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Thread: Gothy delta?

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    Default Gothy delta?

    How in touch with the finer, darker things in life are members of delta? I can think of a few of goth ISTps(in deathrock and other bands and in real life), but what would a goth ENFp(or any other delta type) look like?

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    What CILi said.
    “Whether we fall by ambition, blood, or lust, like diamonds we are cut with our own dust.”

    Quote Originally Posted by Gilly
    You've done yourself a huge favor developmentally by mustering the balls to do something really fucking scary... in about the most vulnerable situation possible.

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    There're things much darker than goth...
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    Define "dark."
    "And above all, watch with glittering eyes the whole world around you because the greatest secrets are always hidden in the most unlikely places. Those who don't believe in magic will never find it." -Roald Dahl

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    Lisbeth Salander from the Millennium series (The Girl with the Dragon Tattoo, etc.) is a gothy SLI.

    Last edited by glam; 04-09-2011 at 10:39 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by CILi View Post
    Hell no.
    Quote Originally Posted by Parkster View Post
    What CILi said.
    what Cili and Parkster said.

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    Hahaha, I mean goth as a subculture and all of the post-punk/darkwave/whatever bands usually from the 80s. Don't have to dress that way, but any delta fans of goth music or still all "hell no's" ?

    If not, punk rock? Or any other music subcultures?

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    Quote Originally Posted by morgause View Post
    Hahaha, I mean goth as a subculture and all of the post-punk/darkwave/whatever bands usually from the 80s. Don't have to dress that way, but any delta fans of goth music or still all "hell no's" ?

    If not, punk rock? Or any other music subcultures?
    I know what you mean, because you just copy/pasted the first line from the Goth subculture article on Wikipedia. So I think you're full of BS, and have no idea what you're talking about.
    “Whether we fall by ambition, blood, or lust, like diamonds we are cut with our own dust.”

    Quote Originally Posted by Gilly
    You've done yourself a huge favor developmentally by mustering the balls to do something really fucking scary... in about the most vulnerable situation possible.

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    Quote Originally Posted by morgause View Post
    Hahaha, I mean goth as a subculture and all of the post-punk/darkwave/whatever bands usually from the 80s. Don't have to dress that way, but any delta fans of goth music or still all "hell no's" ?

    If not, punk rock? Or any other music subcultures?
    Oh, well I'm certain deltas into the goth scene exist, although I don't know any personally.
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    leave me out of this
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    Quote Originally Posted by Parkster View Post
    And you know so much about it that you had to copy/paste the first line from the Goth subculture article on Wikipedia. So I think you're full of BS.
    "The goth subculture is a contemporary subculture found in many countries."

    Definitely not what I said. Also, I never claimed to be goth, but I love that you must not have known what I was talking about since you were the one that Wiki'd it, not I, Zach Braff guy.

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    Okay, you copy/pasted parts from the first two paragraphs.

    Quote Originally Posted by morgause View Post
    Also, I never claimed to be goth, but I love that you must not have known what I was talking about since you were the one that Wiki'd it, not I, Zach Braff guy.
    Maybe I googled your post.

    And I'm sure I know more than you.
    Last edited by Park; 04-10-2011 at 12:34 AM.
    “Whether we fall by ambition, blood, or lust, like diamonds we are cut with our own dust.”

    Quote Originally Posted by Gilly
    You've done yourself a huge favor developmentally by mustering the balls to do something really fucking scary... in about the most vulnerable situation possible.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Parkster View Post
    Okay, you copy/pasted parts from the first two paragraphs.

    And I'm sure I know more than you.
    Oh, I did not!

    So, are you trying to say you're GOTHer than me?

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    that the first few posts in the thread were just so quick to say absolutely not is connected to the general reason i no longer have a type in my sig. i don't have any affinity with the goth subculture but i don't understand why people would be so quick to set limits like that...especially when concepts like delta STs being taskmasters or delta NFs being prisses aren't shot down in the same way. i don't understand why so many deltas on the forum appear to be content to be pigeonholed in a certain way (like suburbanites from the 50s or something) and its why i have trouble identifying with the delta culture on the forum even though i'm quite sure i'm delta based on functional preferences.

    anyway my response would be that its NTR. i'm curious why anyone would say otherwise?

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    Quote Originally Posted by morgause View Post
    Oh, I did not!

    So, are you trying to say you're GOTHer than me?
    I'm trying to say I'm HOTter than you.
    “Whether we fall by ambition, blood, or lust, like diamonds we are cut with our own dust.”

    Quote Originally Posted by Gilly
    You've done yourself a huge favor developmentally by mustering the balls to do something really fucking scary... in about the most vulnerable situation possible.

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    Quote Originally Posted by laghlagh View Post
    that the first few posts in the thread were just so quick to say absolutely not is connected to the general reason i no longer have a type in my sig. i don't have any affinity with the goth subculture but i don't understand why people would be so quick to set limits like that...especially when concepts like delta STs being taskmasters or delta NFs being prisses aren't shot down in the same way. i don't understand why so many deltas on the forum appear to be content to be pigeonholed in a certain way (like suburbanites from the 50s or something) and its why i have trouble identifying with the delta culture on the forum even though i'm quite sure i'm delta based on functional preferences.

    anyway my response would be that its NTR. i'm curious why anyone would say otherwise?

    Awwh, thank you for the respectful response! NTR? Do you mean, like, more an NT thing or is that an acronym I'm having trouble deciphering? I have some real life delta friends who will listen to Bauhaus and Kate Bush with me, even though she isn't goth, I know many of goths have an affinity for her, but I'm just curious about goth deltas in general today.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Parkster View Post
    I'm trying to say I'm HOTter than you.
    Yeah, well, my display pic is hotter than your display pic..

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    Quote Originally Posted by morgause View Post
    Awwh, thank you for the respectful response! NTR? Do you mean, like, more an NT thing or is that an acronym I'm having trouble deciphering? I have some real life delta friends who will listen to Bauhaus and Kate Bush with me, even though she isn't goth, I know many of goths have an affinity for her, but I'm just curious about goth deltas in general today.
    not type related i don't personally know any delta goths, but i've never typed anyone that identifed as goth, so yeah.

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    Quote Originally Posted by morgause View Post
    Yeah, well, my display pic is hotter than your display pic..
    Yo Mama so dark she scared a goth.
    “Whether we fall by ambition, blood, or lust, like diamonds we are cut with our own dust.”

    Quote Originally Posted by Gilly
    You've done yourself a huge favor developmentally by mustering the balls to do something really fucking scary... in about the most vulnerable situation possible.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Parkster View Post
    Yo Mama so dark she scared a goth.
    I am throwing away my Garden State DVD right now as we speak.

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    I am eating dark chocolate as we speak.
    “Whether we fall by ambition, blood, or lust, like diamonds we are cut with our own dust.”

    Quote Originally Posted by Gilly
    You've done yourself a huge favor developmentally by mustering the balls to do something really fucking scary... in about the most vulnerable situation possible.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Parkster View Post
    I am eating dark chocolate as we speak.
    "You gotta hear this one song (by The Cure), It'll change your life, I swear"

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    Look what I found

    Quote Originally Posted by Kristiina View Post
    ISTp is the stereotypical goth guy. I don't know if that's because so many ISTps listen to metal music or it's because goth people act like stereotypical ISTps. (gloomy, egotistical, quiet, serious, enjoying music in a Si-way, etc).
    “Whether we fall by ambition, blood, or lust, like diamonds we are cut with our own dust.”

    Quote Originally Posted by Gilly
    You've done yourself a huge favor developmentally by mustering the balls to do something really fucking scary... in about the most vulnerable situation possible.

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    Kristiina has never met an ISTp has she


    that's okay because neither have I
    "And above all, watch with glittering eyes the whole world around you because the greatest secrets are always hidden in the most unlikely places. Those who don't believe in magic will never find it." -Roald Dahl

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    Quote Originally Posted by laghlagh View Post
    that the first few posts in the thread were just so quick to say absolutely not is connected to the general reason i no longer have a type in my sig. i don't have any affinity with the goth subculture but i don't understand why people would be so quick to set limits like that...especially when concepts like delta STs being taskmasters or delta NFs being prisses aren't shot down in the same way. i don't understand why so many deltas on the forum appear to be content to be pigeonholed in a certain way (like suburbanites from the 50s or something) and its why i have trouble identifying with the delta culture on the forum even though i'm quite sure i'm delta based on functional preferences.

    anyway my response would be that its NTR. i'm curious why anyone would say otherwise?
    My hero. Thank you.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Parkster View Post
    Look what I found
    OOoooh I love it. I love INTp's AND goths because they're even moodier/broodier than I am. Now, I wonder...would a gothic INTp guy(or gal) keep high standards for finding an interesting ENFp? Or be the types that are easily seduced by the first hott girly-girl feeler type with incompatible interests that comes along?

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    Quote Originally Posted by CILi View Post
     
    To me, Goth (like many subcultures) feels frustratingly uncreative.

    If someone's desperate to be different, like, ...why pick the exact same "different" that a couple million other kids did?
    It seems to me that the idea of being "different" means being "different" from a mainstream society in terms of image. It's more just a matter of rebellion against whatever typical world they live in, as well as finding a community who is also averse to that lifestyle, then being concerned with being truly unique. Then of course many Goths legitimately enjoy the subculture for what it is.
    "And above all, watch with glittering eyes the whole world around you because the greatest secrets are always hidden in the most unlikely places. Those who don't believe in magic will never find it." -Roald Dahl

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    I get what both of you are saying. Whether or not you identify with the subculture as a whole, do either(or any) of you listen to any goth bands individually?

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    Quote Originally Posted by morgause View Post
    I get what both of you are saying. Whether or not you identify with the subculture as a whole, do either(or any) of you listen to any goth bands individually?
    Unless Sara Bareilles and Peter Gabriel constitute Goth, no I don't.
    "And above all, watch with glittering eyes the whole world around you because the greatest secrets are always hidden in the most unlikely places. Those who don't believe in magic will never find it." -Roald Dahl

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    Hahaha, nice. Peter Gabriel rules! Kate Bush rules my heart and since the two have collabed more than once, he is cool by default.

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    what is goth music anyway? is it like Kings of Leon?
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    Quote Originally Posted by WorkaholicsAnon View Post
    what is goth music anyway? is it like Kings of Leon?
    haha i like kings of leon.

    i think its like this:




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    Quote Originally Posted by laghlagh View Post
    that the first few posts in the thread were just so quick to say absolutely not is connected to the general reason i no longer have a type in my sig. i don't have any affinity with the goth subculture but i don't understand why people would be so quick to set limits like that...especially when concepts like delta STs being taskmasters or delta NFs being prisses aren't shot down in the same way. i don't understand why so many deltas on the forum appear to be content to be pigeonholed in a certain way (like suburbanites from the 50s or something) and its why i have trouble identifying with the delta culture on the forum even though i'm quite sure i'm delta based on functional preferences.

    anyway my response would be that its NTR. i'm curious why anyone would say otherwise?
    Why are you so self-conscious about having a different taste? If you like the gothic style then say so without reservations. I happen to not have any affinity to it at all, and that's what i stated. I dont know if it's type related. Be proud of your tastes and preferences and OWN them. You dont have to hide what your type is because of that. And most importantly you dont have to feel like an outcast because you like something that some of us dont. That is not the way we Deltas roll.
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    oh i like poppy z. brite a lot. but i think she seems beta-ish. i'm gonna go make a thread.

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    Quote Originally Posted by WorkaholicsAnon View Post
    Why are you so self-conscious about having a different taste? If you like the gothic style then say so without reservations. I happen to not have any affinity to it at all, and that's what i stated. I dont know if it's type related. Be proud of your tastes and preferences and OWN them. You dont have to hide what your type is because of that. And most importantly you dont have to feel like an outcast because you like something that some of us dont. That is not the way we Deltas roll.
    i am honestly mostly indifferent to the "gothic style" and that really doesn't have anything to do with what i posted. thanks though.

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    Quote Originally Posted by morgause View Post
    How in touch with the finer, darker things in life are members of delta? I can think of a few of goth ISTps(in deathrock and other bands and in real life), but what would a goth ENFp(or any other delta type) look like?
    I've had a long association with 'underground' music scenes; relevant to this thread might be some of the emocore and post-hardcore acts from the late '90s through the early-to-mid '00s, as well as metal crossover:












    I can definitely appreciate the 'darker' things in life.
    SLI/ISTp -- Te subtype

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    The whole Goth thing seems ridiculous to me when those who consider themselves Goth think they are so cool because they look at the dark side of life/death. That just seems like trying to glorify negative intuition and put down Te. I have a pet peeve in general on fitting into some kind of image like that.


    Quote Originally Posted by laghlagh View Post
    that the first few posts in the thread were just so quick to say absolutely not is connected to the general reason i no longer have a type in my sig. i don't have any affinity with the goth subculture but i don't understand why people would be so quick to set limits like that...especially when concepts like delta STs being taskmasters or delta NFs being prisses aren't shot down in the same way. i don't understand why so many deltas on the forum appear to be content to be pigeonholed in a certain way (like suburbanites from the 50s or something) and its why i have trouble identifying with the delta culture on the forum even though i'm quite sure i'm delta based on functional preferences.

    anyway my response would be that its NTR. i'm curious why anyone would say otherwise?
    *ahem*. I'm not content with the stereotypes either... Well, it's not about being "content," it's just that I honestly stopped caring about changing other people's views on this a long time ago. You can't force people into being self-aware and doubting their own conceptions. I know you're referring to what Ryu said with the "taskmaster" and "prissy" part, but having talked to him outside the forum for some time, he actually has a wider scope of on things than we he jokes about in the forum.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Lobo View Post
    The whole Goth thing seems ridiculous to me when those who consider themselves Goth think they are so cool because they look at the dark side of life/death. That just seems like trying to glorify negative intuition and put down Te. I have a pet peeve in general on fitting into some kind of image like that.
    could you elaborate on what you mean by putting down Te? intuitively i think there might be something to it (at least for some people who are into subculture stuff)...like the image of something being more important than the reality of it? (that's probably a dumb way of putting it, its kind of a half-formed idea in my head.)

    Quote Originally Posted by Lobo View Post
    *ahem*. I'm not content with the stereotypes either... Well, it's not about being "content," it's just that I honestly stopped caring about changing other people's views on this a long time ago. You can't force people into being self-aware and doubting their own conceptions. I know you're referring to what Ryu said with the "taskmaster" and "prissy" part, but having talked to him outside the forum for some time, he actually has a wider scope of on things than we he jokes about in the forum.
    yeah, those were threads ryu started but i wasn't trying to single him out, they just stuck out prominently in my head. its more about a culture in general that i see here and i don't think that it's that people are stupid or really believe all deltas are closed off to anything but a 1950s suburban lifestyle...i think it has more to do with not caring about changing other peoples views, as you said, and maybe how people use humor that i either don't pick up on or think points to something ingrained...idk. anyway this line of discussion probably isn't productive and i'm bringing things off-topic, but i don't see myself resigning quite yet. because when i read a lot of stuff in delta i experience a sort of dissonance which has at times led me to question my own self-typing but i think the more logical conclusion is that roughly 1/4 of the population doesn't fit into the stereotypes here as opposed to my self-typing being wrong (not that it couldn't be). anyway, for that reason i feel sort of strongly about it and i'll probably continue being a pain in the ass for now.

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    Quote Originally Posted by laghlagh View Post
    could you elaborate on what you mean by putting down Te? intuitively i think there might be something to it (at least for some people who are into subculture stuff)...like the image of something being more important than the reality of it? (that's probably a dumb way of putting it, its kind of a half-formed idea in my head.)



    yeah, those were threads ryu started but i wasn't trying to single him out, they just stuck out prominently in my head. its more about a culture in general that i see here and i don't think that it's that people are stupid or really believe all deltas are closed off to anything but a 1950s suburban lifestyle...i think it has more to do with not caring about changing other peoples views, as you said, and maybe how people use humor that i either don't pick up on or think points to something ingrained...idk. anyway this line of discussion probably isn't productive and i'm bringing things off-topic, but i don't see myself resigning quite yet. because when i read a lot of stuff in delta i experience a sort of dissonance which has at times led me to question my own self-typing but i think the more logical conclusion is that roughly 1/4 of the population doesn't fit into the stereotypes here as opposed to my self-typing being wrong (not that it couldn't be). anyway, for that reason i feel sort of strongly about it and i'll probably continue being a pain in the ass for now.
    Might not be strictly "goth," but my impression is that there's this sense of "what's the point?" to everything, so productivity is placed on the back burner (might even be uncool to be proactive about things and be positive). I've never studied that subculture, so I'm just generalizing based on what I've encountered with people who seem gothic to me. I could be very wrong about all this.

    I think descriptions go into the bullshit realm fairly easily, especially when they attempt to describe behavior and attractions, instead of the underlying causes of the behavior. People are too eager to use socionics as a way to explain things that they don't/perhaps can't understand, and tend to accept things as truth when it gives them peace of mind, rather than being objective about it. If you don't relate to a type description or the people who say they are delta, what does that even mean? I notice how a lot of people here submit themselves to an ideology (socionics) so easily, trust "type descriptions" and people who say they are experts, without really considering that it's/they're wrong. It's kind of fascinating (and kind of scary) really to see just how easily one can manipulate someone's understanding without even using hardcore facts. I'm sidetracking, but yeah, your feelings don't necessarily have anything to do with your type.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Lobo View Post
    The whole Goth thing seems ridiculous to me when those who consider themselves Goth think they are so cool because they look at the dark side of life/death. That just seems like trying to glorify negative intuition and put down Te. I have a pet peeve in general on fitting into some kind of image like that.
    I met a goth girl once who told me.... "You're estranged." In a disdainful way, I mean.

    Probably one of the most ironic observations given to me. Isn't that what she was supposed to be shooting for?

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