This is better

[Timmy]

Lol why is Jinxi banned? Y'all couldn't handle the angst?!

Jinxi asked for a ban so that he would be able to focus on studying for his finals.

He'll be back.

[EyeSeeCold]

10 bucks this is still Jinxi.
I remember a trolling "drugsandpizza"

@Mr.Poli

Jung is the conceptual basis/foundation to all of this. MBTI focuses on more apparent and extreme representations of the types (sidestepping Jungian concepts), while socionics attempts to put face to Jung by defining concepts with actual descriptions and explanations. Socionics is at its core Jung. So Ashton is not at all misleading anyone.

Each person has a primary mindset or mode of operation that exists in either the extroverted or introverted domains, of which two extroverted or introverted functions coexist. The dual-seeking and creative both provide cognitive relief from the HA and leading, as per Jung.

Where you might be having confusion is in how the ID is manifested. This is what socionics seems to want to explain apart from Jung because Jung makes it clear that conceptually an introverted and extroverted representation of a particular function can not exist at the same time and are pronounced in such a way that they truly oppose or negate one another (Jungian subjective/objective <-> passionate/dispassionate).

Generally speaking, the ignoring completely opposes the leading (main part of the psyche) and can only be used if the leading/dual-seeking are not being used. To easily switch from two very different mindsets is not considered a healthy occurrence (split personality). And so the ignoring becomes a limited and ignored function, for the most part.

The demonstrative also completely opposes the creative. To use the demonstrative function, the relief of the creative (to the HA) can not be used. The demonstrative is essentially the Role-function of the HA, just as there is a Role-function for the leading in the superego.

This is where it starts to get confusing though because if we start to talk about the ID manifesting how do we go about it? Conceptually we can start with Jung and notice the extroverted or introverted set of P and J functions being displayed at a given time and take note that there is no set of 'relief' functions associated with them as there is with the primary psyche. So, as an example relating to this video, an IEE can display the following:

ignoring+creative (INTp without Te-Se relief)
leading+demonstrative (ENTp without Ti relief)
creative+dual-seeking (exerting cognitive relief of the primary psyche)
dual-seeking+creative (unconscious experience that is relieving by aiding against neurosis of the leading)

I would add in a couple following labels to that too.
(instinctual defense): ignoring+creative (INTp without Te-Se relief)
(PoLR defense): leading+demonstrative (ENTp without Ti relief)
(Mirror Relief): creative+dual-seeking (exerting cognitive relief of the primary psyche)
(Neurosis Relief): dual-seeking+creative (unconscious experience that is relieving by aiding against neurosis of the leading)

What this implies though is that the creative function of a type won't necessarily be that apparent or even underutilized in comparison to the HA, just as the demonstrative and role can be absent. So the idea of functions being weak or strong really doesn't make any consistent sense to talk about, but perhaps just a more general sense and each personality type is really defined foremost by whether or not they display a particular leading+HA makeup with relief functions (creative+Dual-Seeking) that everything else follows from.

[Vocaloid]

10 bucks this is still Jinxi.
I remember a trolling "drugsandpizza"

Blah, Jinxi doesn't write that way.

[Korpsy Knievel]

10 bucks this is still Jinxi.
I remember a trolling "drugsandpizza"

fail.

[Timmy]

10 bucks this is still Jinxi.
I remember a trolling "drugsandpizza"

Mixing up jinxi and drugsandsoda amounts to a fail. Icehot, you can't possibly be serious.

[golden]

Well, I would be interested in how you act, Vocaloid, when you aren't putting on a defensive front.

We have people saying that they see Fe in your persona. What I saw there was not particularly Fe ego-ish to me, because imo Fe is not essentially about--no offense!--those kinds of random jumps and associations coming from all over the place. (Now, that's just my opinion--anyone here, feel free to assert something different, because I'd be interested to hear it. What EIEs engage in wacky, random behavior of that kind? Examples?)

What you did in that video with Jinxi looks like an impersonation of Fe, maybe. And I also think that if someone thinks it looks like EIE, there might be a stereotype out there of what EIE actually is like. Again, just imo.

And I'm sorry that you were hurt by some people's reactions, possibly including mine. As you said, these are some behaviors you engage in for self-protection; that means that if someone here reacted to it negatively, it's not the REAL you they reacted to, right?

Here's how I see it: our "natural" selves might rub some people the wrong way, but some people will respond positively, too, and from the authentic self we can forge real bonds with the people who appreciate us. But a false front will rub some people the wrong way AND make it difficult to connect in a meaningful way with the people who will best understand and accept us. I'm not saying that's always easy, but it's been true for me. I just exited a phase of my life in which I didn't feel safe exposing my "true" self, but now I'm finding that with many of those same people I avoided expressing my truth with, I now can. They didn't change, but I did. /2 unwanted cents.

[woofwoofl]

This is true, though just wanted to give you my opinion nonetheless. I've been here and have developed in depth multiple angles on various typing systems simultaneously. That seems to be the only way to go about it, so that I'm not missing any important cues in personality types. Maybe one day I can think that one way of seeing things is the most noteworthy, but right now there's not enough evidence.

I don't mean for Gamma quadra to all pounce on you at once, but this sounds exactly like Holographic-Panoramic cognition, which IEEs do... I still maintain that you're a shy IEE in Delta (nothing wrong with that at all, IEEs are awesome), and I think you'll feel a lot better once you go IEE

[717495]

Cognitive styles are so last year.

[Vocaloid]

Well, I would be interested in how you act, Vocaloid, when you aren't putting on a defensive front.

We have people saying that they see Fe in your persona. What I saw there was not particularly Fe ego-ish to me, because imo Fe is not essentially about--no offense!--those kinds of random jumps and associations coming from all over the place. (Now, that's just my opinion--anyone here, feel free to assert something different, because I'd be interested to hear it. What EIEs engage in wacky, random behavior of that kind? Examples?)

What you did in that video with Jinxi looks like an impersonation of Fe, maybe. And I also think that if someone thinks it looks like EIE, there might be a stereotype out there of what EIE actually is like. Again, just imo.

And I'm sorry that you were hurt by some people's reactions, possibly including mine. As you said, these are some behaviors you engage in for self-protection; that means that if someone here reacted to it negatively, it's not the REAL you they reacted to, right?

Here's how I see it: our "natural" selves might rub some people the wrong way, but some people will respond positively, too, and from the authentic self we can forge real bonds with the people who appreciate us. But a false front will rub some people the wrong way AND make it difficult to connect in a meaningful way with the people who will best understand and accept us. I'm not saying that's always easy, but it's been true for me. I just exited a phase of my life in which I didn't feel safe exposing my "true" self, but now I'm finding that with many of those same people I avoided expressing my truth with, I now can. They didn't change, but I did. /2 unwanted cents.

Uh, cool. Thanks for the apology. Blah, me needs to lighten up. I am not a really interesting person .

[golden]

Uh, cool. Thanks for the apology. Blah, me needs to lighten up. I am not a really interesting person .

Hope you know that's not true!

[Vocaloid]

I'm skeptical of it. That typing has been suggested of me a number of times, and appears to make sense. I've always related a lot to Fe-PoLR. But knowing me, I'll likely take it back.

Also another type you might want to think about is LSI, not that I have much reason for it specifically, but mainly because I've seen a lot of LSIs type as INTJ in MBTI, the types seems to be more connected.

Oiiii! Hell-o.... So why do you think he's LSI? He comes off to me as INTp...definitely using Fe..and Ti.
Is there any reasoning behind this?

[silke]

Jinxi is actually using plenty of Fe in that video. He makes several comments like "They can't see your painting", "this is what we're going to see here", "they can't understand french" "she liked me? that's surprising". He is in fact very much in tune with the audience and he is in tune cuz of Fe. His sister looks like an introverted Fi-user to me EII.

... She comes across as having the natural desire to emote and express her moods out in the open, in the few videos I've watched, so I can already tell she's more in common with other Fe types ...

Acting out your own moods is Fi not Fe. Fe lets you read and adapt to moods of other people rather than yourself.

I'm skeptical of it. That typing has been suggested of me a number of times, and appears to make sense. I've always related a lot to Fe-PoLR. But knowing me, I'll likely take it back.

You might have Fe and Fi confused. From the few times I've seen you in chat you seemed Alpha (Fi-PoLR/Role instead of Fe).

[Cuddly McFluffles]

Oiiii! Hell-o.... So why do you think he's LSI? He comes off to me as INTp...definitely using Fe..and Ti.
Is there any reasoning behind this?

ILIs don't use Fe.

His sister looks like an introverted Fi-user to me EII.

How, pray tell, does she strike you as Fi-IJ?

[silke]

How, pray tell, does she strike you as Fi-IJ?

watch these videos of INFPs (INFP is Fi-Ne in MBTI) and notice the similarities with his sister






in this video you can see two girls IEI and EII quasi-identicals talking together (the EII girl mentions this "monotonal wall" about IEIs)

[Cuddly McFluffles]

Please explain to me, using socionics, why you think she's EII. Why do you think she's Fi dominant? How do you reconcile her energy with IJ? These are what I am looking for, not links to videos from a separate theory.

[silke]

That's Myers Briggs. Please explain to me, using socionics, why you think she's EII.

you can type those girls with socio-types, two girls at the top are EII and ones on the bottom are EII and IEI - their EII girls' behavior matches the socionics profile for Fi-Ne http://www.wikisocion.org/en/index.php?title=INFJ & http://www.wikisocion.org/en/index.p...ale_and_female and descriptions of IEs here http://www.socionics.us/works/semantics.shtml

... modest, tactful and delicate ... most frequently he has an asthenic build. He has a quiet voice, gentle view, affectionate smile and an elevated system of thoughts ... loves to have long hair, and sometimes ties it in a tail .. does not give clothing adequate consideration, considering that this is not the main point of life. .... He has a gift for understanding people. He is sympathetic ... they are more greatly occupied by the personal life of classmates, which they often quietly observe from the side, and dreamily think about them, about everything that occurs. Their experiences on this (yes even on other occasions) they describe in verses or prose, to which they regularly devote some time. Their tendency toward the humanities most frequently manifests with the selection of their institute ... Light carelessness and quiet cheerfulness - thus it is possible to briefly describe his style of contact.

and so on, there are lots of similarities

[FDG]

Her sister is obviously extraverted, siuntal please stop, it's embarassing.

[silke]

Her sister is obviously extraverted, siuntal please stop, it's embarassing.

How so? That she is talking to the camera doesn't mean she is extraverted.

Would you label the two girls in the top two videos extraverts as well?

[Cuddly McFluffles]

Light carelessness and quiet cheerfulness - thus it is possible to briefly describe his style of contact.

Where in that video are you seeing quiet?

[silke]

Where in that video are you seeing quiet?

she has stated herself that she is not really like that if you have read the entire thread and her replies

[glam]

Cognitive styles are so last year.

rofl

[717495]

Acting out your own moods is Fi not Fe. Fe lets you read and adapt to moods of other people rather than yourself.


You might have Fe and Fi confused. From the few times I've seen you in chat you seemed Alpha (Fi-PoLR/Role instead of Fe).

I no longer need a reinvention of Socionics. Cancel all other incoming and pending orders.

[ashlesha]

Jinxi is actually using plenty of Fe in that video. He makes several comments like "They can't see your painting", "this is what we're going to see here", "they can't understand french" "she liked me? that's surprising". He is in fact very much in tune with the audience and he is in tune cuz of Fe. His sister looks like an introverted Fi-user to me EII.

i dont see why those statements are Fe and not Te. they basically mean what they mean. (i think they could be Fe if thats how they were intended, but i'm curious for something i can see.) the "she liked me?" thing doesnt strike me as either, i could see an interpretation of Fi superid there.

[silke]

i dont see why those statements are Fe and not Te. they basically mean what they mean. (i think they could be Fe if thats how they were intended, but i'm curious for something i can see.) the "she liked me?" thing doesnt strike me as either, i could see an interpretation of Fi superid there.

Remember some time ago we were discussing Fe/Fi differences in chat and I said Fe is tracking instances of acceptance/rejection between people? This is essentially what Jinxi is doing in this video. He is tracking instances of acceptance/rejection between his sister and the audience, telling her how to behave to make it more acceptable to people who will be listening to the vid, to not speak French, to be more serious, etc. Somebody has commented in chat that Fi is same and I have replied that Fi does this between yourself and another person while Fe detects this happening between other persons. Jinxi doesn't use Fi and thus he is surprised that this particular person likes him - he cannot easily detect acceptance/rejection between himself and another person meanwhile he is fully capable of doing this for his sister and the audience of this video as a Fe user should.

[FDG]

Siuntal you're embarassing, you're assigning functions to human behaviors which are probably shared with reptiles. Just like we were doing with "small talk".

How so? That she is talking to the camera doesn't mean she is extraverted.

Would you label the two girls in the top two videos extraverts as well?

- high energy
- outer-directed style
- very emotive in a "new" setting
- really any other potential E dichotomy

but I don't know why I'm wasting time with you.

[ashlesha]

Remember some time ago we were discussing Fe/Fi differences in chat and I said Fe is tracking instances of acceptance/rejection between people? This is essentially what Jinxi is doing in this video. He is tracking instances of acceptance/rejection between his sister and the audience, telling her how to behave to make it more acceptable to people who will be listening to the vid, to not speak French, to be more serious, etc. Somebody has commented in chat that Fi is same and I have replied that Fi does this between yourself and another person while Fe detects this happening between other persons. Jinxi doesn't use Fi and thus he is surprised that this particular person likes him - he cannot easily detect acceptance/rejection between himself and another person meanwhile he is fully capable of doing this for his sister and the audience of this video as a Fe user should.

i guess i can see how his comments could have been interpreted as Fe if he was trying to make his sister "more acceptable to the audience" or he could have been trying to get her to focus on what he wanted to talk about along with giving her a little shit, which is what i'm more inclined to think. aren't Fe types more subtle about it though? like instead of bluntly giving direction, wouldn't you find a way to steer the emotional atmosphere in an indirect way?

also i'm not sure if you're into model a or not but according to that theory if you're strong in Fe you are also strong in Fi and vice versa and based on that i'm not sure how your distinction would work.

[Marie84]

Remember some time ago we were discussing Fe/Fi differences in chat and I said Fe is tracking instances of acceptance/rejection between people? This is essentially what Jinxi is doing in this video. He is tracking instances of acceptance/rejection between his sister and the audience, telling her how to behave to make it more acceptable to people who will be listening to the vid, to not speak French, to be more serious, etc. Somebody has commented in chat that Fi is same and I have replied that Fi does this between yourself and another person while Fe detects this happening between other persons. Jinxi doesn't use Fi and thus he is surprised that this particular person likes him - he cannot easily detect acceptance/rejection between himself and another person meanwhile he is fully capable of doing this for his sister and the audience of this video as a Fe user should.

This is utterly inaccurate, Fe is not focused on sentiments between people, it's about identifying and/or conveying emotional processes in people. That's not to say that ones devoid of the other, but what you're describing sounds more like an external use of Fi rather than Fe

Jinxi doesn't use Fi and thus he is surprised that this particular person likes him

For a case of Jinxi being IEI this really doesn't make sense, since he'd have the ability to detect those relational sentiments with his Fi demonstrative and picking-up on Fe emotive signs, whereas this sounds more like weak ethics in general

[silke]

i guess i can see how his comments could have been interpreted as Fe if he was trying to make his sister "more acceptable to the audience" or he could have been trying to get her to focus on what he wanted to talk about along with giving her a little shit, which is what i'm more inclined to think. aren't Fe types more subtle about it though? like instead of bluntly giving direction, wouldn't you find a way to steer the emotional atmosphere in an indirect way?

There is a high degree of familiarity between them (at least that's what my Fe tells me) so I personally don't find it strange that they are rather direct with each other. How subtle a Fe user is really depends on the situation really. I've been in situations for example where being direct was actually welcomed and desired by the other person, so I didn't feel bad for being more straightforward than usual.

also i'm not sure if you're into model a or not but according to that theory if you're strong in Fe you are also strong in Fi and vice versa and based on that i'm not sure how your distinction would work.

Not in my experience. I've tried simulating Fi just to see what it would be like but it just felt so unnatural that I have to shortly stop every time. The description of Fi was easiest for me to understand and I feel that I can use it sporadically, but its use as demonstrative element is apparently vastly different from creative IE. Whatever information it metabolizes I just can't see how it would be equivalent of that of creative function.

This is utterly inaccurate,

well that description was from my my POV as somebody who uses Fe as an ego function

Fe is not focused on sentiments between people, it's about identifying and/or conveying emotional processes in people.

the above just repeats the same point twice, not sure what you're trying to point out here

what you're describing sounds more like an external use of Fi rather than Fe

I guess you can call that, extraverted ethics Fe as "external use" of introverted ethics Fi.

For a case of Jinxi being IEI this really doesn't make sense, since he'd have the ability to detect those relational sentiments with his Fi demonstrative and picking-up on Fe emotive signs, whereas this sounds more like weak ethics in general

In normal everyday situations demonstrative Fi is thoroughly blocked out by Ti. Fi is assigned to be part of the unvalued block in xEIs for a reason.

[ashlesha]

sentiments and feelings are different things.

[Birdie]

Have you ever romantically loved someone?

[Birdie]

I am asking you questions to help aid me in determining your type.



And I am curious.

[Birdie]

I know you have been in a romantic relationship.


I was inquiring further, asking whether or not you were in love.

[Birdie]

Infatuated maybe. I don't know what love is, really. I'm too detached to give you an appropriate answer. I don't really understand it myself.

Thank you for putting forth the effort and being polite.

[Crispy]

I don't know what love is, really.

The Controllers (+Ti/-Te in ego, +Fe/-Fi agenda)
INTp; ENTj; ISTj; ESTp

This group works best when put in a position of chaos. It can get rid of the problems of things and make sure that nothing stands in the way of an accomplishment. This group as leaders have no remorse about getting rid of people via firing them. This group follows the rules. It knows its place in the hierarchy of things. These people organize things and make sure that things are organized and in order. This group is extremely decisive. This group tries its best to be nice and kind to people. Inside though, these type has a need to be lonely depressed and withdrawn. This group doesn’t know what happiness or love is.




SEIG HEIL
HEIL HITTA

[Birdie]

The Controllers (+Ti/-Te in ego, +Fe/-Fi agenda)
INTp; ENTj; ISTj; ESTp

This group works best when put in a position of chaos. It can get rid of the problems of things and make sure that nothing stands in the way of an accomplishment. This group as leaders have no remorse about getting rid of people via firing them. This group follows the rules. It knows its place in the hierarchy of things. These people organize things and make sure that things are organized and in order. This group is extremely decisive. This group tries its best to be nice and kind to people. Inside though, these type has a need to be lonely depressed and withdrawn. This group doesn’t know what happiness or love is.

Jinxi does not do this.



Also, may I state that I do not count any website as legitimate if there are typos ergo I am not sure how spot-on your description here may be.

[Crispy]

There's no way we can tell how hard he is trying to be nice. His gauge might already be filled by the time he logs on

However the following the rules bit doesn't seem to fit for jinxi as well as members of other mentioned types (discojoe comes to mind).

Hitta your masterpiece needs reworking quick, to the test chamber!

EDIT: Actually the following rules seems to be in workplace context where advancement based on rule following is possible (cause it mentions hierarchies right after). But maaaaaybbbbbbbeeee

[silke]

Siuntal, what's your verdict?

my verdict hasn't changed, IEI with amplified Ti, will go vote on your poll now

[rat1]

Nah he's ILI. ILI-Ni.

[The Ineffable]

Not in the mood. Too slow a tempo. Low quality stream. You sent me four preview links, what am I supposed to with previews? I need the song in its entirety. Anyway, the quality is just too bad.

:| I think the 126s one is full, not sure, I didn't buy it. Yeah quality sucks, perhaps because of it the horns sound so "celestial" .

[The Ineffable]

Beethoven, man, Beethoven.

Poor mp3's were not existing in his times, that's 100% original!