Is Enneagram theory completely separate from Socionics?

[sar]

Are ennegram types completely separate from socionics? or...not? Thanks!

[noid]

Some say thats 2 totally different system, some say its a bit related to socionic or mbti, and imo, they are.
The problem is that you can read various unrelated description for one type, but the pattern I see is :

1 : , but ISTJ seem to correspond too
2 :
3 :
4 : and perhaps , althought I would more say 5w4 or 5w6 or something like that
5 :
6 :
7 :
8 :
9 : ( aspirationnal is obvious in some description)

[Cat King Cole]

Some say thats 2 totally different system, some say its a bit related to socionic or mbti, and imo, they are.
The problem is that you can read various unrelated description for one type, but the pattern I see is :

1 : , but ISTJ seem to correspond too
2 :
3 :
4 : and perhaps , althought I would more say 5w4 or 5w6 or something like that
5 :
6 :
7 :
8 :
9 : ( aspirationnal is obvious in some description)

I'd revise this somewhat.

1: logic + rationality.
2:
3: not FP
4:
5: logic + introtim
6: dominance, intuition? based on possible mistypes in the community. possibly also generic childhood abuse type.
7: extratim + irrational
8: extratim + sensing
9: judicious + introtim

withdrawn types are by definition introtim. aggressive types are by definition extratim. complaint does not have a direct socionics equivalent.

[Raver]

Some say thats 2 totally different system, some say its a bit related to socionic or mbti, and imo, they are.
The problem is that you can read various unrelated description for one type, but the pattern I see is :

1 : , but ISTJ seem to correspond too
2 :
3 :
4 : and perhaps , althought I would more say 5w4 or 5w6 or something like that
5 :
6 :
7 :
8 :
9 : ( aspirationnal is obvious in some description)

I'd revise this somewhat.

1: logic + rationality.
2:
3: not FP
4:
5: logic + introtim
6: dominance, intuition? based on possible mistypes in the community. possibly also generic childhood abuse type.
7: extratim + irrational
8: extratim + sensing
9: judicious + introtim

withdrawn types are by definition introtim. aggressive types are by definition extratim. complaint does not have a direct socionics equivalent.

I like these Cat, I'm sure those listed functions and types are more likely to correspond to those Enneagram types. However, I'm sure you will find several exceptions to those. IMO, Socionics does correspond to Enneagram, but only to a limited extent. This is why you'll find very different types with the same Enneagrams.

[Cat King Cole]

I like these Cat, I'm sure those listed functions and types are more likely to correspond to those Enneagram types. However, I'm sure you will find several exceptions to those. IMO, Socionics does correspond to Enneagram, but only to a limited extent. This is why you'll find very different types with the same Enneagrams.

I'm presently of the opinion that Withdrawn Extrotims and Aggressive Introtims are paradoxical notions, and thus completely impossible. Other than that, yeah, fair game.

[Raver]

I like these Cat, I'm sure those listed functions and types are more likely to correspond to those Enneagram types. However, I'm sure you will find several exceptions to those. IMO, Socionics does correspond to Enneagram, but only to a limited extent. This is why you'll find very different types with the same Enneagrams.

I'm presently of the opinion that Withdrawn Extrotims and Aggressive Introtims are paradoxical notions, and thus completely impossible. Other than that, yeah, fair game.

I fit into the Withdrawn Extratim label quite well IRL. I also know introverts that can be very aggressive and social. It is paradoxical if you think the reasons they exist is because of Socionics. However, I think Introverted Extratims and Extraverted Introtims are that way as a result of factors unrelated to Socionics imo.

[Bardia]

Two completely different systems. People here like to correlate them together imperfectly.

[Cat King Cole]

These correlations blow chunks of sloppy ass.

Yeah. As it stands the enneagram isn't tied to any measurable psychology. Rather than playing around with neurotransmitters, they'd be better served by rising above the pseudoscience of certainty and correlating with what we know of Big 5.

[mfckr]

These correlations blow chunks of sloppy ass.

Yeah. As it stands the enneagram isn't tied to any measurable psychology. Rather than playing around with neurotransmitters, they'd be better served by rising above the pseudoscience of certainty and correlating with what we know of Big 5.

It's been done. See full report.

I haven't read this yet, but there might be some good ideas in there for how to do the same with socionics.

[Cat King Cole]

Interesting. I'll read through this while sober and more able to adequately apply scepticism to the research and researchers.

[GuavaDrunk]

Two totally different systems. The Enneagram is about types of deeply-ingrained defense mechanisms. Socionics is about cognition methods, or filters. There may be correlations due to cognition type biasing people towards certain reactions for eg, but direct correspondences are highly unlikely.

[somavision]

Yeah. As it stands the enneagram isn't tied to any measurable psychology. Rather than playing around with neurotransmitters, they'd be better served by rising above the pseudoscience of certainty and correlating with what we know of Big 5.

It's been done. See full report.

I haven't read this yet, but there might be some good ideas in there for how to do the same with socionics.

This is very interesting