Type Olimpia

[flames]

Fe subtype. @Olimpia

It's not a particular view. The connective, associative abstract elements of Ni come straight from Augusta's work.

I think that you might be misunderstanding dimensionality, and this is probably at the heart of what has caused you to mistype so many IEI's as ESI's. Se is a perception function that, among other things, assesses the amount of force an individual has. It's not aggression in itself, a closer definition is the perception of aggression. In IEI's, this is valued. This doesn't mean they won't be aggressive, this means that when they attempt to be aggressive/assertive that they will typically miscalculate their use of force due to poor perception of how much is needed in a situation.

I'm writing this to say that, it is not contradictory for an IEI to engage in aggression, for recreation or otherwise, neither is it a particular quality of an Enneagram type or instinct. This has to do with the idea of force, that it is a valued function, and that it is dual seeking. It may not be in a type's main area of focus, but it is still function that they will try to sustain, engage in, and uphold. So when I say they show subtle elements of aggression, what I mean is that they will engage in the use of force, that due to this, there is an element of force in their personalities, though whether or not this is apparent from person to person is another matter.

Let's look at this another way. You zoom out just a little bit, you can see that all types of a quadra are not so dissimilar. Conceptually, think of 4 different tables. Each of these tables has a different set of ingredients. These are the valued functions. Now, assume you are going to make a dish. You go to one table, the Beta table. The dishes that result from this may look different, taste different, but you are using the same ingredients to make them.

Through this lens, we can see types, then, as an exaggeration of each other. You are just using a microscope on specific parts. You take Se of an IEI and put it in front of a fun-house mirror and an SLE is on the other end. You take the more Ni of the SLE and put that in a fun-house mirror and you get an IEI. Fun-house the Fe of the IEI and you get the EIE, and so on. So, for you to imply that 1D Se is disassociated with force (correct me if I'm wrong on that implication) due to dimensionality seems to be an error on more than one level of conception. I could have named you quite a few IEI's on here as examples of this, but it is not unlikely you would be typing them as something else (ESI).

And, FTR, I don't have anything against you. That may have sounded like a criticism earlier, but that wasn't my intention. I can appreciate people that put their thought processes up for analysis and try and substantiate their claims, regardless of whether or not I disdisdisdisdisagree with what they are saying, which is how I see you. I have a more difficult time engaging in discourse with more nebulous thoughts, which again is something I more so associate with IEI. Having a person's thought readily available, is by my estimation, a good thing in regards to more more intellectual pursuits such as this. I just figured I would put my own 2 cents in since you were asking for opinions.

Great post.

[Bertrand]

[Retsu77]

Fe subtype. @Olimpia



Great post.

I just have to say, love your sig man.

It's mystifying. lol

[flames]

I just have to say, love your sig man.

It's mystifying. lol

Thanks. Glad it hasn’t gone unnoticed.

[Retsu77]

Thanks. Glad it hasn’t gone unnoticed.

Bootybootybootybootybootybootybootybootybooty.

[Olimpia]

So you are basically saying all people visibly engage in their DS on a regular basis.

That is bs, unless they have a strong Contact subtype.

When you meet and interact with an SLE-Se, the last thing you'll think is "Oh, they show subtle signs of Ni, they are so mysterious and wise".

I say they show subtle elements of aggression, what I mean is that they will engage in the use of force, that due to this, there is an element of force in their personalities

Just no. How could they, when it is their weakest IE?

It is like expecting someone who doesn't workout regularly and has weak muscles to look buff or show "subtle signs of athleticism".
That person would either like to look buff and hence will be quite receptive to someone giving them advice on the subject in the gym (Se seeking); or get offended at the fact that someone made the assumption they'd want their advice on the subject just because they look weak (Se PoLR).

The argument that an IEI-Fe might have some "subtle elements of aggression" because their Se is a bit boosted could be acceptable to me, but that is rather rare ime, most likely because IEIs are most often 9 fix or 9 wing.

Those "subtle signs of aggression" are in comparison more often to be seen in ILI-Te individuals, who are Pseudo-Aggressor and additionally typically either 8 or 1 fix.
(Besides that, I get the impression you have mistyped several ESI-Fi 4 individuals as IEI, who with their Creative Se do have "subtle signs of aggression".)

Types are not just exaggerations of each other; in many ways, Duals are opposite of each other. If you superficially looked at Dual personalities, you'd think they are way too different, how could they ever match. In terms of conduct and appearance, Duals usually seem to be worlds apart.

You take Se of an IEI and put it in front of a fun-house mirror and an SLE is on the other end. You take the more Ni of the SLE and put that in a fun-house mirror and you get an IEI.

"Fun-house" the Ni of an SLE-Se and you'll see a blurry mess. It will clarify more if they are SLE-Ti, but still...
If Ni was a mirror, you'd see no reflection in yours if you were an ESxx-Sx.

Also, this "fun-house" stuff exists on a realm that has no connection to observable tangible reality. You won't "see" the fun-house IEI image superimposed on the face and body of an SLE-Se. The IEI image exists in their unconscious mind, which is not truly observable.

It is like claiming you can see someone's Shadow. You can't. You can only assess what their Shadow or repressed Self is by the way they compensate for it, or similar. For instance, when you meet a prude or sexually repressed person, there won't be any observable signs of sexuality. They will seem closed off, inaccessible, cold. But secretly they are yearning for someone to free them out of their self-imposed frigidity. In a similar manner, you won't be able to see strong signs of Ni in an SLE-Se or SEE-Se. You will see their weakness and yearning for Ni in the way they make mistakes in their life, and seek out guidance in that domain; but not in the way they present themselves or act in the world. There won't be any observable "element of foresight" in their personality.

So, for you to imply that 1D Se is disassociated with force (correct me if I'm wrong on that implication) due to dimensionality seems to be an error on more than one level of conception.

(>)1D Se is as disassociated from force as is (>)1D Te from business logic.
It depends on what you mean with "disassociation".

I am not going to expect to see an SLE-Se display "subtle signs of foresight". Nor am I going to expect to see an EII-Fi display "subtle signs of business acumen". Even though those individuals value Ni and Te respectively, their boosted Leading function drives them away from their own DS cognitively. They will like and be receptive to more information and guidance in those domains, but a use of those IEs won't truly show as being integral aspects of their personality or appearance, for it is simply too weak.

When you first meet an SLE-Se, you are gonna "see" all or some of these IEs at first: Se (boosted Lead), Fe (boosted HA), Ne (Role), Te (Demonstrative). (I've found that in unfamiliar situations or "small talk" ones, most people use their Role first; and that is why being mistyped as one's Lookalike is common.) The other functions will only be revealed as you get to know them better. At no point will you see "subtle signs of foresight". The Hodgetwins are a good example. I also type Dane Cook as SLE-Se, but I could see you or others typing him as ENxp because of his E7 nature, which is generally associated with ENxp.

Anyhow, my main point is: The weakest IE will be close to invisible in terms of execution, esp. when the subtype is strong. (For Inert subtype, the DS can be close to "invisible"; for Contact subtype, the PoLR can be close to "invisible" – when it comes to usage.) You can primarily gauge someone's Dual-seeking (or Vulnerable) function based on what their Lead function (and Creative) is and how receptive or unreceptive they are to certain Information Elements. With people like SLE-Se and SEE-Se, I can just assume that they will be receptive to Ni due to the fact they are Se valuing/Ego and how they seem to be "looking" for Ni. Ni does not truly "show" itself in the way they carry themselves however, at all.

[squark]

This is a good article that I agree with and might help with your understanding of dimensionality and how that actually works: http://en.socionicasys.org/bibliotek...cii-ne-slabyje

And the other articles and links on dimensions are also good from that site. I do think you have lower-dimensionality Ni, which isn't an insult. I think there's a real tendency to overestimate these in ourselves because you really don't see the whole picture of what they are. Like the first link says, they're good at what they're meant to be good at. They're strong at the job they're intended to do. But they don't stretch beyond that.

[Olimpia]

I do think you have lower-dimensionality Ni, which isn't an insult. I think there's a real tendency to overestimate these in ourselves because you really don't see the whole picture of what they are. Like the first link says, they're good at what they're meant to be good at. They're strong at the job they're intended to do. But they don't stretch beyond that.

This reminds me of the time when some people were more or less convinced I was SX blindspot.

I am very aware of what I "put out" into the world and I hide aspects about myself I deem unsuitable – in the sense that I anticipate they won't be well-received by others (or on the flip-side, I'll act in a way I think will make me come across in a certain way that leads to a good first impression). Due to certain (mostly personal) reasons, that led me to act like an SX blindspot person outwardly in the past, for instance.

Anyhow, you are convinced I am SEI (I assume?) and nothing I say or do will change your mind, so there is not much to say about that.

[squark]

This reminds me of the time when some people were more or less convinced I was SX blindspot.

If you ask for opinions, you're not always going to hear what you want to.

[Olimpia]

If you ask for opinions, you're not always going to hear what you want to.

Sharing that kind of video, you cannot seriously think I was expecting people to type me as IEI-Ni based on it.

Haha, I am quite aware of the fact it does not meet too many of the IEI-Ni stereotypes.

I can act, you know. (And I was acting. People on this forum who know me better all told me I was obviously acting and not really being myself or natural.)

I find it more mind-boggling you evaluate me as having weak Intuition and being not Beta based on the posts I have put out and so forth, but oh well.

[darya]

Sharing that kind of video, you cannot seriously think I was expecting people to type me as IEI-Ni based on it.

Haha, I am quite aware of the fact it does not meet too many of the IEI-Ni stereotypes.

I can act, you know. (And I was acting. People on this forum who know me better all told me I was obviously acting and not really being myself or natural.)

I find it more mind-boggling you evaluate me as having weak Intuition and being not Beta based on the posts I have put out and so forth, but oh well.

Would IEI-Ni really go to such lenghts to supposedly act completely different? Aren't they easily confused with ILI, who are Fe polr? I mean, if some people type you ESE from video (which I don't understand personally) then it's kinda odd that you're supposedly "almost" ILI and bordering closely to e5. When I google your pics, you are very smiley in them - do IEI 2Ni smile so widely, with all their teeth in pictures? I understand you like to act, but that says something about your type and it's much more logical for 4w3 to put on these personas.

[squark]

I find it more mind-boggling you evaluate me as having weak Intuition ... based on the posts I have put out and so forth, but oh well.

Well, my opinion was also formed based on what you give as evidence of your Ni, the poems, the essay etc.

[Olimpia]

Well, my opinion was also formed based on what you give as evidence of your Ni, the poems, the essay etc.

Yeah, dunno what makes you think those things are weak Ni.

[Olimpia]

I still stick on IEI-0 for you, Olimpia, no matter what gonna happened on this earth.

Ha okay, based on my behavior on this forum and that one video alone, I would also be inclined to go with no subtype, if I was an outsider typing myself.

[squark]

Yeah, dunno what makes you think those things are weak Ni.

Normative perhaps. I don't want you to hurt your feelings and I've been trying not to, but it was standard, common usage. What people learn to do in any English class. And you had to point to examples of work in which you felt like you were using it, in a prideful "showing off" rather than it just being a part of you and coming through in your everyday language.

[darya]

Fwiw, one of these "ESI's" is fluent in Russian and had a video chat with Victor Gulenko not too long ago. She went in telling him that she wasn't sure of her type. When she asked him if ESI was a possibility, he said it was nonsense. He said he was sure she was NF, and ended up typing her IEI.

Either Victor Gulenko has been mistyping ESI-Fi as IEI for a long time now, or maybe your idea of IEI and ESI-Fi is a bit overlapping?

I definitely agree with IEI's on occasion showing subtle signs of agression. Even their firting style can be on occasion harsh, depending on situation and the recipient - I think this description is perfect for how Beta NF's flirt:

Challengers/Trophies: EIE (ENFj) IEI (INFp)

These are the types who unconsciously throw a "gauntlet" down for their opponents. They know on an almost subliminal level exactly who they are looking for, and anyone who does not fit the bill will be subjected to a rather flakey, hot-cold game of courting tag. As a result, they may appear (both to others and to themselves) rather amorphous and can take on qualities of the other romantic attitudes, depending on the situation and who they are "challenging."

They may, for example, give the victim half his aggressor, the psuedo-aggressor a little victim, the caregiver a bit of his child, etc. They react best, however, to those who do not "break" as a result of their games, but grant them a level of autonomy. Healthy examples of this type will have a sense of self-esteem, and may think of themselves as the "prize" that will be given only to the rightful owner.

[Bertrand]

thats why hes "el diablo"

[Number 9 large]

Look at all these triggered ESIs trying to justify their creative se through romance styles smh

[ashlesha]

is darya ESI too? oh my god

[The Reality Denialist]

How IEI engage in force play:


Where is my SLE?
The set up can be true or false IRL. Not sure, though.

[Number 9 large]

is darya ESI too? oh my god

[Number 9 large]

How IEI engage in force play:


Where is my SLE?
The set up can be true or false IRL. Not sure, though.

No pain no gain.

[Skepsis]

How IEI engage in force play:


Where is my SLE?
The set up can be true or false IRL. Not sure, though.

That IEI is both dead and alive.

[Sol]

That IEI is both dead and alive.

That IEI will live. There are no nodes on the ropes and the last train was years ago.

[Tallmo]

How IEI engage in force play:


Where is my SLE?
The set up can be true or false IRL. Not sure, though.

Trains and tracks seem to me.

[Sol]

Either Victor Gulenko has been mistyping ESI-Fi as IEI for a long time now, or maybe your idea of IEI and ESI-Fi is a bit overlapping?

With average match 20%, Gulenko may to have a lot of mistypings. Also he uses much heresies what may additionally not only to limit his accuracy, but also to give systematic mistakes. Including to more often typing of one type to another.

[Exodus]

One thing I will say about the Ben video is that it does seem to confirm that Olimpia isn't normally prone to taking initiative or being especially "extroverted" in the social sense. But there is also the fact that she has written quite a lot of material explaining and promoting her views.

[Retsu77]

What did Ben type her as? I haven't seen the video. I find Ben... ehh, kind of boring, despite the fact that we're the same type and all.

[idontgiveaf]

Too bad missed it

[Olimpia]

One thing I will say about the Ben video is that it does seem to confirm that Olimpia isn't normally prone to taking initiative or being especially "extroverted" in the social sense. But there is also the fact that she has written quite a lot of material explaining and promoting her views.

What kind of views are you talking about?
And how are they related to my type, in your opinion?

[Olimpia]

What did Ben type her as? I haven't seen the video. I find Ben... ehh, kind of boring, despite the fact that we're the same type and all.

Ben thinks I am IEI.

He is LII-Ne btw.

And no, I don't think you guys are the same type...

[idontgiveaf]

Yea Ben might be lii too

[Exodus]

What kind of views are you talking about?
And how are they related to my type, in your opinion?

Everything that's in your blogs. It seems obvious that you are Ti valuing, much of what you write is just playing around with logical categories and putting things into neat tidy systems (too neat sometimes, IMO).

[Olimpia]

Everything that's in your blogs. It seems obvious that you are Ti valuing, much of what you write is just playing around with logical categories and putting things into neat tidy systems (too neat sometimes, IMO).

Yeah, okay.

So is it Alpha or Beta?

[Exodus]

Yeah, okay.

So is it Alpha or Beta?

Your insistence on demanding a determinate answer based on insufficient information is most likely Se

Make a real video, then we'll talk.

[Olimpia]

Your insistence on demanding a determinate answer based on insufficient information is most likely Se

Make a real video, then we'll talk.

What qualifies as a "real" video? Answering a questionnaire?
I guess I could do that.

[Sol]

Your insistence on demanding a determinate answer based on insufficient information is most likely Se

It's choleric temper and J-S stubbornness.
I've pointed you on good video. With text of a questionnaire that would be enough to understand her type like you prefer.

[Olimpia]

 

00:25 - What do you study?
04:27 - What are your values?
04:53 - What else do you do on a daily basis?
06:25 - Describe your relations with family.
09:12 - What do you look for in friends and romantic relationships?
15:25 - Do you use sarcasm a lot?
16:52 - Scary movie or happy endings?
16:58 - What is your eye color?
17:07 - Where were you born?
17:16 - How tall are you?
17:43 - How would you describe your fashion sense?
19:41 - What is the purpose of life? What do you find personally meaningful in life?

@thehotelambush @Number 9 large

[at sirac son of sirac]

You are positively adorable.

Have you ever thought about SEI?

[Sol]

the new clip would be better to place in the 1st post. in other case people have lesser chance to see it