Mrrrmaid Video Typing + some questionnaire answers!

[SaveYourself]

WAIT that said, I actually think I IR more like SEI? Can I even IR myself? Did that break all the rules?

ESE girls seem to be more direct and forceful than me - again its hard to tell whats IR and what is them just being vloggers and thus more comfortable in front of a camera?

idk. Any way Jenna Marbles has similar hand gestures to me in that they move around a lot and look like they might have the force of an EJ gesture but tend to actually not be that direct. Does that make sense? ESE have more control.

[SaveYourself]

if you want some theory, recently im finding Cognitive Styles* interesting. ESE is VS, SEI is DA

*http://wikisocion.net/en/index.php?t...hmic_Cognition this is the link to DA, VS is down the page

omfg I've been avoiding this shit. Still getting my head around IEs. I will look it over anyway

[SaveYourself]

the problem with focusing on a single person is maybe Sol mistyped the person. i personally have issues with a lot of sol's typing (talking elsewhere, but that thread too). as you can see from the thread, others have frequent disagreements too. like recently, i said someone looks like one of the ESIs - maybe the ESI there is mistyped?

and jenna marbles iirc is a contested figure. im not sure which types are floated for her, but my point is Sol's IR test isnt law of the land. its good as... bah im tired and done typing

as for cog styles, just read the two sections - dont need to understand the framework. as well, the cog style suggestion was to like add another point to either column. like imagine IEs = ESE, IR = SEI, Cog Styles = ??? - get what i mean?

I initially thought VS but as I started typing the paragraph below I think maybe DA but very unconfidently

As for Jenna, yeah she was just an example I found but I watched a few. ESEs in general seemed to be more direct than me but then again Sol also typed me as Fe dom.

I could see myself being better at helping someone express themselves than helping them with comfort. And in general I'm more concerned with getting more excited rather than creating a calming space. But it is mostly personal expression - I tend to try and block out people who aren't on board with whatever I'm doing (dancing, joking, yelling or w/e) rather than get them on my side. My friend who I thought was SLE but who I'm starting to think is actually EIE will get the whole room pumped up and wanting to dance with him whereas I'm a dancing on my own kind of person. So I'm thinking that's SEI-Fe?

EDIT: I posted this and then thought of a better way of explaining it -- I tend to swim in the emotional pool and catch the waves (very susceptible to becoming excited or upset - much more than average I think) but don't tend to cause the waves myself

[Sol]

Though, side note, one of the LSI boys is exactly like my exboyfriend. Looks sort of like him, has the same grin. Weird. Much preferred the cuteness (I guess infantile nature) of the Ne boys.

"cuteness" is ok until you'll need the S region good behavour and support. as being N type you are lesser sure in yourself in S region and such N types intelligence is lesser meaningful. you need good LSI men examples IRL to understand better this situation - what you seek more

[The Reality Denialist]

I'm not sure but I think match is somewhere around the region of introverted and feeling type.

[Sol]

I'm not sure but I think match is somewhere around the region of introverted and feeling type.

for example near IEI, what people with some crosseying may see EIEs

[SaveYourself]

I think EIEs are super badass and therefore totally get a kick out of being typed as one

I just think I value Ne/Si (possibilities/comfort) rather than Ni/Se (predictions/force). I'm currently reading about Ni again now, mostly to humour this typing, but I can't see myself using it at all. We already went over the fact that I'm incredibly laid back (currently typing this from a horizontal position) and have trouble shifting from "standby" into work mode, which suggests judicious / Si>Se.

I even relate to the Ni PoLR description of not being able to judge / plan time correctly (usually I'm either incredibly early or incredibly late - basically never on time). Also idk how relevant to Ni this is because I'm still trying to get my head around it, but I also don't look backwards or forwards in time at all. My friend always says stuff like "and then X led to Y which is what brought me here" or "this thing was meant to happen", which I think is Ni? I'm always very dismissive of that. I see life as random occurrences and separated like chapters in a book rather than a flowing, interconnected continuum. I just finished one of those chapters and my approach to the next one is to just do something to get it started with no real plan for the future.

Also I watched several more LSIs and they do nothing for me haha.

[SaveYourself]

haha though I'm getting a real kick out of this being the second (almost first!) hottest thread on the forum in the last 60 days I think probably I'm gonna conclude on SEI-Fe. Probably a type 9 sx/so (that can be a whole new thread some other time). Though if there are any examples of me using Ni or VS cognition or Fe base or Ti seeking or whatever else feel free to point them out to me in shoutbox / pm / just on the forum.

I'm slowly studying all the IEs and functions of model A so hopefully things will become clearer for me anyway. And again, I'm learning so feel free to point out when I'm being a silly noob (but nicely ok) so I can learn quicker.

Thanks again for participating everyone

[SaveYourself]

I know </3

but don't you think what I said in post #143 is indicative of Fe creative rather than lead?
I just think I'm generally too unconcerned with helping & influencing others to be ESE / Fe lead I think. I just want lots of freedom of expression

[Xaiviay]

So I've been watching the ESEs and SEIs from here http://www.the16types.info/vbulletin...es-with-Videos

Going off of your video, you present yourself more like the SEIs than the ESEs, imo.

So my vote is for SEI.

[SaveYourself]

actually...

-edit, not important-

in the end, youre probably SEI. just a very weird one, also abnormal/unexpected etc.

guess i will just go back to hating all ESEs. your fault.

loooooool

I've come to quite like ESEs after this. As for type descriptions: didn't clarify much other than that Si+Fe ego sounds right. Anything relating to Ni PoLR in ESE descriptions hits home: I always start things late, take on too much, assume everything is going to be fine and often get bad surprises. But also SEI tends to describe my interaction style more. I think I'm more competitive than Gulenko's SEI but not as volatile as his ESE. Not as caregivery as either of them and definitely not as intrusive as his ESE. Have the work ethic of an SEI lol.

Overall SEI just feels more right I think.

though speaking of being competitive -- I think this post makes this the hottest thread on 16types (so no more deleting posts!!!)

edit: just saw your post about IR - lmao I dunno if that's type related or if I just have that effect on people. I'm preeettyy sure a lot of my irl interactions are like,
mrrrmaid: I'm gonna do this thing
everyone else: mrrrmaid, no!
mrrrmaid: yes

[falsehope]

I agree with Fe but not with Si. You have typical face of Ni. It's very characteristic. I'd guess EIE. Now check out Si PoLR if it something u relate to.

[SaveYourself]

I agree with Fe but not with Si. You have typical face of Ni. It's very characteristic. I'd guess EIE. Now check out Si PoLR if it something u relate to.

I started watching this video on EIE after Sol brought up that typing again and basically I relate to nothing in the Ni block:
"When anticipating trouble, prepares ahead of time" - I don't ever anticipate trouble. I'm optimistic to a fault (possibly) and other people usually point out things that could go wrong and I think they're being a drag for anticipating danger.
"Warns others about impending danger" - see above.
"Interested in unusual phenomena or cutting edge science" - the former maybe but only in passing
"Tends to withdraw and reflect on the meaning of life, the past and the future" - very occasionally. Usually about spirituality / prescribing some sort of meaning to my life but it's infrequent, not an on going exercise. Last time I did this was about three weeks ago. Before that would have probably been around about the time I made the video as a quest for self-discovery. Usually I'll think about something in-depth for an afternoon, come to a satisfactory conclusion and move on.
"Has a good memory for disturbing events" - nah, always looking forward. I can talk about the past quite casually.
"Exposes hidden inadequacy" - don't think I do this. Again, I tend to be positive. The only exception I can think of is calling out political systems.
"Knows what to expect of people" - this one possibly but again I'm really trusting of people and often get warned about being too trusting.

I relate more to Ni PoLR descriptions that Ni creative.

In terms of Si PoLR, we covered it a few pages back where I said I generally didn't have an issue with not relaxing like Golden & Adam do (and actually have the opposite problem). I think both Si lead and Si PoLR are hypersensitive to sensory stimuli, which was tripping me up when I was trying to understand the different types. In general though I do like spending time on aesthetic details and creating an image. I like being touched / being massaged / ASMR whereas I've heard Si PoLRs can take issue with that. Food I tend to either binge or purge so my weight fluctuates a lot but I think that could be indicative of both base and vulnerable Si - possibly with the difference being that base Si has more awareness of what they're doing?

This is a really popular typing for me though so if you or Sol or anyone could point out me using Ni beyond IR / VI I'd be up for listening.

[falsehope]

To type yourself is difficult but to type others is easy. This way you can type yourself based on relationship with others.
So, you could guess what type you are if you have some SEI or IEI friend and then you can see who is closer to you in terms of the way of thinking.
Typing yourself from type descriptions is nearly impossible if you dont have matching personality and usually there are huge variations among people of the same type. And these descriptions doesnt describe most of the people of the given type because it's quite complicated in real life.
You have Ni expressed on the face more than Si, or maybe you are ESE with Ni more expressed, who knows, I used mainly VI to guess your type.
I've seen many Ni people and you pretty match them with everything on your face. Especially eyes and lips are most revealing. I just can't imagine Alpha SF looking like that. They usually look completely different. There's big, visible difference between Ne/Si and Ni/Se axis.

[falsehope]

It also very often works in opposite direction than what you are trying to do - instead of knowing your personality so well you can guess your type without checking out with relationships, in fact you are not aware of your personality and once you discover your type you learn truth about yourself. And by default you choose normal, usual options which sound most cool when guessing your type.
Personality also changes over time so you might take 180 degree turn in 5 years or 10 and then type yourself correctly. These type descriptions for very often for mature, experienced people. Sometimes are describing negative, sometimes positive versions of them. With Ni it's a bit of both, but more on negative side.

[falsehope]

if you dont value input of others which is proper way of handling discussion then it's your problem and you should calm down and leave this discussion now

[AndyW]

Insulting humor is fairly the domain of beta quadra imo. Actually I must say I don’t understand where the connections between Fe and non-sarcasm and socialism, and Ti and no political arguments, are drawn from.

And again, how is the OP evidencing any Ni whatsoever, let alone enough to be Ni dominant?

Don't forget that the function you're most likely to see on a typing video is the creative, not the base. This is due to the creative function being a contact function, whilst the base is inert and thus often remains unseen. (Fe) as an information element is about creating and maintaining group emotional harmony, often at the cost of practicality and/or directness and truthfulness (Te). This often manifests in an idealism focused on collectivism, harmony and equality, of which socialism is one of the most prominent ones. Also, this is only anecdotal, but I know a lot of Delta women, and I've never known a socialist one; they're mostly married to successful (most often conservative) Gamma and Delta NT/ST types and are strongly individualistic. Socialism is anathema to (Fi)-valuers; they want freedom to feel however they want. As for (Ni) lead, I'm just extrapolating that from Mrrrmaid's lack of apparent (Si) valuing although, as I mentioned earlier, since the base function is often discreet it's possible she's SEI. Definitely (Fe) ego block, though. I could consider EIE or ESE as well, but my intuition tells me IEI is most likely, possibly with an irrational subtype.

[Xaiviay]

(Fe) as an information element is about creating and maintaining group emotional harmony, often at the cost of practicality and/or directness and truthfulness (Te). This often manifests in an idealism focused on collectivism, harmony and equality, of which socialism is one of the most prominent ones. Also, this is only anecdotal, but I know a lot of Delta women, and I've never known a socialist one; they're mostly married to successful (most often conservative) Gamma and Delta NT/ST types and are strongly individualistic. Socialism is anathema to (Fi)-valuers; they want freedom to feel however they want.

I don't think Socialism appeals anymore to Fe values than say, Te values o_0. Both have to do with how you want the overall environment to be. Fe could say "I don't want anyone to be able to say things that disagree with my values/hurt my feelings" and Te could say "there's a proper place and function for everything and everyone, and I know best what it is". I'm not saying Te-valuing types would be more naturally Socialist, what I mean to say is I don't think it has anything more to do with certain Socionics types over others.

I'm strongly individualistic and a lot of other Fe-egos I know are as well. Socialism is not appealing to me at all.

Don't forget that the function you're most likely to see on a typing video is the creative, not the base. This is due to the creative function being a contact function, whilst the base is inert and thus often remains unseen.

However, I agree with this^

[SaveYourself]

if you dont value input of others which is proper way of handling discussion then it's your problem and you should calm down and leave this discussion now

this is a four page long type me thread - I super value the input of others and want to understand socionics the best I can. Also idk how I came across in my post to you above but I'm very calm about it all.

My issue with Ni vs Si is that the people who have pegged me as Si/Ne (Golden, Ooo, HotelAmbush) all pointed out things I said that put me on that axis. The people who put me on the Ni/Se axis have asked me to trust their VI / IR typing skills. From looking around the forum at his typings, I actually do hold Sol's typings in high regard. I also agree I look more like a beta NF than an Alpha SF. But literally no one has been able to show me Ni/Se valuing in my video or throughout this thread. So by default I'm trusting the Si/Ne people more. Not least of all because I've also been VI'd as an SEI, IEI and an IEE (and an SLI?). And my post to you was breaking down Ni to try and open that discussion (not close it).

TL;DR I want to be shown not told

RE: Socialism vs Fe
I saw someone else make this distinction of Fe/Ti = socialism, Fi/Te = Capitalism recently. Does that have any weight in literature?
Also did I say I like socialism in my video? I do indeed fall to the left but tried to not get specific. Also fwiw I know zero fans of capitalism irl and I'm pretty sure some of them are delta / Fi. I've seen the SJW movement associated with Delta NFs on here enough for me to sway me to that typing since I'm sure many would probably label me an SJW

[SaveYourself]

haha mrmaid. i think his "calm down" message was to me - i called his post shit (meant meaningless, unhelpful) - post i deleted

haha this was my exact critique...

also the 'shown, not just told' thing

aah okay that makes more sense! I was worried I'd somehow come across as angry??

For the record, it should be super easy to convince me of being EIE because I nut over them so much. The Romantic image of a dramatic political visionary who's equal amounts philosophical and charismatic is my idealised image of myself / what I want to be lmao. Way more than the SEI / ESE and even IEE stereotypes. Just give me receipts

[Danali]

lol @everyone thinking you're EIE

[AndyW]

"ASMR-ish video" looool. poor mrmaid.

i also pronounce it "mistermaid" in my head. poor mrmaid.

That happened to me, too! It took me several minutes to realise how you're supposed to pronounce it. Poor Mrrrmaid!

[Xaiviay]

this is a four page long type me thread - I super value the input of others and want to understand socionics the best I can. Also idk how I came across in my post to you above but I'm very calm about it all.

My issue with Ni vs Si is that the people who have pegged me as Si/Ne (Golden, Ooo, HotelAmbush) all pointed out things I said that put me on that axis. The people who put me on the Ni/Se axis have asked me to trust their VI / IR typing skills. From looking around the forum at his typings, I actually do hold Sol's typings in high regard. I also agree I look more like a beta NF than an Alpha SF. But literally no one has been able to show me Ni/Se valuing in my video or throughout this thread. So by default I'm trusting the Si/Ne people more. Not least of all because I've also been VI'd as an SEI, IEI and an IEE (and an SLI?). And my post to you was breaking down Ni to try and open that discussion (not close it).

TL;DR I want to be shown not told

RE: Socialism vs Fe
I saw someone else make this distinction of Fe/Ti = socialism, Fi/Te = Capitalism recently. Does that have any weight in literature?
Also did I say I like socialism in my video? I do indeed fall to the left but tried to not get specific. Also fwiw I know zero fans of capitalism irl and I'm pretty sure some of them are delta / Fi. I've seen the SJW movement associated with Delta NFs on here enough for me to sway me to that typing since I'm sure many would probably label me an SJW

I suppose you do have a more typical Beta NF look (not sure why, but it's what immediately comes to mind), but in the video examples there were quite a few SEIs who moved around like you and had similar facial expressions. But like you said, your looks don't matter as much as what actually goes on inside your head.

And yes, so far you really don't seem very Se/Ni valuing in anything you've said. Our conversations have suggested to me that you're Si/Ne valuing, too.

The Fe/Ti = Socialism and Fi/Te = Capitalism has no weight in literature as far as I know, but if someone else knows more of it then please tell me. I'm a Capitalist/Libertarian btw, lol, so there are at least some exceptions.

There's a thread where Sperma was basically blaming the whole SJW movement he hates on Deltas (is that what you're refering to?) and I think that's just silly, honestly... My experience is only anecdotal, yes, but I've noticed plenty of Democrats and Republicans from all quadras. I think that people who try to link types or quadras with political parties are just trying to use type theory as a justification for their political agenda, emphasizing the negatives of the types/quadras they're associating with the politics they don't like.

[SaveYourself]

I suppose you do have a more typical Beta NF look (not sure why, but it's what immediately comes to mind), but in the video examples there were quite a few SEIs who moved around like you and had similar facial expressions. But like you said, your looks don't matter as much as what actually goes on inside your head.

And yes, so far you really don't seem very Se/Ni valuing in anything you've said. Our conversations have suggested to me that you're Si/Ne valuing, too.

Word. From what I can tell I actually really don't like Se/Ni though I'll try to keep my mind open.

The Fe/Ti = Socialism and Fi/Te = Capitalism has no weight in literature as far as I know, but if someone else knows more of it then please tell me. I'm a Capitalist/Libertarian btw, lol, so there are at least some exceptions.

There's a thread where Sperma was basically blaming the whole SJW movement he hates on Deltas (is that what you're refering to?) and I think that's just silly, honestly... My experience is only anecdotal, yes, but I've noticed plenty of Democrats and Republicans from all quadras. I think that people who try to link types or quadras with political parties are just trying to use type theory as a justification for their political agenda, emphasizing the negatives of the types/quadras they're associating with the politics they don't like.

Sperma and also Olimpia made the connection. I think I saw it somewhere else as well but I can't remember who / where. I'm guessing it's humanitarian club + Se (the manly, manly, aggressor IE) aversion?

Yeah this just seems like a very loose connection and not something worth bringing into a typing discussion but, like I said, this is the second time I've seen it so I wondered if there was anything written on it. The other person who told me this said it was based in literature (that he didn't provide, obv) and that I just didn't understand socionics This was on PerC, which I have since strayed away from lmao

[Xaiviay]

Word. From what I can tell I actually really don't like Se/Ni though I'll try to keep my mind open.

Lol you and me both, then

Sperma and also Olimpia made the connection. I think I saw it somewhere else as well but I can't remember who / where. I'm guessing it's humanitarian club + Se (the manly, manly, aggressor IE) aversion?

Yeah this just seems like a very loose connection and not something worth bringing into a typing discussion but, like I said, this is the second time I've seen it so I wondered if there was anything written on it. The other person who told me this said it was based in literature (that he didn't provide, obv) and that I just didn't understand socionics This was on PerC, which I have since strayed away from lmao

Oh I see. The problem I see is that even with those two values (humanitarian and Se-devaluing) I've seen plenty of people who are both for and against the SJW movement based on those same ideals. It's possible there is still a correlation, though. Also yeah, that guy's answer on PerC wasn't very helpful lol xD

[SaveYourself]

https://streamable.com/tisg7

what is this

[Desert Financial]

@mrrrmaid you seem like an E and an F.
Gonna agree with @Myst and @Without Warning. IEE seems likely.

[SaveYourself]

@mrrrmaid you seem like an E and an F.
Gonna agree with @Myst and @Without Warning. IEE seems likely.

Looooool I personally ruled out IEE. These days I generally think I bleed Fe out my eyeballs and live that IE more than Ne (and pretty much any other function). I mentioned in another thread that when I think about what I give people, it's always Fe rather than Ne / Si / Ni or whatever else anyone has typed me as.

And if Fe then ESE is more likely because my Fe is positively charged: "being happy, expressing enthusiasm, being happy and open with people." (Unless you use old charges because then I'm still positively charged but then EIE: "maximization of positive emotions. Even small doses are enjoyed. Against the backdrop of the dramatic, turbulent emotions that always accompany this quadra, every small occurrence deserving a positive response is seen as an occasion for joy and uplifts their spirits.") The latter fits me better but also is now outdated?? I definitely proactively try to liven people up and cause mischief but never "escalate conflicts, be angry, indignant" like Fe-. That's a space I slide into when forced but actively try to avoid. But there's obviously now a whole other thread about me & my romantic attitude which points more towards EIE. EIE I think fits better but also I definitely come across more ESE, as other forum members have mentioned.

I'm essentially waiting on @Ben Vaserlan to release an ESE in a nutshell Model G video so I can compare it to EIE (no pressure, Ben) since these have been the most helpful socionics educational resource I've seen yet.

[Ben Vaserlan]

I'm essentially waiting on @Ben Vaserlan to release an ESE in a nutshell Model G video so I can compare it to EIE (no pressure, Ben) since these have been the most helpful socionics educational resource I've seen yet.

Thanks. I appreciate your kind words. I aim to do an FeSx whiteboard soon. Are you a member of my Model G facebook group? https://www.facebook.com/groups/ModelViktor/

[Delilah]

I like your video @OP. I lean Te/Fi for your type. Good luck with your dissertation.

[SaveYourself]

Thanks. I appreciate your kind words. I aim to do an FeSx whiteboard soon. Are you a member of my Model G facebook group? https://www.facebook.com/groups/ModelViktor/

That link comes up as "page unavailable" for me. I did request to join a little while ago but I don't think I got approved and I also can't find it whilst searching for it now? I've 'liked' the Model G page though. Glad to hear it about the FeSx video!

[Dee]

Just by VI I'd go for ESTp. Reminds me of my ESTp girlfrield from teen years.

[SaveYourself]

Just by VI I'd go for ESTp. Reminds me of my ESTp girlfrield from teen years.

ngl - all the men I fancy are beta NFs

[Exodus]

Looooool I personally ruled out IEE. These days I generally think I bleed Fe out my eyeballs and live that IE more than Ne (and pretty much any other function). I mentioned in another thread that when I think about what I give people, it's always Fe rather than Ne / Si / Ni or whatever else anyone has typed me as.

That is sort of the impression I get from your posts

[SaveYourself]

Continued from the Caregiving thread --

As others have already said, being attentive to your own and others' practical needs is an essential part of who Alpha SFs (and Si egos more generally) are. This can lead to being doting in relationships of course, whoever the other person is. It is not about "protecting" someone either.

Is this a description of you? I'm getting the sense that you aren't as averse to conflict and negativity as you described in your video...if you really can't identify with "Caregiving" then EIE could be an option.

haha this was in response to describing extreme personality disorder-esque tendencies. I feel like all of the above is very playful and like a game rather than genuinely seeking conflict. Focusing less on the negative extremes to which this could be taken: I get approached by men fairly often and a lot of the time I don't know why they have singled me out or why they think I would like them because I think I can be a lot to handle / a bit extreme and most guys aren't going to appreciate that (I don't mean this in an egotistical "I'm better than them" sense - just in a practical sense in that I'm excitable with quite extreme opinions and really over the top aesthetics and then really normal guys approach me? What do we have in common? What can we provide each other?) The difference with a friendship situation is I would tone down everything and slowly let the weirdness out as it develops (I call it "the politics dance" where you slowly take it in turns to escalate your political expression to see how radical you can take it before the other person bails). With a dating situation, I won't shy away from saying radical political opinions or taking the lead in the conversation so I am more my 'true' self with the explicit aim of seeing if he likes it and if not, it's just a waste of both our time.

It terms of conflict more generally - I think what I said in the video is that I don't like edgy humour or anything that is done to rile people up, which is something you picked out as being un-Beta like. I'd stand by that still. What annoys me about this is the aim to upset people and often the inauthenticity of it (i.e. saying something offensive just because you can). In terms of conflict style I'm purely punitive. I can only think of one time I've been angry about something that wasn't an ethical judgement (it was some mindless bureaucracy I was being forced to do). If I see someone using offensive humour in real life I'll normally just either ask them to explain it or break it down for them with the explicit intent of making them look stupid. I've been actually angry, like blind rage shouting angry, maybe five times tops. This is my main hesitation for Beta because I rarely feel negative emotions and in the times where I have expressed anger (all punitive, like someone bullying my friend) it took everyone, including me, by surprise because it was so out-of-character.

side-note: I've always loved the term "Social Justice Warrior" even though it's used as an insult and applies to a certain type of political thought. Forgetting about the movement itself for a minute, Social Justice Warrior sounds like a compliment to me because it literally means fighting for fairness and social equality. Like a kick ass paladin. That phrase describes my conflict style well. But I'm probably less continuously charged and ready for battle than the movement itself.

[Exodus]

Continued from the Caregiving thread --



haha this was in response to describing extreme personality disorder-esque tendencies. I feel like all of the above is very playful and like a game rather than genuinely seeking conflict. Focusing less on the negative extremes to which this could be taken: I get approached by men fairly often and a lot of the time I don't know why they have singled me out or why they think I would like them because I think I can be a lot to handle / a bit extreme and most guys aren't going to appreciate that (I don't mean this in an egotistical "I'm better than them" sense - just in a practical sense in that I'm excitable with quite extreme opinions and really over the top aesthetics and then really normal guys approach me? What do we have in common? What can we provide each other?) The difference with a friendship situation is I would tone down everything and slowly let the weirdness out as it develops (I call it "the politics dance" where you slowly take it in turns to escalate your political expression to see how radical you can take it before the other person bails). With a dating situation, I won't shy away from saying radical political opinions or taking the lead in the conversation so I am more my 'true' self with the explicit aim of seeing if he likes it and if not, it's just a waste of both our time.

It terms of conflict more generally - I think what I said in the video is that I don't like edgy humour or anything that is done to rile people up, which is something you picked out as being un-Beta like. I'd stand by that still. What annoys me about this is the aim to upset people and often the inauthenticity of it (i.e. saying something offensive just because you can). In terms of conflict style I'm purely punitive. I can only think of one time I've been angry about something that wasn't an ethical judgement (it was some mindless bureaucracy I was being forced to do). If I see someone using offensive humour in real life I'll normally just either ask them to explain it or break it down for them with the explicit intent of making them look stupid. I've been actually angry, like blind rage shouting angry, maybe five times tops. This is my main hesitation for Beta because I rarely feel negative emotions and in the times where I have expressed anger (all punitive, like someone bullying my friend) it took everyone, including me, by surprise because it was so out-of-character.

side-note: I've always loved the term "Social Justice Warrior" even though it's used as an insult and applies to a certain type of political thought. Forgetting about the movement itself for a minute, Social Justice Warrior sounds like a compliment to me because it literally means fighting for fairness and social equality. Like a kick ass paladin. That phrase describes my conflict style well. But I'm probably less continuously charged and ready for battle than the movement itself.

Interesting. Maybe ESE could work...but this kind of thing does sound rather Beta / SeFe (in particular the bolded parts).

[Lord Panda]

@mrrrmaid I relate to you on feeling really "extreme." The only part I sort of don't relate to is the politics thing. I tend to not think about things like that. If something is too complex I avoid thinking about it. Especially if there are multiple sides to the argument, having me pick sides is difficult. I typically can empathize with all people. Not saying I can't recognize bad politics, I definitely can.

You definitely give off more irrational vibes than rational ones, bases on the video I saw. I definitely think SEI fits, but so could IEI. If you feel like you "bleed" Fe, you could just consider SEI Fe? I think it's likely.

As for the caregiver/victim thing, I change my mind, and say don't put too much stress on that. From what I've seen people tend to have a secondary romantic style that they can relate to. For me, if it's not caregiver, the next best fit would be victim and not aggressor, despite not having weak Se...

But anyway, here's my two cents, hopefully it helps.

[SaveYourself]

Interesting. Maybe ESE could work...but this kind of thing does sound rather Beta / SeFe (in particular the bolded parts).

Yeah I just don't think I have the 'edge' associated with EIE. The whole thread going on at the moment about -Fe in EIEs and them having negative emotions is completely foreign to me. I seem to lack that negativist Ni pessimism. I had a conversation with a friend about whether I can appear cold / guarded when people first meet me (which I worried that I did, since I'm often anxious during first impressions) and he laughed and said I'm never anything but soft and big hearted. But also I don't have any practical caregiving skills or instinct. The best I can think of is protection like I mentioned above or looking out for people to make sure they're having a good time (but in conversation, making sure they're included, introducing them to the right people etc rather than sensory care). I think I'm definitely Fe but then it's just about figuring out which of the above is less of a 'dealbreaker'. This is why I said I was waiting for Ben's video on ESE since his explanations are the ones I understand the best and I'm hoping just a basic understanding of IEs in Model G will clear things up.

@mrrrmaid I relate to you on feeling really "extreme." The only part I sort of don't relate to is the politics thing. I tend to not think about things like that. If something is too complex I avoid thinking about it. Especially if there are multiple sides to the argument, having me pick sides is difficult. I typically can empathize with all people. Not saying I can't recognize bad politics, I definitely can.

You definitely give off more irrational vibes than rational ones, bases on the video I saw. I definitely think SEI fits, but so could IEI. If you feel like you "bleed" Fe, you could just consider SEI Fe? I think it's likely.

As for the caregiver/victim thing, I change my mind, and say don't put too much stress on that. From what I've seen people tend to have a secondary romantic style that they can relate to. For me, if it's not caregiver, the next best fit would be victim and not aggressor, despite not having weak Se...

But anyway, here's my two cents, hopefully it helps.

Yeah I think the 'extreme' is the Fe. Everyone tends to know what I'm feeling at any given time regardless of whether I want them to or not Politics to me is always very generally discussed. I'm not very good - or interested - in technical political debate (I can leave that to my Ti-ego dual I guess) To me it's more about overarching ethical principals, which I love discussing, and then politics should be the implementing of these. So if I debate it, it's like "this is right / wrong", "this political party is corrupt", "there needs to be more attention paid to this issue." But also I find it exhausting and emotionally draining to be in the thick of it. Usually I have no problem picking sides, though. Sometimes I'm maybe too black & white if anything.

I think the victim / caregiver thing might fall into place once I know my type based on ego functions. I feel like more of a victim but I'm not sure I want an aggressor. And I've never actually properly dated an infantile so I don't know for sure I wouldn't enjoy that or pick up the caregiving once I was with one. Like I said above, I'm very protective so maybe if I was actually presented with someone who sucked at Si and kept getting sick I might suddenly step up to the practical caregiving (though the only time I remember being with a sick boyfriend he whined about his illness and I was just like "lying in bed thinking about it just makes it worse - get up and get over it" loool so maybe not. I also tried to cook him a meal once and completely fucked it up so never attempted again). So yeah, it's either working out my creative or dating loads of boys to figure it out, which ever is quicker and easier

[SaveYourself]

RE: being a victim--

I've been thinking about what it is I want from a partner and if I'm gauntlet throwing or 'testing' them, it's not because I want them to 'win' me or 'beat' me at the game. I want the reassurance that we are on the same level, that they will appreciate what I have to offer and that they bring for me. I'm trying to test out as many of the more unlikeable or difficult parts of my personality as possible (as well as the good parts, of course) because dating is a lot of effort and why waste both our time? If we wait until the fourth date to find out we're politically incompatible, or the fifth date before I dress as loudly as I usually do then we might find an issue that seems stupid to break up over but would have been perfectly good reason to not go out with each other in the first place - does that make sense? It might be anxiety or just a straight up fact that I'm out of step with general convention and any time I've tried to appeal to the norm I've just end up on boring dates / hanging out with people I don't like. So I'm looking for security, reassurance and shared values. An honest expression of our true selves.

[golden]

I’ll give an example of a caregiver I know and mentioned earlier. SEI, a visual artist, a homebody, a stoner, loves animals. Sometimes she will cook, her place is not much cleaner than mine but organized differently, and when it gets messy she’s unperturbed by it whereas I am thrown off. She’s married to a pretty eccentric guy and accommodates the eccentricity very well. She likes kids a lot and has good rapport with them but probably won’t ever have any.

She is not someone who’s taking care of any adult babymen, I am pretty sure she’d find that very draining and offputting. It’s fair to say the men in her life have provided her equal care as she’s given them. But she will still do very thoughtful things, like make a painting just for you based on your favorite colors and ideas. She’ll buy really comfortable objects, like the softest bedsheets you ever felt, which I’d have had a hard time finding even if I were looking for them. She’s a cozy and adorable person. She’s reassuring and wants you to feel good.

So I’d say this comes down to her point of view, her vibe, the climate she creates around her. Not some stereotype of a 1950s housewife.