Once and for all: which NF type is Sirena?

[Sirena]

http://www.sociotype.com/tests/result/est/71283

Your Sociotype: IEI-0 (INFp)

Other Possible Types:
EIE (ENFj): 97% as likely as IEI.
EII (INFj): 74% as likely as IEI.
IEE (ENFp): 57% as likely as IEI.

Seriously? LOL. Am I EVER going to completely, without a doubt, figure out which NF type I am??? I have known that I am some type of NF from day 1 but have wavered between all 4 types (especially IEI, EIE and IEE). Nothing seems to fit 100%, either the temperament is wrong or dual-seeking functions are wrong, etc etc. Any ideas on how to lay this to rest once and for all? I am not happy "not knowing" or going back and forth constantly. I want to know beyond a shadow of a doubt.

I have had very minimal success with these Type Me threads in the past because people have sometimes seemed more interested in proving themselves or their personal stereotypes right or just assume that they know me and how my mind works by trying to push a certain type down my throat. Of course I need to come to this realization on my own but I do need help, so ideally I would like for people to help me in pointing out what to look for so I can better differentiate between these 4 types.

Thanks!

[Amber]

Socionics shoots itself in the foot with such results. How can you be IEI-0 and EIE 97% just as likely. If you're IEI 2/3 Fe ...maybe.

ooops, i don't know you, but just by staring at your avatar and going by hunches I'd say IEI (twin/mirror images is a theme I've recurrently come across when dealing with this type).

[Sirena]

Socionics shoots itself in the foot with such results. How can you be IEI-0 and EIE 97% just as likely. If you're IEI 2/3 Fe ...maybe.

ooops, i don't know you, but just by staring at your pic and going by hunches I'd say IEI (twin/mirror images is a theme I've recurrently come across when dealing with this type).

Yeah, I agree it's not very helpful to end up with IEI then EIE 97% as likely, but it seems to be a recurrent theme for me in general, not just from this test. I feel that by now I should have sufficient grasp of socionics to type myself, but as I stated before, I often find things that are contradictory (or I at least see it that way). For instance, I have come to realize that based solely on organization of base functions and valued functions, I am most likely EIE, but then things like temperament always throw me off because I've always considered myself introverted and I'm definitely not comfortable initiating things. Yet, when I try to fit myself into IEI the order of functions don't match as well as with EIE. Ugh. Then there's the whole Delta side that I still can't completely rule out either because I don't feel like I'm into influencing the emotional atmosphere as much as I've read on Beta NF descriptions. Then there's Ti vs. Te. I am completely convinced that I value Ti soooo very much and Te not at all. Also, based on past interactions with Delta STs, there seemed to be an immediate attraction only for things to completely blow up in the long run, I think caused primarily by Fe-related conflicts. Opposing quadras...it should be easy, right?

[Scapegrace]

For what it's worth ai think it's possible that giving the mirror relation as a 97% second possibility is a bug in that test. I took it and got ILI with a 97% chance of being LIE. I don't think anyone would accept that result as being correct.

[Sirena]

For what it's worth ai think it's possible that giving the mirror relation as a 97% second possibility is a bug in that test. I took it and got ILI with a 97% chance of being LIE. I don't think anyone would accept that result as being correct.

Hmmm, maybe a bug then. Still doesn't change that all the suggested types are NFs.

[Iris]

http://www.sociotype.com/tests/result/est/71283

Your Sociotype: IEI-0 (INFp)

Other Possible Types:
EIE (ENFj): 97% as likely as IEI.
EII (INFj): 74% as likely as IEI.
IEE (ENFp): 57% as likely as IEI.

Seriously? LOL. Am I EVER going to completely, without a doubt, figure out which NF type I am??? I have known that I am some type of NF from day 1 but have wavered between all 4 types (especially IEI, EIE and IEE). Nothing seems to fit 100%, either the temperament is wrong or dual-seeking functions are wrong, etc etc. Any ideas on how to lay this to rest once and for all? I am not happy "not knowing" or going back and forth constantly. I want to know beyond a shadow of a doubt.

I have had very minimal success with these Type Me threads in the past because people have sometimes seemed more interested in proving themselves or their personal stereotypes right or just assume that they know me and how my mind works by trying to push a certain type down my throat. Of course I need to come to this realization on my own but I do need help, so ideally I would like for people to help me in pointing out what to look for so I can better differentiate between these 4 types.

Thanks!

I can get a variety of results from those tests because the answer choices are rarely clear cut enough. I can see possibilities in more than one answer. So I got tired of trying tests and tried to stick to type descriptions, going function by function.

I could see possibilities in more than one type description. There are many similarities among the NFs. So I tried considering quadras. Beta sounded scary and tough and Delta sounded too grown up.

**What really helped me was taking a trip with a group of Deltas plus one other Beta. The Deltas were so fixated on their creature comforts. We were at the beach and it was such an "us against the environment" mentality for them. They didn't want to get sandy, they didn't want to get dehydrated, so they couldn't go anywhere without their water bottles ( it was a pleasant 75 degrees every day.) They diligently fixed their hair every morning only to have the wind ruin it every day on their way to the dimly cozy little coffee shop which is where they wanted to spend their time (not on the actual beach.) That was when I realized that Si was not a valued function for me. My Beta friend had what I would consider a normal approach to enjoying a trip to the beach.

Sometimes I say, maybe I'm IEE. But I remember the IEE on that trip was just soaking up the Si provided by the Deltas and having a great time in that atmosphere, which felt totally confining, suffocating and inward focused to me.

When I think about the EII on that trip, trying to protect herself from the wind and sun (with a kind of gentle helplessness) and trying to cater to everyone's comfort, I know I am not that type. (I also need to protect myself from the sun, my attitude is different, because I dislike every second that I am attending to myself.)

Sometimes you just have to spend time in a slightly hostile environment to figure out what type people are. I had actually spent a lot of time working with those people and also travelled with them. But that beach trip really made it clear that they were Deltas and I was not.

[Sirena]

EIEs are naturally animate and passionate and are skilled at generating liveliness and excitement. They believe that people need to be emotionally involved in life, not distant or indifferent to the important things that are happening. EIEs often hold strong views about governance and social custom, though their beliefs stem from the interests of their close emotional relationships. EIEs like to involve people in interaction and create groups based around a shared experience. They tend to try to continually broaden these groups and engage people who seem to be on the sidelines. The individuals who the EIE is spending time with are far more important to the EIE than the event that is actually taking place. EIEs like to make their friends laugh, and employ an over-the-top style of humor. Often the joke is on the EIE, whether or not they know it.

I relate to the bold parts, to varying degrees. I don't consider myself particularly animated or lively (I think bubbly when I read this). I'm actually very self-conscious and maybe a little uptight when in an unfamiliar environment and do not enjoy being the center of attention, except maybe when I'm doing something I know I'm really good at like dancing or acting. So if this is a must for being an EIE, I can't be one. I would say it is the only thing holding me back from typing myself as one.
I do relate very strongly to the part about believing that people need to be emotionally involved, not only in life, but in the world they live in. By this I don't mean that they need to do specific things, but rather that they should have an opinion and take a stand. I'm always disappointed to look around and notice how apathetic people tend to be. I highly admire people that have firm and strong opinions about things and will stand up for them no matter what, willing to die for them if necessary. Seriously, this is how passionate I am about things. I could disagree with someone's principles, yet admire them for how far they're willing to go for them. I can't admire people that are easily influenced and waver on their opinions a lot, especially for personal gain or to save themselves. I find it disgusting and cowardly. That's one thing I can't tolerate: cowardice. This made me think of a time my husband (possibly LII) and I were watching The Tudors, in which Henry VIII was demanding that everyone either agree with his newly self-founded Church of England or of course, be charged with treason and executed. Most people, of course, found it more convenient to keep their heads on their shoulders and tell him what he wanted to hear, except for a couple of people (of which Sir Thomas More stands out and who was my favorite character in the series). My husband didn't see a problem with people doing what they thought they needed to do in order to survive because according to him that wouldn't change what was in their heart. I, on the other hand, could care less what was in their hearts if they weren't willing to stand up for it. To me they all deserved to die for being cowards, even Lady Mary who ended up yielding to the king in the end. My husband thought I was being idealistic and of course didn't actually believe that I would do that if actually confronted with that situation, but I truly in my heart believe that I would or I could never live with myself.
Again, I do not see myself as being the class clown and would definitely not feel comfortable being the butt of anyone's jokes, as I am pretty self-conscious as to how others see me and how I'm coming across.

EIEs are one of the most insightful types about the minds and inner workings of people, and as a result are likely to be skilled persuaders. Their sensitivity to the emotional flow around them allows them a relative sense of emotional control of a situation, and they have an uncanny ability to convince others, even without the use of logic. EIEs generally don't use their persuasion tactics for manipulative gain over others (as much of their sense of self-worth comes from impacting people positively), but they've been known to use these tactics negatively in cases where they cannot win approval of their arguments. In many situations, nevertheless, EIEs value equality among social standards and do not mind taking the back seat if others wish to take the lead. EIEs love their friends, and they will do anything to keep them. Time spent alone for the EIE is often spent thinking about how to better interact with close relationships, even when time spent in those relationships is not particularly pleasing. Even when the other individual is hostile, if the EIE judges them to be a friend they will act in a caring fashion and show affection to the other.

Everything here is pretty accurate except that I rarely ever feel comfortable taking the lead to begin with, except maybe in a purely ethical matter like the one I mentioned above.
I'm also not sure about that last sentence.

[Sirena]

I can get a variety of results from those tests because the answer choices are rarely clear cut enough. I can see possibilities in more than one answer. So I got tired of trying tests and tried to stick to type descriptions, going function by function.

I could see possibilities in more than one type description. There are many similarities among the NFs. So I tried considering quadras. Beta sounded scary and tough and Delta sounded too grown up.

**What really helped me was taking a trip with a group of Deltas plus one other Beta. The Deltas were so fixated on their creature comforts. We were at the beach and it was such an "us against the environment" mentality for them. They didn't want to get sandy, they didn't want to get dehydrated, so they couldn't go anywhere without their water bottles ( it was a pleasant 75 degrees every day.) They diligently fixed their hair every morning only to have the wind ruin it every day on their way to the dimly cozy little coffee shop which is where they wanted to spend their time (not on the actual beach.) That was when I realized that Si was not a valued function for me. My Beta friend had what I would consider a normal approach to enjoying a trip to the beach.

Sometimes I say, maybe I'm IEE. But I remember the IEE on that trip was just soaking up the Si provided by the Deltas and having a great time in that atmosphere, which felt totally confining, suffocating and inward focused to me.

When I think about the EII on that trip, trying to protect herself from the wind and sun (with a kind of gentle helplessness) and trying to cater to everyone's comfort, I know I am not that type. (I also need to protect myself from the sun, my attitude is different, because I dislike every second that I am attending to myself.)

Sometimes you just have to spend time in a slightly hostile environment to figure out what type people are. I had actually spent a lot of time working with those people and also travelled with them. But that beach trip really made it clear that they were Deltas and I was not.

I've never been a huge fan of tests either, I just thought I'd give it another shot. I always get some type of NF as expected, usually EII or IEI because I tend to test as an Introvert. If I were to go strictly by temperament, there's no way I could be Ej. This is one of the things that's throwing me off.

I can definitely relate to your experience at the beach trip. It's exactly how I would react too. I hate for what I consider superficial, mundane things like that to get in the way of my experiences and would certainly not react very well to someone implying that they're important. I want to be immersed in the experience and like you, "dislike every second that I'm attending to myself". To me it feels like I just couldn't be bothered with it, it feels irritating and like a chore every time I have to do it.

Very helpful post. Thank you!

[Iris]

I've never been a huge fan of tests either, I just thought I'd give it another shot. I always get some type of NF as expected, usually EII or IEI because I tend to test as an Introvert. If I were to go strictly by temperament, there's no way I could be Ej. This is one of the things that's throwing me off.

I can definitely relate to your experience at the beach trip. It's exactly how I would react too. I hate for what I consider superficial, mundane things like that to get in the way of my experiences and would certainly not react very well to someone implying that they're important. I want to be immersed in the experience and like you, "dislike every second that I'm attending to myself". To me it feels like I just couldn't be bothered with it, it feels irritating and like a chore every time I have to do it.

Very helpful post. Thank you!

Glad to be of help!

Just to follow up, once I decided on Beta, I could not decide between EIE and IEI. The stereotypes just confused me. So I started considering Se mobilizing vs Se suggestive. Talking with an IEI helped, as she described her powerlessness to get people to do what she wanted, whereas I had experienced the same situation and had no problem getting the desired behavior. I am also more convinced of what people should or shouldn't be doing in any given situation. And then i am willing to try and bend people to my will. Sorry, that makes me sound like a megalomaniac, which i am not. Whereas an IEI, while still holding passionate feelings, is more of a live and let live type. @truck was very helpful to me in coming to that realization.

FYI, I am pretty quiet on the outside, with these very strong opinions that I hide a lot of the time. Because I will have more success if I focus my energy on being influential in a few important areas. (I pick my battles.)

[Iris]

Glad to be of help!

Just to follow up, once I decided on Beta, I could not decide between EIE and IEI. The stereotypes just confused me. So I started considering Se mobilizing vs Se suggestive. Talking with an IEI helped, as she described her powerlessness to get people to do what she wanted, whereas I had experienced the same situation and had no problem getting the desired behavior. I am also more convinced of what people should or shouldn't be doing in any given situation. And then i am willing to try and bend people to my will. Sorry, that makes me sound like a megalomaniac, which i am not. Whereas an IEI, while still holding passionate feelings, is more of a live and let live type. @truck was very helpful to me in coming to that realization.

FYI, I am pretty quiet on the outside, with these very strong opinions that I hide a lot of the time. Because I will have more success if I focus my energy on being influential in a few important areas. (I pick my battles.)

I have an SLE friend that I work with and my interactions with her pointed to activity relationship. She is a little too hasty, and quick to use Se. An IEI would laugh off stuff that I can't. I love her to death, but she can't be my dual. I have worked a small amount with an LSI and he is so much more careful in a satisfying way. With my SLE, I never know when she might jerk the rug out from under me. I am too uptight to be IP.

[Amber]

I have an SLE friend that I work with and my interactions with her pointed to activity relationship. She is a little too hasty, and quick to use Se. An IEI would laugh off stuff that I can't. I love her to death, but she can't be my dual. I have worked a small amount with an LSI and he is so much more careful in a satisfying way. With my SLE, I never know when she might jerk the rug out from under me. I am too uptight to be IP.

From a few interactions I've seen online, IEIs are *thrilled* with the shit SLE does and says, regardless what for or to whom. I've never seen any IEI trying to tone down SLEs brashness or to give them Fi/Fe advice.
Iris, you seem more organized and more deliberate than Sirena from as little as I've read. I suppose it comes from rationality. And you don't really strike me a a drama queen, as forum portraits go.

[Sirena]

Glad to be of help!

Just to follow up, once I decided on Beta, I could not decide between EIE and IEI. The stereotypes just confused me. So I started considering Se mobilizing vs Se suggestive. Talking with an IEI helped, as she described her powerlessness to get people to do what she wanted, whereas I had experienced the same situation and had no problem getting the desired behavior. I am also more convinced of what people should or shouldn't be doing in any given situation. And then i am willing to try and bend people to my will. Sorry, that makes me sound like a megalomaniac, which i am not. Whereas an IEI, while still holding passionate feelings, is more of a live and let live type. @truck was very helpful to me in coming to that realization.

FYI, I am pretty quiet on the outside, with these very strong opinions that I hide a lot of the time. Because I will have more success if I focus my energy on being influential in a few important areas. (I pick my battles.)

Hmmm, I'm not so sure about this. Maybe I'd be somewhere in the middle. This makes you sound very confident, which I lack sometimes. I don't know, I find it so hard to say "this is definitively the way I act" because it changes based on many factors and also my mood. Sometimes I will tell somebody off for breathing, while at a different time I won't give a crap. (Yes, sometimes people are even allowed to breathe ) I have strong opinions as to what people should or shouldn't be doing in a given situation but I'm less confident in my ability to be able to get them to do what I think they should (sounds more IEI>EIE) although TBH, if I feel strongly enough about it, I will let them know. I think I come off as this even-tempered person who then all of a sudden flips a switch. The bold part does sound like what I just wrote, though.

I have an SLE friend that I work with and my interactions with her pointed to activity relationship. She is a little too hasty, and quick to use Se. An IEI would laugh off stuff that I can't. I love her to death, but she can't be my dual. I have worked a small amount with an LSI and he is so much more careful in a satisfying way. With my SLE, I never know when she might jerk the rug out from under me. I am too uptight to be IP.

I react the same way to Se. I like it, but in a more restricted way. I have said before that I am a little uptight and so would have a problem with unrestrained displays of Se and would probably find myself getting them to tone it down. This definitely makes me feel like EIE>IEI.

These are good example of one of my main problems typing myself: one one hand I don't seem to fit the temperament part of EIE, while on the other hand I can clearly see that I value Ti over Se for my DS function, for instance. It's a battle of functions vs. temperament!

From a few interactions I've seen online, IEIs are *thrilled* with the shit SLE does and says, regardless what for or to whom. I've never seen any IEI trying to tone down SLEs brashness or to give them Fi/Fe advice.
Iris, you seem more organized and more deliberate than Sirena from as little as I've read. I suppose it comes from rationality. And you don't really strike me a a drama queen, as forum portraits go.

Do I strike you as a drama queen?

[Sirena]

Is it possible that a strong Ni subtype (EIE) could account for some of ^ this?

[Amber]

Is it possible that a strong Ni subtype (EIE) could account for some of ^ this?

why don't you make a vid with questions as well, if you feel you're floating above so many possibilities? Communication only in written form is damn one-sided and on such a forum it's really not hard to pick one type for another person you know very little and make a case for it. I wouldn't say you appear as a drama queen, but still a bit more loose. I could also speculate on your indecision. Rationals are said to want to reach conclusions faster ...even though sometimes this trait may make them 'cling' to what is not exactly the truth.

[Olduvai]

I am completely convinced that I value Ti soooo very much and Te not at all.

How so?

I think caused primarily by Fe-related conflicts.

Please elaborate.

I am pretty self-conscious as to how others see me and how I'm coming across.

How so?

My husband thought I was being idealistic and of course didn't actually believe that I would do that if actually confronted with that situation, but I truly in my heart believe that I would or I could never live with myself.

3.

Cannot comfortably express volitional pressure. Cannot act in ways deemed dishonorable or deplorable. Is not oriented well in the sphere of personal health and maintenance.

I rarely ever feel comfortable taking the lead to begin with

3. Cannot comfortably express volitional pressure. Cannot act in ways deemed dishonorable or deplorable. Is not oriented well in the sphere of personal health and maintenance.

I'm less confident in my ability to be able to get them to do what I think they should

3. Cannot comfortably express volitional pressure. Cannot act in ways deemed dishonorable or deplorable. Is not oriented well in the sphere of personal health and maintenance.

displays of Se

What would this look like?

It's a battle of functions vs. temperament!

Maybe you should try some Reinin.

[Sirena]

@Chris Clearly: In what position are you referring to Se here?

[Sirena]

why don't you make a vid with questions as well, if you feel you're floating above so many possibilities? Communication only in written form is damn one-sided and on such a forum it's really not hard to pick one type for another person you know very little and make a case for it. I wouldn't say you appear as a drama queen, but still a bit more loose. I could also speculate on your indecision. Rationals are said to want to reach conclusions faster ...even though sometimes this trait may make them 'cling' to what is not exactly the truth.

Video is still one-sided communication, isn't it? I do understand how it might be helpful, though. I'll see about doing this although I have no idea what the heck I would talk about lol.

I would say my approach lines up with wanting to reach this conclusion asap, otherwise I'd just continue to leisurely browse the forum until I made up my mind. I think I was pretty clear in the OP that it was important for me to reach this conclusion and put an end to this.

[Sirena]

Maybe you should try some Reinin.

I am only familiar with a couple of these: aristocratic/democratic, positivist/negativist and constructivist/emotivist, and not to any great extent. I basically just read the descriptions and examples and wrote my answer on here. I feel the strongest about the ones in bold.

Carefree
Aristocratic
Negativist
Process
Obstinate
Strategic
Decisive
Static/Dynamic- unsure, but I'd go with Dynamic>Static
Constructivist- I wrote about this in a recent thread
Merry
Declaring

[Sirena]

@Chris Clearly

Originally Posted by Sirena
I am completely convinced that I value Ti soooo very much and Te not at all.

How so?

Because I appreciate someone breaking things down for me into what makes sense rather than assist me in being more efficient and productive. To me, the most efficient way is not necessarily the best way. I value someone that can help me understand something logically, how things fit into a particular framework. I think this is exactly what I've been asking for in this thread, for instance.

Originally Posted by Sirena
I think caused primarily by Fe-related conflicts.

Please elaborate.

There was initial attraction, but things eroded rather quickly due to their perceived excess of "emotionality" (I don't think that's a word ) on my part. Basically, they consider me emotionally high-maintenance. It left me confused because to me, I was just trying to express how I felt, but it made them uncomfortable and overwhelmed. They seemed to demand some sort of unspoken understanding, which only led me to amp up my emotional response in order to evoke some sort of reaction on their part. It was quite sad, actually, because we just wanted to be close and there was mutual care between us. We just couldn't get there and the harder we tried, the more we alienated each other.

Originally Posted by Sirena
I am pretty self-conscious as to how others see me and how I'm coming across.

How so?

I'm just keenly aware of how others perceive me. I see people that appear so confident and carefree because they lack this filter of self-awareness, they have no clue nor do they care how they're coming across to others (they probably don't care because they don't have a clue). Anyway, I do

Originally Posted by Sirena
displays of Se

What would this look like?

I was referring to using unrestricted force to get what they want/achieve their goals. I like Se more in the sense of willpower, determination, perseverance to achieve a goal. One of the reasons I prefer LSIs over SLEs is how TiSe seems to translate into constancy and reliability vs. the recklessness of SeTi. I need those things to calm my insecurities. I like that more focused use of it. I'm not sure if that explains it.