@Pole
Word!
Huge Joe Rogan fan. He says the same exact things I believe.
LSI-Se 836 Sp/Sx
I lean towards LSI more than SLE. Gives praise for – taking time into your own hands. I could accept SLE.
MOTTO: NEVER TRUST IN REALITY
Winning is for losers
Sincerely yours,
idiosyncratic type
Life is a joke but do you have a life?
Joinif you dare https://matrix.to/#/#The16Types:matrix.org
He has weird ideas about society, and he seems in need of some spirituality in his life.
Obsequium amicos, veritas odium parit
IMO, he's an SLE that has taken a lot of hallucinogenic drugs, which has expanded his mind. Perhaps, it is his suggestive seeking out other worldly experiences.
He makes use of role in his videos, but it is clear that his default state is lead when you look at how he usually acts. I like this video he made about DMT a while back:
“We cannot change the cards we are dealt, just how we play the hand.” Randy Pausch
Ne-IEE
6w7 sp/sx
6w7-9w1-4w5
Lots of Beta themes here - viewing society as a giant system etc.
The biggest issue is and will continue to be that the people of the world confuse capitalism and cronyism. The left basically convinces all these naive young people that if the rich gives up a bit of their wealth everything will somehow be ok. It doesn't work like that at all. Society is a bunch of economic nodes that are interconnected to each other. When you shift wealth all it does is resupply those economic pathways stimulating demand. Rich elite people are always promoting socialist humanitarian policies, because those very polices are the very things that allows them to maintain their wealth. It is essentially like recharging the economic batteries, when really these giant bureaucratic enterprises should fall flat on their face and fail because they are highly inefficient and do not produce the highest amount of quality. Liberal elites like to invoke some spiritual humanitarian reverie in the struggling masses, literally poisoning them with what they tell them is the cure. The cure they provide only displaces wealth temporarily, which eventually flows back to the top of the totem poll. When the system becomes too stressed to maintain misappropriation of resources, then comes the liberal economists to tell everyone that we've hit a bump in the road and need to expand the money supply. They drop the interest rates low and everyone is like "yea this is what I'm talking about... we're booming now". Eventually they have to raise the interest rates up and we tumble right back down into a recession. And then there's more liberal economists that are like "nah the problem is we need to expand the money supply again" so they drop the interest rates all the way down to zero and start talking about negative interest rates.
Moral of the story: We're fucked. We're so fucked. The whole world is fucked. Everyone has fell into the central banking trap and as a result the whole thing is going to topple down. I actually think people will be happier after it happens... I think people in general are stressed the fuck out. Everyone is going to be shocked when it happens though. You can disagree with me, but when it happens you're going to dream my face in your sleep. Sweet dreams.
Model X Will Save Us!
*randomwarelinkremoved
nah quality of life is at an all time high
uppity betas
https://youtu.be/VJMy_BWD3CI?t=958
Peterson blasting Hamlet's go to solution for everything and Maxim (Rogan) perpetually falling for it
Spirituality is just a distraction.
@Hitta is also right here. The rates the central bank sets not only encourage speculation: they force businesses to speculate to remain competitive. Society eventually grows up around the central bank like a warped tree, fueled by the corrupt food that is central bank money. But it's more like a drug that the central bank feeds the economy. Eventually, the highs get too high. But it's not the high that kills you. It's the coming down that kills you. When you actually take a look at the basic stats and fundamentals of the market, you can see that the big one is coming. The central bank's naloxone is tapped out.
Sorry, but Joe Rogan is a f*cking idiot. He's complaining about not being emotionally fulfilled by modern society and seems to feel that making pottery and trading it for chickens would be a superior life to working in an office. He seems to forget that the office is an implicit part of an integrated society that gives his kids a free education and has eradicated smallpox and will give him a very good shot at living past the age of 30 if he doesn't purposefully abuse his body with drugs because he lacks the imagination to create a fulfilling life in paradise.
If he walked the talk, he'd give up all his worldly wealth and move to India or Afghanistan or Somalia, where he really could spend his days trying to make pottery and hoping to trade it for chickens. But he would have to watch out for the religious police, because marginally productive societies don't have much slack to tolerate thought deviants who want to do something different from what has worked for them for the past five thousand years.
IDK, maybe this didn't occur to him, but he should ask himself why so many people in the world would trade places with him in a heartbeat. But he won't do the same with them.
Adam Strange's assessment: don't like modern society? Go to Afghanistan! Don't try to change anything.
Never mind the average lifespan stats that are influenced heavily by infant mortality rate. Never mind that when taking that into account, primitives live on average as long as we do and have fewer degenerative diseases....
I don't advocate not changing anything on our society. Joe Rogan is the one who wants to live in a barter society. I just suggested that he walk the talk, and he can live in those places tomorrow if he wants. All he needs is a plane ticket. Oh, and maybe some vaccinations, but maybe he doesn't believe in them. IDK.
And what is that infant mortality caused by? Not office work, I think.
So let's talk about how a person can become un-alienated from the means of production, which is what this thread seems to be about.
Rogan seems to want to make pottery, even though I'll give odds that he's never tried that and has no idea of what is involved.
My solution would be to make education to whatever level a person wants free of cost to them (the number of people who would take advantage of this would probably be close to the number of people in prison today, so the cost to society would not be significant and we might see a profit) and to print money to give everyone who wants one a job. The jobs don't even have to be productive, they just have to engage a person, because unemployment of any kind is destructive to a human being.
People tend to want to get more stuff from applying less work. This impulse increases productivity, so while basic food production once required over 90% of society's productive capacity, it now engages far fewer people who are now free to find some other things to do. This productivity progression is not going to stop anytime soon, at least not before we run up against hard resource or pollution limits (used all the world's Phosphorus to make bones, or cook in our waste heat), so now that you are free from being attacked by your neighbor for your chickens or having your kids die of smallpox or starving because the McD's have all closed, what are you going to do to fulfill your next level on Maslow's pyramid of needs?
Or what is your suggestion for what the rest of us can do to make your life more fulfilling?
I probably shouldn't post before I've had coffee.
*EDIT* @Aramas, I owe you an apology. By asking you what you'd do to improve society, I turned a valid ethical question into a personal question, and I should not have done that. I'm sorry, because I'm guilty there of doing the same thing that I criticize others for doing, and I need to stop that.
Last edited by Adam Strange; 11-26-2017 at 02:39 PM.
Daniel Patrick Moynihan quotes:
- "Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts."
– quoted in Robert Sobel's review of Past Imperfect: History According to the Movies, edited by Mark C. Carnes- (In response to the question: "Why should I work if I am going to just end up emptying slop jars?") "That's a complaint you hear mostly from people who don't empty slop jars. This country has a lot of people who do exactly that for a living. And they do it well. It's not pleasant work, but it's a living. And it has to be done. Somebody has to go around and empty all those bed pans. And it's perfectly honorable work. There's nothing the matter with doing it. Indeed, there is a lot that is right about doing it, as any hospital patient will tell you."
- "Food growing is the first thing you do when you come down out of the trees. The question is, how come the United States can grow food and you can't?"
– speaking to Third World countries about global famine- "The central conservative truth is that it is culture, not politics, that determines the success of a society. The central liberal truth is that politics can change a culture and save it from itself."
nah whats going on is Hamlet is offscreen in the form of an undying marxist ideology, predicated on beta quadral values, which rogan shares, whether you think hes SLI or SLE is sort of pointless, the point is rogan is just speaking from the point of view of an outdated idealogy, hence the perpetuity of the "falling" for it, which is to say he's jobbing for an empty conflict dreamed up by the man who makes his living off of giving types like Rogan something to bitch about. meanwhile they miss, as adam pointed out, that they're living in the top %.0001 who ever lived, but can't stop from making it out like its hell on earth and all the while refuse to take responsibility for as he astutely pointed out, their own lack of imagination in finding "meaning in paradise"
at the end of the day its good to have types like Rogan nipping at the heels of gamma in order to point out shortcomings, but at the same time there's a real absurd quality to his position
"escape society or remain a slave" how about make it better and show some gratitude instead of simply trying to exagerate the problems to build tension until you're able to seize power and turn it into another communist shithole, because the only thing you really understand is slavery
Why complicate this more than it needs to be. He is a comedian turned MMA commentator who dabbles in psychedelics, marijuana, and life long steroid use. He now talks with eclectic people on a internet radio show. That's about it. The unplug from the matrix types are a bit passe, I think hippies tried it out 40 years ago. It's imo, quite a juvenile thought process on the spiritual journey, certainly "right action", is a lesson of more awakened minds, but why throw the baby out with the bath water and return to a pastoral life? The outer situation will never be perfect, better spend your life forces cultivating freedom and peace in one's own mind.
Rogan is great, except when he steps into 3 am after party "puff puff pass, you know maaan society is like repressive and we are all trapped on hamster wheels dood." Its like no shit, I was pondering that truth before well before puberty, congrats you see the absurdity of it all: plucking the life's work of others and refurbishing their revelations as your own. Sweet.
except that's wrong. Here the two of them are in an anti-Bertrand discussion. Not anti-Bertrand because you're a gender-warrior, but because you're a quadra-warrior applying it in exactly the same way. You can't even keep anything straight and all you see is a giant quadra war fighting for power, and it's stupid.
and I'm sure you'll try to spin this into yet another power-struggle of quadra values and won't be able to see yourself for what you're doing.
I like Rogan, the point is the message in the posted youtube hardly "nailed" it. it was just an expression of the bog standard beta mindset, which peterson sorts out nicely. there's no conflict or spin here, he's just susceptible to Ni but sort of lost on his own. not the kind of person you'd want to take solo advice from in ideological matters, but does well under the right guidance. the problem is if peterson hadn't come along he'd be just another goofy marxist waiting for the right argument to turn him murderous
Ignoring your agenda here, I'm going to take the opportunity to point out a few things that might help with typing. Notice in the video I posted: how Joe makes Jordan look downright fragile and awkward in comparison - lends credence to the intuitive typing for Jordan, but more than that shows Joe as clearly Se lead. Notice his body language, look how centered and grounded he is. Notice how little he moves around and when he does he shows control both of himself and the space around him. Ti is secondary, Se is clearly lead, not only through his body language but his speech and thought processes. He does not think like a Ti lead - this is Ti creative in action but with Se and not with Ne which looks different. Someone else pointed out to me that a good example if you want to compare two Se leads, (one with Ti creative and the other with Fi creative) look for his videos where he's talking to Steven Crowder - notice how they have a similar presence and body language, but when they argue Ti vs Fi shows up.
Last edited by squark; 11-27-2017 at 02:20 AM. Reason: awkward phrasing of sentence
maybe, like I said from my point of view its a sort of collateral issue
I think these criticisms are missing the point of the video, though this is perhaps understandable from the intendedly pithy, punchline nature of these types of presentations.
I didn't get the impression that he was advocating living in a barter economy, nor is his intent to roll back capitalism. He used the concept of barter rather sloppily as an analogy for a form of exchange that prioritizes agency in choosing what to produce and when.
His criticism isn't directed at work in general but at the bureaucratic nature of modern work, which he characterizes as hierarchical, routine, and uncreative. If anything, the exact same criticism would quadruply apply to the omnipresent bureaucratic vortex of every Communist regime that has ever existed.
The charge that he is employing the Marxist concept of alienation of labour is well taken. The plot twist, however, is that he suggests (elsewhere) retooling our education system to produce businessmen and self-starter individuals rather than pliant worker-bees. It is optimistic to believe that everyone will want to run their own business, but the machinery to educate more people into higher levels of agency can certainly exist. There is nothing revolutionary being suggested here, neither is there anything that stretches the bounds of capitalist forms of production.
Joe Rogan does indeed do a lot of (too much) drugs, though.
Last edited by xerx; 11-26-2017 at 10:22 PM.
forgive me if I don't entertain the IEE perspective (I know you will)
^ what's the "IEE perspective"?
I said my piece in regard to Rogan, and mainly responded only for squark's benefit, arguing with IEE is pointless since they can do whatever they want and none of it matters
I generally agree with him and the sentiment, but he doesn't really take into account that some people actually like corporate jobs and don't feel controlled by them.
Also people can have this false belief sometimes that all bosses are these horrible assholes who are simply condescending to others and never get their hands dirty. The best bosses are both condescending/tell others what to do well, they relate to people well- AND they get in the muck with their employers. Triple threat. A LSE-Si who I grew to respect was a lot like this. A good company is run by a person that sends the message 'I'm a worker just like you but I'm also better than you because well this is my company- not yours, but I am rewarding you for feeding my own narcissism.' The two co-exist quite well in a company that has good management... only people who never really worked before would think otherwise- ie spoiled celebrities who have the luxury of sitting on their ass and discussing ideas- and not small business owners. Though I've definitely had the shitty kind of bosses too, and fellow Betas should rip those ones to shreds.
tbh I kind of want to rim Joe Rogan. Not when he looks all sad though.
Also special thanks to @Hitta and @Raver for being brilliant little breeders as usual. You make a ****** proud.
All I see is people that demand things and then bitch about the means by which they can be realistically provided while preaching mind expansion but not providing a realistic alternative... without this machine running things like cities couldn't even exist, they're uninhabitable ... just look at L.A. - 20 million people in a dense area, nothing grows there... without the machine running that population couldn't be maintained. And if you want things like no dental - or maybe even no health insurance - by all means feel free to forgo ever visiting the emergency room. I'm sure you're really committed to that. The lower class would literally starve to death if the machine stopped working... it's actually happened before. You would have people out in the streets - like has happened many times before - rioting and looting... Lol. It's one thing to have ideas for how to improve the functioning of society, but I don't see any clear ideas in the video... you say he "nailed it", what does he even propose? He's talking about his own life and what will make him happy, he isn't even talking about humanities problems or proposing anything. He's saying... don't be a suit. Wooooo.. you mean I want to be happy in life? Thank you for enlightening me... Should all suits abandon their jobs and go find a way to be happy then? Let the machine fall apart? Please enlighten me since you so clearly know what's best
Last edited by rat200Turbo; 01-03-2018 at 07:19 AM.