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Thread: Wuhan Virus

  1. #641

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    Quote Originally Posted by Beautiful sky View Post
    I don’t believe in conspiracy theories. I work in veterinary medicine and I understand viruses and how they evolve. This is a zoonotic evolution of a virus from one animal to another

    Even forest fires are started naturally by lightening. And then they are also started by humans.

    This virus has to many evolutionary apsects for a natural progression. What your statement tells me is that you haven't even read the reports I posted.

    Covid can't infect bat tissue, they just tried. SARS1 can. This says that bats are not the origin of covid, it can't be any simpler. Pangolins are not either. I posted this link a couple posts up.

    You have to ask yourself, how much do you trust the Chinese reports, in light of the ratG13 fabrication, tiktoc, and China's lies?

  2. #642

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    A growing number of scientists think that the virus causing COVID-19 may have been genetically engineered and/or a lab escape – but they can't get their evidence published in journals. Report: Claire Robinson

    As evidence builds for the lab-manipulated origin of SARS-CoV-2, the virus that caused the COVID-19 epidemic, scientific journals are running scared of publishing papers that broach this possibility.

    The rival theory for the virus's origin is that it is a natural spillover event from wild animals ("zoonosis"). The zoonotic theory has been consistently promoted by the Chinese government, which has been keen to rubbish any attempt to pin culpability on its laboratories, notably the Wuhan Institute of Virology (WIV), which has been the centre of suspicion for any lab escape.

    The latest paper to support the lab origin and genetic manipulation theories has been published not in a peer-reviewed journal, but in a magazine. The distinguished scientists Birger Sørensen, Angus Dalgleish and Andres Susrud have published their long-awaited paper on the website of a Norwegian magazine called Minerva.

    Minerva has published an accompanying article which reports, "Sørensen and his co-authors present several arguments for why they consider a non-natural origin for the novel coronavirus to be the most logical explanation on how the virus evolved. It is observations on the spike protein* of the SARS-CoV-2 virus that leads Sørensen and his co-authors to believe that the virus has originated in a laboratory."

    Sørensen told Minerva, "There are several factors that point towards this. Firstly, this part of the virus is very stable; it mutates very little. That points to this virus as a fully developed, almost perfected virus for infecting humans. Secondly, this indicates that the structure of the virus cannot have evolved naturally. When we compare the novel coronavirus with the one that caused SARS, we see that there are altogether six inserts in this virus that stand out compared to other known SARS viruses."

    Sørensen said that several of these changes in the virus are unique, and that they do not exist in other known SARS coronaviruses. "Four of these six changes have the property that they are suited to infect humans. This kind of aggregation of a type of property can be done simply in a laboratory, and helps to substantiate such an origin."

    "A certain reluctance" to publish

    Sørensen had previously told Minerva that he had encountered "a certain reluctance" on the part of journals to publish the paper – without the journals giving "proper scientific objections".

    Former MI6 head Sir Richard Dearlove saw the paper prior to publication and is convinced by it. Commenting on the scientists' difficulties in publishing their work, Dearlove said that one journal "refused it within a week of receiving it, and in the same period accepted for publication two or three Chinese articles that relate to the virus, within 48 hours".

    Sørensen thinks that the journals' reluctance is due largely to the fact that a lab origin for the virus is "a very uncomfortable finding, and the production of new scientific articles that can be used to prove such findings has all but ground to a halt. Chinese scientists no longer publish articles that can be used to support such a hypothesis.” He adds, “This quickly becomes a discussion on politics, rather than science. Nobody wants to put forward the inconvenient truth, many scientists are also concerned about their own funding and position if they were to put forward such a controversial hypothesis."

    Sørensen and colleagues' experience with scientific publication is far from unique. Other scientists have found a similar "reluctance" on the part of journals to offer a platform for their findings. But it doesn't appear to be due to any weakness in the lab origin theory, which is supported by well credentialed scientists.

    "Guilt, greed, and opportunism are powerful motivators"

    Molecular biologist Richard H. Ebright of Rutgers University has been vocal in his view that a large sector of the scientific establishment is strongly motivated to deny any possibility of a lab origin for the virus. He said on Twitter, "For persons who were directly involved in funding, promoting, and/or performing bat coronavirus research and bat coronavirus gain-of-function research at WIV, avoiding a possible finding of culpability for triggering a pandemic is a powerful motivator.
    "For persons who received $200 M in research support for high-risk, no-value virus surveillance research, avoiding the conclusion that virus surveillance research produces no information useful for preventing pandemics, and may have triggered a pandemic, is a powerful motivator.
    "More broadly, for the substantial subset of virologists who perform gain-of-function research of concern, avoiding restrictions on research funding, avoiding implementation of biosafety standards, and avoiding implementation of research oversight, are powerful motivators.
    "Guilt, greed, and opportunism are powerful motivators in science, just as in other areas."
    Evidence for zoonotic origin

    It certainly isn't the case that the zoonotic theory is better supported by the evidence. The main evidence for zoonotic origin for the virus is an article published in the journal Nature Medicine, titled "The Proximal Origin of SARS-CoV-2". The authors, Kristian Andersen and colleagues, dismissed out of hand the possibilityof a lab origin and human manipulation of the virus, on the claimed basis that any lab-generated virus would have been designed differently, based on their computer predictions.

    Commenting on the paper, the virologist Dr Jonathan Latham described the evidence presented for a zoonotic origin as "extremely weak".

    Another scientist unconvinced by Andersen and his colleagues' argument was molecular geneticist Dr Michael Antoniou, who sent a letter to Nature Medicine explaining that "although the authors may indeed be correct in how they perceive SARS-CoV-2 to have arisen, the data they present does not exclude the possibility" that it was developed in a laboratory-based process.

    Dr Antoniou even described a well known way in which the virus could have been created, involving genetic engineering and selection. But Nature Medicine refused to publish his letter. It was left to the journalist Paolo Barnard to give Dr Antoniou a forum for his views on Italian TV.

    Scientist "pissed off" at Nature

    Dr Antoniou is not the only scientist who has come up against Nature's reluctance to publish any argument for the possibility of a lab origin. A scientist who identifies himself only as Henri had a similar experience, as he recounted on the website of the scientist (likely a Chinese native) who blogs anonymously as "NerdHasPower", seemingly concealing his identity in order to protect himself from possible retribution by the Chinese authorities.

    "NerdHasPower" had argued cogently not only that the virus is a genetically engineered lab creation but that evidence for its natural origin was fabricated. Henri, a proponent of the zoonosis theory, doesn't agree with Nerd's conclusions. But with admirable scientific objectivity, he wrote, "Whilst I am on the side of 'not lab made' I am also on the side of 'Nature magazine has a responsibility to further investigate possible scientific fraud'."

    No doubt because Nature Medicine doesn't accept letters to the editor, Henri wrote to its parent journal Nature, acting as an intermediary for NerdHasPower's arguments, which Nerd could not do himself due to his need to protect his anonymity.

    In due course Henri reported back, "The Letter to Nature was rejected outright. I appealed. The appeal failed. I now intend to take the matter up with the Editor-in-Chief." Two days later he wrote, "Radio silence from the Editor-in-Chief and Nature. Consequently, I am pissed off."

    "SARS-CoV-2 could come from a lab"

    Another scientist who believes that SARS-CoV-2 could have come from a lab is the independent consultant and materials scientist Dr Billy Zhang. Dr Zhang wrote a detailed critique of "The Proximal Origin of SARS-CoV-2" and sent it to Nature Correspondence – which refused to publish it, as Dr Zhang told GMWatch. So Dr Zhang published the article on his LinkedIn site, under the title, "SARS-CoV-2 could come from a lab – a critique of 'The Proximal Origin of SARS-CoV-2' published in Nature Medicine".

    In the article, Dr Zhang pointed out that neither Andersen and colleagues' analyses nor the 30 published or preprint articles that the authors reviewed for their paper could rule out the possibility that SARS-CoV-2 was engineered in a lab or that it is a derivative strain of such a lab-manipulated virus.

    He added that a team of researchers from the WIV and the University of North Carolina in the US had as long ago as 2015 published a paper in Nature Medicine detailing how they "created in the lab a hybrid pathogenic virus that was highly infectious to humans".

    Yet, Dr Zhang wrote, this smoking gun of a paper was "conspicuously missing from the 30 references" cited by Andersen et al in their 2020 Nature Medicine article. That's in spite of the evidence it offers that SARS-CoV-2 could have been engineered – and that it could have been engineered in the WIV lab in particular.

    Nature blocks Twitter discussion of manmade origin

    Another example of the extent to which Nature is not tolerating any questioning of the official zoonotic origin narrative unfolded on Twitter.

    Nature’s Twitter account tweeted about how visualising SARS-CoV-2 proteins to understand their structures could help stop the pandemic, by disarming them with drugs. When someone replied that another way would be to "stop the scientists making dangerous chimeric viruses", Nature blocked their account. When someone else said they had been blocked too, a molecular geneticist quipped, "This is getting to be like street cred."

    Papers arguing for lab origin languish in pre-print

    Meanwhile several scientific papers putting forward the possibility of a lab origin and/or genetic engineering in the virus's history have languished on pre-print websites for some time. Pre-print websites give scientists a chance to air their findings publicly and obtain feedback from peers prior to approaching a journal. In some cases, journals will proactively approach the authors and offer to put forward the paper for peer review with a view to publishing it.

    These papers include a study led by Dr Alina Chan of the Broad Institute, MIT, USA. Dr Chan and colleagues explain that SARS-CoV-2, even at very early stages of its detection in humans, was already highly adapted for human infectivity. In this respect it is different from the earlier SARS virus, SARS-CoV (sometimes now called SARS-CoV-1), which caused a human epidemic in 2003. The earlier SARS-CoV was initially far less well adapted to infecting humans and had to acquire mutations gained though many rounds of infectious cycles to reach peak infectivity. This type of progressive adaptation (mutation and selection) is exactly what is expected to happen in animal-to-human virus disease transmission. The fact that there is no evidence as yet for SARS-COV-2 having adapted in this way casts doubt on the zoonosis theory of the virus’s origin. Dr Chan and colleagues conclude that the possibility of a lab escape "should be considered regardless of how likely or unlikely".

    Another study, led by Dr Nikolai Petrovsky at Flinders University in Australia, similarly concludes, "Overall, the data indicates that SARS-CoV-2 is uniquely adapted to infect humans, raising questions as to whether it arose in nature by a rare chance event or whether its origins lie elsewhere." The authors conclude that the possibility cannot be excluded that "SARS-CoV-2 was created by a recombination event that occurred inadvertently or consciously in a laboratory handling coronaviruses, with the new virus then accidentally released into the local human population".

    Yet another paper available only in pre-print form, authored by Rossana Segreto of the University of Innsbruck, is baldly titled, "Is considering a genetic manipulation origin for SARS-CoV-2 a conspiracy theory that must be censored?"

    Segreto argues, "Genetic manipulation of SARS-CoV-2 may have been carried out in any laboratory in the world with access to the backbone sequence and the necessary equipment. New technologies based on synthetic genetics platforms even allow the reconstruction of viruses based on their genomic sequence, without the need of a natural isolate [of the virus]."

    However, she adds, "Unfortunately, theories that consider a possible artificial origin for SARS-CoV-2 are censored by international scientific journals as they seem to support conspiracy theories."

    Of course, it's possible that these papers are currently in the process of being published by journals. But we're not holding our breath. The fact that so much scientific evidence of lab origin and genetic engineering is being withheld from the peer-reviewed literature will doubtless contribute to the frequently claimed scientific "consensus" that the virus has a natural origin. But in reality, there is no consensus – just censorship of scientists who support a lab origin theory.


    * Minerva explains, "A spike protein is a part of the virus attached to the surface of the virus. The spike protein is used by the virus when it enters cells, enabling it to stick in humans. The properties of the spike determine which receptors a virus can utilise and thus which cells the virus can enter to create illness."

  3. #643

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    These papers include a study led by Dr Alina Chan of the Broad Institute, MIT, USA. Dr Chan and colleagues explain that SARS-CoV-2, even at very early stages of its detection in humans, was already highly adapted for human infectivity. In this respect it is different from the earlier SARS virus, SARS-CoV (sometimes now called SARS-CoV-1), which caused a human epidemic in 2003. The earlier SARS-CoV was initially far less well adapted to infecting humans and had to acquire mutations gained though many rounds of infectious cycles to reach peak infectivity. This type of progressive adaptation (mutation and selection) is exactly what is expected to happen in animal-to-human virus disease transmission. The fact that there is no evidence as yet for SARS-COV-2 having adapted in this way casts doubt on the zoonosis theory of the virus’s origin. Dr Chan and colleagues conclude that the possibility of a lab escape "should be considered regardless of how likely or unlikely".

    Another study, led by Dr Nikolai Petrovsky at Flinders University in Australia, similarly concludes, "Overall, the data indicates that SARS-CoV-2 is uniquely adapted to infect humans, raising questions as to whether it arose in nature by a rare chance event or whether its origins lie elsewhere." The authors conclude that the possibility cannot be excluded that "SARS-CoV-2 was created by a recombination event that occurred inadvertently or consciously in a laboratory handling coronaviruses, with the new virus then accidentally released into the local human population".

    Yet another paper available only in pre-print form, authored by Rossana Segreto of the University of Innsbruck, is baldly titled, "Is considering a genetic manipulation origin for SARS-CoV-2 a conspiracy theory that must be censored?"

    Segreto argues, "Genetic manipulation of SARS-CoV-2 may have been carried out in any laboratory in the world with access to the backbone sequence and the necessary equipment. New technologies based on synthetic genetics platforms even allow the reconstruction of viruses based on their genomic sequence, without the need of a natural isolate [of the virus]."

  4. #644

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    got to get you guys up to speed, this info has been circulating on the dark web for months.

    But I mean, I guess Trump is bad and Bill Gates is evil.

  5. #645

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    Conclusions


    The ability of SARS-CoV but not SARS-CoV-2 to replicate in R. sinicus kidney cells, consistent with previous findings (12), may suggest a different evolutionary origin and path of SARS-CoV-2. SARS-CoV was most closely related to SARSr-Rs-BatCoVs from Yunnan, China, suggesting R. sinicus as its primary origin. It could also use Rs-ACE2 as receptor for cell entry (13), which may explain the efficient replication of SARS-CoV in R. sinicus kidney cells. Although SARS-CoV-2 is closely related to SARSr-CoVs in bats and pangolins, none of the existing animal viruses represents the immediate ancestor of SARS-CoV-2. SARS-CoV-2 was most closely related to SARSr-Ra-BatCoV-RaTG13 (96.1% genome identity) in Rhinolophus affinis from Pu’er, Yunnan (2), except that its RBD region was closest to pangolin-SARSr-CoV-MP789 (86.9% nucleotide identity) in smuggled pangolins from Guangdong, suggesting that SARS-CoV-2 may have evolved through recombination (3). The inability of SARS-CoV-2 to efficiently infect and replicate in R. sinicus cells may imply that R. sinicus bats were unlikely to be its proximal origin. However, bats are the primary origin of SARS-CoV, human coronavirus 229E (HCoV-229E), and probably MERS-CoV; therefore, SARS-CoV-2 most likely originated from bats. One possibility is that SARS-CoV-2 has restricted bat species tropism. Other bat species, such as R. affinis, may harbor the ancestor of SARS-CoV-2 and can be tested for cellular susceptibilities in future studies. It is also possible that SARS-CoV-2 can no longer replicate in bat cells because of substantial genetic adaptation, such as through natural evolution in an intermediate host before infecting humans.

  6. #646

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    I feel annoyed I have to connect the dots for you because Ne is pretty irritating to me when explaining.

    Covid19 is a perfect virus in terms it has had zero evolutionary mutations after it infected the first person. It was perfect for people right out of nature. This has not been observed before in other viruses. It is also perfect for mink, a common laboratory testing animal.

    Covid19 has mutated so much for people, says this conclusion, that it can no longer infect the proposed origin bat species. Unlike SARS1, which does. They tried to infect the bats found at the Wuhan market and several others elsewhere. It no longer infects bats.

    Bonus:
    The whistleblower put out a report last week that breaks down in detail how covid differs from natural coronaviruses, in fact, clear evidence its was engineered, from folds and shapes to the genome, the types of selective breeding programs carried out in order for this to happen; what program at the WIV are occurring under the watch of the PLA.

    In fighting in the CCP party between 2 factions have led to a turf war and the WIV had been drawn into it last year.

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    It’s still absolutely baffling to me how the idea that this obviously engineered virus could come from a lab in a country with some of the worst safety records, most extreme ideological nepotism, and ensuant workplace incompetence on the planet, is considered a fringe theory instead of an obvious reality.

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    Can you post the proof that it was made in a lab? From what I understand the evidence is that a Chinese women claimed she worked on it and there's no one to back that up. But whether she is just getting attention or misunderstood the aims of what her lab was actually doing or is actually telling the truth is a bit of a fuzzy to me. This stuff all feels very Alex Jonesy.
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    Just rename this place Beta Central lmao
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nobody View Post
    Can you post the proof that it was made in a lab?
    To now time there are good arguments to suppose this and they overweight arguments to suppose the natural source.

    There is no proof it has natural source as no natural source of it found. There no acceptable probability to mutate so from partly similar viruses in nature and exist experted opinions about good chance it has artificial source. There is publicated data about experiments in labs with similar viruses by USA. There is much of lie about the virus and contraditions in medias and political decisions are not scientifically based while giving the evident harm. There is strange and official censorship about the virus in medias (in Russian since may of 2020). Numbers of death rates strangely differ up to 10 times! Stats are calculated with strong distortions in methods (alike when cause of death is assigned to a virus only because it exist, while it spreads easily). Authotity experts have radically different views on the virus and methods used against it.
    There is USA's evident usage and mass propaganda of virus situation to attack on China as a way to compete with it. Also virus is used to make the harm to people in other countries by economy, education and health systems supression. People are forbidden even to communicate, so their psyche is also supressed. Vaccines are new and have no standard proof to be safe - they are not safe and can be of aims of virus hysterics - to make some change or harm to human bodies. The new vaccines work with genes! While having no standard safety proof and are used so by the excuse of "danger situation".
    There was a malfunction in Detrick labs which could lead to its viruses spreading (most probably the spreading was intentional by that cover). There was strange flu in Autumn 2019 in USA and one of USA politicians publicly pointed on that in related to virus comment (check what China says about zero case). Virus in China region was soon registered after USA militaries visited it. USA had theories of attack on China and preparations against similar virus situation recently before Autumn of 2020.

    There is a lot to suppose the virus is artificial. That methods forced to be used against it are much doubtful, besides evident harm them do.
    Kurginyan is one of politician experts since 1980s, has achievements and authority in that. It's not ufologist or alike. He gathered and pointed on _publicly available_ related data which support this. There should be materials in Internet, though the quality of info on some site alike "ufos" can be lower.

    Take into account there is no _objective_ proof to say: about high death rate of the virus compared to common flu (it's said about ~10% in some European countries, Russia officialy claimed about 1,5%), that methods used against this viruses pack are reasonable where use > harm, the planed vaccines are safe for people health, natural source of the virus, etc.

    In short. It's new kind of world war. It's not just nations war, but also against the humanity as it is.

  10. #650
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    It's totally possible that COVID-19 was manufactured and not a natural by-product from some animal host:

    1. COVID-19's spike protein binds very strongly to the ACE receptors of humans, to gain entry

    2. If COVID-19 originated from bats (the supposed origin), we would see the affinity to bats > affinity to humans, but this is not the case

    3. Tests/models have been done to test this affinity across different species (mice, monkeys, bats, etc) and they've found COVID-19 affinity strongest to HUMAN ACE receptors, almost as if the virus was specifically designed/altered to attach to humans

    4. The cleavage site of PRRA suddenly appears on COVID-19, when its closest relative, RaTG-13 does NOT have it. If this were a natural mutation, it would have taken millions of years. The only way this cleavage site to have shown up if it were put there intentionally. What the insertion does is helps COVID-19 penetrate HUMAN cells much more readily. This makes the virus more contagious and deadly.

    Other evidence that there is some sort of cover up

    1. The doctor who knew this info was threatened with martial law arrest and died in "declared custody" in the Hospital of China.
    2. The laboratory in which the virus was first constructed, was burnt down.
    3. Many scientists/virologists agree that you can't exclude that this virus was manufactured, but they stay quiet or else their jobs and funding for future research would be at risk.

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    huh, well that's interesting.
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    Among aims of virus hysterics and restrictions is to destroy mass education by its distance format.

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    Detrick Virus

    author: Sergey Kurginyan



    previous: part 1, part 2

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    SARS-CoV-2 Is an Unrestricted Bioweapon: A Truth Revealed through Uncovering a Large-Scale, Organized Scientific Fraud

    https://zenodo.org/record/4073131#.X4CA5i-96t8

    Yan, Li-Meng

    Two possibilities should be considered for the origin of SARS-CoV-2: natural evolution or laboratory creation. In our earlier report titled “Unusual Features of the SARS-CoV-2 Genome Suggesting Sophisticated Laboratory Modification Rather Than Natural Evolution and Delineation of Its Probable Synthetic Route”, we disproved the possibility of SARS-CoV-2 arising naturally through evolution and instead proved that SARS-CoV-2 must have been a product of laboratory modification. Despite this and similar efforts, the laboratory creation theory continues to be downplayed or even diminished. This is fundamentally because the natural origin theory remains supported by several novel coronaviruses published after the start of the outbreak. These viruses (the RaTG13 bat coronavirus, a series of pangolin coronaviruses, and the RmYN02 bat coronavirus) reportedly share high sequence homology with SARS-CoV-2 and have altogether constructed a seemingly plausible pathway for the natural evolution of SARS-CoV-2. Here, however, we use in-depth analyses of the available data and literature to prove that these novel animal coronaviruses do not exist in nature and their sequences have been fabricated. In addition, we also offer our insights on the hypothesis that SARS-CoV-2 may have originated naturally from a coronavirus that infected the Mojiang miners.

    Revelation of these virus fabrications renders the natural origin theory unfounded. It also strengthens our earlier assertion that SARS-CoV-2 is a product of laboratory modification, which can be created in approximately six months using a template virus owned by a laboratory of the People’s Liberation Army (PLA). The fact that data fabrications were used to cover up the true origin of SARS-CoV-2 further implicates that the laboratory modification here is beyond simple gain-of-function research.

    The scale and the coordinated nature of this scientific fraud signifies the degree of corruption in the fields of academic research and public health. As a result of such corruption, damages have been made both to the reputation of the scientific community and to the well-being of the global community.

    Importantly, while SARS-CoV-2 meets the criteria of a bioweapon specified by the PLA, its impact is well beyond what is conceived for a typical bioweapon. In addition, records indicate that the unleashing of this weaponized pathogen should have been intentional rather than accidental. We therefore define SARS-CoV-2 as an Unrestricted Bioweapon and the current pandemic a result of Unrestricted Biowarfare. We further suggest that investigations should be carried out on the suspected government and individuals and the responsible ones be held accountable for this brutal attack on the global community.

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    So you are aware ^ this author, Dr. Yan, fled to America in the Spring time from Hong Kong. About 4-5 days ago, last week, her Mother was kidnapped in Hong Kong by CCP undercover police. She are being held by the police now. Dr. Yan's career has been ruined. The Hong Kong University has totally denied they ever knew Dr. Yan. She worked there for over a decade.

    You still want to go with zoonotic origin?



    Last edited by raTG13; 10-09-2020 at 04:21 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by fireee View Post
    when its closest relative, RaTG-13 does NOT have it. If this were a natural mutation, it would have taken millions of years. The only way this cleavage site to have shown up if it were put there intentionally.
    RaTG-13, is not real, it was fabricated.
    Link to paper-->
    https://zenodo.org/record/4073131#.X4CA5i-96t8

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    Dozens of mammals could be susceptible to SARS-CoV-2

    Numerous animals may be vulnerable to SARS-CoV-2, the virus that causes Covid-19, according to a large study modelling how the virus might infect different animals’ cells, led by UCL researchers.

    https://www.ucl.ac.uk/news/2020/oct/...ble-sars-cov-2



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    ^ Now they have to answer why covid-19 never spread to any of these animals listed before?

    Still going with zoonotic origins...? "we found the intermediate host, humans!"

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sol View Post
    Detrick Virus

    author: Sergey Kurginyan



    previous: part 1, part 2
    As intriguing as plandemic, event 201 stuff is, I find it unnecessary and over all harmful as it takes away from the factual truth of the viral origins in Wuhan next to the WIV and Prof Zhengli's work over the past 10 years with gain of function research and the recent PLA confiscation of the new WIV finished in 2018.

    I view plandemic, event 201 stuff as psyopic in nature. There is such a thing as counter-intelligence.

  21. #661
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    dang, losing most of her family to the virus

    https://fox17.com/news/local/it-wasn...virus-pandemic

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    Quote Originally Posted by raTG13 View Post
    ^ Now they have to answer why covid-19 never spread to any of these animals listed before?

    Still going with zoonotic origins...? "we found the intermediate host, humans!"
    Why never? Coronaviruses have been infecting animals ever since coronaviruses have emerged:

    https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/books/NBK92442/

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    Quote Originally Posted by silke View Post
    Why never? Coronaviruses have been infecting animals ever since coronaviruses have emerged:

    https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/books/NBK92442/
    Not covid-19. There is no record of this virus ever having been found in nature in any of the dozens and dozens of animals it can actually infect. Further, it has also never been found in bats, and the study that has tried to infect several bat species in China came up as negative ability to infect bats.

    So, where did this virus evolve from?

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    Quote Originally Posted by raTG13 View Post
    So, where did this virus evolve from?
    The people will be angry when the truth is revealed.
    Last edited by khcs; 10-10-2020 at 09:48 PM.
    This is the comment you are looking for



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    Quote Originally Posted by raTG13 View Post
    Not covid-19. There is no record of this virus ever having been found in nature in any of the dozens and dozens of animals it can actually infect. Further, it has also never been found in bats, and the study that has tried to infect several bat species in China came up as negative ability to infect bats.

    So, where did this virus evolve from?
    They don't know where Ebola came from either. They've never found its animal origins. That doesn't mean that Ebola is a man-made virus.

    It also doesn't make sense to engineer a virus to kill off humans without creating an antidote to it, otherwise your own population it going to get infected and die. And there are news of Chinese doctors and dying from it, so they clearly don't have any antidote or counter.

    As to how it came about, it could have been one viral particle that made it to humans, while being non-viable in bats. So while humans got infected the immune system of bats easily disposed of it.


    "Coronaviruses and bats are locked in an evolutionary arms race in which the viruses are constantly evolving to evade the bat immune system and bats are evolving to withstand infections from coronaviruses. A virus will evolve multiple variants, most of which will be destroyed by the bat’s immune system, but some will survive and pass to other bats.
    ...
    In fact, SARS-CoV-2 most likely evolved from a viral variant that couldn’t survive for a long period of time or that persists at low levels in bats. Coincidentally, it evolved the ability to invade human cells and accidentally found its way into us, possibly by means of an intermediate animal host, where it then thrived. Or an initially harmless form of the virus might have jumped directly into humans and then evolved to become harmful as it passed between people."

    source: Here’s how scientists know the coronavirus came from bats and wasn’t made in a lab

    Quote Originally Posted by raTG13 View Post
    Dozens of mammals could be susceptible to SARS-CoV-2

    Numerous animals may be vulnerable to SARS-CoV-2, the virus that causes Covid-19, according to a large study modelling how the virus might infect different animals’ cells, led by UCL researchers.

    https://www.ucl.ac.uk/news/2020/oct/...ble-sars-cov-2


    I remember a guy writing that while he was sick with COVID it appeared that his hamster caught it too. It started sneezing and passed very quickly. He was upset after realizing that it was probably him who got the hamster infected. So picking up COVID from pets like dogs or cats, or nearby wild animals that in autumn usually come closer to people's homes, seems to be a possibility.

    Looks like it's already affecting some animal farms and wildlife



    https://www.cnn.com/world/live-news/...ntl/index.html

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    Quote Originally Posted by silke View Post
    ... it evolved the ability to invade human cells and accidentally found its way into us, possibly by means of an intermediate animal host, where it then thrived. Or an initially harmless form of the virus might have jumped directly into humans and then evolved to become harmful as it passed between people."
    The fairy tail of a jumping coronavirus. Again and again.
    This is the comment you are looking for



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    Quote Originally Posted by khcs View Post
    The fairy tail of a jumping coronavirus. Again and again.
    As has happened before in history, again and again.

    Can't blame "Chinese bioweapons" for causing Ebola, Marburg, Spanish flu, Rabies, HIV, Smallpox, Chickepox, Hantavirus and a myriad of other viruses that have jumped to humans.

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    Quote Originally Posted by silke View Post
    As has happened before in history, again and again.

    Can't blame "Chinese bioweapons" for causing Ebola, Marburg, Spanish flu, Rabies, HIV, Smallpox, Chickepox, Hantavirus and a myriad of other viruses that have jumped to humans.

    Fake news, fake history, fake science. Nothing surprises me anymore.
    This is the comment you are looking for



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    Quote Originally Posted by silke View Post
    They don't know where Ebola came from either. They've never found its animal origins. That doesn't mean that Ebola is a man-made virus.
    This is true. Funny enough, the two people, married, who both invented the Vaccine for Ebola, were awarded the Order of Canada, the highest honour for members of Canadian society. They used to work at a S4 Bio lab in Winnipeg. That is until they were both arrested on charges of espionage for smuggling viruses to China, last Summer 2019. They were escorted out of the complex in handcuffs by the royal mounted police. Their virus payload was intercepted at an International airport. The destination? Wuhan City, China. Weird. And since you bring up the phenomena of coincidence, it is oddly coincidental for this event to happen at the same time as the Wuhan covid infection began. What leverage did the CCP government have over these two Chinese nationals, who had been darlings of the Canadian people? Now disgraced.

    It also doesn't make sense to engineer a virus to kill off humans without creating an antidote to it, otherwise your own population it going to get infected and die. And there are news of Chinese doctors and dying from it, so they clearly don't have any antidote or counter.
    This is true. Do they have an antidote for Nuclear explosions? Splitting the atom and recombining them is power. Genetic alteration of viruses is power. If you are looking for motivation of the PLA, start with the simplest explanation. Further, I've been following this story for months. Prof Zhengli amoung her team, and even funding from the USA for these types of experiments, are all implicated with strong, unquestionable evidence. I refer you to my previous posts in this thread. Look up the work of Dr. Yan, her two papers explain in exquisite detail, how the virus was made, and for what purpose.

    https://zenodo.org/record/4028830#.X4Mqpi-96t_

    https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7435492/

    https://zenodo.org/record/4073131#.X4MrOi-96t8

    As to how it came about, it could have been one viral particle that made it to humans, while being non-viable in bats.
    See this is where you and I differ. As a nurse, you are taught that 1. natural selection is distinguished by the mechanism of graduated changes creating new form and function. 2. random mutational chance changes to the genetic code is the principle driving mechanism for the creative force in biology.

    I see this, as do many others, as a non-viable functioning explanation for evolution to occur. In the current standard model, only the unlikely event occurring in the unlikely manner is how evolution occurs. Coincidence in this realm is actually normal happenstance. See, you are taught the wrong epistemology.

    So how this relates to covid19? In order for covid to have the form and function it does, many, many changes to its properties would have had to occur. This would have taken time, and lucky serendipity. In order for use ONE particle to have had all the changes nesserscary to produce this virus in its current outbreaking form, would mean that MANY simultaneously occurring mutations in ALL the right ways, would have had to happen, and realistically more than once.

    See, in the current model, people, erroneously, assume that genetic changes are a one and done type of thing? This goes against basic common sense..the environment is far more brutal and unforgiving then computer models, and lab settings will allow.

    So while humans got infected the immune system of bats easily disposed of it.
    The study I had shown early here used bat cells for infection, meaning the immune system as a whole would not have been responding to the covid viral particles. The particles themselves could not produce viral titers capable of infectious amounts.

    "Coronaviruses and bats are locked in an evolutionary arms race in which the viruses are constantly evolving to evade the bat immune system and bats are evolving to withstand infections from coronaviruses. A virus will evolve multiple variants, most of which will be destroyed by the bat’s immune system, but some will survive and pass to other bats.
    This is true. This explains why Prof Zhengli Shi had papered many reports and attended conferences in the United States. In fact five of her recent presentations where all about coronavirus spill overs from bats: "Risk Assessment of Bat coronavirus spill over and prevention strategy" Globalization-Challenge and Response For Infectious Disease" Germany-Sino Symposium, Hamburg 2018

    See, the infectious diseases she has been warning about, the specificities of which she had already researched, occurred right in her home city, only miles from several of her labs she ran, and meters beside a PLA government virus bank.

    See the important thing here is that for you, and many, the majority, all think that only happenstance are the principle driving forces of evolution. For you, coincidence is pure coincidence. The way you are trained to think at a root level is keeping you from seeing what has occurred in Wuhan.

    So, what do we know?

    Examining covid19 researchers and Doctors appears to be a recombinant virus between a bat coronavirus, of which no known relative has yet to be found, including raTG13, which is shown, By Dr. Yan to be a fabrication entered into the gene bank. The recombination happened within the spike glycoprotein, which recognizes cell surfaces. Prof Zheng-li appears to have worked with recombinant coronavirus derivatives at the Wuhan Institute of Virology, all the way back to 2006, and as recently as December, 2019, the VERY MONTH covid19 began to infect visitors at the Huanan Seafood Whole Sale market, just miles from her laboratory!
    DEc, 2019 "Molecular Mechanism for Anti-body dependent enhancement of coronavirus entry"

    This is the paper I showed you in January, when I predicted the world wide pandemic.

    ...
    In fact, SARS-CoV-2 most likely evolved from a viral variant that couldn’t survive for a long period of time or that persists at low levels in bats.
    See, this is not science, this is guess work. Educated, but still guess. Unfortunately this is now also propaganda.

    Coincidentally, it evolved the ability to invade human cells and accidentally found its way into us, possibly by means of an intermediate animal host, where it then thrived. Or an initially harmless form of the virus might have jumped directly into humans and then evolved to become harmful as it passed between people."
    There is that magic coincidence again. We worship the lottery. They have not found an intermediate host. The pangolins that were speculated had also been found to be a fabrication. They were smuggled pangolins. I had already posted about this further back in this thread.

    Again, the evolution steps to become harmful to humans would have taken many generations of viral infections. Covid was perfect from the get go, it is a stable virus with little mutations occurring right now. It is also perfect for dozens of other vertebrates.

    I am aware of these articles, I have seen many. Including the one written by National Geographic in response to Dr Yan's first paper. Its interesting, Disney Corporation purchased National Geographic. Does not Disney have a large theme park in Shanghai? And I remember correctly, didn't China ban Disney, back when the film Kundun was released, about the Dalai Lama? Do you think Disney wants to relive that? Disney, via its subsidiary National Geographic, will not be saying anything negative about the CCP, or the virus, any time soon.


    I remember a guy writing that while he was sick with COVID it appeared that his hamster caught it too. It started sneezing and passed very quickly. He was upset after realizing that it was probably him who got the hamster infected. So picking up COVID from pets like dogs or cats, or nearby wild animals that in autumn usually come closer to people's homes, seems to be a possibility.
    There were videos of soldiers in Wuhan during the initial lockdown saying that the virus can get "anything with a backbone." How would these people have been briefed on the virus way back in February, when researchers are only just finding out about covid abilities now...

    The videos had been removed from the nothing burger servers and the IPs deleted. As I have said, there are people following this more closely.

    Looks like it's already affecting some animal farms and wildlife



    https://www.cnn.com/world/live-news/...ntl/index.html
    Mink, interesting. A common lab testing animal and one favoured by Prof Zhengli in the past for serial combination. She's used them extensively.

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    The case for wearing face masks:

    https://www.ucsf.edu/news/2020/06/41...-masks-prevent

    One category of evidence comes from laboratory studies of respiratory droplets and the ability of various masks to block them. An experiment using high-speed video found that hundreds of droplets ranging from 20 to 500 micrometers were generated when saying a simple phrase, but that nearly all these droplets were blocked when the mouth was covered by a damp washcloth. Another study of people who had influenza or the common cold found that wearing a surgical mask significantly reduced the amount of these respiratory viruses emitted in droplets and aerosols.

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    Another in-depth article that makes the case for face masks:

    https://www.livescience.com/are-face...us-spread.html

    The other study, published April 3 in the journal Nature Medicine, used a more sophisticated method of collecting the virus particles that sick people emit. The researchers asked 426 volunteers to breathe for 30 minutes into a cone-like device that captures everything exhaled. Of these, 43 patients had influenza, 54 patients had rhinoviruses and 17 patients had seasonal coronaviruses (the kinds that cause colds, not the kind that causes COVID-19). This method allowed the researchers to quantify how much virus was found in droplet particles, which are greater than 0.0002 inches (5 microns) in diameter, versus aerosol particles, which are 5 microns or smaller. The participants were randomized to either wear a surgical mask or not wear a mask during the study.

    ...

    And as for masks? Surgical masks reduced the amount of virus released from a sick person in the form of droplets but not aerosols for influenza; the masks reduced coronavirus in both droplets and aerosols; and they didn't reduce either in rhinovirus. For the seasonal coronavirus, researchers found the virus in droplets in 3 out of 10 samples from participants not wearing masks and in aerosols in 4 out of 10 samples taken without masks. In samples taken with masks, no virus was detected in either droplets or aerosols.

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    @xerxe, I'd be interested if you can find a similar study conducted before March.

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    Quote Originally Posted by FreelancePoliceman View Post
    @xerxe, I'd be interested if you can find a similar study conducted before March.
    I'll look into it and try to get back to you.

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    Anti-body Dependent Enhancement.

    The real reason for the covid19 lockdowns, social distancing, and masks.

    When the mainstream news finally breaks this story, Antibody dependent enhancement features of covid19, like SARS1, MERS, dengue, which has been known for over a year now by higher ups in all the Governments, all hell will break loose in society.

    Good thing we all got trained up now and our organizational systems have us all ready to go for decade long social distancing.

    MASKS AND SOCIAL DISTANCING WILL BE THE NORM FOR YEARS.

    ANTIBODY DEPENDENT ENHANCEMENT>

    which means, you will survive covid19 fine the first, second, maybe even third infection, but in the end, it will severally damage, or kill you. This is not dooming. This is actual science coming down the pipeline, and much has already been speculated for over a year.

    So, I know this is a terribly depressing comment, but you heard it from me first. Covid19 is not going away, and finally, there will probably never be a proper vaccine, not unless medical science solves the issue of antibody dependent enhancement.

    https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1....08.20209114v1

    Antibody-dependent enhancement (ADE) of SARS-CoV-2 infection in recovered COVID-19 patients: studies based on cellular and structural biology analysis

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    This is the comment you are looking for



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    Quote Originally Posted by khcs View Post
    But only one has killed a quarter million Americans. Coincidence?

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    Airborne Lupus.

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    We have no good outcome from this virus sabotage against the humanity. It's used to change the life of the most people to worse. They have make vaccines and the problem only will arise.
    Partly excuse is that they may want to economy the resources and not just to spend them and then to ruin the civilization. It's hard to accept the genocide and robbery they have planed, anyway. They should develop technology as did before to solve resources problems, but seems do not want the changes in elites what new technology would bring. While what they do now is comparable with a hithlerism. They shift most people out of civilized world and will keep some minority to live relatively good. Not even nations problem. And it's doubtful to go by that plan to good result. But many problems will be made, for sure. Hithler as you remember has failed in own plans. It's a second try, mb even by same people or by their descendants, by ideologically close followers. New world war, in a new format.
    The most sad is that national governments have betrayed and now act against own people, which still trust them. Even when those governments lie and destroy their lives now, when turn the life to Hithler camps of death.

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    There was never any chance of a vaccine wiping this thing out.

    1 in 7 people get re-infected or relapse. Having antibodies against it is no guarantee of not getting sick again.


    No dependable vaccine is possible, not with our current technology and won't be for the foreseeable future.


    Eventually the VAST majority of humanity is going to get sick with this thing. There is no way around it.


    All we can do is try and keep hospitals from getting swamped, which has been very successful in most places.


    Continuing total lockdowns is completely abusive and counterproductive. It won't help because as soon as things open again people start getting sick again.

    Useless.

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    I can't wait for my protein synthesis mechanism to be altered forever with reprogramming how it functions.

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