my description of Se lead + Ni lead relationship dynamics
This is a work in progress. I've been gathering anecdotal information for a little while now, and I'm always looking for more! If you have experienced or witnessed any real life Se lead + Ni lead relationships, please give me your feedback. (:
https://docs.google.com/document/d/1...it?usp=sharing
Yesss, great!
<3Originally Posted by Chae
I've heard it doesn't work on some cell phones, so here go:
What are Se leads like?
Se leads are characterized by confidence and assertiveness. They know how to make things happen and are happy to push for what they want. They know how hard to push (or not push) depending on the situation. They’re impulsive, impatient, risk taking, and willing to expend a great deal of energy. They’re direct and full of initiative. They love a challenge and seek out opportunities to demonstrate their strength. Knowing that they lack sufficient foresight to be certain of an outcome, they are liable to “just give it a shot” to see what happens instead of thoroughly considering the ramifications. This often doesn’t end well, at which point they fall back on their resilience, brushing themselves off and continuing on to the next adventure.
What are Ni leads like?
Ni leads, on the other hand, are characterized by hesitation and doubt. They’re more comfortable in the role of the insightful observer and visionary than doer. They go with the flow and see how things play out, conserving their energy and avoiding imprudent actions as they can foresee the problems and barriers that are likely to arise. They may get so caught up in considering the outcomes of things that they never actually set firm objectives and take action to complete them.
Why are Se leads and Ni leads compatible?
This combination of characteristics is exactly what makes Se leads and Ni leads a great match even in friend, family, and professional relationships. Se leads are drawn to Ni leads because they’re insightful and laid back, and they generally respond well to the Se lead’s directness and forceful energy. Se leads are accustomed to needing to soften their harsh, flippant manner around most people if they want to get along well with them, and they’re pleasantly surprised to find that Ni leads not only respond well but also encourage it. Ni leads appreciate the right kind of push and are impressed by the Se lead’s power to do. The Se lead, in turn, benefits immensely from the thoughtful input the Ni lead has to offer. The Ni lead helps the Se lead sort through the events of the past and present and find meaningful patterns to help guide plans for the future. Too often, Se leads remember events from their past and think, “I don’t want to make that mistake again! I’m going to do something different this time!” but don’t see all of the nuances that make this situation different from the previous ones. The Ni lead can easily point out what makes this situation unique from others and why those differences are important. The decisive Se lead comes to rely on this input and slow their roll long enough to avoid making as many impetuous mistakes.
What are Se leads like in relationships?
The above traits carry over into the dating realm as well. Se leads are quick to develop interest, confident in their interest, happy to take initiative, and quick to lose interest and move on. If someone catches their eye, they’ll put forth effort to be around the person. They communicate their interest pretty quickly and aren’t shy about trying to make something happen. They tend not to fear rejection as much as most people do because they would rather have an answer they weren’t aiming for than to remain in a state of uncertainty and inaction, and they’re confident in their resilience. They’re action people, always focusing on what they can *do*. They also tend to cast a wide social and dating net in the hopes that they’ll happen to catch something really great.
This combination of traits can result in a variety of outcomes:
-They often wind up with the potential partners who respond quickly to their attempts to initiate (before they have a chance to lose interest). They then discover that the they had been hasty and that the pairing isn’t really as good as they had hoped, at which point they leave. This could take half a week or half a decade depending on how incompatible the pair is as well as their own level of commitment. If they’re committed to the relationship, they’ll put a significant amount of effort into maintaining it, only much later realizing that the day to day problems form an overall pattern that is unsatisfactory and likely to continue, at which point they cut their losses and end the relationship.
-If the object of their interest doesn’t respond quickly or rejects them, the result will either be the Se lead’s rapid loss of interest or the Se lead taking up the chase. Se leads love chasing a potential partner, but only if they’re making progress. If they don’t seem to be getting anywhere, they will abandon the chase and set their sights on a new prize. Alternatively, the Se lead may also accept the rejection and lose interest yet remain in contact with the person. Their interest may or may not later return.
What are Ni leads like in relationships?
Ni leads are slower to develop interest in someone. They remain skeptical and doubtful, and they’re not only hesitant to take initiative but also to go along with another person’s rapid attempts to initiate. They’re likely to doubt the person’s interest, seeing it as insincere or fleeting. Ni leads are also likely to doubt their own level of interest. They note the potential problems in the pairing and hold back, often seeing them as insurmountable. They’re not about to allow themselves to get invested in a relationship while they have significant doubts. Even within relationships, they may experience doubts that cause them to hold back or retreat. Ni leads will sometimes be willing to initiate a relationship if they’re certain that the other person is interested, but they feel uncomfortable doing so and prefer that the other person initiate.
Are Se leads and Ni leads romantically compatible?
What does it look like when a Se lead and Ni lead successfully come together romantically? The process, unbeknownst to the Se lead, actually begins with Ni lead observing them. The Ni lead sees the Se lead as strong, energetic, brave, frenetic, and incredibly social. They seem to do so much with such ease, and they have all of these people buzzing about them. The Ni lead may feel a sense of admiration towards the Se lead, but it doesn’t typically cross their mind that the Se lead might be a good romantic match for them. When the Se lead finally notices and turns their attention onto the Ni lead, the Se lead is pleasantly surprised to find that this individual who appears so calm, laid back, and possibly even timid actually has a bit of an edge to them and responds well to the Se lead’s flippant and harsh manner. The Ni lead is fun and can handle them! As they continue to interact, the Ni lead’s understated insightfulness, dark humor, and encouraging reactions intrigue and charm the Se lead. Once the Ni lead has the Se lead’s attention, the Se lead will quickly develop and express romantic/sexual interest. The Ni lead is mostly just confused by this but does not let it show. They resist the Se lead’s advances either completely or partially (such as agreeing to a date but not letting things move too fast). The Se lead at this point either resolves to win the Ni lead and begins the chase or accepts the rejection yet remains in contact. If the latter is the case, the Se lead finds themselves once again interested in the Ni lead before too long. In either case, the Se lead, being the action person that they are, is sure to express their interest again before too long.
The Ni lead, being hesitant and cautious, may experience any or all of the following concerns: They don’t believe that the Se lead is actually interested in them. Why would they be? How could they even know what they want this quickly? This would likely turn into a troublesome mess. And maybe the Se lead is just joking around? Or maybe they kinda meant it at the moment, but it’s not actually me but rather some idea of me that the Se lead is into. Once the illusion is shattered, they’ll lose interest. And it may not even take that to make the Se lead lose interest. Love interests are probably easy come, easy go for the Se lead. They’re capricious, after all. They’ll notice someone else who catches their eye before too long and wander off. After all, they have all of these people bouncing around in their social sphere and could easily attract or pursue someone else. And how compatible are they really? Furthermore, what about the obstacles to a relationship? If there are circumstances or complications that may make a relationship difficult or impossible, the Ni lead likely won’t even allow their brain to go there and consider the possibility.
From from the Se lead’s perspective, their initial interest is indeed sincere (even if it's not all that strong yet), but when the Ni lead rejects their initial attempts to initiate, they pause long enough to consider that maybe they didn’t know each other all that well, the timing was poor, or there were obstacles that needed to be addressed. They see the Ni lead as wise and competent at looking out for their own best interests. This is very attractive to Se types who know that many potential partners can’t handle them. They know from experience that they tend to rush into things and end up causing a big mess of unforeseen consequences. Seeing the Ni lead’s caution gives them a sense of security because it helps them to explore and reaffirm their own interest, and it indicates that the Ni lead is well equipped to handle their inadvertantly reckless nature and to help prevent problems down the road. The Se lead realizes they naturally seek to overpower, win, and possess others, and they’re not accustomed to running into this type of resistance. When the Ni lead does not quickly give in to their advances as others have in the past, the Se lead’s respect for them grows. They have found their equal! Their interest strengthens, and they continue to pursue the Ni lead.
The Se lead’s persistence over enough time (whether it be days, weeks, months, or years) convinces the Ni lead of their interest and loyalty, and as time goes by, their compatibility becomes more apparent. However, the Ni lead may still be concerned about circumstances that could make things difficult or keep them apart. Se leads, on the other hand, excel at crashing through obstacles. “Difficult? Pfft. Consider it done.” One of their top strengths, after all, is making things happen. They enjoy demonstrating the strength of their determination through defeating such challenges. Se leads are ever focused on action steps and will continue to march forward.
The Ni lead also derives a sense of security from the Se lead’s approach. The Se lead’s frequent displays of interest, the amount of work they’re willing to do to win the Ni lead, their patience with the Ni lead’s reluctance, their power to do, and their grounded physicality are all reassuring to the Ni lead, and eventually they’re happy to enter into a relationship or take the relationship to the next level. You would think at this point that the Se lead’s work at winning the Ni lead would be complete, but it is not. The Ni lead will continue to have occasional doubts, and the Se lead will respond quickly and decisively to those doubts with reassurance and confidence in the relationship. The Se lead will largely be the one leading the relationship, and the they continue to be responsible for initiating most physical intimacy. The Se lead is protective of the Ni lead, considering them not just one of “their people”, but their cherished person.
As time goes by, the Se lead learns through experience how to better use Ni, and the Ni lead learns how to better use Se. Each of them becomes more effective in their use of their lead function due to the support of the other Se/Ni function. The Se lead learns to take a moment to consider the overall picture and how events are related to each other. They’re still decisive and can use incredible force, but the outcome of this is better because they’re applying it in wiser directions and avoiding overly impulsive action. The Ni lead learns how to apply some force and to act when it’s time to act. They’re still primarily observant visionaries, but they learn how to push themselves and others enough to put their plans into action. They also learn how to overcome inertia in their day to day lives and make stuff happen. Each is still very appreciative of the Se/Ni of the other, of course, despite their individual growth.
Sounds great! What could possibly go wrong?
Just because the individuals are Se lead and Ni lead doesn’t mean they’re compatible. There are a whole slew of other factors involved in compatibility: Physical attraction, intelligence, mental health, demographics (age, sex, etc.), culture, religion, interests, life goals/values, attachment style, personality, and other considerations that can all be just as important to compatibility as type. For example, if one partner just simply isn’t physically attracted to the other, a romantic/sexual relationship isn’t in the cards.
Another thing that can happen is that the Ni lead’s concerns about the fickle nature of the Se lead’s interest or the nature of the relationship that the Se lead is looking for (casual vs serious, fling vs long term) can be well founded. The Se lead will quickly lose interest and move on.
It’s also possible that the process of getting to know each other while the Se lead attempts to win Ni lead reveals that the pair isn’t nearly as compatible as the Se lead had initially hoped. This, of course, is invaluable information for avoiding a bad pairing and difficult relationship and/or break up down the road.
Additionally, sometimes the Ni lead is too reluctant. If the Ni lead resists the Se lead’s advances for long enough, the Se lead will eventually be discouraged by the lack of progress, figure it’s just not going to happen, lose interest, and move on. This can leave the Ni lead feeling regretful for their indecision, particularly if the Se lead made multiple attempts to initiate.
As for the Se lead, they may make the mistake of chasing after someone who just isn’t into them and never will be. The excitement of the chase and their feelings of attraction for the Ni lead can cause them to be overly optimistic about the situation. They may overlook or disregard indicators that they’re wasting their time and effort, such as the Ni lead being avoidant or inattentive. Even if the Ni lead isn’t certain of their interest in a relationship, they should still be reasonably receptive and responsive. Spending too much time and effort chasing after the wrong Ni lead can sour a Se lead’s desire to pursue an uncertain partner, leading them back into the pattern of getting involved with people who respond immediately to their attempts to initiate.
Se leads may also make the mistake of never noticing the Ni lead at all.
In summary…
In short, the Ni lead wants to wait either to get involved or to deeply commit until they’re sure that their concerns have been addressed and that the Se lead isn’t going to just lose interest and wander off. If the Se lead doesn't lose interest through this process, they may just be a good pairing with a bright future.
good stuff @Joy.
For sle/iei duality to work you have to usually have similar political goals and moral values and to well, simply find the other person hot. And be around the same age. And it's still a bit annoying because duality takes time to heat up - especially if you aren't used to it. And a shy type that wants to be a writer and a party goer type person (stereotypical but how it often pans out in reality) really doesn't have much in common at first glance and it's difficult to get momentum started. sle/iei often realize how compatible they are during a sexual encounter- but it is an SLE's nature to think there's something better around the corner- and that an even more intense orgasm is possible out there with another submissive partner. It is then at this point the heart must be hooked- which isn't easy. Both types are skeptical and wary of the relationship thing anyway and getting attached to another person. It's a problem of not being Fi valuers.
IEI is also hesitant/doubtful in general and about pursuing a relationship with a SLE - but not our specific plans. It's the lack of se/si/te/ti in our psyches that make actually executing our plans difficult. Successful IEIs tend to delve deeply into one idea and stick with it, and being writers helps us with that.
also IEI (lookalike to SEI) is kind of too goody goody in a way and feels all these moral obligations to society and their community even if they are naturally rebellious, and want to piss on all that moral delta crap anyway. When they see an SLE do this- it charms them to no end- but also like they are abandoning something. It is then so important if the relationship works out that the IEI isn't too self-righteous and the SLE isn't too much of an hurtful bully. But they have to kind of naturally be in those places themselves independently I think, not 'he's a bad boy/girl and I can change him.'
The SLE will also fight furiously for the IEI- because they truly do love them usually.... but this gets them in hot water with authority figures. I've had SLEs threaten other people that tried picking me on before and ended up getting arrested and served even more prison time... then all the deltas basically told him what a horrible piece of shit he was. He was actually doing the right thing (just obviously executed poorly) and what we teach kids to do on saturday morning cartoons but to deltas I was just 'playing victim.' Also the IEI has a hard time explaining to others why a thug makes them feel so comfortable and safe inside and all these stupid delta social workers and teachers and therapists don't.
They dont want to be viewed by others as without having values, they hate that- but that's what often what occurs. Goddamn LSEs, let's throw you all in jail and see how you like it.
Thanks! ^_^
I could definitely see SLE/IEI duality being difficult to get going, but I think SEE/ILI duality is also usually pretty difficult to get going because ILIs are so guarded. They know that if they let someone in, that person could just totally fucking destroy them. They want to be really sure that the person is loyal and trustworthy and that there's a promising future in store for them before they even let their brains consider the person as an option. And that can take a long time, especially with a potential partner who's as capricious and amorous as SEEs. From a distance, SEEs probably look like a terrible choice because they (at least appear to) date a lot, have a short attention span, make poor relationship decisions, flirt with a lot of people, etc. They need to show the depth of their Fi and the longevity of their interest before the ILI will open themselves up to the SEE. So basically, even though the pair values Fi, it's still typically a long process. SEEs appreciate it though because they're used to people giving in to them without much of a challenge, so the ILI's resistance is an attractive challenge, and it makes them feel more secure in the relationship in the long term because they're more sure of what they want and that potential problems have been foreseen and addressed. (And I speculate that feeling like their partner is competent to look out for their own best interests is attractive to them as well since it's not unlikely that they've left a trail of broken hearts in their wake. They don't do it on purpose, but being too quick to get into relationships tends to have that effect.)
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