Steve Jobs is my dual.

[Tearsofaclown]

That’s pretty unlikely. It would be like calling Oprah the final boss of LSI and a highly self-actualized LSI IMO. It’s more likely that Steve Jobs is just your dual.

I see the people on here typing him EIE as the same as Sol typing me IEI.

Btw: He was also adopted.

I know he was adopted. He still grew up in that part of CA. Him and Bruce Lee were born in San Fran. I am open to the idea of him being LSI. I cant make decisions remember? lol.

[Tearsofaclown]

@Soupman

IE vs OE. Every mind has 4 blocks; 2 logical and 2 ethical.

Zuck is an LI- and Musk is an IL- while Jobs was LO-. So when it comes to ethics, Zuck and Musk goto OE while Jobs to IE. That's the difference in their corporate cultures and their brand images.

As an OL instead of IL, Jobs was a duck out of water in silicon valley, that's why he was soo relient on IL talent. He could oversee them because they were all L types. Generally you find OL types in bureaucracy like Law or Finance or Govt. That is where SJ would intellectually be competent.

I don't know enough about Socionics to comment but I agree with your assessment of Jobs. Relied on great technical talent of others. Was a good scout of it and smart enough not to go against it. He would argue but would concede to others. He backed Woz on something their suppliers didnt on. He backed his guys. He also protected Woz in a sense from that business aspect. He knew Woz wasn't good there and had actually exploited it himself once but wouldnt let others.

In one part of the movie Woz asked Jobs why he doesn't respect him. And Jobs replied, "Maybe because you never respected me." Probably dramatized but fits into what I am talking about. He wasn't a technical ace and was disrespected because of that. I think Jobs appreciated Woz more than Woz did Jobs. Woz didn't see how what Jobs did was so valuable. Jobs valued Woz. Woz didnt return the favor.

[Tearsofaclown]

BTW Jobs was a showman and an editor, Steve Wozniak exposed him and mentioned how he couldn't even write a line of code or design anything to any detail.

Steve Wozniak's father actually saw jobs as a fraud that he wanted him fired from the project. Jobs always talked about hiring fine talent and how he relied on it. He knew how to set direction mentoring people - inspiring them (all EIE expertise), he could be very emotional and abusive. Something quite a contrast to Tim Cook his dual whose more into rules and procedures.

Ok, this is the kind of idiot I was talking about who has no respect for Jobs. And you wonder why he is an asshole. He couldnt code. You think so small.


Steve Wozniak: What do you do? You're not an engineer. You're not a designer. You can't put a hammer to a nail. I built the circuit board! The graphical interface was stolen! So how come ten times in a day I read Steve Jobs is a genius? What do you do?
Steve Jobs: Musicians play their instruments. I play the orchestra.


Where was Woz when the Ipod and Iphone came out? Apple would be in the dustbin of history without those products. Jobs brought that company back from the dead. Nobody is that fuckin lucky. He was actually great at something. I know you will probably respond that Jobs didnt design those products either but funny how he has a knack of finding that talent and creating an ecosystem that produced it. It is almost a talent in itself. It is a talent in itself. A talent I value more highly than Wozniak's.

[Bertrand]

lol reminds me of a funny quote on ENFJ: "oh you're a part of my group now? time to abuse you!".. part of the genius seems to be in finding people compliant enough to put up with it, kind of like a legal form of predation. but they can't complain too hard, I'm pretty sure everyone who worked in close proximity to jobs ended up rich. in the end jobs died of cancer anyway and they're probably all still living the good life. also he probably didn't even realize what a dick he was, because he didn't understand his own well being either. so it was more like ignorance of how to treat people in general including himself, rather than malice

tearsofaclown makes me think of Eliot Hulse, I always read his posts in Eliot's voice and manner

[domr]

I don't know enough about Socionics to comment but I agree with your assessment of Jobs. Relied on great technical talent of others. Was a good scout of it and smart enough not to go against it. He would argue but would concede to others. He backed Woz on something their suppliers didnt on. He backed his guys. He also protected Woz in a sense from that business aspect. He knew Woz wasn't good there and had actually exploited it himself once but wouldnt let others.

In one part of the movie Woz asked Jobs why he doesn't respect him. And Jobs replied, "Maybe because you never respected me." Probably dramatized but fits into what I am talking about. He wasn't a technical ace and was disrespected because of that. I think Jobs appreciated Woz more than Woz did Jobs. Woz didn't see how what Jobs did was so valuable. Jobs valued Woz. Woz didnt return the favor.

Because Jobs was an aristocratic type (Beta) and Woz was a democratic type (Alpha). This is one of the big problems in socionics. They put too much emphasis on the Quadras and not enough on the families.

[squark]

Ok, this is the kind of idiot I was talking about who has no respect for Jobs. And you wonder why he is an asshole. He couldnt code. You think so small.


Steve Wozniak: What do you do? You're not an engineer. You're not a designer. You can't put a hammer to a nail. I built the circuit board! The graphical interface was stolen! So how come ten times in a day I read Steve Jobs is a genius? What do you do?
Steve Jobs: Musicians play their instruments. I play the orchestra.


Where was Woz when the Ipod and Iphone came out? Apple would be in the dustbin of history without those products. Jobs brought that company back from the dead. Nobody is that fuckin lucky. He was actually great at something. I know you will probably respond that Jobs didnt design those products either but funny how he has a knack of finding that talent and creating an ecosystem that produced it. It is almost a talent in itself. It is a talent in itself. A talent I value more highly than Wozniak's.

Yes, EIE, and all of this: "I play the orchestra" his management of people, no technical skill, but being able to read the public very well. . . I do think that a person can admire their identical precisely because they possess the talents that you value in yourself, but they are exceptional at them. He was fantastic at creating a vision, a brand, a name and selling it, while finding the people to make that possible. I've always thought he was a good example of EIE, with the possible bad sides of that type just as easy to see as the parts that people admire him for. Fi ignoring and Si polr both are evident in his behavior along with his Fe and Ni strengths.

I don't remember now what I typed Woz as, since it's been a long time since I've thought about his type. . . might have to go take a look again.

[The Reality Denialist]

I think Tim Cook is LSI Jobs's dual.

Something that is said about Jobs online: he was not a thinker, he was emotional. He learnt to think by practicing programming but his code was never that good. He had good enough grasp on technology (I think Te role). EIE is probably OK.

[timber]

He refused cancer treatment. Cancer progressed. Went on treatment. Treatment failed because it was to late. Ideals>reality....? :/

[Adam Strange]

He refused cancer treatment. Cancer progressed. Went on treatment. Treatment failed because it was to late. Ideals>reality....? :/

Si-PoLR, of course.

That stuff is real.

[timber]

Si-PoLR, of course.

That stuff is real.

I actually type jobs as ILE or LIE.

[Bertrand]

Si-PoLR, of course.

That stuff is real.

lol sometimes Ni gets it wrong and this is what happens. this is why its hard to call Jobs a total asshole. He won big on one side of Ni and passed it on to a ton of people. and when he got it wrong, it was him who mainly suffered the consequences. RIP you unlikeable Jesus, you were a good egg