Gamma Examples

[Lord Pixel]

@Lord Pixel the first couple is ILE man - ILI woman contrary. Probably they get along great when there are no cameras / producers around.

Second couple seems like LII - EII business. The guy is a total jackass.

ILE? For the guy I said was an ESI? Are you serious? His body language alone is ESI and his speak tone is Fi heavy, no way an ENTp even in you are typgin him based on their dynamic. I do agree it is contrary though, seeing that they are ESI and ESE.

And This woman is no way ILI, her Fe is loud and clear, not Fe Polr at all.

The second couple perhaps, I still think the man is an ILI and it's a super ego dynamic between ILI and SEI and the SEI is demanding the ILI to be better with his Polr because if Fe is his suggestive function he is not responding well to it.

[Lord Pixel]

Just the standout themes: he doesn't know her, has no history and so he can't yet relate to her. He needs her to admit this reality, and becomes standoffish and cold when she cannot acquiesce (thematic for ESI..?).

She needs him to engage and be open to her participation, she uses the the marriage as proof enough they can be open together, while he remains closed off even to the possiblity of freinds. She has scorn in her voice when she states "We can't even just be friends" which isn't really a big issue for FeSi types, only the moment by moment *play by play*.

Although their real sociotypes could be anything, this narrative fits though so it works on that end.

Wow, I didn't even take it that far, thanks for this more thorough explanation.

[nefnaf]

ILE? For the guy I said was an ESI? Are you serious? His body language alone is ESI and his speak tone is Fi heavy, no way an ENTp even in you are typgin him based on their dynamic. I do agree it is contrary though, seeing that they are ESI and ESE.

He commits a major ethical mistake by referring to his wife as a "stranger" ( 4th function). ESI would do that only to deliberately put someone down, however that is not his intention.

For his dual SEI that would be fine as they are keen to understand other's perspectives. However for the woman this is terrible since it leaves her feeling like the relationship lacks a solid foundation ( mobilizing).

[timber]

He commits a major ethical mistake by referring to his wife as a "stranger" ( 4th function). ESI would do that only to deliberately put someone down, however that is not his intention.

For his dual SEI that would be fine as they are keen to understand other's perspectives. However for the woman this is terrible since it leaves her feeling like the relationship lacks a solid foundation ( mobilizing).

See I saw it as a clear intention to put her down and put the entire thing in its place, which is where he needed the perspective to go in order to move forward. If she had just given in, things might have gone differently, but on her end she couldn't move past this (from the outside) seemingly cold move (it wasn't if you understand how Fi base types work) That she didn't *listen* showed him it wasn't possible for him to proceed (clearly fi is also very conscious for him so it can't be explained away by "hes a man"; "he is Jamaican"; "its a Fi polr"). Fi especially for gamma types isn't "nicey nice". They don;t really fuck around when it comes to relationship--> Se+Fi

[nefnaf]

See I saw it as a clear intention to put her down and put the entire thing in its place, which is where he needed the perspective to go in order to move forward. If she had just given in, things might have gone differently, but on her end she couldn't move past this (from the outside) seemingly cold move (it wasn't if you understand how Fi base types work) That she didn't *listen* showed him it wasn't possible for him to proceed (clearly fi is also very conscious for him so it can't be explained away by "hes a man"; "he is Jamaican"; "its a Fi polr"). Fi especially for gamma types isn't "nicey nice". They don;t really fuck around when it comes to relationship--> Se+Fi

Your understanding is warped somewhat. My typings are correct (at least for the first video), I don't care to get into it too deeply though.

ILE poorly feel how other people relate to them, they need support and reassurance in this area from their partner. Commenting that he feels like they are "strangers" would prompt SEI to start listing the ways in which they've gotten to know each other, which might be what he was hoping for. Obviously it didn't work out that way in the video.

[Lord Pixel]

He commits a major ethical mistake by referring to his wife as a "stranger" ( 4th function). ESI would do that only to deliberately put someone down, however that is not his intention.

For his dual SEI that would be fine as they are keen to understand other's perspectives. However for the woman this is terrible since it leaves her feeling like the relationship lacks a solid foundation ( mobilizing).

No. I disagree. He doesn't put her down. He is stating the fact that they do not know each other, the truth is that they are strangers. (To add context they are actually strangers because this shows makes strangers get married to each other)

Also she is a stranger to his Fi, best way to describe it is he hasn't gotten close to her, he is saying they are not close, and he also states she does not know him, these are statements made from lack of Fi closeness. The man even says I FEEL like you should be best friends with your spouse, this is a judgement based on a personal feeling, not rational thought.

She is seeing a lack of Fe in the marriage, and her Ti seems to be enough to convince her, we are married (fact), we should not be friends because married couples are not just friends (fact).

And this man is not an extrovert by any means. I am an EII and this man mirrors my body language and speech patterns/tone/laughter almost exactly, in that gutteral Fi sense.
And when he gets mad you can see his feelings introvert quickly, so much so that he does not lok mad and has to state that she pissed him off, (I act this way as well). She tries to not get caught up in his negative feelings and tries to lighten the mood, but his mood his Fi isn't influenced by her Fe in that sense.

And the ESI guy can't see how calling her a stranger hurts her, and he can't see how she doesn't feel the same as him, Ne Polr?

And that woman is "Very emotional, she cries when she's happy cries when she's sad." Fe Polr? Really?

[timber]

Your understanding is warped somewhat. My typings are correct (at least for the first video), I don't care to get into it too deeply though.

ILE poorly feel how other people relate to them, they need support and reassurance in this area from their partner. Commenting that he feels like they are "strangers" would prompt SEI to start listing the ways in which they've gotten to know each other, which might be what he was hoping for. Obviously it didn't work out that way in the video.

Weird you are talking about a theoretical version of the video in your minds eye, not the actual dynamic and interaction.

By your version, even if he was ILE, she was being extremely Fe, smiles, touches, cute movements, the whole 9 yards. Even read the comments to the video like: she is so cute and he is so cold. Yeah He's cold because he's trying to form a baseline attraction-repulsion as is (down played opportunity intuition to boot). Even his dominating attitude would work just right for ESI. He was looking for her to be his bitch, and she was looking for a playmate. There were several moments this could have gone well, if only she had started from where he wanted to start, not to where she though it was needing to be directed. This is a great Fe-Fi examplar. She wanted to high five and was shocked he chose not to and he wanted her to listen to him to get to know him on his terms and she was disdainful and pouty because she couldn't fathom his strange needs -->ignored Fi.

I've been doing this for almost a decade and I have excellent people watching skills so not really sure where your critical remark about warped understanding comes from, but okay BUD.

[nefnaf]

No. I disagree. He doesn't put her down. He is stating the fact that they do not know each other, the truth is that they are strangers. (To add context they are actually strangers because this shows makes strangers get married to each other)

Also she is a stranger to his Fi, best way to describe it is he hasn't gotten close to her, he is saying they are not close, and he also states she does not know him, these are statements made from lack of Fi closeness. The man even says I FEEL like you should be best friends with your spouse, this is a judgement based on a personal feeling, not rational thought.

She is seeing a lack of Fe in the marriage, and her Ti seems to be enough to convince her, we are married (fact), we should not be friends because married couples are not just friends (fact).

And this man is not an extrovert by any means. I am an EII and this man mirrors my body language and speech patterns/tone/laughter almost exactly, in that gutteral Fi sense.
And when he gets mad you can see his feelings introvert quickly, so much so that he does not lok mad and has to state that she pissed him off, (I act this way as well). She tries to not get caught up in his negative feelings and tries to lighten the mood, but his mood his Fi isn't influenced by her Fe in that sense.

And the ESI guy can't see how calling her a stranger hurts her, and he can't see how she doesn't feel the same as him, Ne Polr?

And that woman is "Very emotional, she cries when she's happy cries when she's sad." Fe Polr? Really?

I don't know about you but I would never refer to someone I've already gone on several dates with as a "stranger." Neither would any ESI that I can think of.

The idea your spouse should be your best friend is a very Alpha Irrational way of thinking. Gamma rationals take a very different approach in most cases.

I'm probably gonna leave it at that. I'm not expecting you to be convinced of my assessments, I just wanted to put the correct analysis out there so at least it's available.

[Lord Pixel]

Your understanding is warped somewhat. My typings are correct (at least for the first video), I don't care to get into it too deeply though.

ILE poorly feel how other people relate to them, they need support and reassurance in this area from their partner. Commenting that he feels like they are "strangers" would prompt SEI to start listing the ways in which they've gotten to know each other, which might be what he was hoping for. Obviously it didn't work out that way in the video.

Nah man I think your understanding is warped or something, You are claiming someone who is Fi 4d is Fi Polr.

[Lord Pixel]

I don't know about you but I would never refer to someone I've already gone on several dates with as a "stranger." Neither would any ESI that I can think of.

The idea your spouse should be your best friend is a very Alpha Irrational way of thinking. Gamma rationals take a very different approach in most cases.

I'm probably gonna leave it at that. I'm not expecting you to be convinced of my assessments, I just wanted to put the correct analysis out there so at least it's available.

You subscribe to what the woman says, who is your Dual BTW. So yea your thinking lines right up with the ESE woman. They are not complete strangers, but they do not know each other intimately that's what he means when he says stranger, she has not recognized as a deep and close companion to his Fi. And the best friend thing is an Fi value as well, close relations with people. And he says he's ALWAYS felt that way, so that points to static world view instead of dynamic, so rational dyad as well.

It's funny how your own response proved this woman is infact ESE since you line right up there with her.

And and ESI would say it like it is, and that's what he is doing.

I think you viewed parts of the interaction too literally and based your analysis off the literal interpretations.

[timber]

I don't know about you but I would never refer to someone I've already gone on several dates with as a "stranger." Neither would any ESI that I can think of.

The idea your spouse should be your best friend is a very Alpha Irrational way of thinking. Gamma rationals take a very different approach in most cases.

I'm probably gonna leave it at that. I'm not expecting you to be convinced of my assessments, I just wanted to put the correct analysis out there so at least it's available.

This is so wrong its not even funny. Its wrong because its not true of either kinds..why in the heck would a Fi type marry someone who they thought wasnt their best friend? Its preposterous.

Right gamma is business suites and stock markets.

Going on dates =/= besties. You can be a stranger after many months even. DUH. What do you think the ESI-SLE supervision is all about?

"we are strangers" really translates into from this man as: "I don;t like you and the more Fe you behave towards me the more blind you are about who and what I am, stop it and admit what I'm telling you as true and maybe then we can proceed."

Like you can;t see how conscious and multi-dimensional his introverted ethics is, to the point it modifies his behaviour in all the ways Pixel pointed out?

polr means ignorning-blinspot, not even conscious yet painful. It has nothing to do with being a cold-hearted jerk (to some people who don't understand quadra differences I guess)

[Soupman]

He commits a major ethical mistake by referring to his wife as a "stranger" ( 4th function). ESI would do that only to deliberately put someone down, however that is not his intention.

For his dual SEI that would be fine as they are keen to understand other's perspectives. However for the woman this is terrible since it leaves her feeling like the relationship lacks a solid foundation ( mobilizing).

This is idealization of duality is fundamentally incompatible with reality, Jesus do you people look at real people. That nonsense pisses off the dual much like it can the so called "conflictor". (the only exception is of course an inside joke between a couple - otherwise ethical types seem to take a lot of things to heart; the only exception are logical types who'll predominantly analyse emotions like they do language, in-spite of that people have triggers)

Next you'd be surprised to learn that duals aren't actually drawn to each other by default, they don't value each other's opposing way of doing things - unless they are dualised.

[nefnaf]

This is idealization of duality is fundamentally incompatible with reality, Jesus do you people look at real people. That nonsense pisses off the dual much like it can the so called "conflictor". (the only exception is of course an inside joke between a couple - otherwise ethical types seem to take a lot of things to heart; the only exception are logical types who'll predominantly analyse emotions like they do language, in-spite of that people have triggers)

Next you'd be surprised to learn that duals aren't actually drawn to each other by default, they don't value each other's opposing way of doing things - unless they are dualised.

Of course in most cases people aren't automatically drawn to their dual. Real life is messy. At large psychological distance duals often seem like normal people, pleasant company but not special or unusual.

When circumstances force people to interact closely, duality becomes readily apparent in the vast majority of cases. Blowups between duals are rare and tend to smooth over quickly. Of course there are tons of other factors involved that determine how a relationship will actually play out, type is just one factor. But the highly felicitous nature of dual relations can easily be observed if you know what to look for.

[silke]

This guy is so ESI it's not even funny, I love this guy, his little nuances remind me of myself lol.

Male ESI Female ESE

this couple had classic Fi/Fe clashes, Si/Se clashes.

This guy is an EII, reason why you're relating to him so much.

It's an EII-SEI benefit couple.

[Sol]

Brandie (The Official 700 Club) - mb ISFJ

"guy's gotta be an ESI" - N
"This guy is so ESI it's not even funny" - N

Of course in most cases people aren't automatically drawn to their dual. Real life is messy. At large psychological distance duals often seem like normal people, pleasant company but not special or unusual.

Duals differ much by functions and do not look as "normal people" - they are interesting.
Also if you find someone as "pleasant" - it's the minority for you, but not normal.

The sympathy to duals [of other sex, at least] appear easily. The closer you communicate, the more you notice IR effects as should. That they are pleasant you understand quickly, whithout much close distance.
The strongest effect is probably when you get the romantic attraction and then tune to them, introject them. Besides friendship relations.

> When circumstances force people to interact closely, duality becomes readily apparent in the vast majority of cases.

it becomes apparent on the stage you see nonverbal of them and such get the sympathy

> Blowups between duals are rare and tend to smooth over quickly.

Duality predisposes to good friendship, but nontypes factors exist and may create "blowups". It may take some time to adopt to each other, including because the difference in types when people had no experience of this IR close relations.
Also if you communicate formally, on far psyche distance, mb through Internet - the IR effects are lesser and duality will lesser soften the problems. Those who wants relations with some dual (and any good IR) should do IRL informal contact as soon as possibly and more of them, such IR have started to work as should, so nontypes obstacles will be overcame sooner.

> Of course there are tons of other factors involved that determine how a relationship will actually play out, type is just one factor.

The most common factor making problems with "duals" - the wrong types.
LII is doubtful as your type.
There is some chance for you to be T type, more thoughts about Te. In case you had emotional issues episodes. Your sometimes inadequate emotionality and the lack of reason mb explained by psyche instability too, besides F type. The lesser common you are, the easier to mistake in your type. The reason why nonverbal is very important - types related one is more stable than behavior like what people say and do, especially through forums where they have lesser restrictions. For example, I saw one psychopatic girl here, which I typed to T type by the video, but suspected F type by some her overemotional and brainless messages from other account.

The idea your spouse should be your best friend is a very Alpha Irrational way of thinking.

The main idea is the pair should be your good friend. It's universal, as friendship is the part of love.
Though some types like P and Fe valued may to have higher inclination to think that love (including friendship) is temporary state and hence not so meaningful, or that love will appear obligately later and you may ingore the friendship abbilities at first.

So the situation with P alphas should be the opposite. The types which have more of easy and short relations have lesser interest to deep friendship in relations. ILE/SEI tend to have more than average sexual partners without strong feelings, so they lesser seek for deep friendship in romances. It's also what I noticed on practice.

> Gamma rationals take a very different approach in most cases.

LIE/ESI have personal sympathy (Fi) among the main interests and have highly responsible approach to romances (as J), so are the types strongly valuing the friendship in romances which they see as important for good and stable relations.

You've assigned the trait to the least appropriate types and said it as the least relating to the types having it the most. The evident example of your heresy and the lack of practical observations.

> I'm not expecting you to be convinced of my assessments, I just wanted to put the correct analysis out there so at least it's available.

Because you said wrong and understand that have no good basis for this to argue.

Probably you've come to the nonsense by Reinin's heresy or alike. The situation based on the normal theory is the opposite.

[maniac]

when a Ti polr tries to make a convention

[maniac]

isfj

[Lord Pixel]

This guy is an EII, reason why you're relating to him so much.

It's an EII-SEI benefit couple.

I relate to him because of the strong Fi, but we differ. And the woman is an extrovert. Also the ESI has Ne Polr, it's why he can't see the woman's point of view.

[Adam Strange]

This is so wrong its not even funny. Its wrong because its not true of either kinds..why in the heck would a Fi type marry someone who they thought wasnt their best friend? Its preposterous.

Right gamma is business suites and stock markets.

Going on dates =/= besties. You can be a stranger after many months even. DUH. What do you think the ESI-SLE supervision is all about?

"we are strangers" really translates into from this man as: "I don;t like you and the more Fe you behave towards me the more blind you are about who and what I am, stop it and admit what I'm telling you as true and maybe then we can proceed."

Like you can;t see how conscious and multi-dimensional his introverted ethics is, to the point it modifies his behaviour in all the ways Pixel pointed out?

polr means ignorning-blinspot, not even conscious yet painful. It has nothing to do with being a cold-hearted jerk (to some people who don't understand quadra differences I guess)

Nothing to add, just quoting for reference.

[Lord Pixel]

ESI

This girl is almost a spitting personality image of my ex-gf, looks nothing like her acts alot like her, down to the nuances.

[maniac]

that girl seems ESXJ or some other extroverted sensor

[timber]

In my opinion i think she's being very emotional, I didn't think what he said was that deep but I do feel like he should have tried to comfort her a little more ffs he made her cry

Yeah I agree he was a lil immature bout it.

[timber]

isfj

In 2010 I had the amazing, spell bounding pleasure to see the Opening Ceremonies live (upper corner of the stadium, at then GM Place). This performance stands out as one of the most incredible I have ever seen. I'd go further and say that this performance influenced the rest of my life since then. Many people were crying around me, it was that intimate and heartfelt, which is a testimat to the power of this song, the memories of youth, the landscape itself, and the spirit of this Country.



Narration is by Canadian actor Donald Sutherland, and song by ofc Canadian singer songwriter Joni Mitchel. Radio typed her ENFp.

[woofwoofl]

This guy is so ESI it's not even funny, I love this guy, his little nuances remind me of myself lol.

Male ESI Female ESE

this couple had classic Fi/Fe clashes, Si/Se clashes.

the guy makes no sense to me re: etiquette, interacting with people, etc.; right from the start, he opens up a case for why the girl sucks, and why he sucks. Unprompted and destructive. Can't figure out what would make the dude, out of the blue, shit on himself, his marriage partner, and the entire unit. And then referring to himself, and her, as a "stranger", imo one of the worst terms to use to a person. Alienating on multiple levels, and once again out of nowhere. He says he wants his wife to be his best friend; he and his wife chose each other, his actions completely combat his stated goals, wtf. "This isn't regular" from the guy, next -- dude's sabotaging the relationship. Horrible. And the girl's emotive stuff is more louder and open, so she will end up looking more nuts, all for the rolling cameras and the audience to see.

[Allegra]

This guy is so ESI it's not even funny, I love this guy, his little nuances remind me of myself lol.

Male ESI Female ESE

this couple had classic Fi/Fe clashes, Si/Se clashes.

I agree the guy is more Fi than Fe and ESI sounds good enough. The girl might be SEI though as she doesn't come across very bubbly.

[Allegra]

the guy makes no sense to me re: etiquette, interacting with people, etc.; right from the start, he opens up a case for why the girl sucks, and why he sucks. Unprompted and destructive. Can't figure out what would make the dude, out of the blue, shit on himself, his marriage partner, and the entire unit. And then referring to himself, and her, as a "stranger", imo one of the worst terms to use to a person. Alienating on multiple levels, and once again out of nowhere. He says he wants his wife to be his best friend; he and his wife chose each other, his actions completely combat his stated goals, wtf. "This isn't regular" from the guy, next -- dude's sabotaging the relationship. Horrible. And the girl's emotive stuff is more louder and open, so she will end up looking more nuts, all for the rolling cameras and the audience to see.

ESI's have weak Ti.

[Lord Pixel]

the guy makes no sense to me re: etiquette, interacting with people, etc.; right from the start, he opens up a case for why the girl sucks, and why he sucks. Unprompted and destructive. Can't figure out what would make the dude, out of the blue, shit on himself, his marriage partner, and the entire unit. And then referring to himself, and her, as a "stranger", imo one of the worst terms to use to a person. Alienating on multiple levels, and once again out of nowhere. He says he wants his wife to be his best friend; he and his wife chose each other, his actions completely combat his stated goals, wtf. "This isn't regular" from the guy, next -- dude's sabotaging the relationship. Horrible. And the girl's emotive stuff is more louder and open, so she will end up looking more nuts, all for the rolling cameras and the audience to see.

Well, to add context, this is a reality TV show where strangers get married. So it isn't regular, and they did not choose each other.

[Lord Pixel]

I agree the guy is more Fi than Fe and ESI sounds good enough. The girl might be SEI though as she doesn't come across very bubbly.

If I provided more videos you would see how much more bubbly she is when she isn't in a serious conversation.

[Dauphin]

Shel Silverstein: SEE-Fi

[timber]

the guy makes no sense to me re: etiquette, interacting with people, etc.; right from the start, he opens up a case for why the girl sucks, and why he sucks. Unprompted and destructive. Can't figure out what would make the dude, out of the blue, shit on himself, his marriage partner, and the entire unit. And then referring to himself, and her, as a "stranger", imo one of the worst terms to use to a person. Alienating on multiple levels, and once again out of nowhere. He says he wants his wife to be his best friend; he and his wife chose each other, his actions completely combat his stated goals, wtf. "This isn't regular" from the guy, next -- dude's sabotaging the relationship. Horrible. And the girl's emotive stuff is more louder and open, so she will end up looking more nuts, all for the rolling cameras and the audience to see.

yeah, he could have just rolled with it a little more and not have been so standoffish, wouldn't be how I would have chosen to behave. I mean, what did he think it was going to be about? He could have just had more fun with it, it was supposed to be a little bit more enjoyable instead he looked weak and nerdy, no matter how authentic he felt like he was being.

Give him over to the deltas then.

[Spermatozoa]

ESI's have weak Ti.

They make up for it in other ways

[Sol]

ESI have weak Ti.

do not say them

[Lord Pixel]

@Sol

""guy's gotta be an ESI" - N
"This guy is so ESI it's not even funny" - N"

I just saw this, what or who is N?

[Bertrand]

the guy makes no sense to me re: etiquette, interacting with people, etc.; right from the start, he opens up a case for why the girl sucks, and why he sucks. Unprompted and destructive. Can't figure out what would make the dude, out of the blue, shit on himself, his marriage partner, and the entire unit. And then referring to himself, and her, as a "stranger", imo one of the worst terms to use to a person. Alienating on multiple levels, and once again out of nowhere. He says he wants his wife to be his best friend; he and his wife chose each other, his actions completely combat his stated goals, wtf. "This isn't regular" from the guy, next -- dude's sabotaging the relationship. Horrible. And the girl's emotive stuff is more louder and open, so she will end up looking more nuts, all for the rolling cameras and the audience to see.

I think your answer is that this is intentional because its for TV. there's at least two possible results 1) cameras turn off and they go back to normal and it was mainly all for show with no lasting effects 2) they sacrificed their relationship for 5 minutes of infamy. I think in Fe types it may actually be a little of both, where the emotions were real, but they just calmed down as were fine two hours later. people can do this 5 times a day for life and keep it together. guy seems ESE to me

people sometimes think IEE is the poster child for being confused, but its more a keanu reeves "woah" kind of confused. think: does 4d Fe base 2d Ne come off as more confused than 4d Ne base 4d Fe demonstrative. in other words, ESE is the "communicator" and that means straightforward manifestation of everything, including confusion, which is the basis of their self esteem (Ne HA Ti suggestive), they basically get all googley eyed so as to tell LII to explain things better, among other things. IEE is way more subdued in how they go about "communicating" and they're not looking for the same kind of "explanations for literally everything" which is what Ti base produces

[Dauphin]

Getulio Vargas: ILI-Te 6w5 so/sp

[Sol]

Yulia Shipovskaya - ISFJ

[Kalinoche buenanoche]

Sophia Hadjipanteli Fi-SEE 734 so/sx

cool girl

i think that in this video she describes having been infatuated with her imago (''Fabio'') ;/

[Sol]

Sophia Hadjipanteli - IEI

[Kalinoche buenanoche]

@Sol actually i can see that

[Adam Strange]

@Sol actually i can see that

I sure can’t see IEI. I think your first impression of SEE-Fi is correct.