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Thread: INFj-ESTj duality descriptions by Meged, Gulenko, Agusta (EII-LSE)

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    Default INFj-ESTj duality descriptions by Meged, Gulenko, Agusta (EII-LSE)

    The Administrator is the ESTj and The Humanist is the INFj.

    © From: V.Meged, A.Ovcharov. Learn To Manage People Efficiently, 2000.

    The Administrator is very hard working; he rationally spends his time and does not like getting distracted by extraneous talk. He is very practical and economical. He strives to be competent in business issues, accumulating necessary information on problems interesting to him. He tends to take on too many responsibilities. So he needs The Humanist, which can suggest, which actions are most promising. The Humanist willingly helps in this work, doing it diligently and qualitatively.

    The Administrator does not tolerate inferior quality. He likes integrity and uprightness in relations. The Humanist, as a rule, is an exceptionally honest and conscientious partner. He willingly processes great quantities of information, draws general conclusions and schedules actions. The Administrator sees planning as a problem. On the one hand, he is sometimes too impatient, on the other Ė he may be distracted by outside matters, procrastinating on important issues and failing to fulfill them in due time. He accepts this fact very painfully. He needs an undemanding regulator, a provident and prescient partner.

    The second bright trait of The Administrator is his ability to take care of his family's welfare. He strives for a high standard of living. He demands quality and possesses well-developed esthetic taste. He is a kind of gourmet, likes tasty and healthy meals; parties for his close friends or family members organized by him are distinguished by very high taste. The Humanist is very reserved in communication. He is devoted to his narrow but stable circle of friends. He possesses 'clever hands' and interest in various technologies, culinary and medical recipes. While The Administrator creates comfort on a whole, his dual perfects all the details.

    The Humanist is very attentive towards people, which is not applicable to his dual who is interested more in results of work and communication rather than in the very process. For this reason The Administrator, who is usually reserved and polite, may give way to irritation and wrath, especially when people take his precious time. At such moments he loses the feeling of tactfulness, may become blunt. He needs an ever-reserved, diplomatic and peaceful partner by his side. The Humanist softens ethical mistakes of his dual, performs peacemaking activities. By his persuasions he softens harsh behavior of the Administrator, appeals to his inborn nobility, magnanimity and conscience. By doing this, he facilitates communication with others. This helps The Administrator to keep stable the circle of his business partners.

    The Humanist also foresees well the outcome of undertakings and relations. By his advice he helps his improvident dual to avoid many mistakes, the main of which is wishful thinking, especially about health and relations with people. He recognizes well the perspectives of new theories or technologies and he is among the first to struggle for their implementation.

    The Administrator is conservative enough in his views, and without such support he tends to fall into routine, may even stop in his development, stagnate in everyday chores, or lose his spirituality, romantic feelings and interest towards intellectual novelties.

    On the other hand, The Administrator is capable of thinking clearly and logically, of noticing whatís most important, of modernizing inefficient, outdated structures or technologies. He strives for higher quality and better outcome. The Humanist needs such a partner, who switches his attention from trivialities to more global undertakings. In addition, his dual attracts him as a protector and leader.

    The Humanist is a very softhearted and sensitive person. His kindness if often misused by the others. By contrast, The Administrator is full of initiative, but does not like when others impose their own initiatives on him. He may show aggression, but hardly perceives aggression of the others. The Humanist, in spite of his indecisiveness, defends his own interests silently but impertinently, if he is sure of his being right. In practical affairs he is not very capable of protecting his interests, letting his more penetrative dual do it. He tolerates The Administrator's inability to praise, make compliments, which is caused by his insufficient understanding of individual traits and human potential capabilities. The Humanist understands this aspect and considers it to be so obvious that he does not require words of approval. He likes the integrity and hard work of his short-spoken dual.

    This dual pair is characterized with certain reticence, isolation from other people, hard work, and attention to details and integrity in everything.
    SEE-Se, 852 sx/so

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    That must be a description of a healthy homosexual dual relationship...
    It says his/him/he for everything whether it be the infj or the estj, not once does it mention a female...lol


    EDIT...
    [disclaimer mode] Before anyone thinks crazy about what I said, i'm just speaking of how it's normally written when I've seen in the past. At least one of the people being talked about is usually a he or a she. [/disclaimer mode]

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    I would imagine there would be a whole different set of theories on how typing effects homosexuality in relationships At least we know this particular pairing is doing just fine
    ENFp

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    Quote Originally Posted by cracka
    That must be a description of a healthy homosexual dual relationship...
    It says his/him/he for everything whether it be the infj or the estj, not once does it mention a female...lol
    I have read this description a few times before and I didn't even notice it until you pointed it out.

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    looks like cracka is gay and eunice isn't infj
    asd

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    Quote Originally Posted by heath
    looks like cracka is gay and eunice isn't infj

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    Quote Originally Posted by heath
    looks like cracka is gay and eunice isn't infj
    Owned.

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    thats sounds fairly correct, especially the healthy foods. My dad is really into that these days.
    {♠x<ļ))))><ł.∑īĮ`∑.łIcEPiCkł.∑īĮ`∑.ł><((((ļ>x♠ }

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    Default the INFj and ESTj dual description

    I think I'm ENTj right now, but INFj was another type that a couple people said I could be. I read the INFj dual description and did not think I would like a relationship like that. Are there INFjs or ESTjs here that don't like the dual description or don't think it's accurate?

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    If you don't like the duality description, that should be a big red flag. Dual interactions define what each type is.

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    The duality description in the articles section (that I/UDP compiled) of delta rational couple - yes, I find that reasonably appealing.
    Pre-2013 post are written with incomplete understanding.

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    What do the current rosters of EII and LSE think of this profile?
    Pre-2013 post are written with incomplete understanding.

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    He tolerates The Administrator's inability to praise, make compliments, which is caused by his insufficient understanding of individual traits and human potential capabilities
    I have learned how to give compliments to people I really appreciate and qualities I really appreciate, but only when it is really something I do appreciate in someone else.

    I am not sure if "inability to make compliments" is something I would really associate with LSEs. Maybe just not in an Fe sort of way. But, in terms of quality, I can praise or criticize easily it seems. Perhaps not as much as other people need, because I can always see things done better. Yet, compliments can be like rewards that encourage moving in the right direction. Positive reinforcement.



    However on this forum it seems as though I criticize much more than compliment - would you not agree?
    Pre-2013 post are written with incomplete understanding.

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    There's a large problem with descriptions that make no allowances for different subtypes though. They're usually made for the accepting subtype of any given type and ignore the creative subtype, but yes, if one does see oneself strongly in a given description, that is important.
    First eliminate every possible source of error. Thence success is inevitable.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Courage
    I am not sure if "inability to make compliments" is something I would really associate with LSEs.
    I agree with you, my LSE father does compliment, and that is good.
    LSI

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    Default Re: ESTj/INFj duality description

    Quote Originally Posted by Joy
    © From: V.Meged, A.Ovcharov. Learn To Manage People Efficiently, 2000.

    This dual pair is characterized with certain reticence, isolation from other people, hard work, and attention to details and integrity in everything.
    I don't get it. It sounds restrictive and kind of anti-social.

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    It makes a lot of sense to me. Or at least I wouldn't mind it.

    I believe the "isolation from other people" have to do with a certain bit of "wow, look how much I have found here with this one person. I really want to spend a lot of my time with him/her". I think the two types make a great couple. But then again, INFjs are my dual, so perhaps I'm just talking through my hardwiring.
    Pre-2013 post are written with incomplete understanding.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Courage
    What do the current rosters of EII and LSE think of this profile?
    One EII thinks it sounds surprisingly perfect.

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    I don't like all of the "hard work". Really, I'd like the LSE to just do the hard work for us. I hate physical labor and I just don't have the energy. It is not my ideal to have someone I can work hard, side-by-side with. I don't want to be a little princess either, but I'd rather do the emotional work and he can do the physical stuff. I am very strong emotionally.

    I can definitely be the "undemanding regulator, provident and proficient partner". It's surprising to me that there is anyone in the world who could really appreciate that side of me. That's what I love about the idea of duality...that there's a use for my strengths, even the ones I don't know I have.

    Also, I think I'm down for taking care of the details of comfort, while the LSE takes care of comfort on the whole. Does that mean he'll make sure we have the money so I can buy the best ingredients and cook the tastiest meals?

    He tolerates The Administrator's inability to praise, make compliments, which is caused by his insufficient understanding of individual traits and human potential capabilities. The Humanist understands this aspect and considers it to be so obvious that he does not require words of approval.
    Well of course. I am drawn to Te types because I can see the obvious depth of emotion that does not need to be expressed. I know I'm appreciated if he takes care of me, treats me with the worth I deserve. I really do not need these sorts of things to be spoken. Actually, I am often uncomfortable with outward displays of emotion, which is why I decided years ago that I could never marry an ESFJ, although I didn't know about Socionics then. Outward displays of emotion are a sign of instability. I feel like I have to do something about them, and I often don't know what. Like, if they look sad, I must find a way to cheer them up. If they are laughing, I must laugh and smile too. LSEs seem much more stable emotionally. I crave stability and comfort. Although I don't crave sameness.
    EII
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    I know female ESTj and male INFj and they don't feel any attraction each other, despite they spend much time together. I don't understand why. Im sure that ESTj is ESTj, because activity between us is noticeable, Im also sure that this guy is my mirror.
    Strange
    When I meet my friend, female ISTp all who see us together say we were being for each other. So I suppose that duality between ESTj and INFj has to be noticeable as well.
    Plz correct me when I make mistakes! I wanna learn English.

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    Default ESTj -INFj duality description by Aushra

    What are your thoughts?

    Logical extraverts and ethical introverts

    First pair: Logical-sensory extrovert (ESTj), ethical-intuitive introvert (INFj)
    Second pair: Logical-intuitive extrovert (ENTj), ethical-sensory introvert (ISFj)

    The most basic skill that the logical-sensory extrovert has - and values - is logic, the skill to be reasonable and to act logically. That is the only quality that makes them completely confident and content. Itís not important how clever they are, but if others doubt their logic, this does not confuse them. Because of developed sensing, they are extremely sensitive to the aesthetics of their immediate surroundings. It is interesting that their most active attention is not focused on the intellect of others [ - - ] but on othersí skill to act rationally and their appearance. It is not so important how clever their partners are; their elegance and physical shape is more important, since these depend only on their own efforts. Excessive weight is untydines [ -- ]. This is generally one of the most indecent phenomena. The ESTjs accurately and neatly differentiate beaufiful and plain things, but for their rational mind there is nothing that is beautiful and inconvenient, or useless, at the same time. They dress well and elegantly [ - - ]. They wear the same clothing for long, constantly astonishing others with their freshness, as if the factor of time did not exist. The ESTjs themselves will not put on inconvenient foot wear, since they live for themselves and not for their environment. But all others must dress only very beautifully for the ESTjsí aesthetical satisfaction.

    Their attraction to the opposite sex (?) is completely conscious and they donít fear it. They pity those who try to hide it. They have more difficulty with feelings. The ESTjs feel the need for love, they want to be loved and be needed, but they donít know how to write a poem out of their love. An ESTj man tries to attract the girl with kindness, services, gifts, but not with beautiful words about feelings. This torments him, it seems difficult, meaningless. Feelings are their passive and therefore vulnerable side. They cannot quickly fall in love, they fear to be deceived, to mistake their wishes for reality. If love contradicts logic, they reject it. This is one of those types that are considered courageous.

    In people with the developed sensations the intuition is not developed; therefore they exceptionally take chancs, they want complete clarity and confidence. They cannot love, if they think that their feelings are unreasonable. They cannot love someone, about whom they have doubts, whom they donít trust, which causes problems. They canít love even those who are too independent and so have no need constant aid and guardianship. [ -- ] In the sphere of feelings they donít feel up to taking the risk: they can desire those who donít desire them in return, but they canít love those that donít reciprocate their love. They need a partner with deep introverted feeling, and barely noticed balanced emotions on the surface, that is, someone, whose essential internal peace (?) is the skill measure the feeling of others with their own feelings. To logical extroverts, it is exceptionally important the positive and very tactful emotional estimation of all their behavior, concerns, and efforts. For them, life is clear, light, and intelligible, when they donít spoil the mood of their partners, when they make their partners happy.

    The princess of the male ESTjís dream does not show initiative herself, she waits, until he notices her. But when he begins to pay attention to her, he does it very tactfully and is not negative even when joking. ESTjs donít understand sarcastic (?) jokes, they perceive them as negative evaluations of their own personality and that turns them away. They are not tempted nor attracted by mincing manners.

    ESTjs feel responsibility for their partner. They are more aggressive when protecting their partnerís interests from real and imaginary enemies than they are when protecting their own. They worry about their partner, give them instructions, correct and regulate their activities. They do with pleasure all that the partner canít do Ė if the partner really cannot, instead of not being willing to do it. More precisely, they try to overcome difficulties that prevent the partner from taking effective action. They really donít like it, if the partner falls under the influence, and listen to the advice, of others.

    Since this type has the developed and even nagging aesthetic taste (in the behavior, dictated by the second function rather than the first, people are always more nagging), they are inclined to dictate to their partners their own concept of beauty. They are always confident that they know what is beautiful and what isnít [ - -], and they donít regard it as too important whether or not it pleases other people or if itís fashionable. They find it much more difficult to live with someone who has their own taste than with someone who needs them to solve all aesthetical problems, who yields in this field, who listens to their indications.

    Those are the most appropriate feelings of the ethical-intuitive introvert. They are the carriers of the quiet, internal sea for feelings, imperceptible to others. The peace of their feelings is fine and rich, self-sufficient, they do not need verbal proofs of love. Without words they see who loves whom and to what extent, who is necessary to whom, and who is not. This type has the valuable skill to adapt to the emotions of another person, to be anxious with another person, to remove emotional stress, to calm them. This is constant when they are in love in the depth of the soul [ -- ] although the impression most frequently produced is of being cold, locked in themselves, or even insensitive. Their love is [ - - ] intuitive, platonical, incorporeal.

    Just as it is necessary for logical extroverts to love someone, but they donít know how to show it, the ethical-intuitive introverts need someone with that inclination. [ - - ] Courage doesnít come soon, it comes with the faith in the beloved and the confidence that their feelings will not seem ridiculous, that they will not be humiliated [ -- ].

    The ethical introverts search for pleasant emotions. These are assured by the partnerís rationality, logic, skill to protect [ -- ]. No other proofs of love and conversations about love are necessary. What is necessary is that the partner will provide these pleasant emotions by his behavior: not being late to appointments, carrying out their promises, being polite, thoughtful. The expectation that is never deceived, but during which it is possible to dream as much as desired, is one of the greatest pleasures that the ethical-introverts get from the logical extroverts.

    This girl (or man) is happy to live according to the aesthetic tastes and desires of someome else, not so much because she doesnít have her own, but because she desires the complete harmony of interrelations, complete confluence of will [ - - ] The girl wants what pleases him and to adapt to it. But unfortunate is the man who is not a logical extrovert and to whom she canít adapt, that is, he cannot satisfy her basic requirement: to always and everywhere have his opinion. Unfortunate is the man, who, although very clever, is inclined to present his opinions as reflections, not as short mandatory wordings. The ethical-intuitive introvert is constantly dissatisfied and unahappy next to those.

    It is possible to tell this girl that her nature is not sufficiently strong, that each intelligent person must have an opinion and taste. But when in one marriage there are two persons with their own strong ďtasteĒ (two with no taste is also bad), for example, the logical-sensory extrovert and the ethical-sensory introvert, most often the result is not two independent tastes, but the fight between them, due to each othersí selfishness.
    Pre-2013 post are written with incomplete understanding.

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    Quote Originally Posted by UDP View Post
    What are your thoughts?
    I agree with this whole thing. This part is one thing that is very clear to me. I have been called "weak" by people when I have expressed the desire for this kind of direction:

    The girl wants what pleases him and to adapt to it. But unfortunate is the man who is not a logical extrovert and to whom she canít adapt, that is, he cannot satisfy her basic requirement: to always and everywhere have his opinion. Unfortunate is the man, who, although very clever, is inclined to present his opinions as reflections, not as short mandatory wordings. The ethical-intuitive introvert is constantly dissatisfied and unahappy next to those.

    It is possible to tell this girl that her nature is not sufficiently strong, that each intelligent person must have an opinion and taste. But when in one marriage there are two persons with their own strong ďtasteĒ (two with no taste is also bad), for example, the logical-sensory extrovert and the ethical-sensory introvert, most often the result is not two independent tastes, but the fight between them, due to each othersí selfishness.
    EII 4w5

    so/sx (?)

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    Actually I think Augusta got a few things wrong there, especially the "short mandatory wordings" thing. May be a translation issue, may be a misunderstanding of mine; or whatever.
    , LIE, ENTj logical subtype, 8w9 sx/sp
    Quote Originally Posted by implied
    gah you're like the shittiest ENTj ever!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Expat View Post
    Actually I think Augusta got a few things wrong there, especially the "short mandatory wordings" thing. May be a translation issue, may be a misunderstanding of mine; or whatever.
    What do you think would be better? Something along the lines of 'clarity' or 'direct communication'?
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    Quote Originally Posted by Expat View Post
    Actually I think Augusta got a few things wrong there, especially the "short mandatory wordings" thing. May be a translation issue, may be a misunderstanding of mine; or whatever.

    Maybe this is more EII-LSE thing- not as relavant to ESI-LIE? Or maybe it is just translation issue, but it makes sense to me for LSE-EII.
    EII 4w5

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    Quote Originally Posted by munenori2 View Post
    What do you think would be better? Something along the lines of 'clarity' or 'direct communication'?
    Yeah, for instance. The Te-Fi duality (whether Gamma or Delta) is about bouncing information and ideas off each other, in a way that will seem "rambling" or "non-confident" to Alpha and Beta. But it is not "short and mandatory", except - and perhaps that is what Augusta, an Alpha, meant - in the sense that is Te and not Fe.
    , LIE, ENTj logical subtype, 8w9 sx/sp
    Quote Originally Posted by implied
    gah you're like the shittiest ENTj ever!

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    Quote Originally Posted by UDP View Post
    What are your thoughts?
    I don't like it and I feel that such a relationship would stifle me if I am at the receiving end. Parts of the descriptions which I strongly dislike and don't agree with:

    If love contradicts logic, they reject it.
    They cannot love, if they think that their feelings are unreasonable. They cannot love someone, about whom they have doubts, whom they don’t trust, which causes problems. They can’t love even those who are too independent and so have no need constant aid and guardianship.[ -- ] In the sphere of feelings they don’t feel up to taking the risk: they can desire those who don’t desire them in return, but they can’t love those that don’t reciprocate their love.
    They worry about their partner, give them instructions, correct and regulate their activities. They do with pleasure all that the partner can’t do – if the partner really cannot, instead of not being willing to do it. More precisely, they try to overcome difficulties that prevent the partner from taking effective action. They really don’t like it, if the partner falls under the influence, and listen to the advice, of others.

    Since this type has the developed and even nagging aesthetic taste (in the behavior, dictated by the second function rather than the first, people are always more nagging), they are inclined to dictate to their partners their own concept of beauty. They are always confident that they know what is beautiful and what isn’t [ - -], and they don’t regard it as too important whether or not it pleases other people or if it’s fashionable. They find it much more difficult to live with someone who has their own taste than with someone who needs them to solve all aesthetical problems, who yields in this field, who listens to their indications.
    This girl (or man) is happy to live according to the aesthetic tastes and desires of someome else, not so much because she doesn’t have her own, but because she desires the complete harmony of interrelations, complete confluence of will [ - - ] The girl wants what pleases him and to adapt to it.
    Aushra either had a very poor opinion of INFjs, or she didn't understand INFjs at all. Based on the description, INFjs seem to be at a disadvantage imo.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Expat View Post
    Actually I think Augusta got a few things wrong there, especially the "short mandatory wordings" thing. May be a translation issue, may be a misunderstanding of mine; or whatever.
    Yeah, that does seem like Ti>Te, or just something that was worded funny.
    Pre-2013 post are written with incomplete understanding.

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    they can’t love those that don’t reciprocate their love.
    No, I believe that to be quite true for me. It is impossible for me to "love" - that is, have romantic feelings of interest - someone with out there being reciprocation. I just can't do it, because it is not real to me.

    I do not need, like, someone to be totally dependent on me, especially in the modern day world. But having reciprocation is important. I cannot much last, going into a situation and just "hoping" people will change.

    And absolutely cannot love someone if there are lies involved. Nothing makes me distance myself further from people than lies, vagueness, deception, and dishonesty.


    They cannot quickly fall in love, they fear to be deceived, to mistake their wishes for reality. If love contradicts logic, they reject it. This is one of those types that are considered courageous.
    I don't know if I have to say it is courage or not, but, it is absolutely a factor for me.


    IMO, what that quote means is this: if you find someone who is acting in ways that is not indicative of being in love with you, or someone who is acting in ways that are not clear about their relationship for you, then all emotions become suspended. I cannot love someone who treats me wrong, or who lies to me, it erases my feelings for them. It is like, well, I can't believe you did that, or, I guess I was wrong, I misunderstood who you are, etc. I can still be "friends" toward people, but as far as emotional involvement goes, I cannot have it there.

    And I will always, always push for the truth in whatever situation I am in. Another take on that quote may be "they cannot love, when there is uncertainty about the feelings of the other person", or "they cannot sustain a feeling of love when there is logical and factual reasoning that someone is not reciprocating it." The lack of reciprocation makes my own feelings of love unfounded, and then I feel like I am lying, or believing in something that isn't real, so it quickly begins to scale back my emotional involvement.

    See, it's not that I have no emotions or cannot get emotionally involved. I do, on both accounts. It is just that the depth of my involvement is directly related to how much the other person is accepting with it, and consequently, not accepting (love, or deep relationships) from anyone else. I can show initiative and lead and do all these things that show I want to be in a relationship and love someone, but, unless the person 'wants it', well, it is all for naught.
    Last edited by UDP; 01-09-2008 at 05:11 PM.
    Pre-2013 post are written with incomplete understanding.

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    Quote Originally Posted by UDP View Post
    What are your thoughts?
    Well, I think it's dumb... Just look at these quotes:

    The princess of the male ESTjís dream does not show initiative herself, she waits, until he notices her.
    The "princess," give me a break... And then there's this:

    The ESTjs feel the need for love, they want to be loved and be needed, but they donít know how to write a poem out of their love. An ESTj man tries to attract the girl with kindness, services, gifts, but not with beautiful words about feelings. This torments him, it seems difficult, meaningless. Feelings are their passive and therefore vulnerable side. They cannot quickly fall in love, they fear to be deceived, to mistake their wishes for reality. If love contradicts logic, they reject it. This is one of those types that are considered courageous.
    It's so cheesy... And the last sentence is bs, though it might be due to translation. Not that they are not "courageous," just that everybody has to take risks too.

    The description sounds like some Soap Opera to me.

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    lol@sereno. yeah i agree it's a bit cheesy. i do think if you can ignore the melodramatic wording there are some bits of truth.

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    Default INFj-ESTj duality description by Gulenko

    was too tired and lazy to fix up this one (except to change FEL and ESI to LSE and EII for some reason, what's with the weird acronyms?) anyway:

    Stirlitz - Dostoevsky (Gulenko)


    Conflict-free communication in the dual pairs (Gulenko)
    Logical-sensory extravert and Ethical-intuitive introvert
    (Administrator and humanist)

    1. LSE seeks to ensure that all that he did was appropriate and helpful. Useless things do not become one. Business logic of actions - the basic content of its programming statements. These aspirations are adjusted EII, which this function is removed from the wealth to a considerable distance. Among the set of winning strategies EII helps LSE choose the one that can bring maximum benefit. EII pays attention LSE nepragmaticheskie side of life, thereby providing a balance of material and spiritual interests. LSE presents information in a clear logical form, accumulates a large amount of facts and knowledge from different disciplines. This information is required for the processing of EII and theoretical findings. In addition, business activities LSE, taking the form of indirect ways to profit, adjusted EII toward direct way.

    2. LSE periodically creates a comfortable and pleasant. This includes the acquisition of good-quality things, high-quality, nourishing food, comfortable stay. And he LSE is not always enjoy the fruits of their effort, this could, for example, manifested in his ability to make surprises, to present unexpected gifts. These forms of manifestation of care for high stakes need EII, which itself takes care of the pleasant sensations at the level of detail: the maintenance of the house an ideal of purity (especially ethical option), display affection and tenderness in small doses, etc. In the case of large doses of sensations experienced EII awkwardness, for instance, may not consider themselves privselyudno in the mirror, put on a catchy, trendy clothes and go to the theater, etc. Identical views of the LSE, and EII and form to establish order in the house - things need to be cleaned inside after they have used on the table there should be no unnecessary items, shoes should be in decent shape, etc.

    3. According to the role function of the LSE keeps emotions inside himself, controls his behavior in dealing with others, trying to extinguish emotional outbursts that interfere with productive activities. However, they accumulated so much that the LSE can not keep them, and consequently outbreaks of rage. Particularly characteristic of this role for extreme situations, or when someone rudely criticizing his style of performance. The director of this feature appears EII, which adjusts her, giving advice on emotional discharge, calling not get excited over nothing, be positive-minded, not to worry, for example: "be reconciled to him," you did not understand "" calm down "or" cry and calm down ", etc. Without taking into account these suggestions, ignoring verbal and emotional-relaxing effect of the EII, the LSE is living in a high nervous tension.

    4. LSE poorly differentiates temporary tray, especially change the major time periods, so it hardly will be given to planning: starting to prepare long before the deadline, you still do not have time to finish everything on time. The events tend to come ahead of schedule, instead of some more time to prepare for it.Particularly poorly focused in the future, does not like questions on this subject (and what will you do tomorrow? "), Conservative views on family issues are often desired for real. EII does not affect the function of verbal, ie, not lecture and do not criticize.
    It is characterized by a subconscious ability to plan, ie distribute the event in time so that there is no overloading, with the bulk of the work is done near the end of the training that just compensates for the tendency of LSE start all over very early. Not receiving such support, the LSE is overloaded cases per unit time and its performance does not give the greatest possible impact.

    5. LSE configured to receive information in the ethical and moralistic form, ie regarding the issue of relations between people, what the relationship should be in each case. This kind of information it receives from the EII, acting periodically with the ethical nature of the program statements. LSE communicates with people in distant psychological distance that can collect in the best case, explicit attitude of people towards themselves. Concrete ethical program originating from the EII, logical-sensory extravert generalized and subconsciously counted in behavior. Without such a program for the LSE is typical ethical contrast: civility and courtesy toward others and strictness, and sometimes rudeness to a close.

    6. LSE poorly able to separate the large capacity of small, so are hesitant about whether to support or not a person, not knowing the extent of his talent.Uncomfortable for prepayments good relationship to the person. Subconscious requirement, which he pushes to the surrounding society: to show their abilities! EII, by contrast, is well versed in the abilities of people who can help a person uncover them, to show the active kindness. Demonstrating in practice this quality (weight really help people in need), EII eliminates vibrations and thus the LSE doubt on this aspect of life. Without such cooperation and assistance of the LSE at risk of becoming insensitive to people's eyes, a dry man. Feeling it, sometimes inclined to be ostentatious care about someone, welcome reception, etc.

    7. EII in contact with people supporting a close physical distance, trying to be objective and fair even in small things. Smooth, not expressing negative emotions facial expression makes it possible to impose his own community. Curious about all the objective, such as science, meticulously analyzed throughout, gets into the details. This role needs to function in a verbal correction of the LSE in the form of advice: he instinctively knows how to separate the truly necessary to detail, to build an objective picture of the phenomenon, to invent a new method of classifying PLI. LSE also regulates the advice and reminders of physical distance, insisting on its increase. Are given advice like: "Why do you need him," Is it worth it to him to communicate, "" not invite anyone to visit, etc. This function is activated if necessary to calm EII. In this case, the part of men to such phrases as "What do I do with it?", "I will beat his face and other content that is destroying the structure.

    8. LSE unconsciously and continuously exerts pressure on the strong-willed people who do not meet any of the rules if they are legal and feasible to implement. On the other hand, this function appears in it as gambling, the willingness to argue on any subject, even if it does not know much about. Particularly intolerant of aggression. To meet aggressive manifestations counterattack. To resist this pressure can only be quiet stubbornness. EII is difficult to put pressure on people, forcing them to do what is necessary, strictly abide by the rules. Demands and the protection of the inner space takes on the LSE. It does not work while on pain points EII verbally, ie no team, not to teach, there are no annoying to volitional sensor systems. At LSE actually lies entirely a function of active protection of vital interests of the dyad.

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    Kind of makes sense. It seems in these profiles, compared to the others, the two people involved are both healthy or at least normalish. They don't seem to dwell on a persons shortcoming, maybe believing their dual will absorb or corrrect them somehow, and that alone will lead to psychological goodness.



    SLI-IEE plz

    Do they have, say, LSE-IEI descriptions? one for every type relation?
    Pre-2013 post are written with incomplete understanding.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ryu
    SLI-IEE plz

    Do they have, say, LSE-IEI descriptions? one for every type relation?
    It seems there's a Gulenko "8-Function" comparison (like laghlagh's OP) for every dual-pair.

    Other relations exist too, but stuff's a little (or much) sketchier depending mostly on who wrote it (be it Filatova, Strati-whatchamacallit, or whoever). Most of those are really heavy on stories and anecdotes.

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    i guess it shouldn't be so surprising then as to why Maritsa was trained to think how she was trained --- especially if it was on literature like this/that
    Pre-2013 post are written with incomplete understanding.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ryu View Post
    i guess it shouldn't be so surprising then as to why Maritsa was trained to think how she was trained --- especially if it was on literature like this/that
    What are you talking about? This is extremely accurate information. Ni, in LSE, is not having a strong handle on events and how time passes by as they work on projects. Even though they rush to get things done, what's done may not be up to their expectations because they rushed. It stresses them out to do what ILI do with their Ni, which is to reread time and events and in the order they must happen over and over again; this is why Ni is an introverted function, these events and in frame of time that they happen get recorded in their head; Ni types do discuss, or rather tell me, what events should be done when as not to waste time or let time pass by without having completed the event.

    EII take care of Fi, not Ni polr stuff with LSE; by taking care of Fi, we take pressure and unnecessary concentration on that polr. We don't give advice on Ni PoLR; we tell them what events to do from Ne not Ni.
    Last edited by Beautiful sky; 01-10-2011 at 02:19 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ryu View Post
    i guess it shouldn't be so surprising then as to why Maritsa was trained to think how she was trained --- especially if it was on literature like this/that
    Quote Originally Posted by Maritsa33 View Post
    What are you talking about? This is extremely accurate information.
    Yes, that's my point.
    Pre-2013 post are written with incomplete understanding.

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    after reading this one, i think that gulenko is probably a better source for these intertype descriptions than stratsi-whatever and filatova. good to keep in mind in the future. i'll probably post more eventually but i'm not sure when nor willing to make any commitments, so here is a link if you don't want to wait around. :wink:

    http://www.socioforum.su/index.php

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    does the .su in the adress mean


    soviet union?

    lol
    Pre-2013 post are written with incomplete understanding.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ryu View Post
    does the .su in the adress mean


    soviet union?

    lol
    yep. heh.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/.su

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