EII-INFj stereotypes discussion

[ashlesha]

You aren't (diverting too much). It's not a blatant typing thread, but I am weighing the information against my typing. The main issue is that I can be and have been forceful at times, and I made a habit of it in high school. I was even somewhat bullying about it. I'm also very possessive and territorial, and I enjoy having influence over others. Most of this can be attributed to upbringing/environment, but it still doesn't fit any EII descriptions I have heard. Sooooo, I'm looking to see if I'm focusing too much on EII stereotypes - kind of like INFP stereotypes. Have you seen those? Ugh. Airy, floofy, too good for this earth, and all that.

i don't think the ability to be forceful really rules out Se polr, partly because forceful can mean things like yelling when you're angry (which i think everyone has done at one point or another), and partly because it seems like something everybody has to do at one point or another in life (like to avoid being a pushover if you have kids, for example). i guess really wanting to be forceful, or being really focused on territory and influencing others, is something i would consider a valid thing to question in terms of an EII typing, but i'm not sure. it's hard for me to look at this without relating it to myself (i can be territorial and possessive, which has played out in different ways in different contexts, but not in the same way i would expect it to play out for an Se type - i would give examples for context, but i don't want to make this into being about me).

i do think that the importance of upbringing/environment is a really big deal when it comes to how people of the same type will express the same functions in a different way. i guess the question is whether being possessive and territorial and liking to have influence over others is incompatible with EII functions (Se polr most specifically) or not.

the thing that sticks with me is that since i haven't seen anything from you that has made you seem like a "territorial" or "forceful" person or whatever (not that i'm questioning that its true, i just barely know you )- i was wondering if you could talk about examples of this or what it's like for you.

[Lobo]

INFjs are sexy and it's warranted.

[ashlesha]

INFjs are sexy and it's warranted.

[Enters Laughing]

I have always regarded the EII descriptions to be a rather idealised version of how I'd like to be - something that I could never come close to matching. There are times in the past when I've been "forceful" and many times when I've treated people in ways I'm not proud of - even right in that moment. I think it's simply the case that I can't quite be perfect (and even if I could, I'd still feel tainted by how I acted previously) - and that these concerns have always been particularly important to me.

[Cuddly McFluffles]

i don't think the ability to be forceful really rules out Se polr, partly because forceful can mean things like yelling when you're angry (which i think everyone has done at one point or another), and partly because it seems like something everybody has to do at one point or another in life (like to avoid being a pushover if you have kids, for example). i guess really wanting to be forceful, or being really focused on territory and influencing others, is something i would consider a valid thing to question in terms of an EII typing, but i'm not sure. it's hard for me to look at this without relating it to myself (i can be territorial and possessive, which has played out in different ways in different contexts, but not in the same way i would expect it to play out for an Se type - i would give examples for context, but i don't want to make this into being about me).

i do think that the importance of upbringing/environment is a really big deal when it comes to how people of the same type will express the same functions in a different way. i guess the question is whether being possessive and territorial and liking to have influence over others is incompatible with EII functions (Se polr most specifically) or not.

the thing that sticks with me is that since i haven't seen anything from you that has made you seem like a "territorial" or "forceful" person or whatever (not that i'm questioning that its true, i just barely know you )- i was wondering if you could talk about examples of this or what it's like for you.

Being Territorial: Pretty much, what’s mine is mine, and what I have an attachment to is “mine”. I get jealous easily where friends are concerned. I’m not usually confrontational about it, though, because I don’t like people getting mad at me. If a family member is involved, it’s another story (I can be quite argumentative). I will try to avoid openly infringing on others’ territory, since I figure it’d make them mad like it does me. I’m very picky about people going through stuff in my room, but that’s because I hid all sorts of “contraband” growing up. The fact that my mother used to use what we cared about against us may have influenced my feelings on this subject. I keep my stories very close and quiet so that she cannot use them to manipulate me into doing something.

Being Forceful: It’s fun being intimidating and having people afraid of me. Of course, few people are anymore. In high school, I had a “pet human” who… needed to grow a pair. I treated him poorly, even taking advantage of my position over him to bitch him out once. I have come to feel bad about my behavior toward him. I was also a physically violent person, which isn’t really type-related. I never did it to females, though; I always figured they’d hurt me back. It was done when I was irritated at someone or just for the heck of it.

Being in Power: A lot of it may be upbringing, but some of it is just me. I was abused as a kid, so I don’t really trust anyone but myself to know what’s best for me (this also figures into wanting control). I pride myself on noticing and ignoring blatant emotional manipulation (like sucking up). I generally feel that the world is out to get me given the chance, so I try to avoid giving people information that they could later use to manipulate me (like divulging weaknesses). I also tend to avoid showing emotional weakness unless I really trust someone. I don’t know if there’s anyone I’d actually feel safe crying in front of. People will hear me say things like, “He really pissed me off”, not, “He hurt me.” I do try to somewhat dominate certain friends, and I think it could be explained as counterphobic behavior; if I take control, they become less of a threat. If I do show weakness toward/around people, it’s because I don’t consider them a threat.

Having Control: I want to call the shots. I want to have the choice. I despise being told what to do, especially if you don’t have the authority to do so. If you do tell me what to do (outside of a supervisor-worker setting), my instinct is to disregard it and so remind you who holds the power over me, even if that action would cause me harm. I don’t usually follow through with that, but the urge is there. Depending on the person involved, I may remind them that they don’t have the right to order me around. Wanting influence over others figures into this and being in power.

Well, this is longer and more revelatory than planned. Ah well.

[Creepy-bg]

Being Territorial: Pretty much, what’s mine is mine, and what I have an attachment to is “mine”. I get jealous easily where friends are concerned. I’m not usually confrontational about it, though, because I don’t like people getting mad at me. If a family member is involved, it’s another story (I can be quite argumentative). I will try to avoid openly infringing on others’ territory, since I figure it’d make them mad like it does me. I’m very picky about people going through stuff in my room, but that’s because I hid all sorts of “contraband” growing up. The fact that my mother used to use what we cared about against us may have influenced my feelings on this subject. I keep my stories very close and quiet so that she cannot use them to manipulate me into doing something.

Being Forceful: It’s fun being intimidating and having people afraid of me. Of course, few people are anymore. In high school, I had a “pet human” who… needed to grow a pair. I treated him poorly, even taking advantage of my position over him to bitch him out once. I have come to feel bad about my behavior toward him. I was also a physically violent person, which isn’t really type-related. I never did it to females, though; I always figured they’d hurt me back. It was done when I was irritated at someone or just for the heck of it.

Being in Power: A lot of it may be upbringing, but some of it is just me. I was abused as a kid, so I don’t really trust anyone but myself to know what’s best for me (this also figures into wanting control). I pride myself on noticing and ignoring blatant emotional manipulation (like sucking up). I generally feel that the world is out to get me given the chance, so I try to avoid giving people information that they could later use to manipulate me (like divulging weaknesses). I also tend to avoid showing emotional weakness unless I really trust someone. I don’t know if there’s anyone I’d actually feel safe crying in front of. People will hear me say things like, “He really pissed me off”, not, “He hurt me.” I do try to somewhat dominate certain friends, and I think it could be explained as counterphobic behavior; if I take control, they become less of a threat. If I do show weakness toward/around people, it’s because I don’t consider them a threat.

Having Control: I want to call the shots. I want to have the choice. I despise being told what to do, especially if you don’t have the authority to do so. If you do tell me what to do (outside of a supervisor-worker setting), my instinct is to disregard it and so remind you who holds the power over me, even if that action would cause me harm. I don’t usually follow through with that, but the urge is there. Depending on the person involved, I may remind them that they don’t have the right to order me around. Wanting influence over others figures into this and being in power.

Well, this is longer and more revelatory than planned. Ah well.

pet human . probably stings because I think I've felt like one of those before.