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Thread: Life With a Dual

  1. #81
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    no. i want my sli mommy gf

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    Quote Originally Posted by Aaron Something View Post
    no. i want my sli mommy gf
    Are you okay?

    My IEE past fling sent me some nice messages lol. I doubt I’ll ever meet him again though. Probably for the best.

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    Quote Originally Posted by sbbds View Post
    Are you okay?

    My IEE past fling sent me some nice messages lol. I doubt I’ll ever meet him again though. Probably for the best.
    Of fucking course i am.

    Hahaha that's so weird. I'd never do that for anyone unless they're someone i always had a cool thing with. But i'm rarely like that.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Aaron Something View Post
    The fuck i'm going vegan. I love meat. Meat does good to my meat, it keeps it stiff.
    "Q: Can my food choices cause ED?
    A: High-fat diets and higher cholesterol levels are correlated with ED, which is largely caused by clogs in the small blood vessels. So the same things that cause heart disease can lead to ED. In fact, ED can often be the first sign of heart disease."

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    interesting regarding men who wanna help make a bab' "You also need to be careful about androgen supplements, bodybuilding agents and testosterone supplements. The World Health Organization is actually looking at testosterone as a potential male contraceptive because it turns off sperm production. So talk to your doctor before taking any type of supplement."

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    Quote Originally Posted by nanashi View Post
    interesting regarding men who wanna help make a bab' "You also need to be careful about androgen supplements, bodybuilding agents and testosterone supplements. The World Health Organization is actually looking at testosterone as a potential male contraceptive because it turns off sperm production. So talk to your doctor before taking any type of supplement."
    This is only if you inject exogenous testosterone or take other derivative anabolic steroids. That shuts down your testicles. Supplements that boost your own T production have a beneficial effect on fertility as well as having otherwise naturally obtained high T levels (proper exercise, sleep, nutrition, etc.)

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    Quote Originally Posted by nanashi View Post
    The World Health Organization is actually looking at testosterone as a potential male contraceptive
    Lower testosterone level leads to lesser sperm creation and sexual activity -> supressed fertility.
    Unnaturally high levels of hormones (more than in youth) achieved by injections may give paradoxical compensations. For example, to (temporarily) reduce affiliated receptor's sensitivity.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Northstar View Post
    This is only if you inject exogenous testosterone or take other derivative anabolic steroids. That shuts down your testicles. Supplements that boost your own T production have a beneficial effect on fertility as well as having otherwise naturally obtained high T levels (proper exercise, sleep, nutrition, etc.)
    is there a study showing boosts can't cause T to go too high, say, and cause issues?

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    Quote Originally Posted by nanashi View Post
    is there a study showing boosts can't cause T to go too high, say, and cause issues?
    Since the problems are caused by external source of artificial testosterone, I can’t see a mechanism that would make a well-functioning own production cause issues. On the contrary, naturally high T levels are linked with positive health effects in males, and low levels with negative effects.

    The effect of natural boosters is on a different order of magnitude than the unnatural levels that result from heavy steroid use. One of the issues is exogenous testosterone aromatizing into estradiol unless you use a blocker for that. A small amount of estrogen is useful for men but the T level must be much higher for proper balance. Same goes for women in reverse.

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    Quote Originally Posted by nanashi View Post
    interesting regarding men who wanna help make a bab' "You also need to be careful about androgen supplements, bodybuilding agents and testosterone supplements. The World Health Organization is actually looking at testosterone as a potential male contraceptive because it turns off sperm production. So talk to your doctor before taking any type of supplement."
    I've heard of body builders freezi g their sperm off cycle for this reason, hard to make a baby. I also see guys on anabolic s with kids so it's like herm. Didn't the WHO also say no person to person transmission of covid... Just kidding the sperm count studies are well known. Regardless, supplementing with them after 35 is not the biggest issue. Alcohol is far worse.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Northstar View Post
    Since the problems are caused by external source of artificial testosterone, I can’t see a mechanism that would make a well-functioning own production cause issues. On the contrary, naturally high T levels are linked with positive health effects in males, and low levels with negative effects.

    The effect of natural boosters is on a different order of magnitude than the unnatural levels that result from heavy steroid use. One of the issues is exogenous testosterone aromatizing into estradiol unless you use a blocker for that. A small amount of estrogen is useful for men but the T level must be much higher for proper balance. Same goes for women in reverse.
    Yeah amarosin, letrozole, ect ect. Some inhibit amoratization, some inhibit receptors. The worst that will happen is acne, and gyno and mood swings with high E2 levels. Some guys want a little bit as it has synchronous effects, joint protecting, on and on.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Northstar View Post
    Since the problems are caused by external source of artificial testosterone, I can’t see a mechanism that would make a well-functioning own production cause issues. On the contrary, naturally high T levels are linked with positive health effects in males, and low levels with negative effects.

    The effect of natural boosters is on a different order of magnitude than the unnatural levels that result from heavy steroid use. One of the issues is exogenous testosterone aromatizing into estradiol unless you use a blocker for that. A small amount of estrogen is useful for men but the T level must be much higher for proper balance. Same goes for women in reverse.


    I suspected this: " we can’t conclude or promote that there is “zero” risk by using TTh or increasing levels of testosterone among PCa patients. It is important to note that any kind of epidemiologic study design experience different limitations such as sample size/power (mainly in randomized trials), no randomization (i.e., observational studies), no or limited follow-up data, different methodology on data collection and different definitions of exposures and outcomes to conduct pooled-analysis. In addition, comparison among studies is challenging as some studies define high vs. low levels of testosterone with different cutoff points or develop different criteria to define aggressive and non-aggressive PCa. Therefore, there is a need further studies with the adequate power, follow-up data, epidemiological and clinicopathological data that can provide a better explanation about the safety and protective effects of high levels of endogenous testosterone or use of TTh in the natural history of PCa and in men’s health." 2017


    I just keep seeing *possible* side effects to having system directives (hormones, in this case) in any system be very high or very low.

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    Quote Originally Posted by nanashi View Post
    I just keep seeing *possible* side effects to having system directives (hormones, in this case) in any system be very high or very low.
    You cannot reach "very high" levels (many times over the normal reference range) with supplements that only help your body produce as much testosterone as possible. Those levels are only reachable by direct administration of testosterone or other even more anabolic derivatives. The levels in a healthy young man are several times lower than in a pro bodybuilder that injects.

    There are many good reasons to try to have your levels as close to the natural upper range as possible. For older men, TRT is a good idea if tests indicate low T levels.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Northstar View Post
    You cannot reach "very high" levels (many times over the normal reference range) with supplements that only help your body produce as much testosterone as possible. Those levels are only reachable by direct administration of testosterone or other even more anabolic derivatives. The levels in a healthy young man are several times lower than in a pro bodybuilder that injects.

    There are many good reasons to try to have your levels as close to the natural upper range as possible. For older men, TRT is a good idea if tests indicate low T levels.
    There is so much stigma still which is why TRT is not as prescribed as it should be. I have an older sibling who is on TRT, has several daughters, and has never felt better >40

    I envision a world in the not to distant future, where TRT becomes standard practise for this age bracket...the same sort of socio-psychological state exists now as did the same with marijuana in the short years leading up to full legalization in my country. In other words, TRT as well as recreational use is already wide spread, but legality enforces social stigma which creates underground contexts. The amount of guys using them is astronomical. Every single male body you see in a magazine is juicing. Further, just having higher normal state levels is conducive to go good health. Woman take birth control, even past menopause, for the positive effects of the hormone, why not men?

    Modernity invites modern solutions.

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    i'm not saying not to take it. I'm pointing out the human system is complex and that we do not yet know how it affects us in some scenarios and that we would do well to meticulously observe, record and study cases. And....the science echoes my sentiment

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    Humanist Beautiful sky's Avatar
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    Oh this is easy for me!
    I have lived with SEE
    ILI
    SLI
    And ESE and LSI

    Yeah my husband who is the LSE living with him tends to be more balanced between plans about what we will do, how we will have fun (a good time) and keep our home organized. We do have two different sleeping schedules. I am a super morning person. I wake up at 4:45-5:45 which worked better with my SEE dad since he would make us coffee. My husband sleeps in until 7-11 am so our morning time is separate. This does give me time to do my thing and I tend to be more independent so... I guess I’d like it if it was a match but it’s not and it affects us only when we’re on vacation. Since we cannot go anywhere it’s fine. Let’s see my mother is more of a schedule person so she wakes up with a watch and does her own thing where my husband looks to me to do a plan. My LSI brother in law works and is all about work but when he was home he would make us coffee early in the morning too. My ESE and LSE are pretty much the same way. They wake up dazed and takes them a long time to be awake. They move slowly. I wake up and I’m ready to work . Is it better or worse? Idk I like relationships so the only deal breaker for me is if someone doesn’t give me enough time and space to clean my surroundings. I enjoy the sex with my husband
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    I'm constantly looking to align the real with the ideal.I've been more oriented toward being overly idealistic by expecting the real to match the ideal. My thinking side is dominent. The result is that sometimes I can be overly impersonal or self-centered in my approach, not being understanding of others in the process and simply thinking "you should do this" or "everyone should follor this rule"..."regardless of how they feel or where they're coming from"which just isn't a good attitude to have. It is a way, though, to give oneself an artificial sense of self-justification. LSE

    Best description of functions:
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    Quote Originally Posted by Northstar View Post
    This is only if you inject exogenous testosterone or take other derivative anabolic steroids. That shuts down your testicles. Supplements that boost your own T production have a beneficial effect on fertility as well as having otherwise naturally obtained high T levels (proper exercise, sleep, nutrition, etc.)
    You can also shoot HCG during a cycle to keep your natural production flowing

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    Quote Originally Posted by nanashi View Post
    is there a study showing boosts can't cause T to go too high, say, and cause issues?
    It's not possible to naturally bring your levels high enough to cause any sort of harm. Your hormones naturally balance themselves to prevent this. Anabolic steroids are the only way to get your levels that high. It's literally shooting testosterone into your muscles. Forcing your body to over flow with it. Even then the body tries to compensate by boosting estrogen and shutting down natural T production. Hence why you need to take an estrogen blocker and also shoot up the testosterone at least once a week or you will have almost 0 testosterone soon for the few years it will take to kick start your system back without a proper PCT (Post Cycle Therapy).

    HCG(Human Chorionic Gonadotropin) also exists. Pinning this during a cycle keeps your testicles working and lets you reproduce as well.



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    Quote Originally Posted by nanashi View Post
    i'm not saying not to take it. I'm pointing out the human system is complex and that we do not yet know how it affects us in some scenarios and that we would do well to meticulously observe, record and study cases. And....the science echoes my sentiment
    True but keep in mind if you want to go the science route, that for anabolics, dozens and dozens of compounds, there is already a large body of research. Many decades worth BEFORE criminal izatuon in the late 80s, early 90s. Testosterone was synthesized long before the 1960s and was widely used, accepted in medicine and sport. Complex social issues spurned USA government of the time to criminalize these compounds. The rest of the planet followed suite, by choice and by foreign pressure. US were leaders, once....

    Anywho, medicine hailed these compounds and rightly so. There is a massive body of literature and work you can find, including research into the auxillary medications used to diminish and out right remove any side effects.

    Anabolics 2000 and the subsequent publications is a great place to start. It's an encyclopedia.

    There are reasons AIDS and HIV positive patients are prescribed anabolic compounds. In correct dosing they are immune supporting. Meaning, they keep you alive and strong.

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    I'm saying people are not shooting in the dark. There was an entire generation before our's who had time to familiarize themselves before the Drug War.

    Many other countries are far ahead. Russia, the Eastern Europe, China )fuck you CCP dogs), east Asia.

    America as well but the rule is we don't talk about fight club

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    Quote Originally Posted by Beautiful sky View Post
    Oh this is easy for me!
    I have lived with SEE
    ILI
    SLI
    And ESE and LSI

    Yeah my husband who is the LSE living with him tends to be more balanced between plans about what we will do, how we will have fun (a good time) and keep our home organized. We do have two different sleeping schedules. I am a super morning person. I wake up at 4:45-5:45 which worked better with my SEE dad since he would make us coffee. My husband sleeps in until 7-11 am so our morning time is separate. This does give me time to do my thing and I tend to be more independent so... I guess I’d like it if it was a match but it’s not and it affects us only when we’re on vacation. Since we cannot go anywhere it’s fine. Let’s see my mother is more of a schedule person so she wakes up with a watch and does her own thing where my husband looks to me to do a plan. My LSI brother in law works and is all about work but when he was home he would make us coffee early in the morning too. My ESE and LSE are pretty much the same way. They wake up dazed and takes them a long time to be awake. They move slowly. I wake up and I’m ready to work . Is it better or worse? Idk I like relationships so the only deal breaker for me is if someone doesn’t give me enough time and space to clean my surroundings.
    I bolt out of bed upon regaining consciousness when I have stuff to do. Instant adrenalin

  22. #102
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    Had a think about the suggestion of my bf and I being delta irrational duality instead of beta rational duality. I did think about it honestly and for a brief second may have even been convinced.

    But from what I can see, my bf's main issue is that he hates too many choices and my job is to narrow down his options. Like recently we were talking about moving in for real rather than me just staying here and he freaked out because of the other options he might miss out on by committing to me. My response was to give him an ultimatum like, "commit to me 100% or gtfo", essentially removing all his other options. And weirdly the less options he has, the freer and more confident he is. He needs to be convinced that the one option is the best option (which is where Fe+Ni come in) but once that happens he'll commit with no issue. Alternatively, if his mind is made up already he doesn't accept any other possibilities and needs a huge amount of emotional pressure to change his mind, if he will at all.

    My issue isn't that I need Si to calm me down. I need someone to push me to do the things I say I'm going to do. I need to someone to ensure I am not just playing the role of a successful person but actually have integrity and follow through. His job is to hold me to a high, unwavering standard. I have IEE friends who would probably run screaming if he was around calling them out every time they are off track.

    Slightly off topic but I figured it was relevant since I did a huge post about "LSI + EIE living arrangements" that would have been embarrassing if it turned out to be two different types lol
    hopefully this gives more insight into what it's like when beta rationals live with each other
    "I take back like half of the exclamation points.....they make me look....eager to please. Which I AM....but I don't want anyone to KNOW that"
    - Carrie Fisher

  23. #103
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    Quote Originally Posted by nanashi View Post
    "Q: Can my food choices cause ED?
    A: High-fat diets and higher cholesterol levels are correlated with ED, which is largely caused by clogs in the small blood vessels. So the same things that cause heart disease can lead to ED. In fact, ED can often be the first sign of heart disease."
    If you have heart disease, you have more to worry about than your dick not getting a boner.

  24. #104
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    Quote Originally Posted by sbbds View Post
    If you have heart disease, you have more to worry about than your dick not getting a boner.
    If you are male and your dick can't get hard, you might as well be dead. A heart attack would be seen as a blessing.

  25. #105
    f.k.a Oprah sbbds's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Adam Strange View Post
    If you are male and your dick can't get hard, you might as well be dead. A heart attack would be seen as a blessing.
    Eat your own dick. Release the clots

  26. #106
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    Quote Originally Posted by sbbds View Post
    Eat your own dick. Release the clots
    I'm not that flexible. I never was that flexible.

    Nope. My only option seems to be a vegan diet and an enthusiastic partner. Got one, looking for the other.

  27. #107
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    Quote Originally Posted by Adam Strange View Post
    I'm not that flexible. I never was that flexible.

    Nope. My only option seems to be a vegan diet and an enthusiastic partner. Got one, looking for the other.
    So your partner can eat your dick for you?

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    Quote Originally Posted by kingslayer View Post
    HCG(Human Chorionic Gonadotropin) also exists. Pinning this during a cycle keeps your testicles working and lets you reproduce as well.
    Hook me up. When can I start?

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    Quote Originally Posted by sbbds View Post
    So your partner can eat your dick for you?
    I hope so.

    Not every woman realizes how much guys like their own dicks. If a guy finds a woman who likes his dick as much as he does, then she's a keeper.


    When my LSI ex-GF and I were still together and I'd suggest having sex, she'd get this impish smile on her face and lick her lips and reach for my belt. Sometimes she'd suck my dick for hours. She'd bring me to a point just short of orgasm, then she'd stop and start talking about her family or whatever until I was down off that plateau and then she'd start up again. She also swallowed, meaning that she wanted my essence inside of her. You have no idea how that affects a guy. With regular sex, she was just as artistic. Lots of variety and fun and imagination, and she almost never said no.

    There was a lot wrong with the relationship, but that kept it going for three years. Completely overcame all my objections. If I didn't know that there were ESI's out there who were easier to live with, I'd still be with her. I'd have set aside my reservations and I'd have made the best of it.
    BUT, there actually are ESI's out there. I just have to convince one to close the distance.

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    Humanist Beautiful sky's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mrrrmaid View Post
    Had a think about the suggestion of my bf and I being delta irrational duality instead of beta rational duality. I did think about it honestly and for a brief second may have even been convinced.

    But from what I can see, my bf's main issue is that he hates too many choices and my job is to narrow down his options. Like recently we were talking about moving in for real rather than me just staying here and he freaked out because of the other options he might miss out on by committing to me. My response was to give him an ultimatum like, "commit to me 100% or gtfo", essentially removing all his other options. And weirdly the less options he has, the freer and more confident he is. He needs to be convinced that the one option is the best option (which is where Fe+Ni come in) but once that happens he'll commit with no issue. Alternatively, if his mind is made up already he doesn't accept any other possibilities and needs a huge amount of emotional pressure to change his mind, if he will at all.

    My issue isn't that I need Si to calm me down. I need someone to push me to do the things I say I'm going to do. I need to someone to ensure I am not just playing the role of a successful person but actually have integrity and follow through. His job is to hold me to a high, unwavering standard. I have IEE friends who would probably run screaming if he was around calling them out every time they are off track.

    Slightly off topic but I figured it was relevant since I did a huge post about "LSI + EIE living arrangements" that would have been embarrassing if it turned out to be two different types lol
    hopefully this gives more insight into what it's like when beta rationals live with each other
    Seems like a common Beta thing - need to be pushed to act
    -
    Dual type (as per tcaudilllg)
    Enneagram 5 (wings either 4 or 6)?


    I'm constantly looking to align the real with the ideal.I've been more oriented toward being overly idealistic by expecting the real to match the ideal. My thinking side is dominent. The result is that sometimes I can be overly impersonal or self-centered in my approach, not being understanding of others in the process and simply thinking "you should do this" or "everyone should follor this rule"..."regardless of how they feel or where they're coming from"which just isn't a good attitude to have. It is a way, though, to give oneself an artificial sense of self-justification. LSE

    Best description of functions:
    http://socionicsstudy.blogspot.com/2...functions.html

  31. #111
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    Quote Originally Posted by Adam Strange View Post
    I hope so.

    Not every woman realizes how much guys like their own dicks. If a guy finds a woman who likes his dick as much as he does, then she's a keeper.


    When my LSI ex-GF and I were still together and I'd suggest having sex, she'd get this impish smile on her face and lick her lips and reach for my belt. Sometimes she'd suck my dick for hours. She'd bring me to a point just short of orgasm, then she'd stop and start talking about her family or whatever until I was down off that plateau and then she'd start up again. She also swallowed, meaning that she wanted my essence inside of her. You have no idea how that affects a guy. With regular sex, she was just as artistic. Lots of variety and fun and imagination, and she almost never said no.

    There was a lot wrong with the relationship, but that kept it going for three years. Completely overcame all my objections. If I didn't know that there were ESI's out there who were easier to live with, I'd still be with her. I'd have set aside my reservations and I'd have made the best of it.
    BUT, there actually are ESI's out there. I just have to convince one to close the distance.

    Because of us, this is now the LSI blowjob thread
    "I take back like half of the exclamation points.....they make me look....eager to please. Which I AM....but I don't want anyone to KNOW that"
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    Quote Originally Posted by mrrrmaid View Post
    Because of us, this is now the LSI blowjob thread
    I probably need better filters.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Adam Strange View Post
    If you are male and your dick can't get hard, you might as well be dead. A heart attack would be seen as a blessing.
    naw. to live would be a big adventure

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    What's the purpose of SEI? Tallmo's Avatar
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    I know some dual couples who are old now and they've been together for like 50-60 years. Eie+lsi and lie+esi.

    They seem onesided. Like they have never truly expanded beyond their youth personality. I do think duality can prevent psychological growth. Your unconscious side is constatly compensated for so no need to develop.
    The decisive thing is not the reality of the object, but the reality of the subjective factor, i.e. the primordial images, which in their totality represent a psychic mirror-world. It is a mirror, however, with the peculiar capacity of representing the present contents of consciousness not in their known and customary form but in a certain sense sub specie aeternitatis, somewhat as a million-year old consciousness might see them.

    (Jung on Si)

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tallmo View Post
    I know some dual couples who are old now and they've been together for like 50-60 years. Eie+lsi and lie+esi.

    They seem onesided. Like they have never truly expanded beyond their youth personality. I do think duality can prevent psychological growth. Your unconscious side is constatly compensated for so no need to develop.
    @Tallmo, develop into what? What is a youth personality?

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    What's the purpose of SEI? Tallmo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Adam Strange View Post
    @Tallmo, develop into what? What is a youth personality?
    Im just trying to express what Im seeing. Some old people seem like they have aged well and have become complete. But I dont see it in these dual couples. They have stayed too long in a state that needed to grow. It makes totally sense to me knowing duality.

    I think duality is both good and bad.

    Of course my sample is not very big...
    The decisive thing is not the reality of the object, but the reality of the subjective factor, i.e. the primordial images, which in their totality represent a psychic mirror-world. It is a mirror, however, with the peculiar capacity of representing the present contents of consciousness not in their known and customary form but in a certain sense sub specie aeternitatis, somewhat as a million-year old consciousness might see them.

    (Jung on Si)

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    Quote Originally Posted by Tallmo View Post
    Im just trying to express what Im seeing. Some old people seem like they have aged well and have become complete. But I dont see it in these dual couples. They have stayed too long in a state that needed to grow. It makes totally sense to me knowing duality.

    I think duality is both good and bad.

    Of course my sample is not very big...
    This is not very clear to me. Do they seem like children? Are they making childish decisions? Can you give me an example?

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    What's the purpose of SEI? Tallmo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Adam Strange View Post
    This is not very clear to me. Do they seem like children? Are they making childish decisions? Can you give me an example?
    They seem onesided like young people. But in young people it doesnt seem bad, but in old people it seems like stagnation. I cant explain it very well.

    If you look at videos of Carl Jung or Marie-Loise von Franz. I think they are good examples of people who have aged well. Its hard to say exactly what it is but I can feel it and I react a certain way watching people like them.
    The decisive thing is not the reality of the object, but the reality of the subjective factor, i.e. the primordial images, which in their totality represent a psychic mirror-world. It is a mirror, however, with the peculiar capacity of representing the present contents of consciousness not in their known and customary form but in a certain sense sub specie aeternitatis, somewhat as a million-year old consciousness might see them.

    (Jung on Si)

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    I thought that according to theory, duals are supposed to help each other develop and to see the other side of things where they're lacking. And that duality doesn't just "cover blind spots", so to speak.

    I know a couple that's most likely EIE and LSI and they've been married over 50 years. I wouldn't call them childlike. They're respected by their communities (neighborhood, congregation, etc) since they've become pretty well rounded, due to the ease of communication they've had and being able to help each other grow so much over the years.

    Different couples handle things differently though, even if two couples were the same genders in an ITR I don't think they would handle a situation the exact same. So I think that could also be a factor.
    Socionics is a dangerous thing for a woman like me to have, but I have it.

    I can't click “like” on peoples posts due to the poor functionality of the site on my end. Just know that if you quoted me and were nice to me that I’m psychically sending you a like from my heart.



    Model G: IEI-CN
    Model A: Most likely ISFx
    MBTI: ISFP-A
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