ENTp: Asperger syndrome and high IQ

[ArchonAlarion]

None of this is true except the polr hit part. A "polr hit" only happens when you are forced to deal with your polr over a favorable function. Some types will favor making a chair or thinking about the future because it has valued elements to it. Discovering a coin won't be rewarding because there isn't enough new or exciting information to it.

A polr hit happens when information is presented in a way opposite to your creative function.

Time/the future does not have a little tag on it that says "I'm Ni =D!!!". Time is a fundamental aspect of existence. holy shit.

Information is just blank until it has been formatted by a human psyche and spat back out in some form or another.

If you believe thinking about the future or making chairs is type related, I really don't know if we can find common ground now.

Where did the information come from? Did it pop out from thin air? No, we experience information aspects and then manipulate them if we are proficient enough with that type of information. The manipulated and concentrated information is then more valuable and rich than what can simply be experienced.

Information comes from sensory stimulae or mental projection that is then interpreted by the brain, in short.

Information can only be "Xx" if it has already passed through a human psyche. The degree to which elements are present is varied.

[Azeroffs]

Time/the future does not have a little tag on it that says "I'm Ni =D!!!". Time is a fundamental aspect of existence. holy shit.

Information is just blank until it has been formatted by a human psyche and spat back out in some form or another.

If you believe thinking about the future or making chairs is type related, I really don't know if we can find common ground now.

There will be varying degrees of every type of element for everything that exists.

Type will, to some degree, determine how much enjoyment one will get from different activities.

Information comes from sensory stimulae or mental projection that is then interpreted by the brain, in short.

Information can only be "Xx" if it has already passed through a human psyche. The degree to which elements are present is varied.

One of the most fundamental concepts in socionics is the idea of information elements, or facets of reality. The idea is that reality can be divided into categories that different individuals perceive with differing degrees of clarity and precision. These information elements correspond to Jung's 8 psychic functions, but have been given a new meaning. If there are 8 possible different "leading functions" that perceive different aspects of reality, then reality can itself be described in terms of these 8 different aspects. This was a critical step in the development of socionics that led to everything else.

Socionics :: Information Elements

[ArchonAlarion]

1. Having read Psychological Types, I dont recall Jung stating that the types perceive different parts of reality. His idea was that types experience reality (information) in different ways

2. You are arguing circularly. I know perfectly well what mainstream Socionics believes, but it could still be wrong.

3. I want you to explain to me what "internal object dynamics" has to do with emotions. This might be revealing to you.

[Azeroffs]

1. Having read Psychological Types, I dont recall Jung stating that the types perceive different parts of reality. His idea was that types experience reality (information) in different ways

2. You are arguing circularly. I know perfectly well what mainstream Socionics believes, but it could still be wrong.

3. I want you to explain to me what "internal object dynamics" has to do with emotions. This might be revealing to you.

Experiencing reality in different ways does not mean experiencing information aspects with a function that does not contain that IE.

The whole point is that you can perceive emotions. If you can perceive emotions then your mind is processing that. If your mind is processing it then it is with the corresponding IE.

Reality may contain more than just the 8 IEs, but if it does, then we are not processing it and therefore are completely unaware of its existance.



All of what you are saying may be true, but if it is, it is not socionics, and you should not be referring to socionic types.

[ArchonAlarion]

Experiencing reality in different ways does not mean experiencing information aspects with a function that does not contain that IE.

My point is that information about "time" for example will not give a polr hit to Ni polr. They will perceive this fundamental aspect of existence through the lens of whatever elements they value. ESFj will perceive and explain time in X way, INTp will perceive and explain time in Y way.

The whole point is that you can perceive emotions. If you can perceive emotions then your mind is processing that. If your mind is processing it then it is with the corresponding IE.

What element corresponds with emotions and why? Would a ISTp not understand the emotions of a ENFp? Are the emotions of a ESFj more understandable to an INTj than the emotions of ESFp? Why?

Reality may contain more than just the 8 IEs, but if it does, then we are not processing it and therefore are completely unaware of its existance.

Thats just silly.


*edit: And finally you drop the "get out of our club!" bomb. This is usually when I know I'm getting through to people.

[Azeroffs]

My point is that information about "time" for example will not give a polr hit to Ni polr. They will perceive this fundamental aspect of existence through the lens of whatever elements they value. ESFj will perceive and explain time in X way, INTp will perceive and explain time in Y way.

It isn't mere exposure to an element that causes a polr hit. Nor is time limited to Ni. It may have more Ni than anything else though. They will experience the event differently because they are looking at different aspects of the same event.

What element corresponds with emotions and why? Would a ISTp not understand the emotions of a ENFp? Are the emotions of a ESFj more understandable to an INTj than the emotions of ESFp? Why?

Mostly Fe, but there will be other elements to it. All types are capable of understanding all elements. To what degree depends on type. Elements will be better refined by types with more comprehension of that element. For INTj to have a good understanding of Fe, it has to be highly refined. ESFj does just that. ESFp will actually be able to understand the Fe better than INTj, but ESFp sees it as useless for what it wants.

Thats just silly.

How so?.. and regardless, it's the foundation of socionics.

edit:

*edit: And finally you drop the "get out of our club!" bomb. This is usually when I know I'm getting through to people.

Not true. All I'm saying is that you should not refer to a theory that you're not talking about. You're the one now making this personal not I.

[ArchonAlarion]

How so?.. and regardless, it's the foundation of socionics.

edit:


Not true. All I'm saying is that you should not refer to a theory that you're not talking about. You're the one now making this personal not I.

This modification is simply not enough to make what I speak of "not socionics."

At this point, I'm just going to give you a suggestion, which you can consider or not:

Instead of trying to explain how emotions are "internal object dynamics", contemplate what internal object dynamics is first. pretend you never heard that jazz about time, emotions, logic, power, or any of that. Just start from scratch. think about what kind of information is intrinsically "internal object dynamics". Then I want you to consider iif that same information could be "external object dynamics" too. Give it a whack.