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    escaping anndelise's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Peter
    Object/relationships is not related to extraversion/introversion. Instead, extroverts naturally prefer a dynamic IM element. And all judgements are comparisons (i.e. relationships) between two or more objects.
    Xe/Xi refers to Objects/Fields.

    P elements refer to taking something in as a whole, the integrity of the parts are kept together as one unit.
    J elements refer to dividing something up into its parts, each part being seen as discrete.

    When we attempt to understand our world (process information), we need both the ability to see the tree as a whole integrated entity, and we also need to be able to see its parts (branches we could climb, fruit we could eat, shelter it might provide, clues to danger, etc). We break it up, and put it back together, break it up, and put it back together.
    For example, understanding Socionics. We read descriptions of the elements, which are attempts to put together a cohesive definition from various parts (aspects) that are being included. The aspects are the lowest divided parts. From them we build up what Xe vs Xi means, what Xe Statics vs Xe Dynamics mean, What Ne vs Se vs Te vs Fe means. We add together the parts (J) to form a more cohesive picture What is NeFi? SeTi? Alpha quadra? How might each type interact information-wise? etc. All of this requires the tearing apart of information into smaller discrete parts, and rebuilding them up together into a more cohesive whole entity. This is what we do when we process information.


    Extroverts, aka Object oriented types, jump from object to object to object. Sometimes they don't even know how one object they were talking about is related to another object they are now talking about. This is part of what leads to the perception that Extroverts prefer breadth of a topic as opposed to depth.

    Introverts, aka Field oriented types, more easily stick with one subject. They bring in different parts that are related to the subject, forming a deeper understanding of the subject.

    An example, Alpha NT (Ne + Ti). Both use mental constructs of parts and how they connect to form a mental construct of the whole. Aka theorizing.
    They differ, however, in that NeTi is Xe (object oriented). Their Ne object to object jumps aren't readily apparent in how they are connected, though there is an underlying Ti structure. This structure is how the information is linked via neurons. Each types has a different structure between information, and certain clumps fire off together differently than those of other types. So with NeTi, the underlying structure is related to Ti info, while with an NeFi, the underlying structure is related to Fi info. Both Ne types jump object to object, subject to subject, person to person, thought to thought. It might seem "dynamic" to an outsider, but the information attended to isn't particularly dynamic information. (Processing information is ITSELF a dynamic process, but the information being processed isn't necessarily dynamic information. Do you understand the difference?)

    For example, when my NiFe brother and I (NeFi) started hanging out, we had a few communication difficulties. I would be talking about one thing, and the next moment talking about something else. To me, they were connected, though I never defined the connection to him. He, being Xi, would be stuck trying to figure out how I got from point C to point L. It took us a while to figure out that I needed to signal to him when something I'm about to say is fairly random (look there's a bird), vs when something I'm about to say is connected somehow...this part involved me giving a short hand series of connections (ex. the nature of N, which made me think of NTs, which made me think of [person], which made me think of something that person said/did, which made me think of how I felt, which made me think of another time I felt that way, which made me think of a different event that had the same feeling, which made me think of a different person involved, which made me think of something they did, which has me now commenting about some random action some random person did, that to me, is related to the subject at hand, though very indirectly related). ((N->NT->[person]->event->feeling->event->[different person]->event->N))

    An Xi type, has similar jumps, but the jumps are more closely connected to the subject. It doesn't range as far as an Xe's jumps. And the Xi's jumps are more easily connectable without having to define how it's connected. TiNe differs from NeTi, in part, in that Ti is the focus. They go more into depth of a theory than an NeTi would prefer. They break information down into its Ti parts, then build it up into an Ne whole, then break it back down into different Ti parts, then back up into a Ne whole. All the while forming a more in-depth understanding of the theory, or a more in-depth creation/edition of the theory. We see this happen when we get major socionics personalities that keep adding to the theory, adding new parts, adding more complexity, etc. NeTi might comment about some kind of link between socionics theory and another theory, and if the TiNe accepts that connection, they'll work to see how it all fits together. Work that the NeTi isn't likely to do, as they've likely already moved on to something else.


    And before there's further confusion, Ti/Fi are fields that are broken down into individual parts...individual field elements. Hence 'static'. The individual relationships, similarities, differences, connections which serve to further define the attributes of a thing, an idea, a person, an event.

    Ni/Si are fields that are cohesive wholes. Think of systems. If you mess with one part of a system, it will likely alter the entire system in some way. The systems can be broken down into parts (Fe/Te), but those are dynamic parts, each part representing a particular sequence/cycle within the overall system. Systems that primarily utilize Fe information to understand are generally systems that involve living creatures (human, animal, plant, etc). Hence why "ethics" is commonly listed in Fe definitions.
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    Quote Originally Posted by anndelise View Post
    Xe/Xi refers to Objects/Fields.

    P elements refer to taking something in as a whole, the integrity of the parts are kept together as one unit.
    J elements refer to dividing something up into its parts, each part being seen as discrete.

    (...)

    Each types has a different structure between information, and certain clumps fire off together differently than those of other types. So with NeTi, the underlying structure is related to Ti info, while with an NeFi, the underlying structure is related to Fi info. Both Ne types jump object to object, subject to subject, person to person, thought to thought. It might seem "dynamic" to an outsider, but the information attended to isn't particularly dynamic information. (Processing information is ITSELF a dynamic process, but the information being processed isn't necessarily dynamic information. Do you understand the difference?)

    (...)

    And before there's further confusion, Ti/Fi are fields that are broken down into individual parts...individual field elements. Hence 'static'. The individual relationships, similarities, differences, connections which serve to further define the attributes of a thing, an idea, a person, an event.

    Ni/Si are fields that are cohesive wholes. Think of systems. If you mess with one part of a system, it will likely alter the entire system in some way. The systems can be broken down into parts (Fe/Te), but those are dynamic parts, each part representing a particular sequence/cycle within the overall system. Systems that primarily utilize Fe information to understand are generally systems that involve living creatures (human, animal, plant, etc). Hence why "ethics" is commonly listed in Fe definitions.
    Reason is a whore.

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