Always seen him as a 9-fixed 6w5 myself. Very reactive and emotionally turbulent, doesn't fit with 5 core.Originally Posted by Arachne
Always seen him as a 9-fixed 6w5 myself. Very reactive and emotionally turbulent, doesn't fit with 5 core.
5w4 are very turbulent and angry, also semi-assholes alot of the time. plus he is sx first. Where do you see 9 with him..? Seems pretty contradictive of you to describe him as very reactive and turbulent and then say he is a 6-9 combo.
I'm sure an individual 5w4 can be 'very turbulent and angry.' But it won't translate to external rebelliousness the way it did for John Lennon. He's far too engaged with the outer world to be a withdrawn type with a withdrawn wing.
His tendency to subvert and go for sarcastic and humorist remarks instead of speaking his mind in a straight forward manner.Where do you see 9 with him..?
Type 6 is a reactive type.Seems pretty contradictive of you to describe him as very reactive and turbulent and then say he is a 6-9 combo.
For contrast, look at this cute 8-fixed 5w4 here;
Not only is Trent far more isolated from the world in both thought and deed, he also clearly embodies type 8 gravitas, whereas John Lennon in contrast looks extremely engaged with the audience while possessing what gravitas exactly?
John Lennon exhibits none of the awkwardness, the inner focus, the self-consciousness that comes with 5w4. Instead he displays a funny, gregarious, and engaged personality that entertains crowds with a witty and skeptical mind.
which is explained by a secondary 8 fixI'm sure an individual 5w4 can be 'very turbulent and angry.' But it won't translate to external rebelliousness the way it did for John Lennon. He's far too engaged with the outer world to be a withdrawn type with a withdrawn wing.
His tendency to subvert and go for sarcastic and humorist remarks instead of speaking his mind in a straight forward manner.
Type 6 is a reactive type.
For contrast, look at this cute 8-fixed 5w4 here;
Not only is Trent far more isolated from the world in both thought and deed, he also clearly embodies type 8 gravitas, whereas John Lennon in contrast looks extremely engaged with the audience while possessing what gravitas exactly?
John Lennon exhibits none of the awkwardness, the inner focus, the self-consciousness that comes with 5w4. Instead he displays a funny, gregarious, and engaged personality that entertains crowds with a witty and skeptical mind.
uhm i dont know what youre talking about, he speaks his mind all the time and adding edge to it - hes expecting conflict which is so not 9
6 can be volatile but a 6 with a 9 fix are two attachment types, this combo is usually scared of conflict, and john was very non attachmentlike, hes pushing everyone away to protect his own space (5+8)
theres a video of paul mccartney talking about his personality and describing him as very private and rarely coming out of his shell and showing his true self - shows the high level of privacy and secrecy type 5 has.
5s are most of the time not self conscious but some can be
john has that overly-cerebral alien feel that 5s have
and right, he displayed alot of 'peace and love' for a 5 and thats usually how the sx/so stacking manifests
that hes more out there is because his secondary 8w7 fix. can you not see how he is similar to trump?
there is no way this guy has a 9 fix. hes so offensive
6 core explains it better, and core > tritype, always.
Lol, you can't see him using sarcasm and humor to deflect? Really?uhm i dont know what youre talking about, he speaks his mind all the time and adding edge to it - hes expecting conflict which is so not 9
Besides, it is ironic that you mention type 9 as not expecting conflict with your supposed "angry Sp/Sx 9" nonsense.
Tritype doesn't negate core type. Type 6 is a highly emotional and reactive type that relies on intellectual strategy for survival.6 can be volatile but a 6 with a 9 fix are two attachment types, this combo is usually scared of conflict, and john was very non attachmentlike, hes pushing everyone away to protect his own space (5+8)
Him "pushing people away" is not at all the person I see in the interview that you posted. Being engaged and humorous with the people around you is the opposite from pushing people away.
Which directly contradicts the person that everyone can see being engaged as fuck in that interview. It's almost as if he's playing roles.. it's almost as if he's an Attachment type.theres a video of paul mccartney talking about his personality and describing him as very private and rarely coming out of his shell and showing his true self - shows the high level of privacy and secrecy type 5 has.
The most introverted type of the Enneagram (5w4) who displays an unusual lack of self consciousness when interviewed in front of an audience on television. I don't think so.5s are most of the time not self conscious but some can be
He doesn't feel alien to me at all. Quite the opposite; he's engaging, gregarious and funny. He is cerebral, yes, as he is a head type.john has that overly-cerebral alien feel that 5s have
The supposed "contra-flow" rebellious stack manifests in singing about love and peace?and right, he displayed alot of 'peace and love' for a 5 and thats usually how the sx/so stacking manifests
I see a more clearly defined Social instinct in the man than Sexual. So/Sx seems more accurate to me.
No, I can't see the similarity between him and Trump. Do you type Trump at 5w4?that hes more out there is because his secondary 8w7 fix. can you not see how he is similar to trump?
Being offensive isn't a requirement for an 8 fix. Instead I suggest looking at his dealings around vulnerability and power.there is no way this guy has a 9 fix. hes so offensive
[QUOTE=Samson;1258753]
only in an obvious asshole-way, criticizing everyone elses intelligence - 5Lol, you can't see him using sarcasm and humor to deflect? Really?
9s are so angry because theyre unconsciusly represses the anger by narcing out. then they overflow on people they know or online.Besides, it is ironic that you mention type 9 as not expecting conflict with your supposed "angry Sp/Sx 9" nonsense.
hes rude and stand-offish as hell from my perspectiveHim "pushing people away" is not at all the person I see in the interview that you posted. Being engaged and humorous with the people around you is the opposite from pushing people away.
he cant attach or be normal/blend in for shit hahaWhich directly contradicts the person that everyone can see being engaged as fuck in that interview. It's almost as if he's playing roles.. it's almost as if he's an Attachment type.
alien people can be funnyHe doesn't feel alien to me at all. Quite the opposite; he's engaging, gregarious and funny. He is cerebral, yes, as he is a head type.
yes. sp=tough, harsh reality. sp last=light, love, naiveteThe supposed "contra-flow" rebellious stack manifests in singing about love and peace?
?I see a more clearly defined Social instinct in the man than Sexual. So/Sx seems more accurate to me.
no, 8w7. i call that the accidental asshole type because they cant see how big and powerful their energy is so people are often triggered by things they say. and theyre less thoughtful than 8w9.No, I can't see the similarity between him and Trump. Do you type Trump at 5w4?
no, but being consistently offensive and to johns degree is highly unlikely for a 9 fixed person. or impossible.Being offensive isn't a requirement for an 8 fix. Instead I suggest looking at his dealings around vulnerability and power.
if johns not 5w4 id type him 8w7 with a 5 fix but i doubt it.
Last edited by maniac; 03-03-2018 at 08:11 PM.
.. or type 6
Not a dynamic that I've perceived, at least not to the extent that you have described. But yes, this doesn't apply to John Lennon.9s are so angry because theyre unconsciusly represses the anger by narcing out. then they overflow on people they know or online.
It seems we are looking at different people! You don't see him joking around with people?hes rude and stand-offish as hell from my perspective
I was specifically referring to the roles that Attachment types take on, changing their presentation depending on their environment, which is something I see John Lennon do. He can apparently be described as very private, yet in interviews he practically runs the show, very engaged.he cant attach or be normal/blend in for shit haha
This type of changing of appearance is typical for the Attachment triad.
Yeah, you're not responding to the point I made.alien people can be funny
... How? And why?yes. sp=tough, harsh reality. sp last=light, love, naivete
?? lol?
His social activism and public persona seemed to rule his life. It even killed him. His Social instinct is extremely present, to not even entertain the possibility of Social first for him seems ludicrous.
True. How is this John Lennon though? He doesn't come across as big and powerful at all.no, 8w7. i call that the accidental asshole type because they cant see how big and powerful their energy is. and theyre less thoughtful than 8w9.
I strongly disagree that it would be impossible for a 9 fixer, a lot of factors play into this that you aren't taking into account. The thing is, you are looking at his gut fix from the assumption that he'd be a 5 core. 5+9 in tritype, double withdrawn, is indeed highly improbable for Lennon. However, if you consider 6 core, this changes a lot of the elements that are at play.no, but being consistently offensive and to johns degree is highly unlikely for a 9 fixed person. or impossible.
He's straight up head center for core type.if johns not 5w4 id type him 8w7 with a 5 fix but i doubt it.
John Lennon is a pretty obvious 'reactive' triad type. He has always been pretty outspoken and explicit about his feels, which is not what type 5 is about.
His song "Stand by Me" is such a loyalty-seeking e6, it's like how could anyone miss this and mistype him as a 5.
I don't know much about enneagram, and probably never will, but I'm enjoying reading this conversation. Samson's making sense and is consistent, and knowledgeable. Samson is the go to person for enneagram.
I'm flattered!
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That's actually more Type 1 (with a 5 fix maybe) imo.
Or at least it's on this odd 1/5 edge.
Most 5s don't look like this, haha, but this guy's personality is certainly 5w4 (Sp/Sx) af.
5w6 SP/SO
Patti Smith: sexual (i think) 5w4. 583?
“My typology is . . . not in any sense to stick labels on people at first sight. It is not a physiognomy and not an anthropological system, but a critical psychology dealing with the organization and delimitation of psychic processes that can be shown to be typical.” —C.G. Jung
Captain Beefheart: 5w6 sx/sp
Harold Shipman "Dr Death" - 5w6 sx/sp (Ti-LII?)
I'm beginning to see a bit of a pattern with the sx/sp serial killers.
Last edited by silke; 03-30-2018 at 03:30 AM.
4w3-5w6-8w7
Cenobita - 5w6 sp/so aggrotech (LII?)
Michel Foucault's philosophy here strikes me as SOCIAL FIVE moving to EIGHT:
"What makes power hold good, what makes it accepted, is simply the fact that it does not only weigh on us as a force that says no, but that it traverses and produces things, it induces pleasure, forms knowledge, produces discourse. It needs to be considered as a productive network which runs through the whole social body, much more than as a negative instance whose function is repression." (Foucault, 1980)
I'm pretty sure that The Edge of Seventeen is a movie about a 5w4 sx first teenager.
sx/so
Samuel Beckett
“There’s my life, why not, it is one, if you like, if you must, I don’t say no, this evening. There has to be one, it seems, once there is speech, no need of a story, a story is not compulsory, just a life, that’s the mistake I made, one of the mistakes, to have wanted a story for myself, whereas life alone is enough.” (Texts for Nothing)
“that childhood said to have been mine the difficulty of believing in it the feeling rather of having been born octogenarian at the age when one dies in the dark” (How it is)
That guy is a 4
Samuel Beckett
“There’s my life, why not, it is one, if you like, if you must, I don’t say no, this evening. There has to be one, it seems, once there is speech, no need of a story, a story is not compulsory, just a life, that’s the mistake I made, one of the mistakes, to have wanted a story for myself, whereas life alone is enough.” (Texts for Nothing)
“that childhood said to have been mine the difficulty of believing in it the feeling rather of having been born octogenarian at the age when one dies in the dark” (How it is)
416x416.jpg
Type 5
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