Rage and Enneagram Type 6

[Creepy-male]

I see that you´ve already bought the idea that I´m a 6. You were quick to jump into that conclusion and act based on that... not too much intelligence there I must say. You should wait a little more or something. I guess I just irritated you.

Well you can´t irritate me with these silly words even if I´m a 6, try better. And you didn´t reply to me whether you are that gay guy from Holland.

Now can you please discuss Enneagram without tritype? Or is that too much for you? This reminds me of this cool E6 music

Lol I haven't even weighed in on my opinion of your type, and frankly I haven't considered the idea seriously yet. I don't even know where you're getting this stuff, ah man, seriously... what the hell, it's like this stuff is all in your head... fear of being a 6... hyper-reactivity. Calm down man, I came here just to discuss e-types.

Also lol no I'm not a gay guy from Holland, once again where do you get this stuff.... why is the status of my sexuality and where I am from important at all to the discussion between us? You wouldn't be trying to troll me would you sir?

Also I'd be glad to discuss my views on the e6 without tritype... but I'm not about to publicly renounce my belief in tritype because it helps you sleep at night. We all need to just relax and accept the fact there are going to be disagreements... and to move forward and explore what we can accomplish constructively here instead of vying for who is more correct. Disagreement is fine, but the personal attacks and trolling I have no need to participate in.

[electric sheep]

hmmm Airborne is projecting quite a bit in that post... I mean, this whole disagreement began when he started erupting over just a few "silly" words and now you're supposedly the hot headed one. Very interesting.

[Airman]

Lol I haven't even weighed in on my opinion of your type, and frankly I haven't considered the idea seriously yet. I don't even know where you're getting this stuff, ah man, seriously... what the hell, it's like this stuff is all in your head... fear of being a 6... hyper-reactivity. Calm down man, I came here just to discuss e-types.

Also lol no I'm not a gay guy from Holland, once again where do you get this stuff.... why is the status of my sexuality and where I am from important at all to the discussion between us? You wouldn't be trying to troll me would you sir?

Also I'd be glad to discuss my views on the e6 without tritype... but I'm not about to publicly renounce my belief in tritype because it helps you sleep at night. We all need to just relax and accept the fact there are going to be disagreements... and to move forward and explore what we can accomplish constructively here instead of vying for who is more correct. Disagreement is fine, but the personal attacks and trolling I have no need to participate in.

Okay. I´m not trying to troll you whatever that means, probably means irritate you in a virtual way.

And I think we could get more from this discussion if we discussed without tritype especially yourself since you seem so knowledgeable on the Enneagram. And you´re a big contributor to this here. I´m not asking you to renounce your belief on tritype. Just to understand that it is a very complex topic which is highly controversial within the Enneagram community itself. Many authors and people do not even accept it. You know this. But I don´t have a fixed opinion on tritype, I just think that it makes matters more difficult most of the time instead of making them easier. I agree with the basic Tritype theory, I even have my own tritype which is 1-3-6 and that kind of explains a lot, but in a very different manner than the one type traditional enneagram does.

[Creepy-male]

Okay. I´m not trying to troll you whatever that means, probably means irritate you in a virtual way.

And I think we could get more from this discussion if we discussed without tritype especially yourself since you seem so knowledgeable on the Enneagram. And you´re a big contributor to this here. I´m not asking you to renounce your belief on tritype. Just to understand that it is a very complex topic which is highly controversial within the Enneagram community itself. Many authors and people do not even accept it. You know this. But I don´t have a fixed opinion on tritype, I just think that it makes matters more difficult most of the time instead of making them easier. I agree with the basic Tritype theory, I even have my own tritype which is 1-3-6 and that kind of explains a lot, but in a very different manner than the one type traditional enneagram does.

Alright that's what I figured, it's not ridiculous to request a non-tritype description (or at least I think so), but I'm already getting flamed enough in other threads. I'll post in my take on anger and e6... but realize while you may or may not agree with my ideas... it's ok to disagree with me, really it is.

[Airman]

I even think tritype would be useful, if people - basically ENTPs - would not fuck it all up inventing further complexities in the system just to be applauded as big geniuses, much like Aushra did with Socionics and others did also.

In the Tritype Enneagram I think it´s too much to consider each type with a dominant wing and an instinctual subtype. I mean a dominant wing could even be ok, although I prefer not to, but to put a subtype in each of the three types is to assign to each of them the same important role of the basic type, to say that they´re equally important. Then you have to start a whole new Enneagram because the one we have now says a person can only be one type, not three. One type is going to dominate. The other two will be like ways in which the person tends to act influenced by the dominant type and I think that you got that, from your posts.

So for me being a 1-3-6 explains a lot, it explains why I am somewhat 3ish in the image center, while 6ish in the mental center. But these are under my basic rigidity and stiffness of 1, my basic judgmental attitude towards everyone and the world and my idealistic streak.

So why do I prefer not to discuss in terms of tritype? Because it can be confusing, and traditional enneagram explains everything without having to resort to so much information. It´s just economy of time and energy.

[Creepy-male]

I even think tritype would be useful, if people - basically ENTPs - would not fuck it all up inventing further complexities in the system just to be applauded as big geniuses, much like Aushra did with Socionics and others did also.

In the Tritype Enneagram I think it´s too much to consider each type with a dominant wing and an instinctual subtype. I mean a dominant wing could even be ok, although I prefer not to, but to put a subtype in each of the three types is to assign to each of them the same important role of the basic type, to say that they´re equally important. Then you have to start a whole new Enneagram because the one we have now says a person can only be one type, not three. One type is going to dominate. The other two will be like ways in which the person tends to act influenced by the dominant type and I think that you got that, from your posts.

So for me being a 1-3-6 explains a lot, it explains why I am somewhat 3ish in the image center, while 6ish in the mental center. But these are under my basic rigidity and stiffness of 1, my basic judgmental attitude towards everyone and the world and my idealistic streak.

So why do I prefer not to discuss in terms of tritype? Because it can be confusing, and traditional enneagram explains everything without having to resort to so much information. It´s just economy of time and energy.

Yea I wouldn't overstep your boundaries... not to call you stupid, but tritype is some avant-garde stuff. A lot of people will try to learn and use stuff too fast and it becomes a load of crap or a mess. I'm totally in support of just focusing on the fundamentals. It's like when people read up on quantum mechanics without knowing anything about classical physics... and they think they can actually come up with sensible ideas based around quantum mechanics... it becomes a complete mess.

Maybe I'll post my views on the tritype in somewhere more appropriate later. For now, one of the things I'd emphasize is that in my viewpoint I consider tritype to be in a heiarchy. The main type will always have the strongest flavor to your personality. Who you are, what you are about... is most closely matched to the description, issues, virtues, and so forth of the main type... the others present themselves to a less degree.

[Airman]

Yea I wouldn't overstep your boundaries... not to call you stupid, but tritype is some avant-garde stuff. A lot of people will try to learn and use stuff too fast and it becomes a load of crap or a mess. I'm totally in support of just focusing on the fundamentals. It's like when people read up on quantum mechanics without knowing anything about classical physics... and they think they can actually come up with sensible ideas based around quantum mechanics... it becomes a complete mess.

Maybe I'll post my views on the tritype in somewhere more appropriate later. For now, one of the things I'd emphasize is that in my viewpoint I consider tritype to be in a heiarchy. The main type will always have the strongest flavor to your personality. Who you are, what you are about... is most closely matched to the description, issues, virtues, and so forth of the main type... the others present themselves to a less degree.

I agree with that. And this is why I prefer the one type. But I´m not against tritype. In fact I could learn from you. And when you feel like doing it, please open a thread to discuss Tritype and express your views about it more extensively.

[Creepy-male]

lol get over yourself, I have no idea how you came out of nowhere and assumed I was talking about you. You're being very un-9.

Am I now? Care to explain?

gut fix is how you deal with conflict and personal boundaries, heart fix is how you present yourself, head fix describes your thought processes. Your reaction to stress is the lines of (dis)integration. It goes through the same kind of rotating process you're talking about, but you're looking at the wrong things. Writing stories and moping about does not mean you have a 4 fix by any stretch.

Ah, okay, cool

I didn't particularly like that description I gave of 4-fix either, tbh, but my friendly neighbourhood ILE was not available to field my tritype questions and help me distill the whole 4-fix thing into words.

Wait, are you going to insist I'm an ESE for making that comment?

*eye twitch*

u mad? Sounds to me like someone has a case of the prejudices. Try not to be offended by how "wrong" I am, and you might find that I'm not a raving lunatic with zero understanding of Socionics or the Enneagram.

Remember, grasshopper: to find a Nine, look not for what there is, but for what there is not.

[norph]

Oh god, you seem threatened by the idea of tritype. Grow some balls, ideas can't hurt you. Seriously your fear is starting to disturb me... relax, its only talking. Do yourself a favor and yell out something completely false... and observe you will still stand alive. Ever been wrong before? Did god smite you down? No? oh well I guess false ideas can't harm you. Once you've gained your composure we can continue discussion.

I can't decide which of you is making the greater leap.

[electric sheep]

ok brian arthur

9s have the overriding sense that they are not important and they don't matter, as dolphin posted from common 9 attitudes eariler:

"I don’t matter."
"I’m not important."
"I’m not cared for."
"It’s not O.K. to be upset."
"I shouldn’t stand out."

It's strange for you to suddenly materialize and assume I was talking about you. 9s have the problem of not being noticed and having that feeling of invisibility. So for someone that should have a problem of being overlooked, a "non presence" if you will, you sure had an eager presence in that instance.

If you've seen the Breakfast Club, the outcast girl is a 9w1 with a 4w5 fix. She has the invisibility problem, but the way she presents herself is like a 4. It's kind of at odds with 9 descriptions because they supposedly don't like to stand out too much, but she does, although very quietly. She's also probably a social last because she does not follow social protocols at all, like you seem to do very well.

You know, now that I think about it, popping up like that was very "social" of you. So I don't think you should get over yourself, it's quite natural for social firsts to be aware of things like this, maybe even trigger happy. So it took the social first to become aware of it, and the assertiveness to bring it up. This is a microcosm of events and I'm possibly looking too much into it, but I don't think this is much different from how you normally are. Correct me if I'm wrong.

also:

[Creepy-male]

I'd like to conclude this line of discussion about my type with an Isha quote: "also social 3? lol"

And Kam, before you chime in on this thread, just don't. Cheers brah.

[Creepy-male]

I agree with that. And this is why I prefer the one type. But I´m not against tritype. In fact I could learn from you. And when you feel like doing it, please open a thread to discuss Tritype and express your views about it more extensively.

I'm leaving this forum some time, so I don't get sucked in but I intend to reply to you here, so be on the lookout for over the next couple of days. I'm not ignoring you, but I need a break seriously.

[DividedsGhost]

From the great words of ArchonAlarion -

FUCK EVERYONE

- Tritypes is bullshit.

Yeah.

[redbaron]

- Tritypes is bullshit.

true.

[Satan]

Hmm...it seems like Airborne and LucidDreamz / anyone on the forum / ends up arguing over minutiae that have nothing to do with the actual debate. I wish I could just see two blog posts with all the BS cut out. Oh and btw...I can believe *whatever I want* about tritypes. I can be 9 and 2 and 8 for all I care. Having these traits doesn't sound unreasonable. Its stupid to think that one version or another of a theory can be *completely* wrong when it's a pseudoscience like this is. For the love of God, the enneagram is not a science at all. It's more like a tool for understanding. If you treat it like its something more, you get this BS. God, this post could go anywhere on the forums where this type debate is going on. What I want to see, is you talking about yourself, your feelings, and how the Enneagram reflects that, or your understandings of other people/things. Blog posts, people...blog posts!

you know your avatar looks cool, but your message looks like a wall of text...

[Airman]

I'm leaving this forum some time, so I don't get sucked in but I intend to reply to you here, so be on the lookout for over the next couple of days. I'm not ignoring you, but I need a break seriously.

I don´t think you should, but if you think you need to rest, do it. It´s important sometimes. Take good hot showers and relax. And forget about everything that is bothering you, life is too short. And do come back and post ASAP, we had a small disagreement on tritype but it was just that. I kind of like you in a heterosexual manner. You´re knowledgeable. But go ahead take your time, have sex, chill out, see the sunrise, sunset, jerk off watching porn, get the car and drive to remote places full of nature. Take a walk, listen to music you enjoy. Lie on bed for some hours to rest your body.

[UDP]

E6s are def more mental ~

[Airman]

E6s are def more mental ~

more mental than what?

[DividedsGhost]

E6s are def more mental ~

Oh really?

[Airman]

6s are positioned in the dead center of the head triad (aka 'anxiety triad') and most cut off from their own instinct center. Head/Heart/(Gut) is how their centers of intelligence stack, with Gut effectively relegated to blindspot status.

The convergence of these factors makes them the most 'anxious' of the Enneatypes. Most of their awareness becomes centered around their thoughts, and the subsequent reactions to their own thoughts, ad nauseum. Which typically devolves into a vicious feedback cycle under stress.

Don't look for outward signs of their anxiety though. It doesn't work like that. For most of them you will never suspect it when looking at them on the surface, because they tend to conceal that shit. A typical 6 will not look like the stereotype of an anxiety-riddled person. 6s have a heroic capacity for playing pokerface like none other—which is paradoxically, exactly how they give themselves away once you realize that. The more steely, cold, deadpan, and resolved they appear outwardly, the greater the turmoil of anxiety raging within.

Lol Ryu was talking abt me? Well... I don´t think I´m a 6, really.

I always had this tremendous capacity for seeing 'flaws' in other people and this generated an extreme aversion towards these people, which is what I would call the 'rage' of type 1... it´s a basic aversion to that which the individual of this type sees as not being good enough, not perfect enough, flawed. What is flawed must be destroyed. This reminds me so much of Nazism LOL... and many other instances for example Sparta where babies born with some illness were sacrificed because they were not fit enough. Sparta was probably not 1 though, it was probably 8. And 1, 6 and 8 tend to walk together in many aspects to the point of confusion. Especially between 1 and 6, but not between 1 and 8 and 6 and 8 so much.

To me 8 stands out as very easy to identify. It´s a so much 'in your face' type... it´s like totally ridiculous even...8s are blatant.

1s and 6s are not. Authors say Germany is an E6 country. I disagree, Germany is typically E1. E6 has much more emotion than the boring rationality of E1. E6 is better in a sense.

[Beautiful sky]

Lol Ryu was talking abt me? Well... I don´t think I´m a 6, really.

I always had this tremendous capacity for seeing 'flaws' in other people and this generated an extreme aversion towards these people, which is what I would call the 'rage' of type 1... it´s a basic aversion to that which the individual of this type sees as not being good enough, not perfect enough, flawed. What is flawed must be destroyed. This reminds me so much of Nazism LOL... and many other instances for example Sparta where babies born with some illness were sacrificed because they were not fit enough. Sparta was probably not 1 though, it was probably 8. And 1, 6 and 8 tend to walk together in many aspects to the point of confusion. Especially between 1 and 6, but not between 1 and 8 and 6 and 8 so much.

To me 8 stands out as very easy to identify. It´s a so much 'in your face' type... it´s like totally ridiculous even...8s are blatant.

What do you mean by the bolded part?

[Airman]

And I know that I´m not very mental either... I´m very much instinctual. Which sucks. It´s only good to do sports or have sex probably.

Authors disagree but I think that E1s have a repressed MENTAL CENTER, while E8s have a repressed EMOTIONAL CENTER. As to E6s, one book I have says they repress the same center they prefer, which is the Mental, but I disagree, I think they repress the instinctual center, otherwise they´d have more trust in their instinctual capacity to escape dangers.

[Airman]

What do you mean by the bolded part?

exactly what was written.

[Beautiful sky]

exactly what was written.

It said that you see flaws in people. What flaws do you see?

[Airman]

It said that you see flaws in people. What flaws do you see?

why do you want to know?

[Beautiful sky]

why do you want to know?

What do you mean "why do I want to know?"
Are you trying to figure out my intentions?

[anndelise]

What do you mean "why do I want to know?"
Are you trying to figure out my intentions?

lol, are you trying to figure out his?

[anndelise]

6s are positioned in the dead center of the head triad (aka 'anxiety triad') and most cut off from their own instinct center. Head/Heart/(Gut) is how their centers of intelligence stack, with Gut effectively relegated to blindspot status.

The convergence of these factors makes them the most 'anxious' of the Enneatypes. Most of their awareness becomes centered around their thoughts, and the subsequent reactions to their own thoughts, ad nauseum. Which typically devolves into a vicious feedback cycle under stress.

Don't look for outward signs of their anxiety though. It doesn't work like that. For most of them you will never suspect it when looking at them on the surface, because they tend to conceal that shit. A typical 6 will not look like the stereotype of an anxiety-riddled person. 6s have a heroic capacity for playing pokerface like none other—which is paradoxically, exactly how they give themselves away once you realize that. The more steely, cold, deadpan, and resolved they appear outwardly, the greater the turmoil of anxiety raging within.

I can't say anything as to the enneagram connections you've made, but I can say that yes, yes and YES about the vicious feedback cycle. I'd also add that there's a point where it's too much, the pressure's built up too high, and somehow it's gotta be released...which is usually done in a quick fit of rage. But it usually only lasts at most half an hour or so, less if the person does something physical to help get that energy out of themselves. And then things are back to normal.

But it's not like there aren't any signs that the explosion is about to occur. Usually, the person will get more withdrawn, muscles getting tighter and tighter...we're talking over time, days, weeks, etc....face and attitude more stoic, etc. Much like what you wrote in the last part.

[Beautiful sky]

why do you want to know?

Because I am always curious and have an insatiable hunger for all things new and possible.

[Creepy-male]

Hmm...it seems like Airborne and LucidDreamz / anyone on the forum / ends up arguing over minutiae that have nothing to do with the actual debate. I wish I could just see two blog posts with all the BS cut out. Oh and btw...I can believe *whatever I want* about tritypes. I can be 9 and 2 and 8 for all I care. Having these traits doesn't sound unreasonable. Its stupid to think that one version or another of a theory can be *completely* wrong when it's a pseudoscience like this is. For the love of God, the enneagram is not a science at all. It's more like a tool for understanding. If you treat it like its something more, you get this BS. God, this post could go anywhere on the forums where this type debate is going on. What I want to see, is you talking about yourself, your feelings, and how the Enneagram reflects that, or your understandings of other people/things. Blog posts, people...blog posts!

+1000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000 0000

Why is it necessary for you all to share your opinion on tritype... the topic isn't even about that. It's almost suspicious imho.

[Creepy-male]

Don't look for outward signs of their anxiety though. It doesn't work like that. For most of them you will never suspect it when looking at them on the surface, because they tend to conceal that shit. A typical 6 will not look like the stereotype of an anxiety-riddled person. 6s have a heroic capacity for playing pokerface like none other—which is paradoxically, exactly how they give themselves away once you realize that. The more steely, cold, deadpan, and resolved they appear outwardly, the greater the turmoil of anxiety raging within.

Yea the principle the head center is based on is issues of anxiety, not characteristics of anxiety.

It's counter-intuitive, but 6's aren't always anxious.... in the same way that rich businessmen who spend a lot of time dealing with money issues are not necessarily poor.

Usually because they deal with issues of anxiety, 6's appear on the outward to be very calm, logical, and composed. This comes from the various techniques of managing anxiety they have. A normal 6 is skeptical, but calm, as their anxiety is well managed as a result of their mental will and rational thought.

Now once 6's get bombarded by too much absurdity, this starts to chip away at this composure. The six is especially receptive to certain types of bullshit and they may have different reactions depending on the details of the situation. Most often, these reactions appear to others on the surface to be ugly and vice-like, displaying human weakness.

If the 6 however is in peak psychological health and spirits, this produces mannerisms which could be considered virtuous or unusually admirable, displaying human strength.

It's hard to talk details because everyone immediately assumes any example given is something they should immediately identify with... which isn't the case, there is natural variation between different people due to experience and finer details of their personality which can't be expressed by some "model of personality".

Some typical instances of 6's showing their anxiety as a result of psychological pressure....

-Panic Attacks as a result of Anxiety which builds unconsciously Panic Attacks
-Odd Phobias as a result of Anxiety which builds unconsciously Overreacting with fear
-Defensive and Protective of Personal beliefs due to stress from Anxiety Angry/Outspoken
-Contemplative Depression as a result of Doubt/Dread created from excessive exposure to Anxiety Pensive/Melancholy
-Paranoia as a result of Anxiety experienced from relationships where loyalty was abused Mistrusting/Cynical


Some virtues of 6's

-Loyalty... Willing to die for their beliefs and those they trust. Trustworthy partner in relationships when bonded by trust. Responsible with duties when they feel the relationship with institution is trustworthy.
-Resolute Courage. Willing to stay focused under pressure as a result of their loyalty to beliefs. Shows determination to their ideology and people who they trust.
-Eager Learner. Loves to learn new things, mostly from trusted experts. Sometimes wishes to be an expert themselves and definitely has the potential to be.

[Airman]

Thus spoke the Master, the Conqueror, the Enlightened One.

[Creepy-male]

Thus spoke the Master, the Conqueror, the Enlightened One.

lol seriously....

I'm not asking you to eat up my ideas because I'm an expert... all I'm doing is sharing my understanding. If you disagree with it, so be it. Attributing me as being some "master, conqueror, or enlightened guru" is ridiculous -- I don't want that put on me.

[Airman]

lol seriously....

I'm not asking you to eat up my ideas because I'm an expert... all I'm doing is sharing my understanding. If you disagree with it, so be it. Attributing me as being some "master, conqueror, or enlightened guru" is ridiculous -- I don't want that put on me.

Alright it was just a joke. Don´t mind it.

[Creepy-male]

you have 666 posts as I am looking at this message

[Airman]

LOL AND I WAS LISTENING TO IRON MAIDEN´S...sorry it was ONLY THE GOOD DIE YOUNG.

[Creepy-male]

lol well best of luck airborne, I'm leaving this thread tomorrow and getting on again monday evening.

[Creepy-male]

yea I'll admit when I was writing those virtues, I was struggling... it was kind of a weak explanation.

Loyalty isn't perhaps the best way to characterize the best in sixes... its more like they require something to believe in or trust. Experts, Relationships with People, and Ideologies. These "ideas" build a foundation for a world philosophy they can trust in... of course its different for all sixes, some are Chrisitians who trust in the bible and need to intellectualize it and refer to experts... some are Atheists on the opposite side of the pole trusting in Science/Art/Humanities and read from experts and intellectualize the experience of life. Anyways this characteristics leads to them being called "loyalists" usually. They aren't loyal like a dog or a soldier as much as it's this quality that their psyche demands this philosophy so much that they won't sell out their ideologies for more physical things, because there ideas are important to them, they aren't just something for trade to fulfill their desires.

Anyways 5's are very similar too being in the head triad... but their attitude is completely different... they aren't so in need for trust, well frankly because they are more withdrawn and they're not part of the Intensity Triad they are part of the triad which is more about being logical, productive, and reasonable that they share with 1's and 3's. Their triad isn't about trust as much as "If we all just be reasonable, mature and logical we can get some shit done". Also 5's build their own ideas, rather than depend on experts as much... they do have "mentors" and "experts" but they accept these experts more because what they say is sensible and not because they actually care about the person's credentials. But my point here is 5's also hold their ideas in high esteem.

Once you get to 4's this need to hold ideas in high esteem also translates but these ideas become less logical in nature and more emotional. It's more about your true feelings, and hold those emotional experiences in high esteem.

Anyways the point is 4 is hold their core emotional ideology in esteem.... 5 is hold their core intellectual ideology in esteem... 6 is like hold their core intellectual ideology in esteem also but it's less withdrawn and in their own head and more involved in external reality at the cost of being less visionary and more practical.

I generally see Germany as a very 6 nation and the United States as a very 7 nation in terms of solely the thinking triad.

Also the same with the other virtues... it's kind of difficult I find to write on them.... I'd much rather find an example in some movie/book or historical figure that displays the more heroic and virtuous qualities of the 6.

I mean basically it comes down to, 6's aren't sell outs... they are believers in truth as they understand and see it, as are 5's but the 6's are soooooo much more mainstream and practical than 5's. 5's are enigmatic, philosophical, withdrawn, and visionary. They can be eccentric and carry strange perspective, but at the same time 5's also can carry some new profoundly creative ideas... unfortunately in reality its usually a mix between the two and you don't get to pick and choose. I have a great documentary on Kepler... which is surely a 5, a lot of the details mentioned about him translate really nicely into the enneagram explanations of the 5.

The other thing is not all 6's see the truth the same... but they don't sell out on their ideas easily.

Sorry this response is pretty messy (Excuse the typos and rambling).... but check out the intensity triad.... it's 6's 4's and 8's... all deal with issues of trust and loyalty in relationships.

[anndelise]

I just wanted to toss in an idea for you two....

I don't think "loyalty" is the right term as much as "predictability".
"Predictability" also covers the need to find some stability.

When filled with anxiety, seeing conflicts and contradictions..absurdities as it was put, and the tendencies towards phobias, panic attacks, defensiveness/protection, it usually means that the environment is or was unpredictable.

For example, HLD said

Loyalty isn't perhaps the best way to characterize the best in sixes... its more like they require something to believe in or trust. Experts, Relationships with People, and Ideologies. These "ideas" build a foundation for a world philosophy they can trust in... of course its different for all sixes, some are Chrisitians who trust in the bible and need to intellectualize it and refer to experts... some are Atheists on the opposite side of the pole trusting in Science/Art/Humanities and read from experts and intellectualize the experience of life. Anyways this characteristics leads to them being called "loyalists" usually. They aren't loyal like a dog or a soldier as much as it's this quality that their psyche demands this philosophy so much that they won't sell out their ideologies for more physical things, because there ideas are important to them, they aren't just something for trade to fulfill their desires.

"they require something to believe in"
Requiring something we can trust. We trust what we can predict. If I expect that a person or idea will [do whatever], and it does it, then I can trust that it will [do that]. I may not like it, but it's at least something 'solid' from which to build a world view with.

"their psyche demands this philosophy so much that they won't sell out their ideologies for more physical things, because their ideas are important to them, they aren't just something for trade to fulfill their desires."
If I trust something, if it acts certain ways enough that I can expect it to continue to act in those certain ways,...in other words, if it's fairly predictable, then I'm not likely to sell that out or let it go easily...except for something that has even more useful predictableness. Of course, this leads to a sense of loyalty, but, as was said, "not loyal like a dog or a soldier". If at any point the something is no longer predictable, if it changes, if it becomes (or is) uncertain, then that 'loyalty' falls away.

(note, some unpredictable things are accepted as being predictably unpredictable. The anxiety issues step in, though, when sometimes its predictable, and sometimes not,...sometimes you can be certain and trust it to do what it does...but sometimes it doesn't. This creates anxiety. It will also likely engender a need to find out why, what's going on that makes it change like that?)

Anyhoot, just an idea to throw in for consideration.

[xerx]

I don't think I'll ever fully understand the 6 thought process (from what I've read about them needing to look up to authority). If you can't trust your own conclusions, how can you ever put complete faith in someone else's? It's like they turn the concept of epistemic certainty on its head.

Don't get me wrong, I love you guys and find you interesting, but also slightly exotic (in a good way).