Delta: the "boring" Quadra?

[jessica129]

Supposedly I'm Delta and I find it boring as hell....that's saying something

Are you talking about individual Deltas you know, or the group atmosphere you've identified as Delta?

The group atmosphere and several people here.

[Sumer1an]

no.... no... delta is objectively the most boring quadra....

[jessica129]

no.... no... delta is objectively the most boring quadra....

No one could possibly disagree with that. I mean really.

[Cat King Cole]

I could! Deltas are far more interesting than Betas, who are more "fun" but unintellectual IME. I can shoot the breeze with Deltas (especially IEEs and LSEs) about plans, ideas, observations and all that jazz. It's far more stimulating. The only problem is Deltas don't ever really get involved in my atrics, so in that sense they're more "boring".

[DirectorAbbie]

no.... no... delta is objectively the most boring quadra....

And that's refreshing for some people.

[Eye of the Potato]

How does the description of IEE have anything to do with boring? I've never come across a boring IEE in my life. LSI's are boring, not IEE's.

[Suz]

There are people who think that boring means not wanting to go out at night to a club/bar where you have physically uncomfortable conversations and end up spending a lot of money on drinks... I don't care if someone would call me boring. I just do my own thing, and enjoy it.

Ditto.

[Suz]

How does the description of IEE have anything to do with boring? I've never come across a boring IEE in my life. LSI's are boring, not IEE's.

I TOTALLY agree.

I guess boringness is in the eye of the beholder.

[Taknamay]

search for quadra progression or read some quadra descriptions and you'll see it mentioned

I see it mentioned, but I still don't understand.

The description that Wikisocion gives makes Deltas seem pretty cool to me.

[Cat King Cole]

It's usually butting heads over a club-related issue. "You're doing my club wrong!"

SFs can be too pushy and vindictive for my tastes; likewise I guess I can be a bit too fond of pushing the envelope on my take on social convention for them. Similarly I can disagree with the way the NTs throw around "evidence" and seemingly jump to unreasoned conclusions; the flipside of which is likely their being frustrated with how much time Alphas enjoy tossing theory back and forth for interest and refinement's sake.

[Korpsy Knievel]

It's usually butting heads over a club-related issue. "You're doing my club wrong!"

SFs can be too pushy and vindictive for my tastes; likewise I guess I can be a bit too fond of pushing the envelope on my take on social convention for them. Similarly I can disagree with the way the NTs throw around "evidence" and seemingly jump to unreasoned conclusions; the flipside of which is likely their being frustrated with how much time Alphas enjoy tossing theory back and forth for interest and refinement's sake.

Pretty cool how you identify the problem as one of misrepresentation and then cap your post by perpetuating the same.

[Suz]

Alpha - friendly, delightful people for the most part but tend to like being too kinky (in conversation) for my tastes, even if they're very sexually conservative, they still constantly bring up sexual topics and make overtly sexual references and jokes--seems to always be on their mind. And of course the occasional Fe/Ti disconnect from my Fi/Te.

Well maybe it's your fault for being uncomfortable talking about sex.

I'm not uncomfortable talking about sex. I just think that constantly bringing it up in conversation and the very openly sexual humor is off-putting to me. I see it as base, pointless, disrespectful to the act of sex (which to me is a sacred, meaningful thing). In my post I mostly wanted to comment on the general trends i've observed among people of various quadras here on the forum. I do think, while there are exceptions of course, that quadra/sociotype does come into play with respect to this.

My best friend's ESTp and INFp parents are very domestic, well-mannered, industrious people. They're also both sp/sx, which probably pays a bigger part in all of this.

I never said betas aren't well mannered or industrious or domestic. In saying i find them weird, scary, etc, i'm referring to how they make me feel here on the forum, their tastes as shared on the forum, how i perceive their behavior here. This is a place where people anonymously air out the thoughts occurring deep in their minds, and perhaps not ones they would share with you in everyday platonic, psychologically distant interactions.

fwiw I make jokes like that on occasion too. Plus most of the politics/economy/government discussions I see from Gammas are from the NTs, almost nothing from the SFs from what I've seen.

The key words here being "on occasion".

And true re: gamma NTs, since there are hardly any gamma SFs on the forum....

Eh, I've known 'boring' people of all quadras. I can't help but think it's more related to instinct stacking than anything, which seems to be the basis upon which most people get along in the first place as far as I'm concerned.

Galen, i think you over-rely on instinct stacking a bit too much, and undervalue the socionic contributions to intertype interactions. I think both are at play and are not mutually exclusive. Like i stated above, my post describes observations i've made among people of particular sociotypes/quadras here on the forum, where people's types are generally known. The trends hold true, in my view. Obviously not strictly, but the general trends are there imo.

[Creepy-Snaps]

The types in delta quadra are often portrayed as the least sociable and least ambitious.

I would strongly disagree with the least ambitious part. I am very ambitious, and I know many other Deltas who are incredibly hardworking, wanting to get ahead, moreso than other quadras who just want to socialize and live in the moment. However, I would generally agree with the least sociable part.

And like others said, whether it being seen as the 'last' quadra in order, or simply because we value both Si and Fi, so are not overtly confrontational or expressive, I can understand how others view us as boring. BUT............. WHO CARES? Since when did we start caring what the haters say, when we're focusing on pursuing our goals?

I mean, we perceive other quadras differently as well, but it's all just stereotypes being thrown on top of stereotypes. It doesn't really matter how we are perceived, only if it affects what we do.

And I feel anyone wise enough to know better than to stereotype, won't, and those who continue to do so, their opinion really doesn't matter. So, yeah, I'll even go ahead and tell you we're boring, think of us whatever you want, lol it doesn't matter. We don't care.

[Absurd]

I'm so ambitious I eat the bottle after drinking. That's how ambitious I am.

[Aiss]

I'm so ambitious I eat the bottle after drinking. That's how ambitious I am.

[Absurd]

I'm so ambitious I eat the bottle after drinking. That's how ambitious I am.

Mmmm

Welcome back Aiss.

[pianosinger]

When it's just me, my husband (ILI), FIL (SLI) and MIL (EII) together for a long period of time, it's really...nice. Pretty low-key energy-wise, with occasional bursts of activity (mostly centered around mealtime, or something work-related-- I include my children in the "work-related" category). It's very comfortable for the most part, except for when my MIL and FIL start one of their passive-aggressive "fights."

My husband and FIL and I especially can get into some pretty good conversations-- usually with FIL providing the "hub." MY MIL is more constantly active than the rest of us, doesn't typically sit or lay down much during the day unless she's just taken one of her medications that makes her drowsy. Sometimes the rest of us will be lounging around visiting in the living room, while MIL putters around the kitchen occasionally joining in the conversation. If it's just me and my MIL, I'll putter around with her while we visit together.

If it's me with my MIL, conversation tends towards children/child-rearing/child development, psychology/sociology, that sort of thing. We have a lot of common interests/concerns there.

Me with my FIL, it's all over the place, really. He'll often bring some idea to me that he's had, and lay it out for me in detail; then I enjoy giving him my own input, which seems helpful/appreciated by him. We also talk about health/nutrition, and he respects my knowledge in that area while also bringing things to my attention that I hadn't realized/thought about.

FIL and my husband talk politics a lot, which I listen to with interest but seldom join in unless I really think I have something constructive to add-- usually something having to do with the more ethical/social side of the issue, as both my husband and FIL are less-concerned/attuned to the more "human" side of things.

Once in a while we'll all get together and play a game, like Rummikub.

VERY Delta atmosphere. Poor hubs is the only "odd one out," being Gamma. But when he gets tired of being with the rest of us, he just goes downstairs and watches some sci-fi show on the Internet or plays a video game, or works on one of his ongoing fantasy projects.

May all sound pretty boring to some, but I like it. Though I also do enjoy the occasional Alpha/Beta interaction to shake things up, particularly when it comes to acting/theatre; *sigh* I miss performing.

[pianosinger]

and I know many other Deltas who are incredibly hardworking, wanting to get ahead, moreso than other quadras who just want to socialize and live in the moment.

I would think Deltas are more likely to work hard because we A. really believe in the value of what we're doing; or B. want to earn more money to more fully enjoy life. Pure ambition has nothing to do with it.

[Codie]

when it comes to acting/theatre; *sigh* I miss performing.

You seriously look like my aunt (ENFp) in your pic, she gave up acting/ theatre when she had her first son. She sees alot of people she used to go to stage school with on tv now. We'll be watching a program and she'll sometimes point someone out and say I made out with him, those were the days.

[Suz]

LSEs are EXTREMELY ambitious people ime.

Next up (among the deltas) are IEEs (sometimes, in spurts), but a far far second.

LSEs probably blow every other type out of the water as far as ambition goes. I mean obviously not ALL LSEs but the LSEs i know are invariably extremely ambitious.

[ashlesha]

one of the cool things about not typing yourself is not feeling like you're being held accountable for the themes or behaviors of the imaginary groups called typed or quadras. i recommend it.

[pianosinger]

when it comes to acting/theatre; *sigh* I miss performing.

You seriously look like my aunt (ENFp) in your pic, she gave up acting/ theatre when she had her first son. She sees alot of people she used to go to stage school with on tv now. We'll be watching a program and she'll sometimes point someone out and say I made out with him, those were the days.

Haha, well I never made out with anybody lol. I recently went back to my hometown and had the opportunity to see an old friend perform in the lead role of Guys and Dolls with the community theatre organization down there. Brought back a lot of memories, and it really makes me want to get involved with the theatre company up here. I am so swamped with responsibilities already (two kids and one on the way!), but someday I will get back into it-- and bring my kids along for the ride when they're old enough.

When my husband and I first moved up here, I actually talked him into trying out for Beauty and the Beast with me (I was expecting my first at the time), but then we had already committed to being in the community choir and rehearsals were on the same night, so I had to give up my dream of playing Mrs. Potts lol.

[Nico1e]

White People - YouTube

That guy's great with his body language and mannerisms - I laughed at the 'different ways of walking.'

'Blink, mutherfucker, blink!' (1:47)

[Nico1e]

I've seen Deltas associated with themes of 'surviving the collapse of society,' which isn't the same as 'society has stagnated and the Deltas just sit there living their stagnant lives in a stagnant world.' Not all Deltas are necessarily interested in this; if the Ichazo's instinctual subtypes exist then it might be associated with the self-pres subtype (which I call myself).

The 'surviving after society collapses' fantasy isn't really like 'sweeping the streets and enjoying it,' not at all. It's like wishing that all this stagnation would crumble so that we could have things our way for once, because we don't like fighting, and we don't want to go into the streets and riot loudly. But we really want things to change. (I say 'we,' but I mean, anyone who's interested in surviving the collapse of society, but who, at the same time, doesn't want to be a revolutionary who goes around assassinating politicians or whatever.)

I think quadra progression descriptions are partially to blame for this. They commonly portray Alpha as the origin of all progress and innovation and new ideas, while Delta is inevitably associated with stagnation in society. Alpha is thus the rising sun of the socion and that sun falls with Delta whose job appears to be sweeping the streets in repetitive motions after the other three quadra get done (and enjoying it!). This story sounds rather one-sided and there have been attempts at describing this progression in reverse, but somehow even in descriptions of the reverse process Delta still ends up being the epicentre of the exciting "well nothing is happening here". There is indeed a second wave that is lashing in the opposite direction that originates with Ne-Fi rather than Ne-Ti and Deltas are at the very forefront of this wave. May be somebody from Delta can investigate this and see if quadra progression descriptions can be improved upon, as right now the story seems to be incomplete where Delta's role indeed sounds dull and inconsequential.

[ashlesha]

orrr you could just mentally rearrange the information and shift perspectives around and interpret socionics in such away that you are the benchmark that the imaginary group you associate with is held accountable to.

i guess thats the other option.

[Absurd]

one of the cool things about not typing yourself is not feeling like you're being held accountable for the themes or behaviors of the imaginary groups called typed or quadras. i recommend it.

You don't have to, you can always say you disagree with it keeping your self typing intact, your vote counts more when it is cast, so don't hesitate.

Who knows, maybe, you actually do have a backing, and you're not alone.

As for Aiss, where have you been ?

[Absurd]

personally i'm quite ignorant.

Truest thing you've ever uttered.

She types Spock SLE. Come on, she can't be that bad.

[Absurd]

She types Spock SLE. Come on, she can't be that bad.

silly
oh, i should really be polite to monkey though, and thankful to monkey's sackfuls of knowledge.
monkey is so much fun.

I can wait for another typing session, this time with lots and lots of members from you.

This coming from a very very nice LSE should break the ice.

[Nico1e]

one of the cool things about not typing yourself is not feeling like you're being held accountable for the themes or behaviors of the imaginary groups called typed or quadras. i recommend it.

You don't have to, you can always say you disagree with it keeping your self typing intact, your vote counts more when it is cast, so don't hesitate.

Who knows, maybe, you actually do have a backing, and you're not alone.

As for Aiss, where have you been ?

Let's imagine that you found behaviors you disliked, in every single one of the quadras. You wouldn't want to be labeled as a member of a quadra because other members do things you don't like. But as you said, you can turn it around and view yourself as the standard by which others in the quadra should be measured. There is such a thing as being more mature or more developed somehow than other members of the type/quadra that you choose. If you joined a particular quadra, you would sort of raise up everyone else along with you. You might even be able to influence them by telling them not to do the things you don't like, or encouraging them to do the things that you think they should be doing more of.

.... a revolutionary who goes around assassinating politicians or whatever.)

the word you're looking for is not 'revolutionary'. i think some people made some laws. some of these laws refer to things like assassinations, killing, murder, crimes etc etc. anyway, i don't know much at all about these things, personally i'm quite ignorant. thing is, some other people have used words like 'criminal' etc etc. some smart people will prolly come to my aid here and sorta talk in my place..or sth

Revolutionaries are not necessarily murderers. And yeah, there are laws having to do with assassinating the leaders of countries, and I don't know much about those laws either. I do know that there's a bit of hypocrisy where it's forbidden to assassinate some leader of a country, but it's 'okay' for a country to go to war against another country and kill lots and lots of innocent civilians and destroy buildings and infrastructure that has nothing to do with whatever they are fighting about. Assassinating the leaders would actually be better than killing the thousands of civilians, but whatever, they're not going to listen to *my* opinion.

[InkStrider]

LSEs are EXTREMELY ambitious people ime.

Next up (among the deltas) are IEEs (sometimes, in spurts), but a far far second.

LSEs probably blow every other type out of the water as far as ambition goes. I mean obviously not ALL LSEs but the LSEs i know are invariably extremely ambitious.

Interesting. Why do you place SLEs and LIEs behind LSEs? These two extroverts sound pretty ambitious as a type.

one of the cool things about not typing yourself is not feeling like you're being held accountable for the themes or behaviors of the imaginary groups called typed or quadras. i recommend it.

I find it wise to separate theory from application. You can type yourself and others as a general "type", and even delve into it as a theoretical subject of interest, as long as you never allow it to dictate who you are, what you can do, and what you are capable of doing and becoming. It becomes very restrictive otherwise.

[Suz]

LSEs are EXTREMELY ambitious people ime.

Next up (among the deltas) are IEEs (sometimes, in spurts), but a far far second.

LSEs probably blow every other type out of the water as far as ambition goes. I mean obviously not ALL LSEs but the LSEs i know are invariably extremely ambitious.

Interesting. Why do you place SLEs and LIEs behind LSEs? These two extroverts sound pretty ambitious as a type.

Oh true LIEs are pretty ambitious too. I guess they're tied with LSEs. I just feel like LSEs are more about setting their ambitions into action perhaps, but tbh i dont know the LIE type too well.

SLEs... i often feel that yes maybe they're ambitious but they dont mind doing it at others' expense, and that makes me think that they're not capable of getting ahead on their own merits. But ultimately nobody can really get too far behaving that way, because pissing off people does not go over too well at some point. But yes true, SLEs are ambitious too.

I actually was trying to comment mostly on delta quadra ambitiousness, and maybe went into a little bit of hyperbole.

[Cuddly McFluffles]

There are people who think that boring means not wanting to go out at night to a club/bar where you have physically uncomfortable conversations and end up spending a lot of money on drinks... I don't care if someone would call me boring. I just do my own thing, and enjoy it.

Yeah. My Beta Extrotim brother thinks I'm boring because I like to sit around and read. Whatever. Oddly enough, the LSI doesn't seem to think the same.

I understand how Delta could be seen as boring. Look at our descriptions: hard-working, responsible world-savers (through the power of looooooove) or just chilling in the backyard on a cool night. Hell, LSEs sound boring to me, and they're my type's dual.

[Cat King Cole]

or just chilling in the backyard on a cool night.

Help me out here guys, how is this boring again?

Hell, LSEs sound boring to me, and they're my type's dual.

One word: Ryu.

[Cuddly McFluffles]

Ooh, the quote function has been improved. Bless the site staff.

or just chilling in the backyard on a cool night.

Help me out here guys, how is this boring again?

Some people might think it is.

Hell, LSEs sound boring to me, and they're my type's dual.

One word: Ryu.

I am well-acquainted with Ryu. What exactly are you getting at?

Also:

If you're a delta, you are actually attracted to somebody who seems 'boring.' It's like there's some kind of energy just beneath the surface.

Not for me. I want "snap", energy between myself and the person. Believe me, I know an attractive, adorable man who I wouldn't date because while we had stuff in common, we had no chemistry whatsoever. We'd sit there and talk, and there would be awkward pauses, even online. I actually found myself wondering if he had a personality. I inadvertently ignored him one time when a far more interesting acquaintance sat at the table with us; I was busy conversing with that guy. (I miss him, darnit.)

[SupaClassy]

Reading this post, this is what I'm getting:







Yeah. I can deal with that.

[FDG]

LSEs are extremely hard-working and perfectionistic, so they're ambitious in whatever field they choose. However, given that they're reasonable (Si) types, they don't necessarily want to choose a hypercompetitive and socially glamorous one, which is something that say SLEs tend to do.

[Cat King Cole]

^This.

[InkStrider]

I actually was trying to comment mostly on delta quadra ambitiousness, and maybe went into a little bit of hyperbole.

Not at all. A little hyperbole used effectively does help in getting points across.

LSEs are extremely hard-working and perfectionistic, so they're ambitious in whatever field they choose. However, given that they're reasonable (Si) types, they don't necessarily want to choose a hypercompetitive and socially glamorous one, which is something that say SLEs tend to do.

Make sense.

[DirectorAbbie]

LSEs are extremely hard-working and perfectionistic, so they're ambitious in whatever field they choose. However, given that they're reasonable (Si) types, they don't necessarily want to choose a hypercompetitive and socially glamorous one, which is something that say SLEs tend to do.

Yup.

Sometimes my IEE dad gets the idea that he should work someplace else. I'm like, "That's a stupid idea. You're finally proficient where you are, and you want to start over again?"

[717495]

I'm boring in the "not-Se" way, but interesting in the "omg he's Ne" way. Nah not really, I'm pretty much boring all around, but I can be alright around the right people.

Anyway, I dislike most quadra stereotypes because they're not real, they're just based off of incomplete observations and mistypings. I shall destroy. "Hard-working" for example. I know hard-working people of all types, doesn't matter if they're irrational or Ti dominant, Te-PoLR, whatever. I actually know many hard-working Te-PoLRs. My ENFj dad is one of the most hard working people there are, but because of temperament he is pretty energetic, so I think introverts will often not have an upper hand here, however you still see introverts of any type being more hard-working than other extroverts. In the end we just talk perhaps 80% stereotype on here, where many are false, and the other time we make observations and hopefully take them with a grain of salt.