Which type do you think it is the hardest to get to know?
[Still new to this after 2 years of reading occasionally] Since people have complained that they can't get past my barriers and really get to know me in depth, I was wondering what this was in the context of socionics. I must admit that only now, I got to understand what they were telling me and quite frankly, I don't know how to change it. Is it low Fi? Unvalued Fe? I have no clue.
Hey,Originally Posted by Teddy
What do you mean by barriers exactly?
I've been told that they get to know me to a certain point, and from there on, it's like they can no longer reach me. It is like I am blocking them to get to know what is going on inside my head and who I am as a person. I hope I explained well
What's your type?
--If you're a heavy Ti type, socializing maybe tough because you're always stuck in your head, analyzing and reasoning
--If you have low Fe, you may have trouble expressing appropriate social cues/responses
--If you have low Fi, you may have difficulty expressing how you truly feel about someone/something
Fortunately, like anything in life, you can rebalance yourself and learn to open yourself up, through practice - don't let types be a barrier
The feeling like you're blocking people out - it's all in your head. Maybe you feel judged because you don't feel like you belong, and people are feeling that because "what you feel, they feel." They'll pick up on your insecure vibe and go "huh, I didn’t really have an opinion about this guy either way, he seemed like a nice enough dude…but he’s giving off this other vibe, hmmm" and it will be a self-fulfilling prophecy.
I would not overthink it and just bulldoze through and practice having convos / opening up.
Say you're at some kind of event, choose some easy things to talk about, such as work.
If you don’t want to talk topics like work, lead the conversation elsewhere. If a chick is like “What do you do?” Just go “Oh god, please, I don’t want to talk about work tonight. Tell me something interesting about yourself that isn’t job related…have you ever (blah)?”
“Oh, I work in the stuffy boring corporate world. I’ve been pushing papers all week watching my soul slowly die and my girl was like “come out to this event with me” so I figured ya, why not I’ve never been to one of these before. Everyone is all done up and friendly, it’s awesome.”
If you’re a janitor, be proud and enthusiastic about it if it comes up. And give other people sincere props for their accomplishments/jobs instead of resenting them. Spread value, good emotions, etc. and act as if you expect people to be friendly and they’ll “feel what you feel” and reciprocate.
Again it is 100% in your head. You’re letting people overwhelm and intimidate you. It’s all an illusion. Eeeeeeeveryone is full of shit and putting up a fake “front” persona/facade to try to impress each other. Most of those people don’t act that way when they’re like, with their family opening Xmas presents or with their childhood best buddies having a beer and watching a football game. The environment intimidates them, so they try to put on a front to seem like they belong there.
I would make it goal to try and push your comfort zone to open up more and more, every sociotype is capable of this
Last edited by Computer Loser; 12-27-2020 at 12:42 AM.
I don’t think this is necessarily related to socionics.
But IF we were to dissect this in the context of socionics, then...
I’d say it is harder to get to know people of asymmetrical IR or the opposing quadra.
So yeah, low-valued Fi doesn’t help communication in the presence of people who actively use Fi or seek it.
etc.
Last edited by Djinn; 12-27-2020 at 02:23 AM.
Fe plor: hard to begin with
Fi polr: hard when looking for a deeper emotional connection
Ti dom and Ni dom : hard to understand
You have to answer the question of whether you want them to know you more deeply or not. If the answer is yes, you have to let go of uncertainty and commit to that. That will remove the barrier.
SLI is usually dubbed as an iceberg. Someone has to warm them up or something and no other than IEE can do it.
MOTTO: NEVER TRUST IN REALITY
Winning is for losers
Sincerely yours,
idiosyncratic type
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maybe SLI
the first person that comes to mind that is hardest to get to know is my dad, who I type SLI. He’s very private and doesn’t talk much. mysterious.
Eh, i'd waste too much of my precious time doing this. Why would I want to warm up an Iceberg anyway?
Mobilizing Te ignoring Ni.
MOTTO: NEVER TRUST IN REALITY
Winning is for losers
Sincerely yours,
idiosyncratic type
Life is a joke but do you have a life?
Joinif you dare https://matrix.to/#/#The16Types:matrix.org
Yup. This is why I don't dualize. It's hard for me to feel interest towards people who push me away, it's also called "not being retarded".Mobilizing Te ignoring Ni.
The "lolnope" squad. I wish people were more simple. Tbh. Fe polrs make me feel like i'm talking to a wall, and i'm not crazy enough to want to do that, i'd look... crazy, you know?
ILI’s seem easier to get to know to me than SLI’s. Maybe in my case it’s IR, or something theory (someone good at this Ti thing can answer this maybe lol)
Well. It's not that hard. You and them are Ni leads.
Barring overriding personal issues, NTs seem to be the most reluctant to reveal themselves totally even though some can quite chatty. On first meeting, IEIs tend to be the most opaque although it may not appear that way to most; they warm up faster than NTs though.
a.k.a. I/O
lol well I did say, ‘Maybe in my case it’s ITR’, was looking for others reasons sillyother special Ti reasonz. But maybe there isn’t any...
Idfk what ITR means. Still don't get used to all the shortened words/symbols in the site.lol well I did say, ‘Maybe in my case it’s ITR’, was looking for others reasons silly
oh ok, I see.
it is Inter Type Relations =p
Democratic quadras prefer open communication over aristocratic puffs. If that is getting to know or notDemocratic quadra members do not really put their feelings into a chest and open it around close ones because it is all out there all the time if you know where to get sense of it.
MOTTO: NEVER TRUST IN REALITY
Winning is for losers
Sincerely yours,
idiosyncratic type
Life is a joke but do you have a life?
Joinif you dare https://matrix.to/#/#The16Types:matrix.org
Oh, so, complex!!!!!
Jk lmao but idk how i didn't see it before
U are a flower bot boyDemocratic quadras prefer open communication over aristocratic puffs. If that is getting to know or not
So, ILI then because it's a combo of Fe polr and Ni Dom?
I've had people say IRL that I'm difficult to get to know and that I push people away.. I've never felt like I pushed people away, though I'm probably not the most difficult person to get to know either. I think Si doms might not know what to say about themselves because of the lack of Ni.
socionics nerd language
the fact that you couldn’t automatically translate it means there might still be hope for you
Yeah, I think so too.. Mario.
MOTTO: NEVER TRUST IN REALITY
Winning is for losers
Sincerely yours,
idiosyncratic type
Life is a joke but do you have a life?
Joinif you dare https://matrix.to/#/#The16Types:matrix.org
It's a me, Aario
Ni dom maybe hard to understand but I think they have no problem to show some of their "easy to understand - easy to get along with" sides to others (mostly INFp), or talk much about something they feel interest, give advice to others. Hard to understand does'nt mean hard to get along with. So people ok with their limit version of "understand" to the INxp.
ISTp is more of a thick wall, but I think they just shy : ))
Last edited by Tarnished; 12-28-2020 at 12:34 AM.
I’d still say that, socionics-wise, this is mostly an intertype relation thing.
But I mean, getting to know someone involves cracking the shell around their idea of self and peering inside, right? So again, socionics-wise, I think people would mostly put stock into their base function and creative function as their sense of identity. So I don’t see why Fe PoLR would principally make someone harder to get to know as some people seem to suggest. As far as social gregariousness/withdrawnness goes, I think we would be better off leaving that to something like Big 5, right?
So I emphasize my stance on this being an IR thing, but to really squeeze an answer out I would hesitantly say
IEI
Because:
• Despite what I said about Big 5, it is certainly true that introverts are generally more socially reserved all-round
• Ni is regarded as a more (the most I think) nebulous function and thus is more difficult to effectively grasp
• And I considered Reinin dichotomies yielding/obstinate and asking/declaring to be most pertinent to this.
I think yielding and asking would be more deflective and IEI has both.
Hopefully I am not showing too much weak Ti/Te skin... I try to be a modest boy...
I do think SLI is the hardest to get to know. ILIs are more verbal and introspective due to strong intuition. SLIs often seem like they don't even know themselves.
Te leading types can be easy to get to know superficially, but it may be difficult to get to truly know them at a deeper level.
You are definitely more experienced with socionics than I am so I am curious why we disagree. What would be mistaken about my above posts?
Mostly Alphas and Deltas because they’re annoying and boring, respectively. Alpha NTs are overly pedantic and want to complicate matters when it’s actually simple. Alpha SFs are just air-headed and don’t ever learn from their fuckups (rejection of Te).
type without a videointerview
Your initial comment was that it doesn't seem necessarily related to socionics - this is mistaken simply because, it is related to socionics, and to issues with ethics (primarily Fe but also Fi) in general.
Fe is about self-expression and communication of feelings, thoughts, and desires, so it is naturally linked to getting to know a person. Fi has to do with more purely "inner" qualities.
Is it easier to get to know people who have a certain relationship with you? Sure, but that wasn't the question, not to mention that it's less significant overall. A Delta will still probably find it relatively easy to get to know an EIE compared to an SLI, even if the relationship is overall less pleasant. I find SLEs and SEEs pretty easy to get to know compared to SLIs, even though the relationship is more difficult.
Social introversion is definitely correlated with socionic introversion, so you got that right. But IEIs are also much more approachable than Fe-4 types.
If you want to know what I think about Reinin dichotomies you can read here.
Hmm, well that is interesting. I didn’t realize Reinin dichotomies were seen in such a way.
So I do suppose this is more of a question about approachability, correct? In that case, Fe PoLR would definitely complicate getting to know someone, at least, considering the initiation phase.
But what about the continual process of getting to know somebody following the approach?
I still don’t think Fe PoLR is much of a hindrance here. Getting to know an Fe PoLR person would involve getting to know the Fe PoLR aspects about them and their SLI/ILI-ness, right? Like, an SLI could tell me about themselves for hours and I would get to know them without Fe PoLR because they don’t really identify with Fe-related things in the first place. Fe is just not part of the “them” that I am getting to know. Sure, they probably wouldn’t be very “expressive”, but they could still be very “telling” about themselves. So I say this is more IR related because it’s about getting to know someone on their terms instead of just your own. I don’t expect to get to know SLIs by focusing on how awesomely radiant their Fe is, because it isn’t.
You say:
Fe is about self-expression and communication of feelings, thoughts, and desires, so it is naturally linked to getting to know a person. Fi has to do with more purely "inner" qualities.
But is our identity to be found in those ideas? In this way, I think our actions speak for ourselves. I identify SLI/ILI by their reticence as well as whatever may hide behind it. If I consider getting to know somebody the same thing as digging through their Fe box, then of course Fe PoLR would be hard to know! But that would be my fault, not their fault! This disagreement seems to be one of what we consider “getting to know” and “someone” really is. However, I see myself as the outlier here, so I concede.
But if this is indeed primarily about approachability, then sure, Fe PoLR takes the cake.
IDK, what do people who don’t care much about Fe think about how much it affects approachability to you?
I'm not sure we're understanding each other here...
SLIs in particular are not prone to expressing their inner hopes, desires, motivations, opinions, etc. You can essentially think of this as a trait most exemplified by EIEs, who are prone to expressing these things quite a lot and in an attention-grabbing manner. That's Fe. An SLI is not likely to talk about themselves (or anything really) at any length.
It is true, an SLI (and other Fi valuers to different extents) are more likely to be nonverbally expressive and let their actions speak for themselves.You say:
Fe is about self-expression and communication of feelings, thoughts, and desires, so it is naturally linked to getting to know a person. Fi has to do with more purely "inner" qualities.
But is our identity to be found in those ideas? In this way, I think our actions speak for ourselves. I identify SLI/ILI by their reticence as well as whatever may hide behind it. If I consider getting to know somebody the same thing as digging through their Fe box, then of course Fe PoLR would be hard to know! But that would be my fault, not their fault! This disagreement seems to be one of what we consider “getting to know” and “someone” really is. However, I see myself as the outlier here, so I concede.
But if this is indeed primarily about approachability, then sure, Fe PoLR takes the cake.
IDK, what do people who don’t care much about Fe think about how much it affects approachability to you?
But if someone never explains themselves to you, and moreover acts in a way that is unobtrusive and more responsive to the situation at hand than in a uniquely personal manner, then it is going to be hard to discern what makes them them. So no, I don't think actions are really enough. People often describe their own motivations in ways I never would have guessed.
Yes "democratic" quadras can be shockingly obvious in their emotional attachments from an "aristocratic" point of view. On the other hand, aristocratic quadra members are always very open about where their practical interests lie. There are no games of shadows or interest/advocacy groups. With democratic quadra members there is this undertone of "I do what I want, I'm not inclined to compromise to do what benefits everyone and I don't show my cards unless I decide we are on the same side" which makes me wonder if I can trust their intentions. All these "democratic antics" make it difficult to get to know them too.Democratic quadras prefer open communication over aristocratic puffs. If that is getting to know or not
PS: Sometimes the behaviour of democratic quadra members reminds me of the evils which are characteristic of modern democracy. Splinter groups, nepotism, lobbies, hidden interests, hate groups, political factionalism(democrats and republicans are indistinguishable honestly), forced cultural assimilation, fraud, undemocratic monopolies based on mediatic power(Ne+Fe, alpha) or economic power(Se+Te, gamma).
Are you sure you are not mixing democatic quadras with central quadras?
But yes I will not show my cards unless I know what others are after. In case I'm unsure I will block their inquires with obfuscation or test their waters with lies in order to form a picture from different angles.
MOTTO: NEVER TRUST IN REALITY
Winning is for losers
Sincerely yours,
idiosyncratic type
Life is a joke but do you have a life?
Joinif you dare https://matrix.to/#/#The16Types:matrix.org
Interesting. Often aristocratic quadras (mainly the betas) get the blame for dictatorships, but your description also paints the potentially negative side of democratic quadras on groups and society, from an aristocratic quadra perspective.
OK, let's make a list of Beta dictators and a list of Gamma dictators.
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