTPs love being put on the spot. They react quickly to it too! You do not.
Now you may want to sit down for this one. It will come as a shocker. See, rmcnew's profiles are created using a complicated method referred to as "intelligent thought process." I know, I know, it's unsettling. But it's perfectly normal to be bewildered by things like "truth," and "structure" when the bulk of your ideas have mostly consisted of nonsense you made up at night while getting buzzed off of permanent markers. Luckily, there is an easy solution: alcohol. Just drink a six pack a night and go joy riding in a remote area without a seatbelt. This will take the edge off things.Heck, even your profile on ENTPs make it seem like you are looking for SYMPATHY. Not very logical.
Nothing like telling everyone things you cannot possible know, eh? Major buzz, man. Especially when you actually get some dipshit to believe it, because that dipshit is the closest thing you're ever going to get to an actual friend.I dont know if youre an ENFP. But I DO KNOW ONE THING, and it's that youre not an ENTP.
Now, seeing as this is probably your first time being flamed, I suggest you take it like a man, and leave. I beg you don't compose some overly-dramatic post that took you an hour to write because you had to stop every three minutes to finger through a thesaurus.
It's mine too, and I see plenty reason.That's because Se is your role function.
LOL!
now compare discohoe's reply to rmcnew's replies. HUGE differences.
Thank you for proving my point!
What type is marus the maniac?
ASHL
http://forum.socionix.com
I don't see what's so important about the possibility of extraterrestrial life. It's just more people to declare war on.
EVERYONE PLZ CONTINUE TO UPLOAD INFINITE AMOUNT OF PICS OF "CUTE" CATS AND PUPPIES. YOU KNOW WE GIVE A SHIT!!
ENTJ (LIE). And I agree that discojoe is defintly an ENTP (ILE).
discohoe is an ENTP. and look how different him and McMoron react to certain things.I agree that discojoe is defintly an ENTP (ILE).
The way they approach things is very very different. How could they be the same type. They arent.
Ewwwwww .... gosh that stinks, someone needs a diaper change!discohoe is an ENTP. and look how different him and McMoron react to certain things.I agree that discojoe is defintly an ENTP (ILE).
The way they approach things is very very different. How could they be the same type. They arent.
LMAO..
such a Typical ENFP response!
Come on folks lets keep it up!
Top 4 threads in this sub-forum.
Just passed Labyrinth for the #3 spot and only a few more replies and I can get by MysticSonic for #2. After that it'd be a pretty long haul to get #1 but the way this thread is going, I think it could be done.1) INTj or INTp? Replies 168, Author metaiwan, Views 6410
2) [ Poll ] Ok, I can't wait anymore.... Replies 123, Author MysticSonic, Views 5848
3) rmcnew has me almost convinced I'm ENTj/ENxj, Replies 120, Author StevENTj, Views 1487
4) Ne and Ni, you and I? Replies 105, Author Labyrinth, Views 3431
Hey, that is pretty close!
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