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Thread: WTH IS UP WITH ESFP-Fi guys being more shy than I am!?

  1. #81
    Memory of Tomorrow Reuben's Avatar
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    Hi Nanashi you sexy SF type.
    She is wise
    beyond words
    beautiful within
    her soul
    brighter than
    the sun
    lovelier than
    love
    dreams larger
    than life
    and does not
    understand the
    meaning of no.
    Because everything
    through her, and in her, is
    "Yes, it will be done."


    Why I love LSEs:
    Quote Originally Posted by Abbie
    A couple years ago I was put in charge of decorating the college for Valentine's Day. I made some gorgeous, fancy decorations from construction paper, glue, scissors, and imagination. Then I covered a couple cabinets with them. But my favorite was the diagram of a human heart I put up. So romantic!

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    EffyCold The Ineffable's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Typhon View Post
    Its based on her personal experience and I think she just wanted to express frustration at the fact these guys are more shy than she is, not redefine socionics or make any big intellectual claims.
    Of course. It's not a big deal, I was pissed cause many people tell random "truths" here but whatever. The Socionics on the forum (unfortunately) is pretty much what all people claim, basically we type ourselves than we redefine the types around that, not the other way around which would allow us to correct ourselves if we have mistaken.

    I have typed her as Ep since the beginning of time, now this issue - people she likes being more awkward than her - comes in contradiction with both my conclusion and the theory. Why am I wrong here and not her typing? If I hit my head and believe I'm an ESI, do you have to accept that an ESI can have this personality against all what's known about this type (Model and descriptions)? I don't think so, one's self-typing is not a given, but it has to be justified, on that justification is based any new insight. To me, any claim that is not justified is bullshit...

    Sometimes Enneagram stuff correspond to Socionics types, while others come in contradiction with them. Let's put it this way: if a E trait is atypical to ILI, it doesn't make you a so/sx ILI, but a different type. Say this person is innately interested in socializing, people and relationships, because of so/sx (or whatever, it doesn't matter), that infriges on this sociotype, from the ground up the person is not one, this is no rocket science. Calling infrigement on the definition "insightful" is against common-sense, IMO.
    Shock intuition, diamond logic.
     

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  3. #83
    divine, too human WVBRY's Avatar
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    Ok. We get that you beleive she is not ILI. Im not gonna debate this(I beleive she is); but what you argue about an E type trait is, while true, not considering that you might not have observed all sociotypes of this stacking. In other words there can be ILIs who behave like her because of this stacking, all ILIs of this stacking will behave this way, and we can say that this is an ILI triat. Im not saying ennegram and socionics should be superimposed as systems; but lets face it people's qualities are superimposed and muddled hence we can assume that saying ILIs so/sx can behave this way if we observe that others do as well; if not well, then she may really may have been mistyped.

    Let me ask you; have you observed many Te-ILI so/sx types?
    Last edited by WVBRY; 10-21-2011 at 06:18 PM.

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    EffyCold The Ineffable's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Typhon View Post
    Let me ask you; have you observed many Te-ILI so/sx types?
    For the record, I have not typed any ILI other than ILI (no Te- or so/sx).

    I don't see how my answer would be possible (let alone relevant), since the problem lays in the contradiction between these traits and the type. Believing this "so/sx" ILI can exist would be a mistake in the first place, because ILI is a model which from the definition is different, you don't have to look further [1]. So since I told you that this possibility infriges the definition, how can you ask me whether I ever observed one? [2]
    ---

    [1] - It's like going out for diamonds, knowing its crystalline properties a priori, just to come later with graphite claiming that that is in fact that the diamond. It just makes no logical sense.
    [2] - it's like asking me whether I observed an amorphous diamond, it is just nonsensical.
    Shock intuition, diamond logic.
     

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    Quote Originally Posted by WorkaholicsAnon View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by WorkaholicsAnon View Post
    Believe it or not, Absurd, relationships to a lot of us mean more than just sex.
    Quote Originally Posted by Absurd View Post
    To us like you're same type/quadra nanashi is or something else and yea, I was joking, but let's pretend I didn't.
    Quote Originally Posted by kassie View Post
    or date rape.

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    Quote Originally Posted by nanashi View Post
    I already pursue you friendishly. ............You want a boy, though. So do I. WHY IS ONE OF US NOT A MAN??
    just go for it it's all good

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    Quote Originally Posted by Shayley View Post
    The 'familiar roles' described below for the sx/so type, of - provocateur, activist and exhibitionist as well as the overall general description does sound extroverted like and make me wonder if it is at all compatible with the ILI.
    Though on a personal note, written below are some things that I do at times when needed (not on the forum but in face to face one on one or group interactions) such as push buttons, question assumptions and even at times challenge conventions...but I only do it when absolutely needed.

    And once again I still have to say that I haven't yet seen an Ni base in use by yourself. I will keep an eye out for what you write in the future just to be sure though.

    Does anyone here who knows the enneagram well, know of an ILI sx/so type? Is this combination possible? If so can you provide a link to a video clip of them as I would be interested to see how this plays out.

    http://www.ocean-moonshine.net/e1428...ion=80:80sx/so
    This is the type that exudes the most raw charisma and sexual energy. They may identify so strongly with whatever they're involved with that they often become the symbol of its core essence, and sometimes its lead agent for change. Hardly content with the status quo, this subvariant seeks to alter the fundamental structure of something while at once embodying it's purest or most extreme form. Possibly attracted to radical views on politics, philosophy, spirituality or creativity that reflect their penchant for testing boundaries. They enjoy pushing other's buttons, especially those resistant to their modes of expression. It's not uncommon for them to have a pet social, political or spiritual cause which they're able to support with heartfelt conviction. May exploit and seek to redefine sexuality to reflect their own colorful and uncertain understanding of it. While prone to exhibitionism, they are strongly attracted to grounding influences which can anchor them and provide stability. Failure to satisfy an especially intense desire for connection may cause this subvariant to spite others at the risk of jeopardizing the need for an equal, stabilizing force. Can feel pulled between wanting a life of maximum intensity and reassuring episodes of peaceful convention.
    Motivation: to impact others, question assumptions, challenge convention.
    Familiar roles: provocateur, activist, exhibitionish
    Examples of sx/so: Madonna, John Lennon, Yukio Mishima, Robin Williams, Drew Barrymore, Richard Simmons, Elvis, Bono, George Michael, Sinead O'Connor, Joan of Arc





    Some Enneagram 5w6 sx/so peeps (like nanashi), typed by Tomb, dfgray44, marie, Pork, Savory, and others on http://www.stackemup.net:
    Robert Caro
    Cornel West
    Bobby Fischer
    Graham Greene
    Leon Trotsky
    Slavoj Zizek
    Last edited by nanashi; 10-22-2011 at 01:58 AM.

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    Memory of Tomorrow Reuben's Avatar
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    I'm going with Ineffable. Nanashi is clearly an SEE. She's sexy, manipulative, and has a great body.
    She is wise
    beyond words
    beautiful within
    her soul
    brighter than
    the sun
    lovelier than
    love
    dreams larger
    than life
    and does not
    understand the
    meaning of no.
    Because everything
    through her, and in her, is
    "Yes, it will be done."


    Why I love LSEs:
    Quote Originally Posted by Abbie
    A couple years ago I was put in charge of decorating the college for Valentine's Day. I made some gorgeous, fancy decorations from construction paper, glue, scissors, and imagination. Then I covered a couple cabinets with them. But my favorite was the diagram of a human heart I put up. So romantic!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Reuben View Post
    I'm going with Ineffable.
    I noticed that already, have fun. Don't get stuck in the honey jar.

  10. #90
    an object in motion woofwoofl's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by nanashi View Post
    I do as long as they are Gamma SF and like me, too.
    I do like you

    Quote Originally Posted by Absurd View Post
    Quote Originally Posted by Reuben View Post
    I'm going with Ineffable.
    I noticed that already, have fun. Don't get stuck in the honey jar.
    p . . . a . . . n . . . d . . . o . . . r . . . a
    trad metalz | (more coming)

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    Memory of Tomorrow Reuben's Avatar
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    Don't get stuck in the honey jar.
    The honey jar got stuck in me. Need your help Absurd...
    She is wise
    beyond words
    beautiful within
    her soul
    brighter than
    the sun
    lovelier than
    love
    dreams larger
    than life
    and does not
    understand the
    meaning of no.
    Because everything
    through her, and in her, is
    "Yes, it will be done."


    Why I love LSEs:
    Quote Originally Posted by Abbie
    A couple years ago I was put in charge of decorating the college for Valentine's Day. I made some gorgeous, fancy decorations from construction paper, glue, scissors, and imagination. Then I covered a couple cabinets with them. But my favorite was the diagram of a human heart I put up. So romantic!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Reuben View Post
    The honey jar got stuck in me. Need your help Absurd...
    If stupidity could fly you would be a genius.

  13. #93
    divine, too human WVBRY's Avatar
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    If stupidity could fly hed be in fucking orbit.

  14. #94
    EffyCold The Ineffable's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Reuben View Post
    I'm going with Ineffable. Nanashi is clearly an SEE. She's sexy, manipulative, and has a great body.
    I actually type her IEE, though in respect to this thread I guess it does not make a difference. At a first sight one main difference between a Se-Base and a Ne-Base is that a Se Base never pees against the wind, even when that's where the toilet is. Although maybe I'm wrong, I can't imagine an SEE (as Gammas in general) outside the system, protesting against the status quo. Just saying.
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    divine, too human WVBRY's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Ineffable View Post
    Se Base never pees against the wind, even when that's where the toilet is. Although maybe I'm wrong, I can't imagine an SEE (as Gammas in general) outside the system, protesting against the status quo. Just saying.
    U wrong bro

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    I am not an infantile, romantically. I may be a pseudo-aggressor, but I'm not an aggressor.


    As far as my relation to forum members:
    Gamma's make sense to me and cheer me up, both with little effort on my part.
    Ashton (ENTJ-Ni) types me as ILI-Te sx/so When Ashton and I used to talk, the Te and Gamma were obvious in both of us. Timmy and Cpig are probably closest to me typewise on the forum, and Ashton is very near my type.
    Woofwoofl and D0lphin and Axelysyd (SEEs) are attractive from my pov, really attractive.

    Delta's are what I'm used to because I have an EII mom for whom I clearly am the benefactor and several delta friends.
    Galen (ENFP) thinks I'm ILI I am drawn to/mesmerized by his Fi, and he's said he's drawn to my Te. We clearly have different values where sp and so instincts are concerned.
    I supervise Airborne (ESTJ).

    Alpha and Beta
    A merry type (?) saw me on Tinychat when I misunderstood something Fe favoring types would get and said, "Oh, you are ILI, aren't you?" in a surprised tone. The person had been only typing with me before then seeing me on cam.
    Ineffable is in an extinguishment relationship with me.
    DJ (ISTj) clearly is my benefactor. We have a cool friendship, though. I find his Se attractive, and I like his Ti. He's stated that my Te pisses him off sometimes.
    Golden (ENFJ) and I understand each other, but I bring way too much Fi-valuing to the table for her taste.
    My ESTp best friend and I have a great semi-duality relationship.

    I VI like Kim Raver, Natalie Zea, and Vanessa Paradis.


    I'm Ip. This whole thread started because I am surprised that the Ep types who like me will make some moves but that I make a lot of them, too.
    http://www.wikisocion.org/en/index.p...IP_temperament
    http://www.wikisocion.org/en/index.p...e=Gamma_Quadra

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    Quote Originally Posted by nanashi View Post
    I supervise Airborne (ESTJ).
    I think everyone supervises him on here, especially me.

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    divine, too human WVBRY's Avatar
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    edit.

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    Default look how they act in public sometimes

    he's the extrovert. She's just an intense introvert. http://www.oprah.com/oprahshow/Jada-...hshow?page=155

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    Memory of Tomorrow Reuben's Avatar
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    Honestly, what the fuck does it mean by 'Your Te pisses me off', "I love your Fi", "You're supervising me with your Ni", "Stop turning me on with your Se".

    What the fuck?

    Try instead: "Your penchant for long-winded, unnecessary delving into ridiculously irrelevant detail pisses me off", "I love the way your eyes light up when you talk to me", "You're making me uncomfortable with your insistence on the need to plan my timetable and keep track of time", "Stop sticking your big, hairy penis in my face".

    C'mon seriously. Can we be more human and less of Aushra Augasta's drones?
    She is wise
    beyond words
    beautiful within
    her soul
    brighter than
    the sun
    lovelier than
    love
    dreams larger
    than life
    and does not
    understand the
    meaning of no.
    Because everything
    through her, and in her, is
    "Yes, it will be done."


    Why I love LSEs:
    Quote Originally Posted by Abbie
    A couple years ago I was put in charge of decorating the college for Valentine's Day. I made some gorgeous, fancy decorations from construction paper, glue, scissors, and imagination. Then I covered a couple cabinets with them. But my favorite was the diagram of a human heart I put up. So romantic!

  21. #101
    divine, too human WVBRY's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Reuben View Post
    Honestly, what the fuck does it mean by 'Your Te pisses me off', "I love your Fi", "You're supervising me with your Ni", "Stop turning me on with your Se".

    What the fuck?

    Try instead: "Your penchant for long-winded, unnecessary delving into ridiculously irrelevant detail pisses me off", "I love the way your eyes light up when you talk to me", "You're making me uncomfortable with your insistence on the need to plan my timetable and keep track of time", "Stop sticking your big, hairy penis in my face".

    C'mon seriously. Can we be more human and less of Aushra Augasta's drones?
    I agree, I think that her drscriptions are really just theorotical and not practical examples at all.

  22. #102
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    Quote Originally Posted by nanashi View Post
    or at least as shy. I mean.....I'm sx/so and Te subtype, so that means I'm more social than other ILIs, but COME ON. Dammit.

    I can hit on you. I can ask you out. I can flirt. I can make the first physical move, I can come to your music show when you want me to so much, but IF YOU (according to my platonic guy friend) clearly like me a lot , stop being so damned skittish. I keep thinking of being forward, and I see your skittishness and think you are maybe not into me. AND IT IS STOPPING ME FROM HITTING ON YOU AGAIN.

    And multiple experiences are making me feel weirdly firebally compared to you.

    So, maybe that's good. This whole expression of my heretofore unexpressed feeling has resulted in me accepting this trait of yours, and I feel more "fine, I'll keep hitting on you."
    This dude is ILI as I am ESE.

  23. #103
    carrina's Avatar
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    ESFP-Se "Easily manipulates relationships; able to attract people who do not yet know him. Is emotionally unstable; therefore is frequently unsociable (may provoke something and in the case of failure - rapidly retreat into the shadows)"
    Also cited as "an emotional, gusty, and nervous person."- See more at: http://www.sociotype.com/socionics/t....oQYoArK2.dpuf

  24. #104
    carrina's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Reuben View Post
    Honestly, what the fuck does it mean by 'Your Te pisses me off', "I love your Fi", "You're supervising me with your Ni", "Stop turning me on with your Se".

    What the fuck?

    Try instead: "Your penchant for long-winded, unnecessary delving into ridiculously irrelevant detail pisses me off", "I love the way your eyes light up when you talk to me", "You're making me uncomfortable with your insistence on the need to plan my timetable and keep track of time", "Stop sticking your big, hairy penis in my face".

    C'mon seriously. Can we be more human and less of Aushra Augasta's drones?
    So much ze funny

  25. #105
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    Quote Originally Posted by Typhon View Post
    U wrong bro
    You right bro

  26. #106
    back for the time being Chae's Avatar
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    Thread's super old, but relevant nevertheless, I had some thoughts on this.
    Fi shyness isn't actual shyness, but selectiveness. Gamma types need a gradual "warming up" in any type of human relation, we're not on a merry level instantly (yes yes SEE-Fi's Fe is 4.5D but it isn't VALUED i.e. considered with conscious efforts. They are always merry when they have to be but in private... oh man). We value Ni, so long-term dedication determines our choice of interaction, and SEE-Fi's Ni is more pronounced than SEE-Se's, that's important. So nothing too casual here. Meanwhile, SEE-Se is the opposite of shy, sporting very prominent democracy. See @jaded whore. Te HA creates a focus on how necessary a relation is to one, hence SEE-Fi will be reserved until decisive while looking out for someone who's also keen on a more pragmatic style of interaction.

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