What's up with LII-IEI relationships in particular?

[Ryan]

How many LII cops do you believe work in the streets?

Hardly any.

Which tells me how much of a moron you probably are.

Please walk up to an LII & punch him in the face, harm their family or their spouse cause you'll regret doing that. To suggest an LII will cry and just avoid those particular types of conflict either means you are stupid or you take socionics definitions too seriously.

LIIs will protect people they love. It may or may not be through Se but they will protect them

Yeah, but it's still a painful experience. If LIIs have to resort to violence to fend off for themselves or others they will be miserable and will dread whoever/whatever put them in that situation. To suggest that LIIs will enter a relationship with IEIs to provide any kind of protection is such a huge stretch. LIIs don't subscribe to caveman mentality/theories. Also, you could at least entertain the idea and ask further clarification instead of blowing him off since the person you replied to initially is an LII and presumably speaking from his own experience. How presumptuous of you to speak on behalf of LIIs while not being one.

"With other children they are usually well-wishing and gentle, try to maintain stable relations and avoid conflict situations, and especially physical confrontations. Most of all they dislike being pressured into having to resolve heated issues by direct forceful measures."

[Stray Cat]

Hardly any.

Yeah, but it's still a painful experience. If LIIs have to resort to violence to fend off for themselves or others they will be miserable and will dread whoever/whatever put them in that situation. To suggest that LIIs will enter a relationship with IEIs to provide any kind of protection is such a huge stretch. LIIs don't subscribe to caveman mentality/theories. Also, you could at least entertain the idea and ask further clarification instead of blowing him off since the person you replied to initially is an LII and presumably speaking from his own experience. How presumptuous of you to speak on behalf of LIIs while not being one.

"With other children they are usually well-wishing and gentle, try to maintain stable relations and avoid conflict situations, and especially physical confrontations. Most of all they dislike being pressured into having to resolve heated issues by direct forceful measures."

First of all, there are a bunch of LII cops walking the streets every single day and there are also LIIs who are in the armed forces protecting the very country you live.

Secondly, just because confrontation may be uncomfortable for them does not mean that they will not ultimately protect people they love or are responsible for.

I never said LIIs would enter relationships assuming it their duty to protect an IEI and as for the LIIs here who actually do fear the idea of protecting others are probably just sheltered internet wimps. It isn't simply because they are LII

There's a difference between the dislike or non-preference of using force to protecting others and just completely shying away from it because that person is an absolute pussy

[Ryan]

First of all, there are a bunch of LII cops walking the streets every single day and there are also LIIs who are in the armed forces protecting the very country you live.

Hardly any doesn't mean zero, what are you even arguing for?

I never said LIIs would enter relationships assuming it their duty to protect an IEI

This is you?

LII seem to take pride in being protective and responsible toward their loved ones. IEI seem to appreciate being under somebody's protective wing

Taking "pride" in being protective and responsible toward their loved ones sounds like something an SLE would say, it's not in LII's vocabulary. You are simply wrong in this instance.

[Stray Cat]

Hardly any doesn't mean zero, what are you even arguing for?


This is you?

Taking "pride" in being protective and responsible toward their loved ones sounds like something an SLE would say, it's not in LII's vocabulary. You are simply wrong in this instance.

I'll rephrase it. There are a lot of LIIs working as cops or members of the armed forces

You live in a bubble. A person's type doesn't define them the way you're suggesting it must. People are not automatons. An LII with a wife & children may live by different principles than an LII who simply does not. People cannot be herded into fixed behavior no matter how strongly you believe a particular psychological system.

What I am suggesting is that, when necessary, an LII can tap into their inner bravery and that, yes, an LII can take pride in being able to protect whom they hold dear. It does not mean they will brag about it. In fact, there are plenty of MMA fighters and martial arts practitioners who are LII. A person can be LII but he or she is also human, first

I do agree that an LII would not want to be pressured into that type of behavior, however

[Ryan]

@Stray Cat If you are protesting this much, I'd like to hear your conclusion to your own question in the title, since you don't seem interested in LIIs answers.

[Lord Pixel]

Which tells me how much of a moron you probably are.

Please walk up to an LII & punch him in the face, harm their family or their spouse cause you'll regret doing that. To suggest an LII will cry and just avoid those particular types of conflict either means you are stupid or you take socionics definitions too seriously.

LIIs will protect people they love. It may or may not be through Se but they will protect them

Whoa buddy lol, calm down, it ain't that serious, I don't even remember what this was about.

[Exodus]

First of all, there are a bunch of LII cops walking the streets every single day and there are also LIIs who are in the armed forces protecting the very country you live.

Secondly, just because confrontation may be uncomfortable for them does not mean that they will not ultimately protect people they love or are responsible for.

You seem to have missed the point. Nowhere did I say that it was impossible for an LII to protect someone if they have to (or to be a cop or whatever), but this is not something that they are proactive about or "take pride in" as you suggested, certainly not compared to many other types, such as LSI.

[Stray Cat]

You seem to have missed the point. Nowhere did I say that it was impossible for an LII to protect someone if they have to (or to be a cop or whatever), but this is not something that they are proactive about or "take pride in" as you suggested, certainly not compared to many other types, such as LSI.

I didn't

You actually dismissed the context. I said an LII would take pride in protecting someone they loved. I didn't say they would be prideful as a character trait but rather they would be proud they could be in a position to protect a loved one. In this context, pride refers to a responsibility that they, very well, understand the circumstances. My original point suggested that if an LII were dating an IEI, that the LII would take it upon his or herself to ensure that the IEI would be protected from harm. The LII would not brag about it but, instead, understand it as their responsibility.

[lynn]

I didn't

You actually dismissed the context. I said an LII would take pride in protecting someone they loved. I didn't say they would be prideful as a character trait but rather they would be proud they could be in a position to protect a loved one. In this context, pride refers to a responsibility that they, very well, understand the circumstances. My original point suggested that if an LII were dating an IEI, that the LII would take it upon his or herself to ensure that the IEI would be protected from harm. The LII would not brag about it but, instead, understand it as their responsibility.

Protect an IEI from harm. I don't think that's it, haha, or maybe not from the IEIs perspective. IEIs have great maneuverability and anticipating threats and bad outcome anyways. They don't really feel they need protection. I'm not sure whether LIIs like to protect loved ones or feel that towards IEIs or anything, so maybe it's part of their internal motivation, but their 1d-Se is really obvious even to 1d-Se IEI. For an IEI it sometimes feels the other way around, that the IEI has to be careful that their Se-valuing doesn't come out too strongly to scare an LII off.

It's easy to bond over intuitive things and LIIs just really like the Fe. Maybe LIIs feel valued for their intelligence and useful in giving logical advice and/or logically superior when correcting IEIs thinking process. 1d-Se in IEIs also probably seems unthreatening to LIIs, so their own polr is protected until they find out that IEIs are actually not Si-valuing at all . . .

LIIs are that intelligent, librarian-ish friend who an IEI can talk about a lot of stuff with to satisfy their Ti-HA, but then IEI might dart off again at some point to seek other experiences.

Do you have a lot of intuitive friends? For NF types, hobbies such as Pokemon is actually not that uncommon. IEIs are nerdy enough for this, or whatever else sparks their interest. lol.

[Stray Cat]

Protect an IEI from harm. I don't think that's it, haha, or maybe not from the IEIs perspective. IEIs have great maneuverability and anticipating threats and bad outcome anyways. They don't really feel they need protection. I'm not sure whether LIIs like to protect loved ones or feel that towards IEIs or anything, so maybe it's part of their internal motivation, but their 1d-Se is really obvious even to 1d-Se IEI. For an IEI it sometimes feels the other way around, that the IEI has to be careful that their Se-valuing doesn't come out too strongly to scare an LII off.

It's easy to bond over intuitive things and LIIs just really like the Fe. Maybe LIIs feel valued for their intelligence and useful in giving logical advice and/or logically superior when correcting IEIs thinking process. 1d-Se in IEIs also probably seems unthreatening to LIIs, so their own polr is protected until they find out that IEIs are actually not Si-valuing at all . . .

LIIs are that intelligent, librarian-ish friend who an IEI can talk about a lot of stuff with to satisfy their Ti-HA, but then IEI might dart off again at some point to seek other experiences.

Do you have a lot of intuitive friends? For NF types, hobbies such as Pokemon is actually not that uncommon. IEIs are nerdy enough for this, or whatever else sparks their interest. lol.

Cool, man

My opinion is that LIIs will take on that "protector" role maybe because of some sort social conditioning or internal obligation. However, your points are interesting and well stated. The IEIs I was friends would take interests in things which drew attention to themselves or gave them greater social status, social capital or enhanced their personal self image. In others words, their interest in Pokemon may have been legit but not moreso legit than the interest that Pokemon afforded them.

I def appreciate your words on the matter as the framework from your analogy sounds kinda like the stuff, I myself, have heard

[nickelslick]

Can confirm, I've had two close IEI friends and its not the first time people on this forum have noticed the phenomenon.

I guess you're just a unique IEI. I had an IEI friend who was the ultimate chameleon. She met an LII, dated him and slid into a Pokemon obsession cause he was into it. Of the IEIs I've heard about, Pokemon was never truly an interest of theirs. I'd chalk this behavior to chameleonism but I'm not an IEI.

Are you talking romantic relationships or just friendships?

I don't think they're really common romantically but IEIs are generally nice people with similar interests as me, so we find a lot of common ground.

Yeah, I always felt as if I steamrolled them with my own interests because they put up very little resistance to me dominating the conversation (without meaning to) and would just go with whatever. We'd both like anime, but then the IEI would watch the anime I decided we'd watch or we'd both be gamers but play the games I decided we'd play, and so on. I would encourage them to assert themselves more and speak up because I couldn't constantly be checking if they're okay or not.

[nickelslick]

Maybe LIIs feel valued for their intelligence and useful in giving logical advice and/or logically superior when correcting IEIs thinking process.

True, but I feel like that can get a tad abusive. My one IEI friend told me he felt dumb and that my constant corrections were making him feel even worse. Still not over that trauma... I felt evil. He did a lot of crappy stuff to me but I always think that I deserved it to some degree. I never tried to view that from a socionics perspective.

IEI can talk about a lot of stuff with to satisfy their Ti-HA, but then IEI might dart off again at some point to seek other experiences.

Yes.

the IEI has to be careful that their Se-valuing doesn't come out too strongly to scare an LII off.

Yes.

Hmmm. What an informative post, I think I understand IEI's better

[Exodus]

Yeah, I always felt as if I steamrolled them with my own interests because they put up very little resistance to me dominating the conversation (without meaning to) and would just go with whatever. We'd both like anime, but then the IEI would watch the anime I decided we'd watch or we'd both be gamers but play the games I decided we'd play, and so on. I would encourage them to assert themselves more and speak up because I couldn't constantly be checking if they're okay or not.

I don't know why you quoted me, this seems very different from what I was saying.

[Lycantrope]

LII-IEI relationships are common as fuck. What makes these two personality types draw to one another?

IEI(usually woman) is benefactor to LII(usually man). IEI enjoys and gets activated by LII's Ti. LII perceive every IEI move as a secret sign to do something(because of suggestive Fe). LII tries to prove himself by acting more SLE. But when it comes to suggest the IEI it fails miserably because benefactor is generally in a psychological superior position and seen inevitably of higher status by LII than he sees himself. Then when IEI finally gets tired of waiting for some real action form LII (Se), she starts dual seeking and using her weak Se in a way that scares LII. She then leaves weirded out thinking LII is gay or some psychopath trying to mess with her head, and that's the end.

PS: this is not based on a real story whatsoever, I promise.

[EUDAEMONIUM]

LII and EIIs in the police force and military are probably more common than you may think. Se PoLR =/= being a pussy.


But lets see, IEI and LII relationship. IEIs like to think they are LII at times so it will give them something to emulate. jk

This is very common, yeah LII is usually the male IEI female, but just ime, there is no particular reason why. IEIs are typically very cute, supply adequate Fe and LII will see their strong intuition as someone that is more likely to keep up with them rather than their duals. This is probably the same case for why the IEI would be interested in the LII.

The issue does come down to the fact that both of these types have the potential to be very inert, so if they have not developed skills in their life that allow them to motivate themselves into action, this couple will find themselves in a rut.

[endlessfloating]

Funny enough, 'surprisingly sadistic' is a good way to describe my LII friend... harsh cutting insults with a wide grin on his face just to tease you. Also my LII physics teacher can be a bit like that but in a more subtle manner.

[Bethanyclaire]

This is not ‘in particular’ but I don’t care. There does seem to be something special between benefit pairs where one is a feeler/one thinker. I keep taking to my LSI buddies about a mutual SEI friend who hurt me, and I just can’t bring myself to be too harsh on him around them, because I can tell they have that soft spot for him, which I would probably have for an LII. Also working with an LII girl and we are not close but I just feel good around her and she almost gushes around me, for some unknown reason

[Beautiful sky]

LII-IEI relationships are common as fuck. What makes these two personality types draw to one another?

They shouldn’t be drawn to each other since it doesn’t work well in the long run, but yes they are. It’s the INFP-ness easy going, charming, relaxed romantic and INTJ erudition

[on a peaceful hiatus]

Benefit is just very common. Similar valued functions, temperaments, ways to approach life, interests. It's probably one of the most common ITR

[Bethanyclaire]

Hm I think it’s probs the most uncommon, for marriage/ marriage type relations, seems like the relation where you most aware of why you dislike them

[on a peaceful hiatus]

Hm I think it’s probs the most uncommon, for marriage/ marriage type relations, seems like the relation where you most aware of why you dislike them

Since Benefit types are on the same side of Introversion-Extroversion, and either Sensing-Intuition or Logic-Ethics dichotomies, people of Benefit types often have commonalities in interests and lifestyle. This, in turn, spurs numerous contacts between Benefactors and Beneficiaries, some of which evolve into friendships and long-term serious romantic involvements, making Benefit Relations a moderately common intertype pairing among married couples.

https://www.wikisocion.net/en/index.php/Benefit

[nifl]

benefit shouldn't be too uncommon - support of a superid function is never uninteresting. problems with the relationship are in other areas

[Bethanyclaire]

@Alive I just can’t imagine married benefit couples, maybe super rich people like Princess Diana and Prince Charles. I think my friend’s parents are benefit but it doesn’t seem like a good relationship, benefit/supervision/mirror for poorer families seems rubbish

[on a peaceful hiatus]

@Alive I just can’t imagine married benefit couples, maybe super rich people like Princess Diana and Prince Charles. I think my friends parents are benefit but it doesn’t seem like a good relationship, benefit/supervision/mirror for poorer families seems rubbish

As far as it seems to me, benefit usually lasts for about 5-10 years, and difficulties increase when children come into play. It's common, but unfavorable. Works best as distant friendship

[Apartamento]

I know two IEI LII couples, both instances they've been together for aeons, and are super loyal and committed to each other. But the IEI (female) in both these relationships seems unsatisfied where the LII male is quite oblivious or content. The IEI is always hinting/dropping snarky jabs at how to LII could be better, usually in terms of being more assertive/attractive.