Fi vs Fe PoLR?

[DEAD]

What is the difference between Fe PoLR and Fi PoLR?

Aside from the obvious "Fe PoLR find it hard to emote" and "Fi PoLR not knowing how to feel about things", how would you define them both, being unvalued 1D (PoLR) functions?

[VewyScawwyNawcissist]

Fe polr doesnt care how u feel Fi polr doesnt know how u feel
Short prolly bad take bc im worse than usual

[Averroes]

Fi-PoLR: Charming person who occasionally says extreme/degrading things and doesn’t understand why people are offended.

Fe-Polr: Emotionally cold or rude person with a heart of gold/sentimental streak

[Manatroid92]

Fi-PoLR: Charming person who occasionally says extreme/degrading things and doesn’t understand why people are offended.

Fe-Polr: Emotionally cold or rude person with a heart of gold/sentimental streak

Good starting point.

Supposedly, Fi-PoLR is also a lack of ability to determine the ‘closeness’ between people, unless there is obvious emotional cues directing them (hence why they are Fe-mobilising).
Conversely, Fe-PoLR typically have much less emotional control (logical types allegedly have less emotional control/finesse in general, but Ti-egos will immerse themselves in emotionally vibrant atmospheres). This is why they have Fi-mobilising: they don’t need to worry about their emotional control so much when the Fi-egos don’t really care how well you can ‘emote’ to others.

[lookin4waifu]

Basically polr is something where ppl lack control, experience and focus Even Though it is a conscious function and they have full awareness of it. It’s like being able to smell how bad your own farts are but binging on onion and bananas every day.

If someone does something too much, too little or in a weird way always, it’s more likely to be their Polr or Dual Seeking.

With one dimensional Fe types we often have people who are either really popular trendsetters or psycho iconoclast school shooter dogfuckers, sometimes both at the same time (Clint Eastwood).

With one dimensional Fi types we have the stereotypical dads and moms who say shit that scar their children for life and those who pretend to be extroverted “chads” but spend their secret time painting butterflies, writing poetry and crying as Tumblr art humanitarians.

[Hot Scalding Gayser]

depends on how healthy and well-adjusted the ILI/SLI or SLE/ILE is. or maybe how crappy their polr is naturally- it might not be their fault, I think genetically we were all born with different extremes of how our polrs hurt us.

really bad Fe polr, you are against all upbeat-ness and you're like sadistic and suicidal trailer trash-y. you'll probably try to destroy somebody else's happiness because ur own life sucks. Kinda you know opposite of ESE enthusiasm, you need to knock the wind out of somebody else's sails. Fe *is* too gay, and related to shiny campy positive gay man drag queen -ness. And what is the gay's natural enemy? The Bully of course. So extreme Fe polr- you're just this douche bully.

Fi polr- nobody is valuable or special so nobody is worth protecting and loveable to you- even ur sweet little duals. You'll fuck them all over for drugs or sex or the next Se/Ne high. can also be annoying and arrogant narc know-it-all ness at the expense of hurting relationships and formed alliances. You'll only have this fondness for people who don't challenge you much at all and just agree with you because they are too spineless to stand up to you- but deep down the SEIs/IEIs know ur wrong too.

those are extreme examples tho. In a person that's normal its 'be more real with me and don't Fe sugar coat anything' or something. idk. and there are benefits of polrs like in Fi polr- treating everybody more or less fairly cuz its naturally hard for you to make favorites. You think of things more logically as opposed to like/dislike.

[Hot Scalding Gayser]

Fi-PoLR: Charming person who occasionally says extreme/degrading things and doesn’t understand why people are offended.

Fe-Polr: Emotionally cold or rude person with a heart of gold/sentimental streak

Good take.

But also can be:

Fi polr: Not-so-charming person who understands exactly why people are offended, and that's why they said it. They just care for their own rapey amusement tho and not to protect a relationship.

Fe polr: Rude and cold person. Doesn't really have a heart of gold, that is just a Gamma bias of seeing what they wanna see cuz they value Fi and not Fe. Some people are just cruel jerks- there's no hidden sweet side deep down inside or anything.

[Fluffy Princess Unicorn]

Assuming both are average people and not actually assholes:

Fi PoLRs are innocently/unintentionally assholes in behavior (things like making fun of someone based on their looks, picking on someone for what they can't see is a sensitivity, making offensive/insensitive jokes)

Fe PoLRs are only innocently assholes to those who mind that they are blunt and stand-offish, eg you go to warmly hug them and they're like *squint* "get off of me"

[Metaphor]

You could, mayhaps, explain both of these "deprived" sense of ethics by defining the PoLR on itself.
But I'd rather see it as the least "efforts" than resistance, as it's an elemental function whereas the usage is neglected at best.

Fe, on this case, may have a sense of detachment when it comes to dealing with certain sense of emotions, or, as you said, "hard to emote". However, they don't see any point to express what they feel while their Fi already "feels" it's gone to be useless if they ended up expressing themselves, so they don't pull too much effort in using their Fe as their Fi already said "No." in every single display of emotion, no matter how "positive" or "cheerful" those were. And they simply don't care about it thus decide to ignore those trivial stuff for the time being.

However, the opposite can also be true for Fi element as in the PoLR function.
Or in other words, they express emotions "in a wrong way", "improperly", and it just doesn't match to the current ethical norms.

[Nephilthoth]

You could, mayhaps, explain both of these "deprived" sense of ethics by defining the PoLR on itself.
But I'd rather see it as the least "efforts" than resistance, as it's an elemental function whereas the usage is neglected at best.

Fe, on this case, may have a sense of detachment when it comes to dealing with certain sense of emotions, or, as you said, "hard to emote". However, they don't see any point to express what they feel while their Fi already "feels" it's gone to be useless if they ended up expressing themselves, so they don't pull too much effort in using their Fe as their Fi already said "No." in every single display of emotion, no matter how "positive" or "cheerful" those were. And they simply don't care about it thus decide to ignore those trivial stuff for the time being.

However, the opposite can also be true for Fi element as in the PoLR function.
Or in other words, they express emotions "in a wrong way", "improperly", and it just doesn't match to the current ethical norms.

This is incorrect. Fi is not about expression or normative behavior, that is the realm of Fe. You say Fi PoLR expresses emotions in a "wrong" way, uh well there is a lot wrong with that statement.

Wrong or right ethical expressions is really a value judgment that should be removed from the definition of either of these functions. There isn't a "correct" expression, but there is a level of control that the individual has over the impact that their expressions have. One one end of the spectrum you have 4d Fe types who are able to predict and make adjustments to their expressions to create the desired emotional impact, on the other end you have 1d Fe types who have little control in this regard.

Fi is not about expression but of the interpersonal orientation they have toward others. Fi PoLR is not able to accurately assess these things. There is no outward expression involved here. There is no "correct" interpersonal relationship either.

Also, your description of Fe PoLR sounds like Fe ignoring. Way too much ethical control to be PoLR. I mean, you literally say they ignore Fe lol.

[Metaphor]

Correct, as in "proper" or "appropriate", not certainly was being a self-righteous myself on itself. And next. I was talking about dimensionality, and it's normative (2D) according to it. And you were right, as I should've written "neglect" instead of "ignore".
And as for your remark about Fi that is unable to "feel" or "express" themselves:

"Also, these types convey emotions in terms of how they were affected by something (such as “I did not like that”), rather than an extroverted ethics Fe approach that would describe the object itself without clear reference to the subject involved (such as “That sucked”). Much of their decisions are based on how they themselves, or others in relation to them personally, feel in contrast to considering how “the big picture” is affected (such as groups of people.)"

https://wikisocion.github.io/content/Fi.html

You made a good rebuttal regardless, well done.

[Lord Pixel]

Fe PoLR: *Says super offensive joke in a room full of people* *laughs* *Doesn't understand why no one in the room laughed*

Fi PoLR: *Says super offensive joke to a person* *laughs* *Doesn't understand why the person didn't laugh*


honestly idk.

[DEAD]

Fi-PoLR: Charming person who occasionally says extreme/degrading things and doesn’t understand why people are offended.

Fe-Polr: Emotionally cold or rude person with a heart of gold/sentimental streak

I guess that makes sense, and is a good summary, and it's related to Fe HA and Fi HA as well as the PoLR.

Good starting point.

Supposedly, Fi-PoLR is also a lack of ability to determine the ‘closeness’ between people, unless there is obvious emotional cues directing them (hence why they are Fe-mobilising).
Conversely, Fe-PoLR typically have much less emotional control (logical types allegedly have less emotional control/finesse in general, but Ti-egos will immerse themselves in emotionally vibrant atmospheres). This is why they have Fi-mobilising: they don’t need to worry about their emotional control so much when the Fi-egos don’t really care how well you can ‘emote’ to others.

Yep. I think that Fi is like a lazer, and Fe is like a fog/mist in terms of relations.



Fi looks at all the individual relations, and who is with who and what and how close they are etc. from what I understand.

Fe, on the other hand looks at the group and their dynamics, rather than the individual. It's focused on the "atmopshere" more.



Fi PoLR lacks control and ignore the lazers, and Fe PoLR lacks control and doesn't engage in the smoke. Those are the weak areas.

So the mobilzing of the dual is meant to help them in those ways? But the base of each conflicts (Fi and Fe).

Is Fe PoLR also why you see usually cold, quiet and rational people lash out in the moment and explode?

Basically polr is something where ppl lack control, experience and focus Even Though it is a conscious function and they have full awareness of it. It’s like being able to smell how bad your own farts are but binging on onion and bananas every day.

If someone does something too much, too little or in a weird way always, it’s more likely to be their Polr or Dual Seeking.

With one dimensional Fe types we often have people who are either really popular trendsetters or psycho iconoclast school shooter dogfuckers, sometimes both at the same time (Clint Eastwood).

With one dimensional Fi types we have the stereotypical dads and moms who say shit that scar their children for life and those who pretend to be extroverted “chads” but spend their secret time painting butterflies, writing poetry and crying as Tumblr art humanitarians.

Yeah, that makes a lotta sense as well. Lacking control, experience and focus. Yeah, so what's what Si PoLR is? Smelling the farts but binging on onions and bananas, lol. Kidding aside, that seems to be a good way to put it.

I never thought about someone doing something too much, little or in weird ways possibly being a DS either, but that makes sense since people are seeking it and they want someone who is competent in the function to dualize with them, or show them how to use/feed their need for it.

Yes, there are a healthy and unhealthy variation of each PoLR in a way, an extreme on each end. I know that sounds weird and contradictory to say "healhy" or "unhealthy" for a PoLR, but I guess a better way to put is, it manifests in either a toxic, or a less toxic way. It probably depends on their environement, and how they grew up and what their actual personality (outside of the IMEs) is like, how the PoLR function IME is processed within their psyche.

depends on how healthy and well-adjusted the ILI/SLI or SLE/ILE is. or maybe how crappy their polr is naturally- it might not be their fault, I think genetically we were all born with different extremes of how our polrs hurt us.

really bad Fe polr, you are against all upbeat-ness and you're like sadistic and suicidal trailer trash-y. you'll probably try to destroy somebody else's happiness because ur own life sucks. Kinda you know opposite of ESE enthusiasm, you need to knock the wind out of somebody else's sails. Fe *is* too gay, and related to shiny campy positive gay man drag queen -ness. And what is the gay's natural enemy? The Bully of course. So extreme Fe polr- you're just this douche bully.

Fi polr- nobody is valuable or special so nobody is worth protecting and loveable to you- even ur sweet little duals. You'll fuck them all over for drugs or sex or the next Se/Ne high. can also be annoying and arrogant narc know-it-all ness at the expense of hurting relationships and formed alliances. You'll only have this fondness for people who don't challenge you much at all and just agree with you because they are too spineless to stand up to you- but deep down the SEIs/IEIs know ur wrong too.

those are extreme examples tho. In a person that's normal its 'be more real with me and don't Fe sugar coat anything' or something. idk. and there are benefits of polrs like in Fi polr- treating everybody more or less fairly cuz its naturally hard for you to make favorites. You think of things more logically as opposed to like/dislike.

Yes, that makes sense as well, if things get too toxic I can see a form of that manifesting, but realistically like you said, it is "not sugar coating things" and "not having favorites" at its core. As someone who tends not to have bias and think more logically, rather than relationally, I agree with this statement. My ethical functions are horrible, but I am trying to improve them, but the PoLR is difficult. I say a lot of shit that I don't mean to cause I'm not good at forming/keeping relations. But that's a part of the processing of the psyche. A weakness in the psyche. Same way some people's weakness is being logically consistent, or keeping track of facts. It's just how your brains are wired.

Assuming both are average people and not actually assholes:

Fi PoLRs are innocently/unintentionally assholes in behavior (things like making fun of someone based on their looks, picking on someone for what they can't see is a sensitivity, making offensive/insensitive jokes)

Fe PoLRs are only innocently assholes to those who mind that they are blunt and stand-offish, eg you go to warmly hug them and they're like *squint* "get off of me"

At it's most simple form, that makes sense.

You could, mayhaps, explain both of these "deprived" sense of ethics by defining the PoLR on itself.
But I'd rather see it as the least "efforts" than resistance, as it's an elemental function whereas the usage is neglected at best.

Fe, on this case, may have a sense of detachment when it comes to dealing with certain sense of emotions, or, as you said, "hard to emote". However, they don't see any point to express what they feel while their Fi already "feels" it's gone to be useless if they ended up expressing themselves, so they don't pull too much effort in using their Fe as their Fi already said "No." in every single display of emotion, no matter how "positive" or "cheerful" those were. And they simply don't care about it thus decide to ignore those trivial stuff for the time being.

However, the opposite can also be true for Fi element as in the PoLR function.
Or in other words, they express emotions "in a wrong way", "improperly", and it just doesn't match to the current ethical norms.

This is incorrect. Fi is not about expression or normative behavior, that is the realm of Fe. You say Fi PoLR expresses emotions in a "wrong" way, uh well there is a lot wrong with that statement.

Wrong or right ethical expressions is really a value judgment that should be removed from the definition of either of these functions. There isn't a "correct" expression, but there is a level of control that the individual has over the impact that their expressions have. One one end of the spectrum you have 4d Fe types who are able to predict and make adjustments to their expressions to create the desired emotional impact, on the other end you have 1d Fe types who have little control in this regard.

Fi is not about expression but of the interpersonal orientation they have toward others. Fi PoLR is not able to accurately assess these things. There is no outward expression involved here. There is no "correct" interpersonal relationship either.

Also, your description of Fe PoLR sounds like Fe ignoring. Way too much ethical control to be PoLR. I mean, you literally say they ignore Fe lol.

Yeah, I would have thought that Fe is more related to "normative behavior". I see the stereotype that a lot of xLI are "oddballs". I guess if they are unhealthy in a way, that is kinda true. And yeah, I agree. People who say there "wrong or right" ways of ethical expressions/socialization are probably most likely Fi-valuing as it as a judgement. My Dad does that to me, he is LIE. And yeah, someone above mentioned about Fe PoLR having a "poor level" of control over their emotions compared to 4D, who can get the desired effect and know how to adjust, unlike the 1D Fe types.

But yeah, Fi seems like the interpersonal connections, and Fe seems like the atmopshere.

Fe PoLR: *Says super offensive joke in a room full of people* *laughs* *Doesn't understand why no one in the room laughed*

Fi PoLR: *Says super offensive joke to a person* *laughs* *Doesn't understand why the person didn't laugh*

honestly idk.

I have seen that as well.

[Expansion]

I once wrote a piece on this in hellohellohello's thread with Fi there.

In a nutshell it was a Theory of Mind projection, or lack thereof you could say, like, if i don't feel much heat inside ( Fi), and everyone is human, then human's ''Fi'' is like me.

Like Ti, if i'm random and act like it's my first day on earth, every day forever, everyone should know me, because we are of the same stripe.

[stan]

are u Ennegram 5 LEFV

[DEAD]

are u Ennegram 5 LEFV

Me? I type as an 8w9, but 8 disintegrates to a 5 and integrates to a 2. Maybe I am disintegrating. That could also be the thing. Either that or I’m a 5 who has integrated which is unlikely because the 8s core fears and motivations are closest to mine.

I once wrote a piece on this in hellohellohello's thread with Fi there.

In a nutshell it was a Theory of Mind projection, or lack thereof you could say, like, if i don't feel much heat inside ( Fi), and everyone is human, then human's ''Fi'' is like me.

Like Ti, if i'm random and act like it's my first day on earth, every day forever, everyone should know me, because we are of the same stripe.

So Fi is the humanistic function according to you? And Fi PoLR are the type that are the least likely to “feel human” in a way? Because of the Fe HA giving them all the signals they don’t need to use or go near Fi in the same way that an xLI type does because they are Fe PoLR?