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Thread: SLI or something else?

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    Default SLI or something else?

    VI Marathon go to post #10


    After "studying" socionics for quite a while I came to the conclusion that SLI could be a accurate typing but I am still not sure. So I am looking for confirmation or other suggestions. I'll write some stuff about myself but feel free to ask questions


    work / study
    At work it's important for me that:
    -there's a good atmospehre
    -that I am respected
    -that it's not a chaotic environment
    -that the stuff I do makes sense
    -that I respect my boss
    -that tasks are clearly explained and that I know what people expect from me

    Whereas I have an Idea of what salary would be fair for my work the personal factor tends to play a bigger role

    Between strict schedules and open schedules there isn't a clear preference for me. Both works well for me.

    Where I see a problem in my study is giving written work a final structure. The area of research and writing a handout on the other hand come easy to me
    As a rule of thumb I prefer subjects where I see a practical implementation over highly theoretic stuff. Especially when something doesn't grasp my intential Interest I prefer it when I see at least a practical implementation. Nevertheless I enjoy theoretical discussions about subjects I am interested in a lot.
    If I had to decide between lectures or exercises I'd choose exercises but I prefer a balance between both



    Leisure
    I have few very close friends and about two dozens of acquaintances/not so close friends. I really can't hang out all the time with the same people and like it a lot to "switch" to other friendscircle.
    At the moment my only hobb are working out regularly at the university gym and playing one time a week football(soccer) with some friends. I also like to play videogames and read books but reading books is more something I do during the big vacations. I try to read everyday the newspaper to be aware what's happening in the world it's also something I enjoy obviously. The only magazin I read on a regular basis are GEO history and the magazin from my university. I also throw an eye from time to time to the economist
    A comfortable surrounding is important to me but I am quite tolerant. I live in a five people flat and as long as my personal room is ok I don't care to much but it seems that I still care more about order than my co-habitants.

    If you'd ask me after my biggest problem area I'd say women

    Here are two actual pics vor VI purposes:
    IMAG0175.jpgIMAG0177.jpg
    Last edited by DaftPunk; 11-19-2013 at 11:32 PM.

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    Éminence grise mikemex's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Daft21 View Post
    If you'd ask me after my biggest problem area I'd say women
    How so? I think SLIs were easy to deal with. Calm even on a prank, really slow to anger, pay attention to the black girl here (3:56):

    [] | NP | 3[6w5]8 so/sp | Type thread | My typing of forum members | Johari (Strengths) | Nohari (Weaknesses)

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    Quote Originally Posted by mikemex View Post
    How so? I think SLIs were easy to deal with. Calm even on a prank, really slow to anger, pay attention to the black girl here (3:56):

    lol I can identify a lot

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    Quote Originally Posted by Daft21 View Post
    After "studying" socionics for quite a while I came to the conclusion that SLI could be a accurate typing but I am still not sure. So I am looking for confirmation or other suggestions. I'll write some stuff about myself but feel free to ask questions
    SLI was my initial 'vibe', though it's hard to explain, in posts you respond with certain directness and immediacy, addressing exactly the text that is there, which distinguishes SLIs from similar intuitive types. Do you know your instinct stacking by any chance?

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    Quote Originally Posted by siuntal View Post
    SLI was my initial 'vibe', though it's hard to explain, in posts you respond with certain directness and immediacy, addressing exactly the text that is there, which distinguishes SLIs from similar intuitive types. Do you know your instinct stacking by any chance?
    I always thought sp/sx. sp/so could be a possibility but sp/sx seems way more likely.

    Don't know if I should believe in Tritype but it would be 6w5-4w5-8w9

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    Quote Originally Posted by siuntal View Post
    SLI was my initial 'vibe', though it's hard to explain, in posts you respond with certain directness and immediacy, addressing exactly the text that is there, which distinguishes SLIs from similar intuitive types. Do you know your instinct stacking by any chance?
    why did you ask after instinct stacking? I am still curious on your response.

    Don't you think that LIE, LII and even ILI could also be pretty direct and to the point?

    I am just wondering if I am really Si-Base because when I look at my brother (Si-SEI 9w8) and see him with which ease and joy he dresses or how he cooks or how he's confident in his workouts I start to doubt.

    It's also that he's very conflict avoiding whereas I am not conflict averse. Other things that would speak against Si-Base is that I am completely unable to establish a sleeping rythm and my clothing style is also more a one dimensional or two dimensional based mainly on experience.
    As child I always wore the clothes my mother prepared for me (also to not insult her) and my younger brother always choose his own clothes.

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    xSTx I need a side picture please

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    Post a photo of yourself where you're amongst people but not posing for the camera and one of your face where your eyes are visible.

    Don't worry about side profiles or necks or whatever.

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    boom boom boom blackburry's Avatar
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    if I were the black chick I would've leaned forward to fix his collar, and would've kicked him extremely hard in the perinea, making sure to dig a bit of heel into it, and walked away.



    You could be SLI, sure.
    Last edited by blackburry; 11-19-2013 at 03:01 PM.

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    @DaftPunk

    Picture 2 reminds me of how I dress and stand when I'm socialising with people, head craned forward, attentive but casual. I would say judging from your posture and face that you're Ej.

    Nothing about you is screaming Beta or Alpha, you seem to be Te/Fi valuing. Picture 6 makes me think sensing > intuiting, pretty obvious ST face, but your neutral expression looks quite formal, despite the fact that your body language is quite casual.

    I'd be inclined to say you're ESTj with a high level of confidence.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Narc View Post
    @DaftPunk

    Picture 2 reminds me of how I dress and stand when I'm socialising with people, head craned forward, attentive but casual. I would say judging from your posture and face that you're Ej.

    Nothing about you is screaming Beta or Alpha, you seem to be Te/Fi valuing. Picture 6 makes me think sensing > intuiting, pretty obvious ST face, but your neutral expression looks quite formal, despite the fact that your body language is quite casual.

    I'd be inclined to say you're ESTj with a high level of confidence.
    Thanks, epsecially for breaking it down how you came to your conclusion

    What would be the second most likely type in your opinion, SLI?

    I alwyas thought I am to lazy to be LSE but it's mostly study related. During leasure time I am always doing something and seldom sit on the couch watching tv often I also don't have the nerves to watch a movie.

    When it comes to extroversion vs introversion in a general understanding I am pretty much in the middle (like most) so I only can decide by functions if I am a socionics introvert or extrovers.


    '

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    Quote Originally Posted by DaftPunk View Post
    Thanks, epsecially for breaking it down how you came to your conclusion

    What would be the second most likely type in your opinion, SLI?
    There's no point in me giving you a second most likely type because you'll just continue to waver between the two in uncertainty like you were doing with LSE and SLI. I don't think you're SLI, and I'm quite sure you're LSE, although I can understand how it's easy to not be sure between two mirror types, especially if you've dabbled in Reinin dichotomies and found ones that match up in both types.

    Quote Originally Posted by DaftPunk View Post
    I alwyas thought I am to lazy to be LSE but it's mostly study related. During leasure time I am always doing something and seldom sit on the couch watching tv often I also don't have the nerves to watch a movie.
    Identify the source of your laziness. Is it rooted in perfectionism, low energy or apathy? This may provide you more insight. Do you feel like you should​ be doing something when you're procrastinating?

    Quote Originally Posted by DaftPunk View Post
    When it comes to extroversion vs introversion in a general understanding I am pretty much in the middle (like most) so I only can decide by functions if I am a socionics introvert or extrovers.
    Yeah, that's pretty common (especially in countries that aren't heavily gregarious).

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    Quote Originally Posted by Narc View Post
    There's no point in me giving you a second most likely type because you'll just continue to waver between the two in uncertainty like you were doing with LSE and SLI. I don't think you're SLI, and I'm quite sure you're LSE, although I can understand how it's easy to not be sure between two mirror types, especially if you've dabbled in Reinin dichotomies and found ones that match up in both types.


    Identify the source of your laziness. Is it rooted in perfectionism, low energy or apathy? This may provide you more insight. Do you feel like you should​ be doing something when you're procrastinating?


    Yeah, that's pretty common (especially in countries that aren't heavily gregarious).
    It's rooted in how I should do the task and fear from failing at the task. When you don't do something at all you can play the cool lazy guy when you get bad rewards for your work it hurts (I know it's stupid and wrong but I am just honest)
    Perfectionism plays probably also a role but to a lower degree. I am also bad at predicting how long a task takes time.

    I feel bad when I am procrastrinating so I became good at repressing.

    I like Reinin and even read his book lookin at his dichotomies the one outstanding which speaks for LSE is negativist. Mostly I say at first no to a request. Often I don't speak it out but think "no" for myself. As a second step I start to really think about the request.

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    LSE > SLI, Te subtype.
    “Whether we fall by ambition, blood, or lust, like diamonds we are cut with our own dust.”

    Quote Originally Posted by Gilly
    You've done yourself a huge favor developmentally by mustering the balls to do something really fucking scary... in about the most vulnerable situation possible.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Park View Post
    LSE > SLI, Te subtype.
    Te-subtype by VI or overall impression?

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    ISTp

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    Overall impression. I think you're leaning towards the Te/Fi axis.
    “Whether we fall by ambition, blood, or lust, like diamonds we are cut with our own dust.”

    Quote Originally Posted by Gilly
    You've done yourself a huge favor developmentally by mustering the balls to do something really fucking scary... in about the most vulnerable situation possible.

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    Daft it's not so much about being laze. My SLI ex was very active, it's that he was in his head with stuff that he would feel and imagine while he was working. There are even LSE Si who come so close to SLI Te that one can't tell the difference. I would say that the major difference is in Seeking Ne or Fi. Being natural emotional speakers, LSE seek out someone to get Fi, which is to speak to them about their family relational/emotions almost on a constant basis. SLI are more looking for someone who's into New Ideas and can inspire them into new possibilities.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Maritsa View Post
    Daft it's not so much about being laze. My SLI ex was very active, it's that he was in his head with stuff that he would feel and imagine while he was working. There are even LSE Si who come so close to SLI Te that one can't tell the difference. I would say that the major difference is in Seeking Ne or Fi. Being natural emotional speakers, LSE seek out someone to get Fi, which is to speak to them about their family relational/emotions almost on a constant basis. SLI are more looking for someone who's into New Ideas and can inspire them into new possibilities.
    I am more Fi than Ne seeking on a constant base.

    What also makes me think LSE is that I am probably a negativist and process oriented by Reinin Dichotomies.

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    Quote Originally Posted by DaftPunk View Post
    I am more Fi than Ne seeking on a constant base.

    What also makes me think LSE is that I am probably a negativist and process oriented by Reinin Dichotomies.
    Are you carefree or farsighted?

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    Quote Originally Posted by DaftPunk View Post
    I am more Fi than Ne seeking on a constant base.

    What also makes me think LSE is that I am probably a negativist and process oriented by Reinin Dichotomies.
    Either way. I'm happy to have you as my dual. We get along very well I would say.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Maritsa View Post
    Either way. I'm happy to have you as my dual. We get along very well I would say.
    To be honest with you, some of your posts I really liked and others not at all but when we interacted personally we got along well that's true



    Quote Originally Posted by Maritsa View Post
    Are you carefree or farsighted?
    It's hard to tell when you're Enneagram 6 because you have to cut out everything that's not related to the Reinin dichotomy. It's mainly the negativist thing that stands out for me.

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    Default Positivist and Negativist

    You say you are Negativist and it makes me want to explore that a bit, since I am seen as the optimist with my SLI and he the pessimist, yet, I am the Negativist and he the Postivist. In Socionics terms it really does describe us though. The following info and quotes are from Wikisocion.

    In Conversation

    I frequently use "not" "cannot" "nobody" "never". These statements are so very like me:

    - "Negative experiences are not always necessary, I don't need them"

    - "There won't be an occasion to do anything"

    - "I cannot say that this is not true"


    I never hear my SLI talk in such phrases. He instead is more straightforward, plain, matter-of-fact in the Positivist manner, talking about what can be done or what should be done in different situations, for example,

    - "You can call him only at this-and-this time") rather than what cannot or should not be done.

    Where as I would say in the Negativist manner: "If you call them at such a time it will be pointless"

    Social Behavior

    Here is another factor of Postivist/Negativist which has the effect of balancing out my SLI and my I/E preferences, making him a more extroverted Introvert, and me a more Introverted Extrovert, as far as assimilating into groups. (Its taken me over 800 posts before I feel sort of like I'm in this group):

    "Negativists are remote types. They need constant assurance, even in a group they consider their own. Therefore it is more difficult to fully integrate Negativists into a group. Positivists on the other hand, are inclined to close range communication. They do not polarize contrasts, but smooth them over in one way or another. Thus Positivists facilitate monocentric group structure and unity of purpose. Whereas Negativists amplify polarizing forces conducive to polycentric group structure."
    Yes, I do tend to polarize. I hate the effect when it happens though. It pains me when I see I have had an undeniable role in troubling interactions - I do just want to get along. I feel dismayed at strife.

    But its true, I do seem to put my opinions in a negative form: "You don't seem IEE to me! You don't think like me" "You should not gossip" "That was unkind" "Why are you being mean to Maritsa?"...

    Then I guess that's polarizing, and I think, "How did I cause all this trouble? I was just saying what i think!" (or, I was just saying "Don't say bad things!") Its like from Wikisocion:

    From a Negativist's point of view, he or she is not being a downer, but rather restoring the balance by pointing out the opposite.
    Yeah. That's what I think.

    Some might say @Maritsa causes polarizing, but you have to admit, its in a Postivist form:

    "You are SEE. Confirmed." Nothing Negativist about those statements.

    So according to Gulenko, we can all look at each others behavior on 16types forum group and notice:

    Postivist/Negativist Group Behaviors.

    Gulenko says:

    The overall incidence of monolithic or polarized group behavior is a reliable index for gauging Positivist–Negativist tendencies. Negativism generates tension in intragroup relations, leading on one hand to an increase in psychological distance between members, but on the other hand activating its internal momentum to say "Move!".

    Positivism by contrast contracts psychological distance and encourages internal group cohesion, but can also bring complacency, carelessness, and 'vapidity' of existence.
    You vapid positivists!

    And here is an embarrassing statement that seems to describe some interactions I have had on this forum:
    The relation between Positivists and Negativists is illustrated well by the analogy of electric conductors. Electric-people (Negativists who have accumulated a negative psychological charge) discharge into conductor-people (Positivists), who tend to provoke them in just the right way to do so. All of which happens mostly automatically and unconsciously. The resulting emotional flash establishing temporary balance of psychological (electro-)potentials. This beneficial surge of emotional release, Aristotle in his "Poetics" called 'catharsis'—psychological purging via intense experience.
    So think about your group behavior, and think of which fits you. Do you cause emotional flashes?? I do. And its embarrassing to me.


    Trust

    Also, Positivists tend to be more trusting - and Negativists are not trusting - and this has gotten my SLI into trouble, trusting the wrong people. I remember thinking right off "He needs me, because I would have never let that person in his life..." (that caused him so much trouble).

    I have a longtime (Postivist) EII friend whose marriage ended about when mine did (it had also started about the same time; we met when we were both newlyweds putting our husbands through college). She did a LOT of dating. It was nice for her because it gave her instant social life. I on the other hand, did not trust to date and chose not to and really had no social life. I remember her showing me her online dating profile (because I considered dating briefly, as her life seemed much more fun than mine) and it just seemed too scary to un-trusting-me. "You write all that stuff, online?? Anyone could see it!" It all worked out, we both found our Duals (neither of us knew we were looking for a Dual) at near the same time and seem now to be "permanently dualized"..).

    Finally, Wikisocion tells of Harry S. Sullivan's findings on:

    Physical Appearances

    of Postivist/Negativist behavior in groups which is so telling. In a group of people almost all the time, unless I am walking around, I am face to face talking to someone.

    Negativists gain leverage in communication from positions opposite the partner, Positivists from positions alongside or at an angle deflecting a straight-on gaze.
    Also posture in a group. Mine is more likely to be closed. Look:

    Clinical psychologists studying nonverbal cues classify gestures indicative of critical attitudes. Such gestures are typically 'closed'—for instance, a hand at the mouth. From a Socionics standpoint then, closed demeanor is better explained by Negativism, not Introversion.
    I must say, if one had to pick just from what you provided in this thread, you are side-by-side and/or open in posture in ALL of the group pictures you showed us, Daft. In the third one, see the blond girl to the left of you? (black blazer, white buttoned cuffs, pilsner glass). She is closed.

    So you Introvert SLIs can see that's another way to spot your IEE Dual in a group. Not so very extroverted-looking in the group. You might need to approach her. She needs the Postivist to approach! But don't worry, she can talk. She is an Extrovert! She just needs an opening. You have the key.

    Posture

    Also, Daft, you have a more relaxed posture that is not saying "Negativist". LSEs are just "stiffer".*(see below) You stand not like my stiffer LSE brother but like my more relaxed, more self-possessed SLI brother. And that mysterious self-possessed quiet confident look of SLI always attracted girls attention. Combined with that SLI steady gaze.** Its a good thing. See this:

    Negativism induces tangible bodily tension. Negativists are inclined to accumulate 'charge', making highly-charged Negativists easily overexcitable (especially if also Dynamic). In order to compensate against this, Negativists are recommended to engage in physical exercise that relaxes and smooths internal tension. While Positivists are recommended to perform physical exercise that excites and intensifies their physiological processes.
    Daft, you wrote:
    Quote Originally Posted by DaftPunk View Post
    Mostly I say at first no to a request. Often I don't speak it out but think "no" for myself. As a second step I start to really think about the request.
    Opposite of me. I most often say "yes" first. Because I am people-pleasing? Because I like to help? I don't know, but its caused me problems and I had to work hard at saying no, finding it hard to turn down requests, and had to start by learning to say, "Let me get back to you" to prevent too much "yes".

    So, I do not think that this has anything to do with Postivist/Negativist.. And I still think you are SLI. Looks like one, talks like one, thinks like one. Must be one! But I think I get it. I think that the "P" in you wants to keep it open while you continue to collect more info to be quite sure...


    *Here is what is said of LSEs which is true of my very tall LSE brother and not of my average-tall SLI brother -not sure of heights of types but this is how height played out in my particular family. From Socionics.com concerning LSE:

    Their gait and movements are sharp, tense and jerky showing an internal tension synonymous to this type. ...have a characteristic upright posture often appearing as if their backs are inflexible giving the impression that they are executing a military drill. ...
    So, EIIs, you need to look for that jerky gait! And Daft, you don't look like a guy with a jerky gait...

    **(LSE gaze is more intense/active than SLI gaze while SLIs seems more deep and steady).
    Last edited by Eliza Thomason; 11-20-2013 at 05:36 PM. Reason: added headings, typos etc.

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    I agree with LSE. Delta ST seems pretty obvious and I also think you VI as an extrovert.

    The best way to figure out introversion/extroversion, I think, is to ask yourself whether or not socializing with people whose company you enjoy drains or energizes you. When I meet with a close friend and hang out, my energy level increases and I feel mobilized (this is not the case for all forms of socializing as social events can also be draining to me). Introverts, from what I understand, need recovery time and feel drained even after enjoyable socializing.
    “Let us forget with generosity those who cannot love us”
    ― Pablo Neruda

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kim View Post
    I agree with LSE. Delta ST seems pretty obvious and I also think you VI as an extrovert.

    The best way to figure out introversion/extroversion, I think, is to ask yourself whether or not socializing with people whose company you enjoy drains or energizes you. When I meet with a close friend and hang out, my energy level increases and I feel mobilized (this is not the case for all forms of socializing as social events can also be draining to me). Introverts, from what I understand, need recovery time and feel drained even after enjoyable socializing.
    you've seen her pics? She's the quintessential IEE. All company drains me.

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    This whole forum is negative.
     
    God is most glorified when we are most satisfied in Him.
    - John Piper


    Socionics -
    the16types.info

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    Quote Originally Posted by Maritsa View Post
    you've seen her pics? She's the quintessential IEE. All company drains me.
    Whose pics?
    “Let us forget with generosity those who cannot love us”
    ― Pablo Neruda

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kim View Post
    I agree with LSE. Delta ST seems pretty obvious and I also think you VI as an extrovert.

    The best way to figure out introversion/extroversion, I think, is to ask yourself whether or not socializing with people whose company you enjoy drains or energizes you. When I meet with a close friend and hang out, my energy level increases and I feel mobilized (this is not the case for all forms of socializing as social events can also be draining to me). Introverts, from what I understand, need recovery time and feel drained even after enjoyable socializing.
    Quote Originally Posted by Maritsa View Post
    ...All company drains me.
    Yes, Maritsa, that confirms what Kim just said. And I have seen this with my two EII longtime friends, too. And they are not antisocial by any means. Both like to entertain at home and they do it well (its well-planned!). Both like to go out. But they have their limits. Just "so much" going out, for them.

    I agree with Kim; feeling energized or drained even after enjoyable company is probably is the best way to tell between Extrovert and Introvert.

    And Kim, as to his VI'ing as an Extrovert, what you are seeing could also be that he is VI'ing as a Positivist Introvert - SLI, according to this (from Wikisocion):
    Clinical psychologists studying nonverbal cues classify gestures indicative of critical attitudes. Such gestures are typically 'closed'—for instance, a hand at the mouth. From a Socionics standpoint then, closed demeanor is better explained by Negativism, not Introversion.
    And as to pic:

    Quote Originally Posted by Maritsa View Post
    you've seen her pics? She's the quintessential IEE....
    Quote Originally Posted by Kim View Post
    Whose pics?
    I am thinking she means me. But she is the only one that I have revealed myself to not just because I consider her a friend now but because I know she is into VI (and she understands my desire to keep my identity private so I feel safe to write freely here). I am truly the Negativist who mistrusts and can bit a bit closed off to protect privacy, and this for me was amplified when during my prolonged custody battle involving lies were created from what I wrote online. So my actual online identity is pretty non-existent.

    However, probably after SLI and I marry (we are in the homestretch waiting for that) I will post a pic of both of us for a brief period here before I hide it again....

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    Seriously Judicious Emotivist Eliza Thomason's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Saberstorm View Post
    This whole forum is negative.
    Or vapid.

    I like that word.



    vap·id

    ˈvapid/

    adjective

    1. offering nothing that is stimulating or challenging.
    "tuneful but vapid musical comedies"

    synonyms
    insipid, uninspired, colorless, uninteresting, feeble, flat, dull, boring, tedious, tired, unexciting, uninspiring, unimaginative, uninvolving, lifeless, tame, vacuous, bland, trite, jejune More




    (Irritating negativists and vapid positivists!)

    .
    .
    .
    .

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kim View Post
    I agree with LSE. Delta ST seems pretty obvious and I also think you VI as an extrovert.

    The best way to figure out introversion/extroversion, I think, is to ask yourself whether or not socializing with people whose company you enjoy drains or energizes you. When I meet with a close friend and hang out, my energy level increases and I feel mobilized (this is not the case for all forms of socializing as social events can also be draining to me). Introverts, from what I understand, need recovery time and feel drained even after enjoyable socializing.
    I don't think I am drained by people but often drained by for me boring topics. When a discussion or an activity is pleasent I never have the feeling that I could use a break. On the other hand when I was with many friends on a island in Thailand I started to enjoy time for me alone especially in the morning. But it can also be that I am not a morning guy. I also never had a problem with presentations and as a student and had always good oral marks.

    By looking at the ratonal/irrational dichotomy I feel that I tend to favor stable environments. I also veryfie incoming information directly. Relationship wise I tend to like flippy women and find them interesting but I wouldn't have the nerves to be in a longterm relationship with them. One time a female friend said that clumsy women are sexy I answered her that it can be fun from time to time but in the long term it's just annoying. I also can't stand it when women play the role of the clumsy girl.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Eliza Thomason View Post
    You say you are Negativist and it makes me want to explore that a bit, since I am seen as the optimist with my SLI and he the pessimist, yet, I am the Negativist and he the Postivist. In Socionics terms it really does describe us though. The following info and quotes are from Wikisocion.

    In Conversation

    I frequently use "not" "cannot" "nobody" "never". These statements are so very like me:

    - "Negative experiences are not always necessary, I don't need them"

    - "There won't be an occasion to do anything"

    - "I cannot say that this is not true"


    I never hear my SLI talk in such phrases. He instead is more straightforward, plain, matter-of-fact in the Positivist manner, talking about what can be done or what should be done in different situations, for example,

    - "You can call him only at this-and-this time") rather than what cannot or should not be done.

    Where as I would say in the Negativist manner: "If you call them at such a time it will be pointless"
    Most of the time I am pragmatic like your SLI but I tend to see rather what's absent than what's present. I also got lot's of feedback from people that I am to negative especially in judgement. I took that to heart and try to say first what I like and not what I disliked even though the later comes easier to me.

    Quote Originally Posted by Eliza Thomason View Post
    Social Behavior

    Here is another factor of Postivist/Negativist which has the effect of balancing out my SLI and my I/E preferences, making him a more extroverted Introvert, and me a more Introverted Extrovert, as far as assimilating into groups. (Its taken me over 800 posts before I feel sort of like I'm in this group):



    Yes, I do tend to polarize. I hate the effect when it happens though. It pains me when I see I have had an undeniable role in troubling interactions - I do just want to get along. I feel dismayed at strife.

    But its true, I do seem to put my opinions in a negative form: "You don't seem IEE to me! You don't think like me" "You should not gossip" "That was unkind" "Why are you being mean to Maritsa?"...

    Then I guess that's polarizing, and I think, "How did I cause all this trouble? I was just saying what i think!" (or, I was just saying "Don't say bad things!") Its like from Wikisocion:



    Yeah. That's what I think.

    Some might say @Maritsa causes polarizing, but you have to admit, its in a Postivist form:

    "You are SEE. Confirmed." Nothing Negativist about those statements.

    So according to Gulenko, we can all look at each others behavior on 16types forum group and notice:
    I like to speak freely without taking personal matters to much into consideration. But I became softer with the years. So I naturaly tend to polarize even though it's not my main intention

    Quote Originally Posted by Eliza Thomason View Post
    Postivist/Negativist Group Behaviors.

    Gulenko says:



    You vapid positivists!

    And here is an embarrassing statement that seems to describe some interactions I have had on this forum:


    So think about your group behavior, and think of which fits you. Do you cause emotional flashes?? I do. And its embarrassing to me.
    The negativist group behavior fits me more. I caused emotional flashes even too. Normaly I am energized by debates with controversial opinions to much common ground is boring . That's actually one of the main reasons why I doubt being SLI


    Quote Originally Posted by Eliza Thomason View Post
    Trust

    Also, Positivists tend to be more trusting - and Negativists are not trusting - and this has gotten my SLI into trouble, trusting the wrong people. I remember thinking right off "He needs me, because I would have never let that person in his life..." (that caused him so much trouble).

    I have a longtime (Postivist) EII friend whose marriage ended about when mine did (it had also started about the same time; we met when we were both newlyweds putting our husbands through college). She did a LOT of dating. It was nice for her because it gave her instant social life. I on the other hand, did not trust to date and chose not to and really had no social life. I remember her showing me her online dating profile (because I considered dating briefly, as her life seemed much more fun than mine) and it just seemed too scary to un-trusting-me. "You write all that stuff, online?? Anyone could see it!" It all worked out, we both found our Duals (neither of us knew we were looking for a Dual) at near the same time and seem now to be "permanently dualized"..).

    Finally, Wikisocion tells of Harry S. Sullivan's findings on:
    I don't like to depend to much on people and wouldn't say that I am very trusting on the other hand I am also not mistrusting and generaly think that people have bad intentions. I think that could fit both Delta ST's.

    Quote Originally Posted by Eliza Thomason View Post
    Physical Appearances

    of Postivist/Negativist behavior in groups which is so telling. In a group of people almost all the time, unless I am walking around, I am face to face talking to someone.


    Also posture in a group. Mine is more likely to be closed. Look:



    I must say, if one had to pick just from what you provided in this thread, you are side-by-side and/or open in posture in ALL of the group pictures you showed us, Daft. In the third one, see the blond girl to the left of you? (black blazer, white buttoned cuffs, pilsner glass). She is closed.

    So you Introvert SLIs can see that's another way to spot your IEE Dual in a group. Not so very extroverted-looking in the group. You might need to approach her. She needs the Postivist to approach! But don't worry, she can talk. She is an Extrovert! She just needs an opening. You have the key.
    Normally my main problem is to make the first step after that I don't have problems with conversations. But I see what you mean

    Quote Originally Posted by Eliza Thomason View Post
    Posture

    Also, Daft, you have a more relaxed posture that is not saying "Negativist". LSEs are just "stiffer".*(see below) You stand not like my stiffer LSE brother but like my more relaxed, more self-possessed SLI brother. And that mysterious self-possessed quiet confident look of SLI always attracted girls attention. Combined with that SLI steady gaze.** Its a good thing. See this:



    Daft, you wrote:


    Opposite of me. I most often say "yes" first. Because I am people-pleasing? Because I like to help? I don't know, but its caused me problems and I had to work hard at saying no, finding it hard to turn down requests, and had to start by learning to say, "Let me get back to you" to prevent too much "yes".

    So, I do not think that this has anything to do with Postivist/Negativist.. And I still think you are SLI. Looks like one, talks like one, thinks like one. Must be one! But I think I get it. I think that the "P" in you wants to keep it open while you continue to collect more info to be quite sure...


    *Here is what is said of LSEs which is true of my very tall LSE brother and not of my average-tall SLI brother -not sure of heights of types but this is how height played out in my particular family. From Socionics.com concerning LSE:



    So, EIIs, you need to look for that jerky gait! And Daft, you don't look like a guy with a jerky gait...

    **(LSE gaze is more intense/active than SLI gaze while SLIs seems more deep and steady).
    In all the group pictures I was under the influence of alcohol . My gait is normally paced with a straight upper body but not stiff as well. In general I'd say I have a better(healthier) posture than most. You could be right about the "P" looking for more information. Normally I don't rush to conclusions.

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    Quote Originally Posted by DaftPunk View Post
    One time a female friend said that clumsy women are sexy I answered her that it can be fun from time to time but in the long term it's just annoying.
    Then IEE is probably not your dual and you are probably LSE.
    “Let us forget with generosity those who cannot love us”
    ― Pablo Neruda

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    Quote Originally Posted by Kim View Post
    Then IEE is probably not your dual and you are probably LSE.
    Not even a Fi-IEE ?

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    Quote Originally Posted by DaftPunk View Post
    To be honest with you, some of your posts I really liked and others not at all but when we interacted personally we got along well that's true

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    Quote Originally Posted by Eliza Thomason View Post

    I am thinking she means me. But she is the only one that I have revealed myself to not just because I consider her a friend now but because I know she is into VI (and she understands my desire to keep my identity private so I feel safe to write freely here).
    I wasn't typing you.
    “Let us forget with generosity those who cannot love us”
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    Quote Originally Posted by DaftPunk View Post
    Not even a Fi-IEE ?
    They might be tad less clumsy, but not by much from what I see.

    Maybe a graceful EII is a better dual for you.
    “Let us forget with generosity those who cannot love us”
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kim View Post
    They might be tad less clumsy, but not by much from what I see.

    Maybe a graceful EII is a better dual for you.
    I think Maritsa ment you with looking like a typical IEE(?)

    My brother's girlfriend made a MBTI test in a workshop and got ENFP I told her a bit about socionics and she took a test where she got IEE. She fits the Ep temperament and is clearly ethical, likely intuitive and obviously not Se valuing so it seems she really is Fi-IEE or as second consideration SEI. I lived for a short while with them and even though I had very good conversations and al with her in daily life (e.g. chores or how to paint rooms) she was a bit to random for me.
    My brother by the way is Si-SEI and it makes sense that I am his Supervisor. I feel somehow guilty how i threat him in the past and when we are both in a group conversation I learned not to supervise him by saying nothing but I have to bite my tongue somehow.

    In Tolstoy's War&Piece I always had great sympathy for Princess Maria which is a perfect example of a graceful EII.

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    Seriously Judicious Emotivist Eliza Thomason's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DaftPunk View Post
    My brother's girlfriend made a MBTI test in a workshop and got ENFP I told her a bit about socionics and she took a test where she got IEE. She fits the Ep temperament and is clearly ethical, likely intuitive and obviously not Se valuing so it seems she really is Fi-IEE or as second consideration SEI. I lived for a short while with them and even though I had very good conversations and all with her in daily life (e.g. chores or how to paint rooms) she was a bit to random for me.
    My brother by the way is Si-SEI and it makes sense that I am his Supervisor. I feel somehow guilty how i threat him in the past and when we are both in a group conversation I learned not to supervise him by saying nothing but I have to bite my tongue somehow.

    In Tolstoy's War&Peace I always had great sympathy for Princess Maria which is a perfect example of a graceful EII.
    I do not think IEEs are clumsy clods or anything, but I do think EIIs have more natural grace. How about the your brother's IEE? Clumsy or not? Yes, IEEs are a bit random so sounds right.

    So, I see you are leaning towards other types at the moment, but if you decide you are SLI (its still open with you, right?) then you can observe your Dual in her...

    Remember your Dual is quite different from you, and at first, you often don't value each other's differences... Its easier to pass your Dual by than other types, they say. Odd, but true. Here is a good brief description http://www.socionics.com/rel/dlt.htm

    "Easiest and quickest to start" relations are Activity.

    And if you decide you are SLI, then it woudl be "Comparative" with your brother, basically good relationship except:

    "In a family environment these relations are very heavy, as they can create a mistrust between partners and do not allow them to feel their own significance. "

    and

    "Once one partner becomes superior to the other, they may have serious disagreements and conflicts."

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    Quote Originally Posted by DaftPunk View Post
    I think Maritsa ment you with looking like a typical IEE(?)
    No, Maritsa has not seen pictures of me. She probably mistook my typing of you for a typing of Eliza.

    My brother's girlfriend made a MBTI test in a workshop and got ENFP I told her a bit about socionics and she took a test where she got IEE. She fits the Ep temperament and is clearly ethical, likely intuitive and obviously not Se valuing so it seems she really is Fi-IEE or as second consideration SEI. I lived for a short while with them and even though I had very good conversations and al with her in daily life (e.g. chores or how to paint rooms) she was a bit to random for me.
    Yeah, not your dual.
    “Let us forget with generosity those who cannot love us”
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