Time

[zenbrat]

Is a sense of time relatively abstract to all members of Delta? Does it seem like a resource we can never get a handle on, i.e. time is always hoarded or overspent?

I tend to lose time. I sit down to check email "for a sec" before we leave to pick up dinner... two hours later...

I never calculate how long something will take with any degree of accuracy. I forget a lot of little prerequisite details, then have to waste time trying to take care of them all so I can actually DO the scheduled activity... hours later.

I am chronically late unless it costs me money or causes me to pay the same amount for less time.

I overspend time. I like to schedule things in advance so I can (try to) make sure I make enough time for everything. If someone cancels, I am disappointed but flexible - I have other stuff waiting in queue that can be moved around. If invited to something I don't want to do, I will say "I'll try to make it" then procrastinate or hesitantly make an excuse at the last minute.

My ISTP friends hoard time. They are noncommittal about scheduling because they hate the feeling of impending obligations. But, if on the day of the invite you say "oh, I didn't know you wanted to, so I made other plans", they are a bit affronted. I've learned that any show of interest in the activity (however noncommittally communicated) translates to "yea, ok". If they don't want to, or aren't planning on it, they will say so on the spot.

What invariably happens is that I overschedule, mainly because I misinterpret the level of "interest" from others. Then I'm a flake because I wasn't planning for that event with them. I then have to put it off indefinately, reschedule, make excuses or just not explain and say "I can't".

Very bad thing to do with xSTx types - makes them angry and obstinate because they decide you're a flake. ISTP's think you're toying with them. ESTJ's think you don't respect their time. INFJ's think you just didn't care enough about them.

How can Delta types speak each other's time language in a way that makes sense to all? How can we appropriately communicate interest and explain our own quirks in a way that avoids repeated misunderstandings?

[implied]

@ zenbrat - call if you're going to be late.

[force my hand]

This is very interesting to me, though I'm not sure I can articulate why.

Keeping appointments with respect to business, or 'formal' contexts is very important to me, and I will usually make them. However, not without a lot of stress - repeated checks of the clock to make sure I'm on schedule. I would prefer not to be in that position to begin with, because it feels like my future is being squeezed into some unavoidable point - like rafting on a river, having the current pick up, and realizing that it's too late to stop and you'll just have to go through that looming canyon with all those lovely rapids.

For that reason, I demand flexibility in more personal terms. "What time will you be arriving?", my mother asks when I make plans to visit them. "I don't know - I'll leave when I leave." I leave whenever the impulse strikes, and that could be ahead of time (to her surprise, "if I'd known you'd get here so soon, I'd have gotten some dinner ready!"), or hours after the fact - in the middle of the night.

Environment is also a hefty factor. If I'm out and about in public, then I expect personal engagements to be kept because I will be there. In fact, I may have recently toasted a potential relationship because I got fed up with her not keeping her agreed appointments; it doesn't matter that you decided to call me and reschedule - you gave your word on a place and time and failed to live up to it.

On the other hand, I'm very bad at keeping dates if I'm at home doing what feels like 'decompressing'. I think, hey, this is a good situation - I really don't feel like going out, so let's reschedule? The hypocrisy is not lost to me, but again the previous river rafting analogy comes into play. I don't want to be directed that way.

To further confuse the issue, I cannot judge how seriously someone is about keeping plans when they make them with me. I have to rely on my personal experiences with them. For example, my parents are rock solid. My sister? half and half. Friends? Some even worse. My inability, or perhaps my skepticism to take others at face value makes forming and maintaining new friendships difficult. "Oh no, I was just kidding about getting together today - you're so naive!" is something I fear to hear.

[rockclimber]

I am rarely late for anything, and it really annoys me when other people are.

[jewels]

Zenbrat, I competely relate with your post.

Personally, I have no concept of time at all. I'm usually late, not because I want to annoy people, but because I'm so wrapped up in whatever I'm doing. But I feel guilty every time though!! If I have to be somewhere on time (a movie, flight, etc) I will be there. Or if I know the person waiting will feel very uncomfortable (let's say a girl friend who is waiting to meet me at a bar and I know it feels weird to wait alone). But if it's a group and they're content w/o me it's harder for me to get there on time.

I was visiting my parents today in another city and actually had to ask my dad (ENTJ) if I had enough time to do something before I left. He said no. I was actually glad he said that because I had been thinking "hmm...if I do this extremely quickly, it's possible." My problem is if I really want time, I sometimes kid myself into thinking there actually is enough time, when there isn't.

I've been late to just about everything and yeah, I will lose track of time and waste six hours doing who knows what. Other times ten minutes will feel like six hours.

I'm usually more reliable if I've made a "committment" to meet someone somehwere and I know they'd be pissed. But if they seem laid back like I am, I am less concerned.

But I've noticed when I've had teachers lecture the class to be on time "or else" I tended to be late. Not on purpose. (and only if it didn't affect my grade and was just a power trip the teacher was on).

I don't know how to improve this time issue, except for hanging out w/ types that have a better grasp of it and can be like "wait! why are you starting a paper mache sculpture now?? We have to leave in 5 minutes! Put the paper mache down!!" (you know what I mean?)

[Slacker]

I have absolutely no sense of time. It's random whether I'll be on time, or late, or early. This is largely because I don't have any way of estimating how long it'll take me to get places. My parents have finally figured out if they need me to be somewhere, to tell me what time the event is *and* what time I should leave my house. I had to pick them up to go to the airport. They said, "Pick us up at 12:00. You'll need to leave your house at 11:15." And guess, what? I was there right on time. Problem solved.

[Mea]

Eh. I do relate to what the ENFps have said on this thread so fair. I have pretty poor sense of time.

Say I arranged to meet a friend at 6pm. And it's 5pm now. The place is 15min away. I'd be doing my stuff, wasting time. Till it's 6pm, get ready, and prolly leave 15min later. I somehow think I have lots of time when I actually don't. I feel bad.
Not all the time though. Sometimes, i turn up too early and have to wait.

[jessica129]

I'm always late. I'll wake up earlier and think I have all the time in the world to get ready so I take my time and end up being even later. No matter how hard i try or how early I leave for something, I'm always late. Most of it is due to being completely disorganized. I'll be in the car ready to go only to realize I don't have my car keys. There's some sort of stupid thrill I get out of waiting til the absolute last minute to see how late I can leave to get somewhere on time.

[Park]

Something about time, SLI, and Delta :

Introverted sensing gets caught up in activities it enjoys. If you have a hobbie of carving out models, then you can get lost in your workshop for hours. If you enjoy a sport, you can practice it in your solitaire until fatigue kicks in; and you enjoy it. Working with something you love is where you get your energy and confidence from. You also dislike it when people try and predict what will happen; such as while watching a movie. You perfer to watch and enjoy what happens. You love details and specifics and vivid explinations. You perfer to see things in clarity rather than vagness. It perfers useful, practical things. You can sometimes ignore the problems of the future, deaming them as unimportant. Your comfort and personal space always takes priorety number one. You might have something important that you will have to take care of, but ignore it if you are not in the right mood. Losing track of time is a common problem for Introverted Sensing. This can lead to you either being late, or becoming overly neurotic about losing track of time. You might try to be early when you are going somewhere so you don't have to worry about time. Your body also has an ability of "taking care of itself". This means that if something doesn't feel right to you, such as being tired, you will naturally fall asleep ignoring other oblegations or tasks. You also dislike it when people suggest to you how to take care of yourself; you feel everyone should take care of their own personal space. Introverted Sensing also focuses on the experiences of the past a lot. This means that you can play back a past moment in your head, reliving it. You also observe often; when you are interested in something. This means that you can anaylze people, their body language, etc.. You are concious of your own body and can usually adapt and control it; such as you'd do while playing a sport. You are sensitive to touch and may not like it when people touch you who you want to push away from. You can also get into a comfort zone beause of this. Ted Williams would always order his baseball bats the the same exact width. One day, he got a bundle and grasped one of the bats in his hand. He immediately said, "too thin" and sent the bats back. Sure enough, the bats that were sent to him were 1/8th" too thin. Introverted Sensing does have to do with appearence, but when you see no need to socialize or are not around people, you can ignore this.

[flower]

I tend to lose time. I sit down to check email "for a sec" before we leave to pick up dinner... two hours later...

I do things like this all the time, I even get frustrated with myself sometimes but still cant stop doing it.

My ISTP friends hoard time. They are noncommittal about scheduling because they hate the feeling of impending obligations. But, if on the day of the invite you say "oh, I didn't know you wanted to, so I made other plans", they are a bit affronted

Me totally, I hate that feeling of commiting to some plan, but on the day, im now in the moment and the vast majority of the time I choose to go ahead with whatever it is.

Losing track of time is a common problem for Introverted Sensing. This can lead to you either being late, or becoming overly neurotic about losing track of time. You might try to be early when you are going somewhere so you don't have to worry about time.

I do generally lose track of time very often and im not good at estimating how long it takes to do something, I use this strategy all the time when there is someting I absolutely cannot be late for.

[meatburger]

Yeah i can relate aswell to not estimating the time well too. What Jewels said is how i see it. Im on time depending on how important i think it is for me to be on time. For instance if its a group of my friends at a party i will basically always be fashionably late. If its just one friend i tend to always be on time. If i had to catch a flight i would probablly give myself an hours leeway. If i deem it important i actually consider it very carefully. Leave 45 mins to get there, 15 mins leeway etc.

Recently i went to the Circ du Soelil with an ISTp and he said we should leave 30 mins before it started. I said hmm dude perhaps we should go a little earlier. He was like nah i can get there in 15 mins with the traffic at the moment. Anyway we ended up leaving about 25 mins till it started and we were running and had to pay for a park. Luckily i was asking people for directions as we were running. They had like zipped up the tents etc so we were like the last ones to arrive. Afterwards he admitted that he should have given it a little longer lols

[rockclimber]

I think being late is rude.

It is entirely possible to be fashionably punctual.

[meatburger]

Parties... if I go at all, it'll be late. Gotta give it time to get started

Exactly. I like to leave it a little later because then everyone else will be thinking "I wonder who else is comming" and then i come and they are like yay more people

[flower]

I think being late is rude.

I remember talking to a friend about that. When im late meeting someone, with some people they get really annoyed at you for it, even if if dosent matter, ie your just meeting up for a drink and your 10 mins late. But other people dont care, there just like, it dosent matter so its fine. I dont mind people being late when they meet me, unless it means you miss something becasue of it or something, otherwise it dosent matter, and after you know someone for a while you get to know how likely they are to be late and by how much, so you bear that in mind when your meeting them. eg I have one friend who is always late, so when im going to meet her, if i have something to do quickly that will make me a bit late i just do it and dont worry coz I know she will be a bit late anyway.

[UDP]

If it is a matter of professionalism it is unacceptable because your lateness affects much more than your own situation.

[Slacker]

As far as being rude, my ENFj dad says that too. He reads all sorts of intent behind the lateness, like someone is thinking their time is worth more than his, that kind of thing. He would get *very* angry at me when I was late. But upon hearing that it's just that I have no idea how long it takes to get places, and I'm fine with him telling me what time to leave my house if I'm meeting him somewhere, he now feels he has power over the situation and understands that it isn't that I don't care about his time. It really helps to communicate when there are different ways of looking at a situation.

[anndelise]

I have a long history of getting caught up in something and losing track of the time.
Nowadays I fear starting something when I have some place to be, because I know of my tendency to get caught up in it.
Hours before an appointment, I'll gather things together so that I can just grab them.
Then I'll pace. Recheck to make sure I have everything I need. Pace. Realize I forgot something. Search for it. Start to get involved in something and stop myself as soon as I realize it. Pace. Realize I forgot something else. Put it with the rest of the stuff. Deliberately overestimate how long it will take me to get there, figure out the time to leave from there. Get distracted by something else, suddenly notice the time, go to grab the stuff I need but can't find it...cuz i put it somewhere that should be obvious ....finally find it, leave for the appt, get there and realize that I'm either half an hour early or a few minutes late. There have been times when I've said "screw it" and left early, even though I would be an hour or more early. I can always just sit in my van and read and know that I won't be stressing out over making sure I leave on time to be there on time.

It turns out, a lot of people think it's about as rude to show up too early as it is to show up late.

[flower]

lol, I use that strategy anndelise, if I have to be somewhere at a certain time and I dont want to get their early to make sure, I will get everything ready so I can just grab it, and ages before I keep checking the clock over and over, so as not to get drawn into the flow of time when I start doing something.

[HitmanISTP]

x

[Hot Scalding Gayser]

I seem to have a very good sense of time. I know how to be exactly on time everywhere I go. I've noticed people that are too paranoid about it get there too early and people that are over-confident get to places late. I figure if you just look at is a place you're going to, and something that doesn't have to mean your very existence, you'll arrive there on time unless a rare emergency happens. I hope I'm making sense.

If I'm timid about a place I'll get there super early. That doesn't help me though, because then I have to wander around 2 hours before getting there and I can then talk myself out of it! And likewise if I think 'oh it's just so and so' and don't really think much of it I'll get there too late and I'll miss out on something important. If you notice a pattern in people, people that are late to places seem to not be respectful of others and people that are too early seem to be too respectful and too worried about what other people think. So I think I'm perfect because I have the happiest medium. ;D

[Creepy-bg]

I have a long history of getting caught up in something and losing track of the time.
Nowadays I fear starting something when I have some place to be, because I know of my tendency to get caught up in it.
Hours before an appointment, I'll gather things together so that I can just grab them.
Then I'll pace. Recheck to make sure I have everything I need. Pace. Realize I forgot something. Search for it. Start to get involved in something and stop myself as soon as I realize it. Pace. Realize I forgot something else. Put it with the rest of the stuff. Deliberately overestimate how long it will take me to get there, figure out the time to leave from there. Get distracted by something else, suddenly notice the time, go to grab the stuff I need but can't find it...cuz i put it somewhere that should be obvious ....finally find it, leave for the appt, get there and realize that I'm either half an hour early or a few minutes late. There have been times when I've said "screw it" and left early, even though I would be an hour or more early. I can always just sit in my van and read and know that I won't be stressing out over making sure I leave on time to be there on time.

hehe that's kind of cute

[Froody Blue Gem]

I attempt to keep my finger on the pulse of time but I can't quite do it. It is an interesting concept overall. Thinking ahead to what I will do in the next few days, in the next few years, but that could change at the drop of a hat. I don't really mind it changing all that much. When people ask me how long a project, or a task will take me, I can't really give a good answer. I move at a very slow pace. I am pretty good with time management in the work setting, but keeping track at in general, I am weird with it.

In some ways, it's frightening when all of this time passes and I blink and I lose track of it. Due dates are helpful and if I have a lot of time to do them. I am horrible with tight due dates. With each passing year, things seem to go by quicker and quicker. With recent changes, a lot of things have gone by like a big blur. I want time spent to be meaningful, but it is easier said than done.

[ContractedCriminalboy]

Yeah I'm terrible with time. I can burn through time too easily and lose track it and frequently over/under estimate how much time is needed for a task or a trip, frequently starting things way too early/arriving places way too soon.

[Aramas]

Something about time, SLI, and Delta :

I've had a problem with timing before. I would always show up early to things lol very much so. Something that has always confounded me was how people managed to show up around the appropriate time with very thin margins like 3-5 minutes before. For me it's 15-20 minutes lol. And if it's something rare I might be an hour early lol.

I also got pissed at my manager once because he got mad I was late but it was like a literal 2 minutes so I was like really you're gonna be upset like that

[Aramas]

lol, I use that strategy anndelise, if I have to be somewhere at a certain time and I dont want to get their early to make sure, I will get everything ready so I can just grab it, and ages before I keep checking the clock over and over, so as not to get drawn into the flow of time when I start doing something.

I will set the timer on the microwave when I cook so I don't have to manage time. It makes it so I get perfect uniform results every time when cooking the same stuff.

...... All this talk about time reminds me of how time is treated in Lord of the Rings. All the timing there is fairly polychronic. People all show up to the same place in a few days or weeks of each other and it's fairly slow paced. It's kind of funny now that I think about it.

[Aramas]

My ISTP friends hoard time. They are noncommittal about scheduling because they hate the feeling of impending obligations.

Didn't see this part until now. Pretty much me to a T. I get anxiety about making plans because I can feel the pressure from the future obligation and it kinda stresses me out. My ideal situation is texting someone and asking if they want to hang out in a bit. Not too much advance notice, but no need to hurry either.

[lkdhf qkb]

I have a rather bad sense of time. As other IEEs mentioned, I have a lot of trouble knowing how much time is needed to do something. I'm also loosing "track" of my time expenditure very often, so that I often end up being late. I also don't do time management, but not because I can't plan things, but because most of the time I'm lazy to do so and the whole thing feels contrary to my nature. The idea of having activities and goals that you have to squeeze into some finite amount of time appears barbaric to me. I don't "fill or spend" my time, because the pressure of "having to use it wisely" would actually just make me stress out and spoil my time rather than make it better. I do try to be on time for commitments though.

My approach to doing things is the opposite to time management. It's activity management. I basically have a sense of pace that I want to protect at all times, not some activities that I want to have done; I arrange goals and activities accordingly. "Late" or "early" are defined by my perceptions of progress, not some outside object like a clock. The kind of questions I ask myself:

- How much things can I do today while keeping my optimal pace?
- How much things do I need to do to feel like I achieved some progress today?
- What needs to be done to avoid any regret this week?
- When do I need to leave to feel like I'm having a smooth journey with neat transitions and little waiting times?

I have a relatively good sense of prediction and tactics though. I know where and when "to be" to get the things I like, which piece/person will move/act to where, etc... A lot of my life looks like me not doing anything or going anywhere; I'm waiting for the bus. Most people just didn't notice that there is a stop here or have no clue where the bus goes or it's schedule, so they go by foot; those busy bees look at me and think I'm some idler. Yet in the end I arrive where I wanted to be ! (probably has to do with enneagram 9 tho, not IEE)