Extended TheHotelAmbush Questionnaire

[tower]

The Extended Questionnaire v0.2 by @thehotelambush


Describe yourself.
Agent interacting with the world. Agent means a being with will. Oh and female. Still haven't lived enough. See the rest of the answers for more.

What do you study or do for a living? How did you come to do that? What do you like or dislike about it?
Not yet decided on my career. Want some more money and want it to match me, being enough of a challenge, intellectually matching my level too.

What are your values, and why?
I'll just mention two core ones now. I have never tried to fully organize this topic yet. So. Truth, perseverance, equally important. Truth: I have this image in my mind about always wanting objectivity for absolute truth even if it's "bad news". Perseverance: it's about how I won't give up on things. That would go against my fundamental being. Say, just how my brain got built.

What else do you do on a daily basis? What are your interests and hobbies? Why do you do them?
- On a daily basis right now... Deciding on career. Figuring out who I can commit to as my SO for a real relatonship.
Otherwise, as usual: maintaining my place where I live. Training. Educating myself. Looking for someone (yah, romantically), even before I figured out much about what I actually need there for such a relationship to work, eh. More recently, also trying to keep friendships maintained.
- Interest/hobby: Sports but this is not just a "light" hobby, I'm dead serious about it.

Describe your relations with family and friends. What do you like and dislike about them?
- Family: okay, we can all count on each other, no grudges held, can argue out in the open, no deep relationships though there and I don't know if I like that.
- Friends: not many close friends. I like it if they are attentive and are willing to go hang out together with me. I like how they are also intelligent and deep. Don't like it when they get flaky, best way to rile me up tho'.

What do you look for in friends? In romantic relationships?
- Friends: we can look at each other and go on to just have fun naturally together. Strong bonus: can have deep discussions too.
- Romantic: emotional compatibility... and deep discussions and attentiveness with enough mental healthiness overall. I don't know, still figuring out some parts of this. Last but not least, sex, of course.

What conflicts have you encountered recently with other people? Why did they happen? Which kinds seem to happen on a regular basis?
Conflicts arising from:
- communication issues
- unfair treatment
- disagreements on issues
- conflict of (material) interests
- just random bs started by whatever people

All that can happen regularly enough.

How would your friends describe you?
forceful/aggressive
logical/intelligent
willful=following own rules=can't be controlled
adaptable
calm

What do people generally see as your strengths? What do you like about yourself?
- They say:
logical/intelligent
confident
resourceful
persevering
will achieve what I set my mind to
athletic

- I like these too.

What are your weaknesses? What criticism do you often face from others? What do you dislike about yourself?
- They say as criticism:
forceful/aggressive (though friend didn't say it as criticism...)
too demanding/controlling
too rigid/stuck-up
insensitive/unfeeling-robotic
too intense in some things
- I see it as weakness (?): often only seeing what's in front of me. Not sure if this is an actual weakness but I've regretted it before. And I don't usually regret things so this says something.
- I dislike: when I get called too forceful.

In what areas of life can you manage well on your own? In what areas of your life would you like help?
- Former: impersonal stuff, anything that can be dealt with concretely.
- Latter: emotional stuff.

What things do you find to be a chore? What things do you enjoy more than others?
Um, no idea. I never think about this. Well, wait, maybe for second question, sports compared to some other people.

What goals, aspirations, or plans do you have for the future? How did you come to have them?
Figuring this out again. How, by taking my time on this more than I used to. Lol

If you had enough money to live comfortably for the rest of your life without working, what would you do with your time?
Take up some social causes by creating organizations for them (I already have several ideas on this but none serious right now because I have more urgent concerns now).

What traits do you find endearing that others might dislike? What traits are considered positive/neutral by others but tend to annoy you?
- First question: strong emotionality
- Second question: fake "charismatic" image that everyone's supposed to love without thinking

What kinds of things do you do to manage and/or beautify your environment (your room, your house, etc.)? What do you think of daily chores?
- First question: good stylish aesthetics on the whole with some bits of special touches, where uniqueness and interest in social status are both involved. Good furniture/main items with good materials, not saving on the money, and have matching items e.g. carpet, artsy pictures on the walls, material and colour of the walls/flooring/etc, each room with a different theme but matching on the whole, put some other cool objects here and there, incl. the cups/medals I won in competition. And organize all things neatly.
- Second question: neutral on them. They exist. OK. That's it.

How do you behave around strangers?
Reserved, contained. Can smile.

How do you react to conflict? What do you do if somebody insults or attacks you?
- First question: prefer to respond in some direct way to resolve it. Constructively is best but it's totally ok to first express anger etc.
- Second question:
1. Insult: depends on the situation. I could of course insult back but I don't like pointless and personal insults. Some examples: I'll tell them to fuck off if in an argument where personal bs doesn't belong, if the person is not close to me. If close to me, I can sometimes be a bit more patient to first figure out what's going on but ultimately I don't allow bad treatment to go on. I will intentionally ignore the insult if it's some guy in the street (I'm a girl), I don't care to start interaction with such guys.
2. Attack: if verbal, see above, usually pointless if it gets personal. If not then fine, I will directly respond. If part of an ongoing conflict, I retort. If physical (happened before), I respond physically, hold them down is my first instinct usually, but I can also dole out a retaliation. If more serious life-threatening attack e.g. in some bad street in the city (no this one didn't happen yet), I'd try to injure them, while trying to escape and I might also shout for help etc. If less direct attack, e.g. in business (happened before a few times), I counteract it in whatever way it's possible in the situation. But if less direct means some passive-aggressive shit e.g. sarcasm, I hate that and as soon as I identified it, I'll respond directly. e.g. strongly tell the person off etc.

What is one common misconception that people have? Explain why it is wrong.
I don't know what misconceptions are supposed to be all that specially common. I don't track this, there's so much bs out there. Well, wait, one example coming to mind, creationism in the USA... yeah. Seen there are definitely a LOT of people into it there. I can't believe that many people believe in that bs. It's wrong because it's all imaginary.

What did you do last Friday?
Got up with some difficulty (not good).
Breakfast. Little to-dos/tasks.
Trained.
Thought about my goals. What to change. How to move forward. Etc.
Had coffee in café.
Met current boyfriend there.
Ate out together.
Went to a bar to drink together.
Went home.
Thought more, digging more... and little to-dos/tasks etc.
Read up on psychology.
Doing this questionnaire now (it's Friday evening).
Gonna go to bed after.

What is your biggest accomplishment?
Well, one of them was, doing a business (ended it since then) with great money.

What is something you regret?
Making a decision in an important personal area of life based on the wrong data. I was feeling very disillusioned which affected my way of thinking without me noticing. Then a year later I realized certain things about this when I went on a holiday and had a chance to think about it again. I undid the decision there but the damage was already done and wasted time.

Who do you admire, and why?
No one, too independent for this.

What's been on your mind? Has anything been worrying or concerning you? What problems have you encountered lately?
Future life course has been on my mind. Still somewhat feeling like stuck in a status quo mode not yet fully knowing what to truly change and what can be left as is. Hard to figure out what's fine as it is now and what's gotta be changed. I've tried to change things and ended up realizing it was not what I needed to change. Really struggling with this part, always tripping myself up in it. And I'm so slow to get ahead from this but I am moving a bit.

What are your religious or spiritual beliefs and why do you hold them?
Abstract only. I'm too unfeeling by default for this.

What are your political beliefs, and why? To what extent do you care about politics?
Global government is what I'd like one day. And I care about some bigger political issues sometimes when people get really involved. Used to care more for my country's politics on a daily level but then had a disillusioning moment with the party I voted for back then. I still easily get interested though. Must be some instinct hah.

Would you ever be interested in starting a business? Why or why not? What role would you play in it? What kind of business would it be?
Already had one. Maybe will do another. Role: owner, do various tasks with business partner, I was also managing contacts with clients. I could also be interested in doing a bigger business where I can manage others too but that's not going to be right now.

What kind of work environment do you prefer? What do you look for in a job?
- 1st: a fair one.
- 2nd: enough money, challenge, intellectually too but I need a level of concreteness too.

What is or was your favorite school subject and why?
I excelled the most in chemistry, and mathematics, so to speak, affected me the most deeply mentally, and I really liked to outdo others physically but I dunno about favourites.

How do you approach responsibility? What do you tend to expect of others?
It's a normal thing is how I see it. I expect some basic things from people yep.

Where did you go on your most recent vacation? What did you do there? How did you like it and why?
Paris with close friend. Was poignant somehow but beautiful.

What were you like as a kid? How have you changed since you were a child?
Not all that much changed.

What was your high school experience like?
Crap. People thought I looked down on them.

Talk about a significant event from your life.
Skip

Do you like kids? Why or why not?
I'm very bad with small kids. I'm incredibly awkward and restrained with them. The older the kid the better.

If you were to raise a child, what would be your main concerns, what measures would you take, and why?
Take care of their autonomy and intelligence, including social intelligence, and their ambition.

Ever feel stuck in a rut? If yes, describe the causes and your reaction to it.
Yeah lately. Never before that. Would keep trying beating my head into the wall. Lol

How do you see other people as a whole? What do you consider a prevalent social problem? Name one.
1st: Not sure. 2nd: Will we survive and for what purpose. I do like to analyze the latter sometimes in more depth. But the former question... really really just flies over my head for some reason.

What do you do if you're not getting what you want? What approach do you use?
Any direct approach that will work for the situation if this is with people. Negotiate, argue, threats, sometimes can wait for better moment, whatever.
If this is about not getting to a long term goal in a timely fashion like I imagined it, I will get raging. Then I calm down and just keep moving, also figure out better methods if needed.

Are you comfortable taking leadership roles? In what areas? Why or why not?
I am. Wherever needed if I feel like it, if I care enough about the people and/or with my goal aligning with theirs enough. This isn't my default, I don't constantly go look around for the chance to take charge but I like it actually when I suddenly do so.

How often do you get angry? What kinds of things make you angry?
Several times a day, "too normal" for me lol. Why, things not behaving, people fucking around.

What is the best thing that happened to you during the past week?
One of my close friends finally passed an exam that I'd been supporting her so much about, for so long.

What is the worst thing that happened to you during the past week?
My training could've gone better.

What is the purpose of life? What do you find personally meaningful in life?
- 1st: Humanity's progress
- 2nd: Great enough goals with regard to contributing to people's good, understanding things on a deep level, challenges and achievements including competitive and "material stuff". A tiny little bit of abstract spirituality. Exploring the world. Special connections and talks and doing things with some people.

What is the most interesting place you have been, and why?
I've travelled too much to figure out the favourite.

How do you dress or manage your appearance?
Pricey enough, sexy enough, special enough (depending on what I can afford at a given time).

Do you like surprises?
If good.

Is there anything else important about you that we should know?
-

[The Exception]

I will say SLE is likely.

Base Se- Themes of forcefulness, ambition, competitiveness, perserverance throughout the questionnaire.

Logical obviously stronger than ethical.

I also see hints of Ni suggestive in the response to this question:

What's been on your mind? Has anything been worrying or concerning you? What problems have you encountered lately?
Future life course has been on my mind. Still somewhat feeling like stuck in a status quo mode not yet fully knowing what to truly change and what can be left as is. Hard to figure out what's fine as it is now and what's gotta be changed. I've tried to change things and ended up realizing it was not what I needed to change. Really struggling with this part, always tripping myself up in it. And I'm so slow to get ahead from this but I am moving a bit.

[tower]

I will say SLE is likely.

Base Se- Themes of forcefulness, ambition, competitiveness, perserverance throughout the questionnaire.

Logical obviously stronger than ethical.

I also see hints of Ni suggestive in the response to this question:

What's been on your mind? Has anything been worrying or concerning you? What problems have you encountered lately?
Future life course has been on my mind. Still somewhat feeling like stuck in a status quo mode not yet fully knowing what to truly change and what can be left as is. Hard to figure out what's fine as it is now and what's gotta be changed. I've tried to change things and ended up realizing it was not what I needed to change. Really struggling with this part, always tripping myself up in it. And I'm so slow to get ahead from this but I am moving a bit.

Thanks. Do you see this as consistent with the other questionnaire of mine you've read?

[tower]

I do still appreciate input from anyone else, too, of course.

[The Exception]

Thanks. Do you see this as consistent with the other questionnaire of mine you've read?

Both questionnaires indicate you are definitely a logical type and not an ethical one.

I didn't get as clear of a read for your type on the original questionnaire.

[tower]

Both questionnaires indicate you are definitely a logical type and not an ethical one.

I didn't get as clear of a read for your type on the original questionnaire.

OK I'm totally in agreement on Logical type. Not necessarily against the SLE suggestion so far. I'd like to see a bit more clearly on other things here though.

You had an argument for Se valuing, OK. Which parts would you see as Fe/Ti valuing over Te/Fi valuing? And specifically Fe mobilizing with Fi vulnerable? (In this questionnaire. Or the other one too if you want to look.)

Note for the below part: I'm not expecting anyone give answers for the questions/issues coming up beyond the theory, just asking about how it relates to type. It's okay if you want to give advice/thoughts on the non-type part too, I'm not against it but I'm not demanding it or anything like that.


So, if this helps about the Fe/Fi thing, I think what I look for in the area of feelings/relationships with people is some kind of emotionality but also some sort of depth. Depth definitely in terms of not having a simple mind where you can really talk about deeper mental things. So this part is more than just feelings probably. I'm not sure how to analyze this more closely at the moment, what does SLE look for with their Fe mobilizing and Fi vulnerable functions that's definitely different from what all other Logical types look for?

I did say I don't have a problem with strong emotionality unlike some other people and I know that's what's Fe valuing is in the theory, but at the same time I have a problem with fake "charismatic" stuff where I'm supposed to just follow things without thinking, which doesn't sound like Fe valuing or at least not blindly into it? Specifically, I call it fake where I don't really see what is the big deal. It just goes over my head as to what it is that other people love so much about those people. I'm not sure what this is. Thoughts?

I also mention deep relationships, e.g. how I'm not connected with others in the family too closely. And I said I'm not sure if I like that. So that's kinda some focus on weak Fi, or Fe? I know focus on its own doesn't mean valued function.

Actually, I have recently started to have more focus on spending time with people, maintaining the friendships a bit more consciously for example, and part of that approach somehow had me end up having had some extra time spent with my siblings too but it's weird somehow. As a kid I did not have a problem spending time with them but then I drifted away from everyone really as a teenager. Including them and everyone else really. Just people on the whole.

And with that part of more focus on people and relationships, with the family members it's been quite good but it's also awkward for me, I don't think it's a visible thing, it's more like "what's the goal with this?". And I don't really know if there's a real point. With my close friends I don't have a problem about whether there is a point. Not sure why. Not sure what factors are there to see what affects this. I mean, as a kid I was fine with spending the time with them so it's not that I dislike them or find them boring or whatever. I'm less interested in them than in my close friends but not disinterested.

With family, I noticed I have been able to spend much of that extra time with them also because I was also interested in the topics brought up. Oh also because of letting my brother convince me to spend time on some stuff with him. Again that's a bit out of character for me. Some of the time together has been fun though and some of the topics were interesting analysis, too.

One more thing about the close friends. I said "I like it if they are attentive and are willing to go hang out together with me". There's nothing I hate more than if people I'm strongly interested in (some new acquaintances or the close friends) somehow have me end up with not ever spending time with them. Them finding excuses when I do sometimes take initiative for meeting and at other times my being too oblivious to contact them, these factors working together or whatever?

And, as for the phrasing "willing to", I don't mean I must always initiate hanging out together, I do appreciate it if they do it. That's actually really fun when people I'm strongly interested in (see above two categories of that) do that. But that seems like some distant unrealistic idea somehow instead of it being a real thing that easily and consistently comes in life. It used to be different before I drifted away from people, maybe. But it isn't just because I was oblivious for a long time about this. There is more to this difference. Note I don't mean to complain or wallow here, I don't really see the point of that, I'm just intellectually analyzing the differences, how this is strange.

OK, so I don't want to get into this too deep now unless someone specifically wants to know more. I hope this shows enough about where my Fe/Fi would be positioned, let me know please.


As for what you called Ni suggestive: that note of yours is something that got me thinking for sure. How does an IEI help the SLE in these matters? Btw where I speak of change with regard to that, I mean changes internally in my approach, my mind, etc. It's not the visible stuff I'm talking about there. It's more like I one day got this strange insight out of nowhere that I had to change if I wanted to get where I wanted to get and I've been chasing that line of thought for a while. I do want to say I got some things figured out in this area but it's been so slow.

EDIT: I'll add lines from the chat on this that I said to @pasjc:

"Well I kind of need to feel better the purpose of some of the goals I've set before. I also need to elaborate on some of them more, change them (some details for them) where applicable in this process. It's a bit weird with how I didn't need to do this before. I did achieve some big goals before but I still have some more longer term ones that I didn't yet get close to and somehow my attitude to them changed - I still want them but I feel I have to change something because things haven't worked out yet about these. And that then feels like, something "crashed" in how it was all internally built before and I have to rebuild it all from scratch (even if not actually from scratch). And it also makes me feel that I have to think it through much more thoroughly than before. Hence my reference to taking my time more with this than before (as I said in the questionnaire). Including that idea on how I would have to change, too. And all that's what's taking incredibly long."

[pasjc]

I also think you are SLE. I do not think I am all too eloquent when talking about socionics, so I will quote some segments from the wikisocion SLE composite that I think match you.

Fe Mobilizing - There seems to be an "emotional contradiction" with the SLE; there is a constant internal struggle to both reveal to others their true feelings and a desire to guard themselves from adverse people or situations. He finds it extremely difficult - almost unnatural - to express his deepest feelings about an experience he's had. SLEs try to avoid looking vulnerable, weak or dependent, which is why they appear to be such closely guarded individuals.

You keep emphasizing wanting a deep relationship or having deep discussions, presumably because you do not experience it much.

What things do you find to be a chore? Um, no idea. I never think about this.
What do you think of daily chores? neutral on them. They exist. OK. That's it.

7th function Si definitely

Read about the small groups - quadras, clubs, temperaments, romance styles, communication styles:
It is often easier to tell which one you are because there are fewer possibilities.

You are clearly in the beta quadra:

• Beta quadra types are inclined to look for general rules explaining people, politics, mechanisms and trends, rules that once defined can be applied generally, rather than go about things in a case-by-case way.
• Beta types are often deeply concerned about social issues and the direction the world is heading. They believe that apathy is a significant cause of societal problems, and work to fight against it.
• Beta types are not inclined to enjoy discussions of personal experiences when the focus is on a person's own inner feelings, especially when described in a subdued way. (Question you skipped)

Read http://www.wikisocion.org/en/index.p...amic_Cognition Holographical-Panoramic cognition and see if it applies to you.


It's clear to me that you seek Ni - it is the function of time. Here is a description of suggestive Ni:
The individual is attracted to people who are confident in their ability to evaluate where present trends are leading and to choose the opportune moment to initiate action, or to refrain from it. The individual is impulsive but at the same time desiring of not going too far in his impulsiveness and unsure of his own ability in this area, so people who are confident on how far to go and when to stop are admired and their company is desired. The individual also longs for a sense of greater meaning in his life beyond the immediately physical and enjoys the company of people who can show him the light in that area.

As far as using socionics to find a career goes, I don't think it's a wise move. I've never been impressed with what they have come up with. Usually you can do better.

[Exodus]

Yeah, SLE makes the most sense. Major themes are proactivity and clinical analysis, you don't seem to demonstrate any kind of emotional attachment.

[tower]

I also think you are SLE. I do not think I am all too eloquent when talking about socionics, so I will quote some segments from the wikisocion SLE composite that I think match you.

Fe Mobilizing - There seems to be an "emotional contradiction" with the SLE; there is a constant internal struggle to both reveal to others their true feelings and a desire to guard themselves from adverse people or situations. He finds it extremely difficult - almost unnatural - to express his deepest feelings about an experience he's had. SLEs try to avoid looking vulnerable, weak or dependent, which is why they appear to be such closely guarded individuals.

You keep emphasizing wanting a deep relationship or having deep discussions, presumably because you do not experience it much.

Thanks. I have experienced deep discussions before, I'm just saying this is an important thing to me.

I don't like to be asked about deep feelings about whatever experiences. But if I have known someone for a long time and they got close enough to me then maybe I can discuss some such stuff with them. Not as first priority or anything but I'm not incapable of it.

I do have a "wall" around me where I easily deflect attempts from others to "look in". This is when I'm intentionally detaching from the person/people.

What things do you find to be a chore? Um, no idea. I never think about this.
What do you think of daily chores? neutral on them. They exist. OK. That's it.

7th function Si definitely

I just don't think about what feels like a chore, yeah.

You are clearly in the beta quadra:

Beta quadra types are inclined to look for general rules explaining people, politics, mechanisms and trends, rules that once defined can be applied generally, rather than go about things in a case-by-case way.
Beta types are often deeply concerned about social issues and the direction the world is heading. They believe that apathy is a significant cause of societal problems, and work to fight against it.
Beta types are not inclined to enjoy discussions of personal experiences when the focus is on a person's own inner feelings, especially when described in a subdued way. (Question you skipped)

Yeah that fits.

Read http://www.wikisocion.org/en/index.p...amic_Cognition Holographical-Panoramic cognition and see if it applies to you.

Don't know about this one.

It's clear to me that you seek Ni - it is the function of time. Here is a description of suggestive Ni:
The individual is attracted to people who are confident in their ability to evaluate where present trends are leading and to choose the opportune moment to initiate action, or to refrain from it. The individual is impulsive but at the same time desiring of not going too far in his impulsiveness and unsure of his own ability in this area, so people who are confident on how far to go and when to stop are admired and their company is desired. The individual also longs for a sense of greater meaning in his life beyond the immediately physical and enjoys the company of people who can show him the light in that area.

As far as using socionics to find a career goes, I don't think it's a wise move. I've never been impressed with what they have come up with. Usually you can do better.

Oh I'm not sure what I said that sounded like I wanted to use Socionics to find a career.

The Ni stuff does seem cool, though I would say I'm able to create a bit of meaning for myself when I contemplate some things. But I noticed in some areas related to people I can't at all do this on my own. Not sure if the way I'm putting it makes sense, let me know if not.

Yeah, SLE makes the most sense. Major themes are proactivity and clinical analysis, you don't seem to demonstrate any kind of emotional attachment.

Thanks.

The clinical analysis thing really fits, lol. Proactivity... I relate some but I'm often just reactive getting moving responding to something. I thought low emotional attachment is just strong Logic. But yes, I find I usually need a long time to start feeling strong attachment to people. It's very consistent then though in terms of providing commitment. (I won't have the feelings themselves consistently, they are on and off, but the commitment is consistent yes.) I don't mind if it takes time, I find it's best for me anyway if I don't have too much of an emotional reaction initially. I prefer to be able to first see objectively what's going on. When someone (yeah, a guy) affected me emotionally too fast, it didn't end up well. Just ruined the objective judgment and that was no good for me, I almost got into the wrong relationship that way, I won't let that happen again.


Well (to both of you), ok, if this fits with SLE then I'm ok with that for now. Do let me know if you got any other thoughts.

[Exodus]

Thanks.

The clinical analysis thing really fits, lol. Proactivity... I relate some but I'm often just reactive getting moving responding to something. I thought low emotional attachment is just strong Logic.

Yes there is a tradeoff here between Ti and Fi. If you are emotionally involved with things then you can't analyze them objectively, and vice versa.

[tower]

Yes there is a tradeoff here between Ti and Fi. If you are emotionally involved with things then you can't analyze them objectively, and vice versa.

Being emotionally involved, is that not Fe? I was kind of talking about feeling very involved in emotionality in the moment. And that was so new for that kind of situation, I mean the amount of involvement (never THAT much before), that it interfered with the "clinical analysis", lol. If it happens again, I know now how to handle it. At least I know in theory, lol.

[Myst]

@tower Definitely ST type. Not SLI, absolutely not like Se Ignoring. Then, some bit of focus on Ni and a lot of focus on valuing general rules as mentioned above too (Ti). So yeah, Beta ST.

Of note is how the Sensory themes are most elaborated on.

[Myst]

Tower, I got the strong overwhelming impression you are ILE. Firstly there were subtle hints of Fi Polr, and a huge amount of Ne + Ti.
I am relatively new to Socionics so take what I say with a grain of salt -in this questionnaire came across as an adventurous ILE who is open to possibilities and does not want to commit to any one thing and that can look Se like but ultimately your sense of curiosity and possibilities came across really loudly to me.

That being said I absolutely agree with the other forum members that you are Ti -Creative and Fe HA, but I don't see you as Se leading.

Where do you see the curiosity and possibilities and unwillingness to commit with "huge amount of Ne"? I'm not seeing any Ne, just Ni.

"Deciding on career. Figuring out who I can commit to as my SO for a real relationship."
"It's very consistent then though in terms of providing commitment."
-- these seem like disinterest in commitment to you?

Where OP - in several places - talks about goals, that seems to you like OP is "open to possibilities and does not want to commit to any one thing"?

SLE and ILE have an Fe HA. I actually find them to be very emotional in that Fe is their "wild card" function and they have trouble controlling their emotions and both types can have emotional outbursts and be rather dramatic. This is especially true of an HA Fe Enneagram 7 or Enneagram 8.

OP's questionnaire is very unemotional. Hardly dramatic. But I guess Ti subtypes can be this dry. And the post you responded to was actually emphasizing how for OP this experience was foreign/new.

[Exodus]

Being emotionally involved, is that not Fe? I was kind of talking about feeling very involved in emotionality in the moment. And that was so new for that kind of situation, I mean the amount of involvement (never THAT much before), that it interfered with the "clinical analysis", lol. If it happens again, I know now how to handle it. At least I know in theory, lol.

I thought someone might call me on that wording

I mean emotional involvement in the sense of being emotionally attached or paying attention to one's preferences and feelings towards things. If you mean being caught up in the emotional state of the moment then yes that would be Fe.

[tower]

Tower, I got the strong overwhelming impression you are ILE. Firstly there were subtle hints of Fi Polr, and a huge amount of Ne + Ti.
I am relatively new to Socionics so take what I say with a grain of salt -in this questionnaire came across as an adventurous ILE who is open to possibilities and does not want to commit to any one thing and that can look Se like but ultimately your sense of curiosity and possibilities came across really loudly to me.

That being said I absolutely agree with the other forum members that you are Ti -Creative and Fe HA, but I don't see you as Se leading.

I would like to know what came across as me not wanting to commit to anything. That could not be further from the truth. If SLE is like that then I'm not SLE.

Then, I'm not clear on what you mean by sense of possibilities for me. Please elaborate. Thank you for all your input.

[tower]

@tower Definitely ST type. Not SLI, absolutely not like Se Ignoring. Then, some bit of focus on Ni and a lot of focus on valuing general rules as mentioned above too (Ti). So yeah, Beta ST.

Of note is how the Sensory themes are most elaborated on.

Thanks. I can elaborate on other things too if needed, my line of thinking etc, I guess it was just natural to get into more detail for those "S topics".

My focus on Ni is quite... hmm. I'm pretty sure I seek Ni quite strongly in a sense. It's like, lately, in certain areas I've been into it a lot, trying really hard at seeing some stuff, while having very little focus on Fe, which does not seem entirely normal to me. And I'm not sure where I am with Fe in terms of needing or seeking it. With Ni, I do know I'd appreciate some input to figure out some things faster, so that's how I see myself seeking it.

So I refer to only certain areas above for my Ni focus. Areas about 1) figuring out a certain long term direction better 2) and about diving into my own internal world. Otoh, in life in general, I often don't have a direct future focus at all. It's often just the present moment, nothing more nothing less. This doesn't necessarily mean I'll be impulsive, though. I can be that, too, of course.

To be more clear here about my word usage of direct future focus, I do indirectly have a focus on the future, in terms of how I do have long term goals I'm consistently and usually very patiently working for. That's one reason why I'm not always impulsive. But that's not the same as directly focusing on the future, focusing directly on how things will be playing out.

But then if I get impulsive about something getting in the way or whatever other immediate issue, I can be too much in the present. Then sometimes I'm able to make myself focus on where things are going and make myself incredibly patient in that way. Even certain emotionality (I mainly mean anger, rage) can seriously decrease in those situations because then my view of the issue changes to be more long-term focused for the solution. I can enjoy this. I did not need an IEI to teach this to me though lol. I just get a bit better at this as I age, it seems.

Note though that these situations are situations that I can face with logical thinking. In relationships, well, I've been learning how to solve issues more with logic there too, but I sometimes do feel the need for someone's input on how the emotional side of things is playing out over time. I can sometimes try and play with this myself but it's difficult to see the emotional side of things so by default not much material to work with when I try to see how certain more complex (well, complex to me, haha) events follow from each other in relationships.

Thoughts as to whether this is standard Ni dual seeking? Anyone can answer this question of course.

I thought someone might call me on that wording

I mean emotional involvement in the sense of being emotionally attached or paying attention to one's preferences and feelings towards things. If you mean being caught up in the emotional state of the moment then yes that would be Fe.

Gotcha, I was talking about the former first but then mentioned the latter so that could've been the source of the misunderstanding. Where I said my feelings are on/off but the conscious commitment applying to my behaviour is steady, I was talking about feelings towards the person. I don't like to have the focus on my own feelings too often, tbh, for some reason, but I do think it's good to have it sometimes. The commitment part is unemotional on its own. And where I was talking about the romantic side of things, I was talking about getting caught up in the emotional state of the moment.

Now where I said it was so new to me, I meant it in the romantic context specifically. With friends it's not like it's new, no, I'm a lot more used to the Fe stuff there.

Could you add your thoughts on the above lines (in this same post) about my Ni seeking?

[Exodus]

Thanks. I can elaborate on other things too if needed, my line of thinking etc, I guess it was just natural to get into more detail for those "S topics".

My focus on Ni is quite... hmm. I'm pretty sure I seek Ni quite strongly in a sense. It's like, lately, in certain areas I've been into it a lot, trying really hard at seeing some stuff, while having very little focus on Fe, which does not seem entirely normal to me. And I'm not sure where I am with Fe in terms of needing or seeking it. With Ni, I do know I'd appreciate some input to figure out some things faster, so that's how I see myself seeking it.

So I refer to only certain areas above for my Ni focus. Areas about 1) figuring out a certain long term direction better 2) and about diving into my own internal world. Otoh, in life in general, I often don't have a direct future focus at all. It's often just the present moment, nothing more nothing less. This doesn't necessarily mean I'll be impulsive, though. I can be that, too, of course.

To be more clear here about my word usage of direct future focus, I do indirectly have a focus on the future, in terms of how I do have long term goals I'm consistently and usually very patiently working for. That's one reason why I'm not always impulsive. But that's not the same as directly focusing on the future, focusing directly on how things will be playing out.

But then if I get impulsive about something getting in the way or whatever other immediate issue, I can be too much in the present. Then sometimes I'm able to make myself focus on where things are going and make myself incredibly patient in that way. Even certain emotionality (I mainly mean anger, rage) can seriously decrease in those situations because then my view of the issue changes to be more long-term focused for the solution. I can enjoy this. I did not need an IEI to teach this to me though lol. I just get a bit better at this as I age, it seems.

Note though that these situations are situations that I can face with logical thinking. In relationships, well, I've been learning how to solve issues more with logic there too, but I sometimes do feel the need for someone's input on how the emotional side of things is playing out over time. I can sometimes try and play with this myself but it's difficult to see the emotional side of things so by default not much material to work with when I try to see how certain more complex (well, complex to me, haha) events follow from each other in relationships.

Thoughts as to whether this is standard Ni dual seeking? Anyone can answer this question of course.
---
Could you add your thoughts on the above lines (in this same post) about my Ni seeking?

What you are talking about is definitely Ni but it could be Ni mobilizing.

The dual-seeking function is something that you should have persistent difficulties with. You can develop it to some degree with experience but it's always there. The mobilizing function is something you can kind of do on your own, though not consistently.

[Myst]

My focus on Ni is quite... hmm. I'm pretty sure I seek Ni quite strongly in a sense. It's like, lately, in certain areas I've been into it a lot, trying really hard at seeing some stuff, while having very little focus on Fe, which does not seem entirely normal to me. (...)

Sounds like introverting more than what's optimal for you.

To be more clear here about my word usage of direct future focus, I do indirectly have a focus on the future, in terms of how I do have long term goals I'm consistently and usually very patiently working for. That's one reason why I'm not always impulsive. But that's not the same as directly focusing on the future, focusing directly on how things will be playing out.

The latter is what does need "real" Ni. The former I'm sure can be done by 1D Ni dual seeking too.

But then if I get impulsive about something getting in the way or whatever other immediate issue, I can be too much in the present. Then sometimes I'm able to make myself focus on where things are going and make myself incredibly patient in that way. Even certain emotionality (I mainly mean anger, rage) can seriously decrease in those situations because then my view of the issue changes to be more long-term focused for the solution. I can enjoy this. I did not need an IEI to teach this to me though lol. I just get a bit better at this as I age, it seems.

Doesn't really say much beyond definitely weak Ni and definitely strong Se.

Are you able to focus on Fe in the same way or better?

Note though that these situations are situations that I can face with logical thinking. In relationships, well, I've been learning how to solve issues more with logic there too, but I sometimes do feel the need for someone's input on how the emotional side of things is playing out over time. I can sometimes try and play with this myself but it's difficult to see the emotional side of things so by default not much material to work with when I try to see how certain more complex (well, complex to me, haha) events follow from each other in relationships.

Seeking Fe and Ni / superid together.

Thoughts as to whether this is standard Ni dual seeking?

The part on impulsivity was close to it. Other than that, SLEs really appreciate Ni insights on meaning, even a condensed form of that from a Ni base type gives a lot to the SLE, definitely gives them more than a condensed form of Fe from a Fe base type.

[tower]

What you are talking about is definitely Ni but it could be Ni mobilizing.

The dual-seeking function is something that you should have persistent difficulties with. You can develop it to some degree with experience but it's always there. The mobilizing function is something you can kind of do on your own, though not consistently.

OK, the difference between "developing it to some degree with experience" vs "kind of can do it but not consistently" is not entirely clear to me since it's hard to say if I have actual persistent difficulties with Ni in any sense. Or with Fe. If it counts, well, in terms of trying to develop Ni, I find I get to some embarrassingly simple conclusions with disproportionate difficulty to arrive there but I can use them then alright. Some of them seem less embarrassingly simple to me tho' and that's cool. As for Fe, I've also been putting more focus on that too, and if I get to a realization there, I don't feel embarrassed about how simple it seems in retrospect. It just feels, great. I mean, great in terms of how useful it seems. Like some big missing piece has been found. Note I don't necessarily mean great in the sense of being non-trivial. I kinda have no idea about that. So I don't know if others would see those realizations as embarrassingly simple, lol. Tbh, I really hope not, uhh, I'd rather not think about this for some reason lol, whatever this means for type. I'd rather not berate myself about it in the manner I can do it a bit about Ni, I'd rather just have no expectations for this area (Fe). Just let it be what it is.

Let me know if that made sense to you and if you can see what it means for type.

Are you able to focus on Fe in the same way or better?

God knows if it's the same/better. The one thing I can say though is, I definitely started on developing Ni earlier than Fe. However, the first time I ever wanted to develop anything, that was with Fe a long time ago. It just failed right away. So then I went to Ni later after someone gave me some "Ni books", with extra focus on it, while zero real focus on Fe in terms of developing it.

The part on impulsivity was close to it. Other than that, SLEs really appreciate Ni insights on meaning, even a condensed form of that from a Ni base type gives a lot to the SLE, definitely gives them more than a condensed form of Fe from a Fe base type.

The "Ni books" have given that to me before. To be more precise, they just gave me the ability to find it in myself and believe my own thoughts on it. That was a real awesome insightful moment. Then I would go on from there to a bit further with my own thoughts than what I read in the books. Kinda proud of that, lol

[tower]

The dual-seeking function is something that you should have persistent difficulties with. You can develop it to some degree with experience but it's always there.

Let me add this other thing - any typical examples of what that persistent difficulty (specifically with the dual seeking function actually already having been developed to some degree with experience) looks like would be really appreciated, both for Fe and for Ni. It's of course ok too if you can't think of any examples.

[Exodus]

Let me add this other thing - any typical examples of what that persistent difficulty (specifically with the dual seeking function actually already having been developed to some degree with experience) looks like would be really appreciated, both for Fe and for Ni. It's of course ok too if you can't think of any examples.

ok, with SLEs their main problem is lack of foresight, they tend to act purely based on impulse and get into sticky situations more than they should.

With LSIs their main problem is communicating in a reasonable manner, they have strong opinions about how things should be but they come across as overly rigid and don't mold what they are trying to communicate to others. They are more careful and organized than SLEs but also less good at being social and charming, etc.

Experience is mostly a non-issue, overall you should look to whichever one seems more capable, independent, and aware than the other -- that will be the Mobilizing function. It is much harder to develop the Suggestive function.

[tower]

@thehotelambush

Thanks, to everyone else too. I'll think and see what fits me more.