Enneagram Type 3

[Hope]

This image is rather contraflow, though.
I could see that fitting Sx/So or even Sp/Sx better.

so/sp could be?

[Olimpia]

so/sp could be?

Well more likely than So/Sx because of the contraflow, imo.

[Chae]

She's dropping all the important 3 keywords

[flames]

There's only two types of people in the world
The ones that entertain, and the ones that observe
Well baby I'm a put-on-a-show kinda girl
Don't like the backseat, gotta be first
I'm like the ringleader
I call the shots (call the shots)
I'm like a firecracker
I make it hot

When I put on a show
I feel the adrenaline moving through my veins
Spotlight on me and I'm ready to break
I'm like a performer, the dance floor is my stage
Better be ready, hope ya feel the same

All eyes on me in the center of the ring
Just like a circus
When I crack that whip, everybody goin' trip
Just like a circus
Don't stand there watching me, follow me
Show me what you can do
Everybody let go, we can make a dance floor
Just like a circus

[Olimpia]

. . . [O]ur so-called phallic-receptive type actually corresponds to a character type (the urethral character-) proposed by Ernest Jones, a close associate of Freud's, as well as to the Enneagram personality type Three. This type of male narcissistically invites admiration of his body (phallus) from others, and is often sexually exhibitionistic. . . . Is narcissism better understood as the unconscious desire to have one's genitals admired, or to have one's self admired? Even if a strictly Freudian interpretation could be shown to be the ultimate truth, such an interpretation is usually so far out of the range of normal awareness and behavior as to be all but meaningless. It seems better to work on overcoming ones inflated self-love, for example, than to reduce narcissism to the desire to have one's genitals admired.

– Personality Types: Using the Enneagram for Self-Discovery by Don Richard Riso, Russ Hudson



This explains why male Type 3s often seem gay, no matter their actual orientation.
Or in other words: "Is he gay, or is he just Type 3? (Or both?)"
#metrosexual

 

It also explains why I have been attracted to a fair share of gay men... My Imago is Type 3. FML

P.S: This sounds like @Daddy Lessons has a 3 fix, maybe even core?

[maniac]

@Medusa Umm.. I disagree with that completely. There is something subtly feminine about male 3s because they are focused on their image. But 3 also has a much greater masculine quality because they repress feelings, take up space and is competitive and driven.

If some type seems "gay" I would say male 2s rather than 3s. 2 is soft and wants to give and love, 3 is hard and self-sufficient.

[Olimpia]

@Medusa Umm.. I disagree with that completely. There is something subtly feminine about male 3s because they are focused on their image. But 3 also has a much greater masculine quality because they repress feelings, take up space and is competitive and driven.

If some type seems "gay" I would say male 2s rather than 3s. 2 is soft and wants to give and love, 3 is hard and self-sufficient.

My father is a Type 3 who represses his feelings and is driven, so he is masculine in that way. But still, because of his attention to his appearance, people would wonder whether he was gay.

3s combine both masculine and feminine qualities in them. I do agree that 2s are more stereotypically feminine. My post was not really about femininity; not all gay men are super feminine, not all super feminine men are gay, so this is not my point. It is the way how 3s try to attract and draw in attention to their appearance that can seem "gay" or metrosexual etc. to people.

[flames]

– Personality Types: Using the Enneagram for Self-Discovery by Don Richard Riso, Russ Hudson



This explains why male Type 3s often seem gay, no matter their actual orientation.
Or in other words: "Is he gay, or is he just Type 3? (Or both?)"
#metrosexual

 

It also explains why I have been attracted to a fair share of gay men... My Imago is Type 3. FML

P.S: This sounds like @Daddy Lessons has a 3 fix, maybe even core?

It's certainly possible. Does this mean I am metrosexual?
I don't personally know many 3s but I do know one who is actually gay.

"narcissistically invites admiration of his body (phallus) from others, and is often sexually exhibitionistic" - I am certainly often guilty of this

@Medusa Umm.. I disagree with that completely. There is something subtly feminine about male 3s because they are focused on their image. But 3 also has a much greater masculine quality because they repress feelings, take up space and is competitive and driven.

If some type seems "gay" I would say male 2s rather than 3s. 2 is soft and wants to give and love, 3 is hard and self-sufficient.

I would rather describe myself as "repressing feelings, taking up space, competitive and driven, self sufficient" than what is called 2-ish. 2 is probably the image type I relate to least.

[Olimpia]

Type 3s become what you (society/potential partners/etc.) want them to be... That's how their "chameleon"-nature expresses itself.

This makes it difficult to gauge whether the personality type is rather masculine, feminine, or androgynous.
Whether they are more feminine or masculine in appearance and behavior very much depends on their gender and which society or culture they find themselves in.
That's how, at their core, they are an androgynous Enneagram type, which could "go either way" and is not particularly feminine nor masculine inherently.

The 3w4 tends to be slightly more feminine than the 3w2. The 4 wing adds a stronger awareness to their own internal world, and less of a desire to conform to outside expectation. The 4 is a feminine type, and combined with the desire to be "unique" and not adapt to the environment and its expectations, the 3w4 tends to be more feminine no matter which culture they find themselves in. Having said that, the difference between 3w4 and 3w2 is rather small, so it is possible to find a 3w2 person that is more feminine at their core than a 3w4 person.

[Olimpia]

Usually, Type 3s are characterized by a strong sense of self-love, which at unhealthy levels turns into narcissism. The interesting difference between a 3w2 and 3w4 is how the latter's self-love is "broken" or "two-faced". The 3w4 is much more aware of their internal self, and a feeling of being flawed or deficient and ashamed, like a Type 4. 3w2s may also feel deficient in some way, but it is typically much more unconscious for them. Only at the unhealthiest level, this belief of being flawed might emerge. With 3w4, it is much more at the forefront and in the back of their minds.

I've found that compared to 4s, who are often times actually in denial of their envy, the 3w4's envy is more exhibitionistic. The envy of a 3w4 typically drives them to accomplish more, whereas the envy of a 4w3 or 4w5 more often results in them becoming depressed and demotivated. The envy of a 3w4 does not demobilize them, it can make them put more work and effort into something; whereas the envy of 4s, especially of 4w5, tends to render them "frozen" or deeply engrossed in self-pity or self-hate, for at least a while.

[Pallas]

This thread summarized:

Chae.gif

[flames]

Usually, Type 3s are characterized by a strong sense of self-love, which at unhealthy levels turns into narcissism. The interesting difference between a 3w2 and 3w4 is how the latter's self-love is "broken" or "two-faced". The 3w4 is much more aware of their internal self, and a feeling of being flawed or deficient and ashamed, like a Type 4. 3w2s may also feel deficient in some way, but it is typically much more unconscious for them. Only at the unhealthiest level, this belief of being flawed might emerge. With 3w4, it is much more at the forefront and in the back of their minds.

I've found that compared to 4s, who are often times actually in denial of their envy, the 3w4's envy is more exhibitionistic. The envy of a 3w4 typically drives them to accomplish more, whereas the envy of a 4w3 or 4w5 more often results in them becoming depressed and demotivated. The envy of a 3w4 does not demobilize them, it can make them put more work and effort into something; whereas the envy of 4s, especially of 4w5, tends to render them "frozen" or deeply engrossed in self-pity or self-hate, for at least a while.

Judging by that I would relate to 3 more. I had myself typed with a 4 fix for a long time but it may have just been a manifestation of sx, which I have learned to control. I feel like as I get more mature I relate to 3 more.

[maniac]

She's dropping all the important 3 keywords

I think you type her sx/so and she is way too responsible about business and money stuff as you can see in the video. Shes almost always talking about business related things and making a name for yourself is also part of sp. I type her sp/so.

Look at Madonna. Much less strategic-like. And she says in the video that she finds it odd that people are scared to do what she does. She doesnt understand the SP first neurosis and risk of losing money and safety. And as she also says she is a "rebel" while Beyonce just copies what everyone else has done, its nothing new. Madonna revolutionized the music industry by being the first to succed with lyrics about female sexuality (sx) which was unheard of and scandalous in that time period, and strength (3). What has Beyonce done that is revolutionary? nothing.

[Chae]

This thread summarized:

Chae.gif

[Chae]

I think you type her sx/so and she is way too responsible about business and money stuff as you can see in the video. Shes almost always talking about business related things and making a name for yourself is also part of sp. I type her sp/so.

Look at Madonna. Much less strategic-like. And she says in the video that she finds it odd that people are scared to do what she does. She doesnt understand the SP first neurosis and risk of losing money and safety. And as she also says she is a "rebel" while Beyonce just copies what everyone else has done, its nothing new. Madonna revolutionized the music industry by being the first to succed with lyrics about female sexuality (sx) which was unheard of and scandalous in that time period, and strength (3). What has Beyonce done that is revolutionary? nothing.

That was not the topic But okay. Add in their difference of Beta versus Gamma there.

[maniac]

That was not the topic But okay. Add in their difference of Beta versus Gamma there.

I dont care about no Beta vs Gamma. Sp is Sp.

[Chae]

I dont care about no Beta vs Gamma. Sp is Sp.

Good!

[Chae]

Jeffree Star is a clear 3w4 sx/so imo... Actually, he could probably be the spokesperson for sx/so



"Honestly if I would have been born a woman I would probably be having kids or abortions, sucking my husbands dick and working at Walmart and hating my life, so thank god I have a dick "

Yep, it's precisely his typing. His bf is a contraflow stacking as well. SP/SX 9w1 I think, or a 6w5. Make an interesting (dis-)integration couple.

[Chae]

[maniac]

[Chae]

@Vespertine remember this picture? Very 3 social last.



(bnw version to increase 4-wing melancholy)

[Pallas]

3w4:

[flames]

And every time I thought I'd got it made
It seemed the taste was not so sweet
So I turned myself to face me
But I've never caught a glimpse
Of how the others must see the faker
I'm much too fast to take that test

Ch-ch-ch-ch-changes
(Turn and face the strange)
Ch-ch-changes
Don't want to be a richer man
Ch-ch-ch-ch-changes
(Turn and face the strange)
Ch-ch-changes
Just gonna have to be a different man
Time may change me
But I can't trace time

[flames]

@Chae

[Stellafera]

[Chae]

[Stellafera]

with 7 in the tritype

[Olimpia]

[dot]

This is the absolute epitome of 3w4.

I also always related to this song and Marina's lyrics as a 4w3.. melancholic like a 4.. yet they have this success-driven and almost superficial/empty 3 vibe. The lyrics always hit a sweet spot within me. So 3w4 and sometimes 4w3 makes a lot of sense to me!
I always wondered what enneagram type she is? Apparently she describes herself as a heavy introvert.. but who knows. I sometimes thought she was some kind of NT.. definitely an intuitive in my opinion.

[darya]

I also always related to this song and Marina's lyrics as a 4w3.. melancholic like a 4.. yet they have this success-driven and almost superficial/empty 3 vibe. The lyrics always hit a sweet spot within me. So 3w4 and sometimes 4w3 makes a lot of sense to me!
I always wondered what enneagram type she is? Apparently she describes herself as a heavy introvert.. but who knows. I sometimes thought she was some kind of NT.. definitely an intuitive in my opinion.

3w4 ENxx imo, could maaaybe be ILE. Not an introvert - a bunch of *clear* extroverts think they're heavily introverted, I know quite a few personally. Usually the intuitives have this misconception about themselves. They think that because they read books, introspect, aren't the loudest people at the party, don't like clubs and spending every minute around people, they're not extroverted. Even my higly extroverted LSE friend described herself as needing to recharge from people on her own. It's true, she needs time away from peple everyday for some time to read or sleep or whatever. That doesn't make her an introvert, that's a normal need for almost everybody.

[maniac]

Agree that Marina is 3w4 (so/sx 378 possibly).
About her describing herself as an introvert, that's interesting. My so/sx 6 sister does the same but I definitely don't see her as an introvert.

[flames]

3w4 for Marina, and her music is probably the most 3w4 thing I can think of.

Agree that Marina is 3w4 (sp/so 378 possibly).
About her describing herself as an introvert, that's interesting. My so/sx 6 sister does the same but I definitely don't see her as an introvert.

Yeah, it's actually rather common. Everyone needs some alone time so many people can mistake themselves for introverts when they are not. Some extraverts also just might not like most people or get energized more by things than people.

[flames]

[darya]

3w4 for Marina, and her music is probably the most 3w4 thing I can think of.

She's the artist whose lyrics I identify with by far the most (also many parts of Lana's and Gwen's lyrics). What is lacking with Marina is that she's not romantic enough, very detached.

[dot]

She's the artist whose lyrics I identify with by far the most (also many parts of Lana's and Gwen's lyrics). What is lacking with Marina is that she's not romantic enough, very detached.

I didn't doubt her being 3w4, but as a 4w3 I also identify with her music a lot, especially when she dives a lot into that 4 wing. I also thought about her being ILE or IEE, there is something Ne-ish about her.
And I know what you mean with extraverts who think of themselves as introverts.. ironically I also have an LSE friend who thinks that.. I also met an EIE who didn't really understand what I meant when I said I need a lot of space and time for myself (like REALLY A LOT).. maybe because she was so-last.. but yeah.. once you've met a real introvert like me and have lived with me.. you will notice that my room is my safe haven, lol.
And that there is a difference between someone liking to occasionally spend some time alone, which as you said everyone does, and the time an introvert needs.
I would also say that introversion seems to differ between the introverted functions. I as a Ni-dom am probably one of the introverts who spend most of the time in their head.. Si-doms seem to collect energy differently.. and they also appear less introverted, at least not introverted in the 'autistic' Ni-way.

[maniac]

@darya

She's not detached in this song:



You're hard to hug, tough to talk to
And I never fall asleep when you're in my bed
All you give me is a heartbeat
I've turned into a statue
And it makes me feel depressed
'Cause the only time you open up is when we get undressed

You don't love me, big fucking deal
I'll never tell you how I feel
You don't love me, not a big deal
I'll never tell you how I feel

[Chorus:]
It almost feels like a joke to play out a part
When you are not the starring role in someone else's heart
You know I'd rather walk alone, than play a supporting role
If I can't get the starring role.

Sometimes I ignore you, so I feel in control
'Cause really, I adore you, and I can't leave you alone
Fed up with the fantasies that cover what is wrong
Come on, baby, let's just get drunk, forget we don't get on

You like my dad, you'd get on well
I send my best regards from hell

Another one:



I think some of her songs are sort of parodies of other people, which is why i think she has a 7 fix - trickster vibe

[flames]

She's the artist whose lyrics I identify with by far the most (also many parts of Lana's and Gwen's lyrics). What is lacking with Marina is that she's not romantic enough, very detached.

Yes, I also relate to her the most. Though I agree she is more detached and robotic (than myself), she even has some songs about that.

[maniac]

3 is detached from the heart center, thats why

Level 5: Become image-conscious, highly concerned with how they are perceived. Begin to package themselves according to the expectations of others and what they need to do to be successful. Pragmatic and efficient, but also premeditated, losing touch with their own feelings beneath a smooth facade. Problems with intimacy, credibility, and "phoniness" emerge.

[darya]

3 is detached from the heart center, thats why

Level 5: Become image-conscious, highly concerned with how they are perceived. Begin to package themselves according to the expectations of others and what they need to do to be successful. Pragmatic and efficient, but also premeditated, losing touch with their own feelings beneath a smooth facade. Problems with intimacy, credibility, and "phoniness" emerge.

3 sx is different in severity. 3 is detached, but her music reads sx last.

[lemontrees]

3w4 ENxx imo, could maaaybe be ILE. Not an introvert - a bunch of *clear* extroverts think they're heavily introverted, I know quite a few personally. Usually the intuitives have this misconception about themselves. They think that because they read books, introspect, aren't the loudest people at the party, don't like clubs and spending every minute around people, they're not extroverted. Even my higly extroverted LSE friend described herself as needing to recharge from people on her own. It's true, she needs time away from peple everyday for some time to read or sleep or whatever. That doesn't make her an introvert, that's a normal need for almost everybody.

I know this ILE girl who posts regularly on fb about her introversion... she also posts about 4 times a day. Her reason is she can't go out two nights in a row, but she does go out about 3 nights a week.

I thought about how a majority of authors are extroverts in socionics. They may even be "loner-types" (so-blindspot), but the sheer level of verbosity it takes to write these 1000 page novels didn't come from an SLI. When I was younger I thought Proust was IEI, I am now reconsidering Ne base for him.