Light-Fe INFp
L- Ni ENFj
Misa- Se ISTj
Ryuk- Ni ENFj
Light-Fe INFp
L- Ni ENFj
Misa- Se ISTj
Ryuk- Ni ENFj
L is a stereotypical LII. Light is a stereotypical LIE (albeit a reclusive one). I'm not sure on what planet Misa could possibly be a Logical type.
What do these signs mean—,
, etc.? Why cannot socionists use symbols Ne, Ni etc. as in MBTI? Just because they have somewhat different meaning. Socionics and MBTI, each in its own way, have slightly modified the original Jung's description of his 8 psychological types. For this reason,
Just one example: in MBTI, Se (extraverted sensing) is associated with life pleasures, excitement etc. By contrast, the socionic function(extraverted sensing) is first and foremost associated with control and expansion of personal space (which sometimes can manifest in excessive aagression, but often also manifests in a capability of managing lots of people and things).
For this reason, we consider comparison between MBTI types and socionic types by functions to be rather useless than useful.
-Victor Gulenko, Dmitri Lytov
Originally Posted by Typhon
You're right L is a stereotypcal LII, but that doesnt make him an actual LII. Light is beta NF as he seems to dabble in controversial matters of godd vs evil. And Misa isnt the logical subtype of ISTj, which is why she doesnt come of off as super logical and dry, but more emotional and bubbly and even ditzy.
I haven't see the show all that much, but L does remind me of how I imagine niffweed lives his life haha. INTj seems believable in that regard.
When it comes to TV show figures or imaginary characters in general, it'd probably be best to take them at face value, at least in terms of type. It's really difficult if not impossible to create a completely dynamic character unless it's based off of one's self, so what appears on the outside is more or less going to be how the character is.
It doesnt have to be created off of one's self, really, I think most fictional charatcers are based on real people or synthesis of several real life people. So as far as taking them at face value is concerned he seems to me EIE, L, I mean, being so starrish and media obssesed. An LII I imagine would be oblivious to his image. I think i am taking him at face value, but he is rather complex, thats the first thing that strikes me about many fictional characters; they type like real people, probably because they aerent created out of aether but based on real people.
Hmm, well you may very well be right, seeing as how I've barely ever watched the show. Just in my opinion, in the clips of him I've seen on youtube, his energy seems way to staunch and unmovable for him to be anything other than Ij.
I've also never had any experience with character development, but it sounds like an interesting process if you do base a character off of somebody you already know. It just seems like the easiest way to make a character is to base it off of one's self.
Nigga say whaa?L doesn't even show his face to the public. Outside of the Kira task force, he's known to almost everyone as a voice behind a computer screen. Even the viewers don't get to see him till episode 7 or so.
And further than that, L... a Beta type? What are you smoking?
What do these signs mean—
Just one example: in MBTI, Se (extraverted sensing) is associated with life pleasures, excitement etc. By contrast, the socionic function
For this reason, we consider comparison between MBTI types and socionic types by functions to be rather useless than useful.
-Victor Gulenko, Dmitri Lytov
No he doesnt show his face to the public but hes still a media whore. And what am I smoking? Wahtever you are.Nigga say whaa?
And further than that, L... a Beta type? What are you smoking?
That's abjectly incorrect. The one and only mass public display he did was done to draw Kira out, and it was done because it was by far the most efficient way to go about it. He actually takes great pains to conceal his actual identity, going so far as to utilize not just one, but three pseudonyms (Eraldo Coil being one).
That's still not proof that he's Beta though. I really can't see how L can possibly be anything but an alpha NT.
What do these signs mean—
Just one example: in MBTI, Se (extraverted sensing) is associated with life pleasures, excitement etc. By contrast, the socionic function
For this reason, we consider comparison between MBTI types and socionic types by functions to be rather useless than useful.
-Victor Gulenko, Dmitri Lytov
L = INTp
Light = INTj
Light, Alpha? L, Gamma? No way.
What do these signs mean—
Just one example: in MBTI, Se (extraverted sensing) is associated with life pleasures, excitement etc. By contrast, the socionic function
For this reason, we consider comparison between MBTI types and socionic types by functions to be rather useless than useful.
-Victor Gulenko, Dmitri Lytov
Light IEI
Near LIE
Death Note
Light: LSI-Ne, 1w2 so/sp (INTJ)
Ryuk: SEI-Si, 5w6 sp/sx (ISTP)
L: LII-Ne, 5w4 sx/sp (INTP)
Near: ILI-Ne, 5w6 sp/so (INTJ)
Mello: SLE-Ne, 3w4 sp/sx (ENFP)
Misa: EIE-Se, 4w3 sx/so (ENFJ)
Takada: IEE-Fi, 1w2 so/sx (ENFJ)
Higuchi: SLE-Te, 8w7 sp/so (ENTJ)
Mikami: LSI-Fi, 1w2 so/sx (ISTJ)
Matsuda: EIE-Se, 7w6 so/sx (ENFP)
Soichiro: SLI-Si, 6w5 so/sp (ISTJ)
Aizawa: LSE-Si, 6w7 sx/so (ESTJ)
Mogi: SLI-Ti, 6w5 sp/so (ISTJ)
What do these signs mean—
Just one example: in MBTI, Se (extraverted sensing) is associated with life pleasures, excitement etc. By contrast, the socionic function
For this reason, we consider comparison between MBTI types and socionic types by functions to be rather useless than useful.
-Victor Gulenko, Dmitri Lytov
Near is soit hurts to watch.
I've heard ESI for Light. What are your reasons for LSI?
Johari/Nohari
"Tell someone you love them today, because life is short; shout it at them in German, because life is also terrifying."
Fruit, the fluffy kitty.
My own thoughts would be the fact that he's a brutal mass-murderer? And basically completely ruthlessly evil.
INTPs have claimed L. The eyes are a big clue, but personally I haven't watched anything to judge.
LSI
-_-
I'm looking for a Socionic explanation.
Johari/Nohari
"Tell someone you love them today, because life is short; shout it at them in German, because life is also terrifying."
Fruit, the fluffy kitty.
Also, I have found 2-3 other threads on the Death Note series, one of which is by Aleksei, and that's without checking the second page of search results. Why do we need yet another one when a poster can simply grave-dig one of the others?
Johari/Nohari
"Tell someone you love them today, because life is short; shout it at them in German, because life is also terrifying."
Fruit, the fluffy kitty.
Socionics explanation: would an ESI, "the Conservator", the type known for having a keen judgement of good and evil, do that?
@Skeptic
I somewhat liked Light, actually, but you can't ignore the fact that he had no problems manipulating people to save his own hide. Seems pretty evil to me, at the very least in the DnD sense.
I will concede that "brutal" was not exactly accurate, however. But he did kill a whole lot of people. Definition of "mass-" murderer.
They theoretically could, if they didn't perceive it as evil, as Light didn't (he perceived himself as dishing out justice and promoting the greater good, albeit at his self-admitted expense of letting one evil person live, himself). A good example of that is Claude Frollo engaging in racially motivated genocide for what he perceives as the good of France and the Church. Remember, your definitions of "good" and "evil" are not everyone's definitions - especially in a culture like Japan, which is less dominated by humanistic post-Enlightenment ethics than the Western world. The Mosaic law and thus traditional Judaic ethics says stoning of male homosexuals is good and just. The Homeric moral code says racking up a large body count in battle is moral and just, as it promotes an example of strength. Many moral codes are anathema to the moral system of Enlightenment humanism, but that doesn't make them any less theories of ethics.
However, I do agree that Light Yagami is LSI, for the following reasons:
1) It fits his intertype relations reasonably well. I could very clearly see him and Misa as LSI-EIE duality.
2) He seems ridiculously Ti, not really concerned for pragmatic efficiency so much as what is logically consistent with his worldview and vision of the world.
3) His manipulation style seems Fe, playing at the emotions of people like Misa and Takada as opposed to the Fi sort of "I scratch your back, you scratch mine" manipulation which plays on interpersonal distance as opposed to overall emotions, best exhibited by Vito Corleone in The Godfather. He, indeed, really doesn't seem concerned at all for depth of interpersonal relationships, one of the core elements of Fi.
Oh, yeah, and I rooted for Light. I think his vision of the world would make for a better society - a society with strictly defined rules of conduct, strict law, and strict penalties - which leads to adherence to said law. A conductive, organic society, in other words.
Last edited by CloudCuckooLander; 12-31-2010 at 11:22 PM.
2-subtype system: IEI-Fe
8-subtype system: D-IEI-Fe
16-subtype system: IEI-ESE
IEI-Fe 2w3 > p6w5 > 8w7 sx/so
"He who has felt the deepest grief is best able to experience supreme happiness. We must have felt what it is to die, that we may appreciate the enjoyments of living." - Edmond Dantes (The Count of Monte Cristo, Alexandre Dumas père)
Lol @ Light as Sensing.
Excerpt from Reinen's Book (INTj's use of
Sound familiar to any of you?“The world should live in harmony, people deserve to be happy", says a Robespierre, "so let's take a guillotine and chop off heads of all bad people who hamper our creation so that only good ones remain and everyone will be happy. Let's build a society free of the bad people, oppression, violence, injustice … But this purpose is achieved by means of a guillotine”. This is how this type expresses his creativity.
ILI (FINAL ANSWER)
Ne also includes considering multiple ways in which events could unfold, and operating under all of those premises. Light seems to have only one vision of how the future could unfold, which gets him into trouble on numerous occasions as it leaves him unprepared. L, by contrast, never ignores a possibility - he clearly shows Ne.Lol @ Light as Sensing.
Excerpt from Reinen's Book (INTj's use of
Sound familiar to any of you?
Additionally, Wikisocion's Se definition:
That driven nature describes Light to the T.Extroverted sensing (Se) is an extroverted, irrational, and static information element. It is also called Se, F, volitional sensing, or black sensing.
Se includes the ability to know how much power, force, or influence is latent or required.
Types that value Se are much more comfortable with direct behavior aimed at making an immediate impact. This may at times be perceived as abrasive, particularly by types who do not value Se. There is usually a competitive edge to this style of group interaction, resulting in a more intense atmosphere than that of introverted sensing (Si)-valuing quadras. They appreciate contemplating possibilities only if they feel like they stand to gain something from it, or it has a perceived potential impact on "the real world".
Unlike Si, which is about one's subjective sensory experience (how intense or enjoyable it is), Se is about achieving an object of desire. It gives one the ability to influence, bend, and push situations and people in order to achieve such an object, rather than to enjoy the situation one is in.
Plus, Wikisocion's definition of LSI's creative function:
That maneuvering for power and vantage points to gain leverage over his enemies, decisively enforcing rules and punishing violators - that's what Light always does.2. Se Extraverted Sensing
LSIs prefer to apply their clear, logical thinking to forcibly affect how the real world is organized, rather than simply producing conjectures or thought exercises that have no material application. LSIs prefer to work with systems of "real" things — material assets, organizations, management, and production — and to perfect their structure and organization (Ti). When they are certain they are right, LSIs can act decisively to enforce rules, and, if necessary, to punish violators, in order to protect the integrity of the system.
LSIs handle high-pressure situations well and can maneuver skillfully around obstacles to achieve their goals. They cannot be intimidated easily by displays of force or aggression, but follow closely the balance of power and make sure they are in the best position.
2-subtype system: IEI-Fe
8-subtype system: D-IEI-Fe
16-subtype system: IEI-ESE
IEI-Fe 2w3 > p6w5 > 8w7 sx/so
"He who has felt the deepest grief is best able to experience supreme happiness. We must have felt what it is to die, that we may appreciate the enjoyments of living." - Edmond Dantes (The Count of Monte Cristo, Alexandre Dumas père)
So you would say Light is more physically aggressive than spiritually aggressive, I'd presume?
ILI (FINAL ANSWER)
I actually like LII > LSI. The whole point of the series seems to be that Light goes bad due to following his ideals more and more while having a steadily weakening grasp on the real world.
I would say Light is bent on punishing violators of his personal code of law, which fits the very definition of Se-creative. He's not generally directly aggressive, but he also showed in the scene where he got into a fist-fight with L that he's not afraid to be directly aggressive when need be, when the vantage point is most beneficial for leverage.So you would say Light is more physically aggressive than spiritually aggressive, I'd presume?
Oh, and from the Ne-PoLR definition:
I seem to recall quite a few of these childish tantrums when Light fails to meet his goals, and even when an obstacle to said goals presents itself. It's what attracted L's attention in the first place. Not to mention his incoherent psychotic tantrum at the end of the series.They set clearly achievable goals, which they often reach. Failure to meet these goals causes the LSI to express anger and lose control of his emotions in the form of a seemingly childish tantrum.
2-subtype system: IEI-Fe
8-subtype system: D-IEI-Fe
16-subtype system: IEI-ESE
IEI-Fe 2w3 > p6w5 > 8w7 sx/so
"He who has felt the deepest grief is best able to experience supreme happiness. We must have felt what it is to die, that we may appreciate the enjoyments of living." - Edmond Dantes (The Count of Monte Cristo, Alexandre Dumas père)
That's all I needed to know.
I actually haven't thoroughly analyzed the show as of yet (only watched all 30-sumthin episodes once). I'd like to make a list of all these character's types but it will probably take me days or even weeks, as I go for quality over quantity. If I come to absolute certainty on a few character's types I might post them up here.
ILI (FINAL ANSWER)
Death Note
Update
Light- LSI-Ne, 1w2 so/sx (INTJ)
L- LII-Ne, 5w4 sx/sp (INTP)
Mello- SEE-Ne, 3w4 so/sp (ENFP)
Near- LII-Ne, 5w6 sp/so (INTJ)
Misa- EIE-Se, 2w1 sx/so (ENFJ)
Ryuk- SEI-Ne, 7w6 sp/sx (ISTP)
Higuchi- LSI-Te, 8w7 sp/so (ENTJ)
Mikami- LSI-Ti, 1w9 so/sp (ISTJ)
Takada- EIE-Ti, 1w2 sx/so (ENFJ)
Matsuda- EIE-Se, 1w2 so/sx (ENFP)
Soichiro Yagami- LSI-Ti, 6w5 so/sp (ISTJ)
Aizawa- SLE-Ti, 6w7 sx/so (ESTJ)
Mogi- LSI-Ti, 1w2 so/sp (ISTJ)
Watari- SEI-Si 1w2 sx/sp (INFJ)
What do these signs mean—
Just one example: in MBTI, Se (extraverted sensing) is associated with life pleasures, excitement etc. By contrast, the socionic function
For this reason, we consider comparison between MBTI types and socionic types by functions to be rather useless than useful.
-Victor Gulenko, Dmitri Lytov
Put pics of them so I can VI, lol
I don't strongly object to ESI for Light, but his sense of JUSTICE appears too generalized for-- it seems rather clearly Aristocratic (what with giving all criminals, even jaywalkers, the literal axe, for example).
L seems pretty Si-valuing, what with being a sweet-addicted pervert and stuff.
What do these signs mean—
Just one example: in MBTI, Se (extraverted sensing) is associated with life pleasures, excitement etc. By contrast, the socionic function
For this reason, we consider comparison between MBTI types and socionic types by functions to be rather useless than useful.
-Victor Gulenko, Dmitri Lytov
Aleksei u r wrong.
Well, you are better off if you back up that statement -- preferably employing correct spelling.
What do these signs mean—
Just one example: in MBTI, Se (extraverted sensing) is associated with life pleasures, excitement etc. By contrast, the socionic function
For this reason, we consider comparison between MBTI types and socionic types by functions to be rather useless than useful.
-Victor Gulenko, Dmitri Lytov
lol I was just kidding with you. I dont really agree with your typings of some of these charasters, but I dont see any point in discussing it.Well, you are better off if you back up that statement -- preferably employing correct spelling.
Fictionally speaking, L is unhealthy. His Ti is neurotic, probably a result of feeling unsafe and wanting to figure things out to gain security. He has no actual friends, is probably a schizoid, and has a high distrust of everyone. His diet is supposedly full of sweets and caffeine to keep him going from lack of sleep and he doesn't seem to have much concern for his overall well-being over his desire to figure or predict everyone/everything out.
The ego functions aren't supposed to be unhealthy. It wouldn't make any sense. The super-id is an unconscious area where Jungian neurosis and obsession stem from. If you were to suggest LII, then he would have to either be neurotic from Si (focusing on the details of objects - firsthand impressions) or Fe (focusing on being personally passionate with other people).
But he instead is concerned with estimating (secondhand impressions) and neurotically understanding and predicting the people around him. The whole show is basically him confronting Light and trying to stop him. Why would an Se-PoLR do that? Why would it make any sense to attribute unhealthy aspects to the ego?
Here's what I came up with, if anyone cares. I supplied some basic reasoning so you can follow how I came up with it.
I use a method of typing that's a bit different than MBTI/socionics.
Basically, how I see it, the unconscious functions follow the conscious ones.
And they are continuously updated by the ego, their expression more of a test on the competence of the ego.
So I came up with
L - Ni-Fe //Fe because he gets to know people to analyze/figure things out. He's more considerate in this regard too over Te.
Near - Ni-Te //Te because he gathers information about how a situation leads to another
Light - Te-Ni //Reminds me more of Jung's Te and his Ni is used to determine the best course of action
Mello - Se-Fi could work. He does fit Jung's Se better than anything else, imo. Te would be his way of testing his ego over Fe.
L and Near both seem to fit Jung's Ni.
How about applying DnD alignments to Light?
I'd say Chaotic Good, although the conviction reeks of unique lawfulness of a strange variety.
The police is mostly lawful, especially Light's father. L on the other hand might be NG.
This is how serious I'm about typing people.
“I tell you, freedom and human rights in America are doomed. The U.S. government will lead the American people in — and the West in general — into an unbearable hell and a choking life. - Osama bin Laden
I haven't seen the show in a couple of years, but from what I remember, L seemed more True Neutral. Now I want to go back and watch the first season again, though instead of doing this paper. Thanks for that.
Glad to be of assistance.
I'm rewatching the whole series.
True Neutral also seems to have a good viewpoint.
He comes off as a cold neglected person with serious issues (or maybe just Fe PoLR) and deceives himself with his sense of absolute justice.
I still believe he's a good person. Better than most of the pussies unable to make a kill perceived righteous even if you wouldn't need to actually do anything besides write a name. It's a virtue to be cold and calculative when fighting evil.
Then again I don't believe in:
Absolute moral
Death sentence like that to be effective in making a better world
I'd still use Death Note if I would be handed one, but killing convicts sounds like an old testament style "eye for an eye" thing.
“I tell you, freedom and human rights in America are doomed. The U.S. government will lead the American people in — and the West in general — into an unbearable hell and a choking life. - Osama bin Laden
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