I think I may be an ILI after all (Questions on Intertype Relations)

[Manatroid92]

So, a bit of background, I guess.
I've been hanging around on this forum for maybe about a year now, and at some point late last year made a 'Type Me' thread, as one does (if anyone wants to see it can be found here: https://www.the16types.info/vbulleti...re-Manatroid92).

After bouncing between several types, some months ago it was suggested for what - at the time - seemed like a decent enough reason that I was EIE-Harmonising (Dialectic-Algorithmic Cognitive Style). After mulling over and looking at type descriptions I came to eventually agree with the typing: sure, I'm a reserved person, but I'm also quite prone to doubt and hesitation, and in the past I've even had my emotional moments, some of which involved breakdowns. Even when I had doubted the suggested typing, I still came back around to EIE several times.

Come to today, I had a small conversation with my mum (who knows me pretty well) and kind of asked indirectly-related typology questions regarding myself. From what she said, it made it appear that my strengths were more Te-related than Fe- or even Fi-related. I wasn't too surprised by this, but it did make me think on my typing again for another reason.

My partner is an ESI, almost no question about it. The idea of someone being highly knowledgeable is very appealing to her (she has said so herself), highly economically minded, she is definitely strong in Se, and she doesn't value Ne at all. Before, it seemed to me that us being Mirage-relations made the most sense, but looking at Activity relations on Wiki-socion I found a quote that, among a few other bits and pieces, I couldn't help but consider...

one property of activation relations: once you spend several days away from each other all the differences and disagreements are forgotten

...which, thinking back, is pretty apt in regards to all the times that we have been apart for various reasons and then come back together. I always knew this was true of Activity relations, actually, but looking at it again makes me re-think everything over again.

To be fair, while I'm not an intensively emotional person, I *can* be quite expressive/comical and over-the-top at times. I know that type descriptions can be really detrimental to typing someone on their own, of course, but as far as ILI-descriptions go, one would think they're the most uncongenial and humourless people on Earth (and heck, maybe that's true in relative terms)! The other thing is, though, that I pretty much don't care much about money/profit at all, and money is supposedly a very consistent theme with Gamma/Delta types. ILIs are also supposedly very meticulous/thorough with details, and I've, on occasion, been quite sloppy instead.

That being said, I think the posters I find most interesting on the forum tend to be Gamma-people as well, so all things considered, being an ILI is not out of the realm of possibility.

Any thoughts are welcome to be posted, though I guess this was as much for getting my thoughts out as it was asking for opinions from other ILIs/Gammas.

[The Reality Denialist]

So tragic DA type? Lol. Makes sense.
It is strange that supervision types may resemble each other so much.

Do you have clear mood swings (goes from 0 to 100 suddenly, maybe several times on a daily basis) or just long lasting alterations? The former is closer to ILI and latter EIE.

[godslave]

So tragic DA type? Lol. Makes sense.
It is strange that supervision types may resemble each other so much.

Do you have clear mood swings (goes from 0 to 100 suddenly, maybe several times on a daily basis) or just long lasting alterations? The former is closer to ILI and latter EIE.

The same idea came to my mind just before reading your post ! The supervision ring looks like this in my mind :

 

[godslave]

Do you resonate with this social mission ? : "To create motivation for the discovery of abilities, to risk for the sake of an idea" (Fe Ne)
or this one ? : "Predict the course of events and take steps to balance the system" ( Ni Ti )

Source : https://varlawend.blogspot.com/2018/...planation.html

Have you ever thought of being an influencer, a teacher or unlocking the potential of the masses ?

EDIT :

one property of activation relations: once you spend several days away from each other all the differences and disagreements are forgotten

I think that this could be applied to any person who has established a strong bound with another person. For instance, parents, or any other family members especially siblings etc.. The chance that one finds oneself in an activation ITR with all his loved ones is close to 0.

[Manatroid92]

So tragic DA type? Lol. Makes sense.
It is strange that supervision types may resemble each other so much.

Do you have clear mood swings (goes from 0 to 100 suddenly, maybe several times on a daily basis) or just long lasting alterations? The former is closer to ILI and latter EIE.

Tragic indeed, haha.

Good question about the mood swings, though I'm not sure how well I can answer. I don't even know if I quite have swings per se, because generally speaking I'll probably know if something recently happened has caused my mood to be in a certain state. Example: it's the weekend, I've woken up in a decent mood, do my usual morning routine, after which I start finding something a game to play, only for indecision to set in about what I want to play, doubting and doubting away until more than a couple hours have passed and I haven't done anything. Obviously my mood has dimmed at this point, though no-one would be able to know why unless I explicitly told them (which I won't, haha).

Sometimes I'm just moody though and don't really know why, though this is less often.

Apologies if the answer wasn't very clear.

Do you resonate with this social mission ? : "To create motivation for the discovery of abilities, to risk for the sake of an idea" (Fe Ne)
or this one ? : "Predict the course of events and take steps to balance the system" ( Ni Ti )

Source : https://varlawend.blogspot.com/2018/...planation.html

Have you ever thought of being an influencer, a teacher or unlocking the potential of the masses ?

Out of the two, its hard to say. I like the sound of both of them, but if you were to go by how I spend my time, the latter is *maybe* closer? I'm a very risk-averse person in general.
I *kind of* liked the idea of being a teacher at one point (almost everyone in my family is), though it was never something I really wanted to do, and to be honest managing students just sounds like an outright pain.
I was a fan of acting/theatre studies in school so that was a plan I had, though I developed some anxiety issues and eventually never saw much potential in myself for that. So I ended up doing a game design university course, got married and now have a boring (but stable) part-time job.

[godslave]

Out of the two, its hard to say. I like the sound of both of them, but if you were to go by how I spend my time, the latter is *maybe* closer? I'm a very risk-averse person in general.
I *kind of* liked the idea of being a teacher at one point (almost everyone in my family is), though it was never something I really wanted to do, and to be honest managing students just sounds like an outright pain.
I was a fan of acting/theatre studies in school so that was a plan I had, though I developed some anxiety issues and eventually never saw much potential in myself for that. So I ended up doing a game design university course, got married and now have a boring (but stable) part-time job.

Interesting, one thing I'm sure of is that you need some Fe when it comes to acting, you just need it period. Now, ILI in general are not fans of acting those who do often find themself playing the same kind of roles (not very emotionally expressive). I concede however, that with passion and hard work anyone can achieve a somewhat acceptable level of acting skills. I suspect nonetheless that ILIs who achieved a good level in acting might have a Fe accentuation or have at least developed it in the process. It would be interesting to know what your teachers thought about your acting skills. Did they support and encourage you in this direction ?

[Manatroid92]

Interesting, one thing I'm sure of is that you need some Fe when it comes to acting, you just need it period. Now, ILI in general are not fans of acting those who do often find themself playing the same kind of roles (not very emotionally expressive). I concede however, that with passion and hard work anyone can achieve a somewhat acceptable level of acting skills. I suspect nonetheless that ILIs who achieved a good level in acting might have a Fe accentuation or have at least developed it in the process. It would be interesting to know what your teachers thought about your acting skills. Did they support and encourage you in this direction ?

Weirdly, I never asked them directly what they thought about my skills exactly, because I didn't want to find out on the off chance that it wasn't a good direction for me. But the thing is, out of the people who auditioned, I did end up getting fairly prominent support roles (or in some cases, niche comical roles that required higher levels of energy), and I was never criticized for not having enough energy or emotion, and the teacher we did have in the later years of school took her job fairly seriously.

I got into it in the first place because my first drama teacher persuaded myself and my good friend at the time (think he may be IEE) to do it, though it didn't take me much convincing because my older brother had done it before and I thought if he could do it I should do okay too, haha.

[The Reality Denialist]

Tragic indeed, haha.

Good question about the mood swings, though I'm not sure how well I can answer. I don't even know if I quite have swings per se, because generally speaking I'll probably know if something recently happened has caused my mood to be in a certain state. Example: it's the weekend, I've woken up in a decent mood, do my usual morning routine, after which I start finding something a game to play, only for indecision to set in about what I want to play, doubting and doubting away until more than a couple hours have passed and I haven't done anything. Obviously my mood has dimmed at this point, though no-one would be able to know why unless I explicitly told them (which I won't, haha).

Sometimes I'm just moody though and don't really know why, though this is less often.

Apologies if the answer wasn't very clear.

I think this answers it. It sounds stable. You said you have no reason to loose your temper or change your mood. An ILI can be very emotional and an EIE can be very rational hence "logical". (I have posted a typing video of myself in anything goes section in which I highly doubted of not being logical.)

[The Reality Denialist]

BTW. About your mental breakdowns. I have had 2-3 resets in my life. Those have developed pretty slowly but I have recollected myself successfully after rather long pauses.

[DogOfDanger]

It is impossible to truly be an ILI, socionics model A is incoherent.

[Renna]

I think ILI can make jokes, but "over-the-top" seem to be something need at least 2D Fe.

One of the rare ILI character I found in fiction, and one of the rare Anime that actually have NTs as main character (LII, LIE, ILI)

[Manatroid92]

I think this answers it. It sounds stable. You said you have no reason to loose your temper or change your mood. An ILI can be very emotional and an EIE can be very rational hence "logical". (I have posted a typing video of myself in anything goes section in which I highly doubted of not being logical.)

This is helpful to know. Thanks!

BTW. About your mental breakdowns. I have had 2-3 resets in my life. Those have developed pretty slowly but I have recollected myself successfully after rather long pauses.

In my worst instances I’ve been kind of catatonic for maybe a 30-minute period, and it’s only when I’ve stuffed up something really bad and been blamed for it, but it’s only happened a handful of times and only after a previously stressful sequence of events. And generally when I get into arguments I can regulate my emotions if they hadn’t been plugged like a volcano (or again, stress).

[Hot Scalding Gayser]

The Fe polr in male ILIs is a lot more anviliciously obvious than the Fe polr in female ILIs... so to me a female ILI would be a more 'EIE like' than a male ILI.

Ur going from 4D Fe ego to something being ur polr? That's kind of bizarre, makes me think maybe u were in envrionments where people treated ur ego like shit and gave u complexes based on who u r. This abuse doesn't have to be that obvious either, it can be really subtle and insidious that constantly chipped away at ur self-esteem. But I don't know... I could be wrong just a theory.

[on a peaceful hiatus]

Te doesn't give a shit about socionics and will not wonder for years about their own type.

[nifl]

Te doesn't give a shit about socionics and will not wonder for years about their own type.

Te types have valued Fi, which leads to an interest in relationships and what they're emotionally attracted to/repulsed by. They will rarely wonder for years about their own type, I agree, because of the methods to decide on it being more evident to these types - unless they're a more atypical person.

@Manatroid92
Try to make a typing video, to get some opinions based on your real-life behaviour. Also, forget about DCNH and Cognitive Styles, at least until you've discovered whether you find the base theory convincing or not; It'll only make finding your type more difficult for yourself.

[Manatroid92]

The Fe polr in male ILIs is a lot more anviliciously obvious than the Fe polr in female ILIs... so to me a female ILI would be a more 'EIE like' than a male ILI.

Ur going from 4D Fe ego to something being ur polr? That's kind of bizarre, makes me think maybe u were in envrionments where people treated ur ego like shit and gave u complexes based on who u r. This abuse doesn't have to be that obvious either, it can be really subtle and insidious that constantly chipped away at ur self-esteem. But I don't know... I could be wrong just a theory.

I know, yeah, going from base to vulnerable sounds pretty ridiculous, haha.
I wouldn't say that I've been abused at all throughout my life, unless there happened to be supervision/conflict relations when I was younger and it affected me development in some way. I did definitely develop some anxiety either throughout high school or not long afterwards, and was mostly able to deal with it afterwards (I'd been diagnosed as autistic around the time I started high-school, and having knowledge of it at the time may have made be much more self-conscious about expressing myself than I otherwise would have been).
But my family's always been supportive of me, the only real 'trauma' that I could remotely point to is that my father suffered from PTSD after he came back from Iraq, and during the time he was away things were stressful for my mum so I made an effort to get along with my siblings better.

Te types have valued Fi, which leads to an interest in relationships and what they're emotionally attracted to/repulsed by. They will rarely wonder for years about their own type, I agree, because of the methods to decide on it being more evident to these types - unless they're a more atypical person.

@Manatroid92
Try to make a typing video, to get some opinions based on your real-life behaviour. Also, forget about DCNH and Cognitive Styles, at least until you've discovered whether you find the base theory convincing or not; It'll only make finding your type more difficult for yourself.

Yeah, when I think about it, me being a Te/Fi valuer doesn't really make much sense, but at the same time it can be hard to outright discard the possibility.
I have two typing videos in the thread I included in my first post of this thread. If you think it's worth doing another one I could (I've gotten a bit more used to being on camera now), but I'd recommend checking the others if you haven't already.

[Manatroid92]

Te doesn't give a shit about socionics and will not wonder for years about their own type.

Generally speaking, I'd agree. Fi/Te valuers aren't looking to consternate on what a relatively Ti-based system is telling them about people. There's no real 'productivity' to be gained from engaging in it (not yet, at least), and Ti-vulnerable types are less likely to engage deeply with it in the long-term unless they had specific reasons to do so.

But there are still a number of officially-typed people here who clearly *are* Te-valuers too, so they at least do study it.

Also, I've only been stuck on Socionics for 1 year, thank you!

[on a peaceful hiatus]

Also, I've only been stuck on Socionics for 1 year, thank you!

I've confused your name with the user Megatrop who frequently posts in chat. My bad

[Manatroid92]

I think this answers it. It sounds stable. You said you have no reason to loose your temper or change your mood. An ILI can be very emotional and an EIE can be very rational hence "logical". (I have posted a typing video of myself in anything goes section in which I highly doubted of not being logical.)

@Sanguine Miasma I had a look through the section and I wasn't able to find the thread, would you mind posting it here or PMing it to me so I could take a look?

[crazymaisy]

ILI get the FE failure more from living with familiar people, that is SO or family mostly, mood swings I look at as Motivation To Do or To Quit or to Change to Something Else pretty much how ILI mood swings are in their head IMO.

If, then, else; up, or down, else over.

[Manatroid92]

ILI get the FE failure more from living with familiar people, that is SO or family mostly, mood swings I look at as Motivation To Do or To Quit or to Change to Something Else pretty much how ILI mood swings are in their head IMO.

If, then, else; up, or down, else over.

That makes sense, because from what I understand, it's being in close relation to people where Sociotypes/Functions/IEs become most prominent, so if one has Fe-vulnerable, it's most likely to be a bigger issue when they're stuck with people that just being out in public.

And yeah, I recognize you demonstrating DA there, haha.

[The Reality Denialist]

@Sanguine Miasma I had a look through the section and I wasn't able to find the thread, would you mind posting it here or PMing it to me so I could take a look?

https://www.the16types.info/vbulleti...=1#post1526197

[Manatroid92]

https://www.the16types.info/vbulleti...=1#post1526197

I don’t have access to my computer at the moment, but thanks for this! Will look at it tomorrow.

[Manatroid92]

https://www.the16types.info/vbulleti...=1#post1526197

I've had a watch of the video, you seem like a pretty cool guy.

I can agree with G's typing of you that you seem like an Ethical type, emoting seems to come fairly naturally to you (ie. it's performative like Fe is, but it doesn't feel very forced either).
I know in my older videos I'm much more subdued by comparison, so I might consider making a new video and see how it compares to yours.

Thanks again for sharing the vid.

[Manatroid92]

Posted a short video in the Anything Goes section as well, if anyone's interested.

https://www.the16types.info/vbulleti...=1#post1528443

[Metaphor]

Hm, I watched your video, and it somewhat reminds me of a famous author: do you know uh, Osamu Dazai from No Longer Human?

[Metaphor]

L also was an ILI.

[The Reality Denialist]

Yeah. ILI might make sense. That or IEI. You seem to have a distant subtype. N or H. I suppose especially that kindred H subtypes may resemble both types.


I mean there is one EIE ho thought being SEI... so.

[Manatroid92]

Hm, I watched your video, and it somewhat reminds me of a famous author: do you know uh, Osamu Dazai from No Longer Human?

I don’t know him, no, but I did look up him up just now, and he does kind of look like an ILI would (if VI is relevant to the discussion anyway), and why you’d relate me to him.
It’s a fairly said/tortured look that is supposedly common to ILI in general, like he’d tell you how the world is/will be with no fancifulness.

EDIT:

EDIT :

I think that this could be applied to any person who has established a strong bound with another person. For instance, parents, or any other family members especially siblings etc.. The chance that one finds oneself in an activation ITR with all his loved ones is close to 0.

Sorry @godslave, I think I missed this edit comment before.
Yeah, you're right in that regard. I'm thinking that's not itself an indication of Activity relations, so I won't use that as evidence for ILI

[Metaphor]

I don’t know him, no, but I did look up him up just now, and he does kind of look like an ILI would (if VI is relevant to the discussion anyway), and why you’d relate me to him.
It’s a fairly said/tortured look that is supposedly common to ILI in general, like he’d tell you how the world is/will be with no fancifulness.

I understood about your ILI impression for him, but I'm certain that he was, in fact, an EIE or, to be exact, Ni & Harmonizing subtype as well. He didn't show any Te, but he seemed to play himself as a character with a deep concern towards the usefulness of society. However, his Fe was very obvious, especially when he had explained about his own emotion. I suggest you watching this video below for more details:

[Manatroid92]

I understood about your ILI impression for him, but I'm certain that he was, in fact, an EIE or, to be exact, Ni & Harmonizing subtype as well. He didn't show any Te, but he seemed to play himself as a character with a deep concern towards the usefulness of society. However, his Fe was very obvious, especially when he had explained about his own emotion. I suggest you watching this video below for more details:

Ack, sorry I saw your other comment mentioning ILI and I mixed the two together.

From the video I can definitely see what you mean, he does have a more humanitarian lean than what an ILI might have (not saying they can’t, of course, it’s just that it’s not ‘the norm’). Like it seems he is remembered as quite soulful and poetic, which is more typical of NFs.

[Hot Scalding Gayser]

You just seem way too nice to be ILI. ILIs are often bully sadistic assholes, especially if male. but I've met a few female ILIs like that as well. an iLI also would never use the phrase over the top to describe themselves even if they were being over the top somehow, the very thought would make them cringe and hurt their Fe polr but 4D Fe would be that way easily.....

Fe is the 'nice' function. It's the warmth function that brings social harmony and cohesion - its kinda like when SLE is healthy they will use their mediocre 2D Fe to bring people together. An absence of Fe is just pure cold- like an ILI sadistically analyzing something but it doesn't have any human appeal. It's not that the ILI is completely heartless themselves necessarily, but cuz they value Fi and have Fe polr- it won't be showy.

EIEs have 2D Te, and so you wouldn't be completely retarded at Te-ish things. 2D functions are underrated, usually people are quite good at figuring them out. Like as long as a course is Ti logic and not Te logic I will be very good at it even tho I'm an ethical type but as an ethical type I can't consistently care so much about logical stuff anyway because of how boring it is to me.

You might just let the stupid and bad stereotypes of EIEs go to your head. All jokes aside who in their right minds would want to be part of a type that is the cause of all the world's suffering according to X? Also Gulenko has these weird ideals of EIE because he has a supposedly EIE wife and that seems misguided as well. People on this site can be malicious assholes (I should say 'myself included' but whatever, that should be naturally implied- that's yet another way people are assholes) and I wouldn't let it get to u.

[Hot Scalding Gayser]

oh it seems ILIs will apologize for being assholes kinda if they sense some Fi connection between u but only until then. I've had that happen before when a Fi bond was forming that I didn't even really know was forming. so I don't want it to seem like I was calling ILI = asshole in a campy way but ehhh it is still campy and true cuz my school had A LOT of ILI bullies.

[Manatroid92]

You just seem way too nice to be ILI. ILIs are often bully sadistic assholes, especially if male. but I've met a few female ILIs like that as well. an iLI also would never use the phrase over the top to describe themselves even if they were being over the top somehow, the very thought would make them cringe and hurt their Fe polr but 4D Fe would be that way easily.....

Fe is the 'nice' function. It's the warmth function that brings social harmony and cohesion - its kinda like when SLE is healthy they will use their mediocre 2D Fe to bring people together. An absence of Fe is just pure cold- like an ILI sadistically analyzing something but it doesn't have any human appeal. It's not that the ILI is completely heartless themselves necessarily, but cuz they value Fi and have Fe polr- it won't be showy.

EIEs have 2D Te, and so you wouldn't be completely retarded at Te-ish things. 2D functions are underrated, usually people are quite good at figuring them out. Like as long as a course is Ti logic and not Te logic I will be very good at it even tho I'm an ethical type but as an ethical type I can't consistently care so much about logical stuff anyway because of how boring it is to me.

You might just let the stupid and bad stereotypes of EIEs go to your head. All jokes aside who in their right minds would want to be part of a type that is the cause of all the world's suffering according to X? Also Gulenko has these weird ideals of EIE because he has a supposedly EIE wife and that seems misguided as well. People on this site can be malicious assholes (I should say 'myself included' but whatever, that should be naturally implied- that's yet another way people are assholes) and I wouldn't let it get to u.

Yeah, I’m slowly beginning to agree with the notion that I’m very likely not an ILI. As you said, as an ethical type it’s difficult to give too much attention to ‘logical’ things because they get boring; I think I feel that way too, and that it’s more in my affinity to be ‘ethical’ than logical (also, privately I sometimes realise how inconsistent I can be with my own logic; I do care about being consistent but it’s very easy to incidentally glide over it).

And yeah, stereotypes/negativity are always going to exist, and we shouldn’t put too much stock in them, I’m 100% certain there’s very awesome people of each type who understand they are not good at some things, and try to improve them instead of just being crappy people and not caring about it.

I feel pretty certain about being a Beta NF now, but it’s hard to figure out which one: I’m a generally pretty impractical individual, but I do not know if that’s due to low-Si or low-Te (I feel shitty about both/either of them at different times).

EDIT: Or alternatively, figuring out if I value Ti or Se more. I don’t know if I prefer to be kept under watch in my house by an LSI Judge Dredd, or if I want to be dragged around by an SLE barbarian warlord.

[Bethanyclaire]

I’ve met ILIs who could be described as ‘gentle spirits’ before, in case this helps. And EIEs you could describe as ‘boring’. Not saying you’re boring lol. But sometimes non-stereotypical descriptions are handy.

actually being a pretty weird, subtypey IEI, I consider myself to share both those traits

[Hot Scalding Gayser]

Yeah, I’m slowly beginning to agree with the notion that I’m very likely not an ILI. As you said, as an ethical type it’s difficult to give too much attention to ‘logical’ things because they get boring; I think I feel that way too, and that it’s more in my affinity to be ‘ethical’ than logical (also, privately I sometimes realise how inconsistent I can be with my own logic; I do care about being consistent but it’s very easy to incidentally glide over it).

And yeah, stereotypes/negativity are always going to exist, and we shouldn’t put too much stock in them, I’m 100% certain there’s very awesome people of each type who understand they are not good at some things, and try to improve them instead of just being crappy people and not caring about it.

I feel pretty certain about being a Beta NF now, but it’s hard to figure out which one: I’m a generally pretty impractical individual, but I do not know if that’s due to low-Si or low-Te (I feel shitty about both/either of them at different times).

EDIT: Or alternatively, figuring out if I value Ti or Se more. I don’t know if I prefer to be kept under watch in my house by an LSI Judge Dredd, or if I want to be dragged around by an SLE barbarian warlord.

An LSI can do both really. and so can SLE. Mirrors are mirrors!

I think ur EIE-Ni if not maybe IEI-Fe.