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Thread: Amazing 1983 Prophecy: Donald Trump will lead America back to God

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    Quote Originally Posted by sbbds View Post
    What’s the point of your pictures? Don’t you understand word syntax? They still say that they want to disrupt it.

    @End is right. It’s a stated fact by them that it’s their goal.
    Word syntax says the last word in the chain of modifiers is the noun, those before are adjectives.

    Nuclear: adjective
    Family: adjective
    Structure: adjective
    Requirement: noun

    "We disrupt the... requirement." Not "we disrupt the... traditional" or "we disrupt the... structure."
    It certainly didn't say "we disrupt the nuclear family structure option." It says requirement.

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    I agree with this prophecy btw. I think Trump is gonna save the world lmao, in an amazing Fi polr character development plot twist. Because that’s how all stories work, DUH!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Grendel View Post
    Word syntax says the last word in the chain of modifiers is the noun, those before are adjectives.

    Nuclear: adjective
    Family: adjective
    Structure: adjective
    Requirement: noun

    "We disrupt the... requirement." Not "we disrupt the... traditional" or "we disrupt the... structure."
    It certainly didn't say "we disrupt the nuclear family structure option." It says requirement.
    Ok... and they want to disrupt it.

    They see the traditional family structure as a requirement (or more accurately see the world as seeing it that way). And they want to disrupt it and/or the requirement for it. Regardless they are anti-family structure as it currently is.

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    If you’re so scared of being culled as a white boy @Grendel, it looks like these are actually the people who are going to do it to you.

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    Quote Originally Posted by sbbds View Post
    Ok... and they want to disrupt it.

    They see the traditional family structure as a requirement (or more accurately see the world as seeing it that way). And they want to disrupt it and/or the requirement for it. Regardless they are anti-family structure as it currently is.
    Opposing something means opposing allowing it as an option. Opposing it as a requirement allows choice.

    Choice is good.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Grendel View Post
    Opposing something means opposing allowing it as an option. Opposing it as a requirement allows choice.

    Choice is good.
    Well I’m glad you don’t believe you’re going extinct anymore but I still think the highly male-excluding language as @End pointed out is highly worrying. They don’t even mention the word “father” at all, but say “parents”. It reeks of people who are triggered and afraid to trigger others; running from emotions because of pain. Running from emotions means not solving problems that need to be addressed unemotionally.

    ”We make our spaces family-friendly and enable parents to fully participate with their children. We dismantle the patriarchal practice that requires mothers to work “double shifts” so that they can mother in private even as they participate in public justice work.

    Also, what the fuck? This seems to imply that all WOMEN or all mothers are supposed to be SJWs that are fighting towards their agenda.

    And how is working a double shift patriarchal? Women doing double shifts is a result of feminism and women wanting to work more.

    Nice find and source posting @End . Good eye. Fuck this bullshit.

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    Quote Originally Posted by sbbds View Post
    Well I’m glad you don’t believe you’re going extinct anymore but I still think the highly male-excluding language as @End pointed out is highly worrying. They don’t even mention the word “father” at all, but say “parents”. It reeks of people who are triggered and afraid to trigger others; running from emotions because of pain. Running from emotions means not solving problems that need to be addressed unemotionally.

    ”We make our spaces family-friendly and enable parents to fully participate with their children. We dismantle the patriarchal practice that requires mothers to work “double shifts” so that they can mother in private even as they participate in public justice work.

    Also, what the fuck? This seems to imply that all WOMEN or all mothers are supposed to be SJWs that are fighting towards their agenda.

    And how is working a double shift patriarchal? Women doing double shifts is a result of feminism and women wanting to work more.
    If I had to guess, it's related to the fact that two income household used to be a cheat that only some families used to pay mortgage, but became a race to the bottom somehow with the housing sector where you all but needed to be two income to stay competitive and pay the mortgage off. Doesn't mean they're gonna help that at all though.

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    Newspeak white knight trash

    Trump is the opposite of this Satan walking the Earth

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    What today politicans may is to return most people to state of the past, where was lower education, lower technology and where religion was more in peoples minds. Such weaker and more poor people are easier to be controlled and supressed by the minority for interests of this minority. But it's doubtful to say that people in past much better fited to monotheistic religious ideals on minds level, not surface rituals alike more visiting churches. That they felt happier and were stronger.
    Returning to God? To more of slavery - possibly.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Grendel View Post
    And you were slaughtering kulaks!


    Oh, and you persecuted jews too. Worse than the third reich of germany, might I add. Not many people know about this, but back in the day, Hittler actually made a special exception that the Karaite sect of jews were never to be targeted for execution, but you Soviets lined your karaim against the wall and had them shot. So you were actually worse than Hittler on jews.


    Oh, and remember that war you "single-handedly" fought to defeat those nazis, whom you'd made a nonaggression pact with a while earlier? Guess who paid for your efforts? Who funneled all that money and oil and trucks into your war effort? We did. The good old US of A funded your destruction of the nazi forces in the Lend-Lease Act.

    So STFU.
    Tu quoque! But right nonetheless.

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    Quote Originally Posted by sbbds View Post
    Newspeak white knight trash

    Trump is the opposite of this Satan walking the Earth
    the problem is that Trump represents the right-wing extremism battling the left-wing extremism, and each side only identifies the extremism in the opposing side and not that on their own side, by and large. The state of intense political polarization between both sides makes for an atmosphere in which criticizing the failings of ones own side will lead to accusations of supporting the other side, and that is becoming increasingly dangerous to people in the form of economic penalities.

    But Trump is the leader of the nation, he knows the nation is tearing itself apart, and he seems to do whatever he can to make it tear itself apart further. He likes the increasing polarization and seeks to increase it. He's basically a vector for polarization.

    He also is the first president in my lifetime who truly only represents half the nation rather than all of it. This isn't to say politicians in general are any good at representing their constituents if those constituents don't have buckets of cash.

    The problem is that every win on either side of the culture war, under such intense polarization that renders the country dysfunctional, is a loss for everyone, because the other side will retaliate by amping up its own extremism.

    Take an issue like free speech. While Trump fights for the free speech of the right wing, he doesn't support it at all for the left wing. He would be fine with cancelling people on the left, just not on the right (unless of course they call out their own side). He would be fine with getting rid of free press entirely and replacing it with his own personal propaganda machine. He just doesn't like it when the left infringes on free speech for those on the right. So basically, he's just as anti-free speech as the extremists on the left.

    The division of the culture war benefits Trump, so he has no interest in ending the extremism across the board. He loves it.
    Last edited by marooned; 09-12-2020 at 02:46 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by inumbra View Post
    the problem is that Trump represents the right-wing extremism battling the left-wing extremism, and each side only identifies the extremism in the opposing side and not that on their own side, by and large. The state of intense political polarization between both sides makes for an atmosphere in which criticizing the failings of ones own side will lead to accusations of supporting the other side, and that is becoming increasingly dangerous to people in the form of economic penalities.

    But Trump is the leader of the nation, he knows the nation is tearing itself apart, and he seems to do whatever he can to make it tear itself apart further. He likes the increasing polarization and seeks to increase it. He's basically a vector for polarization.

    He also is the first president in my lifetime who truly only represents half the nation rather than all of it. This isn't to say politicians in general are any good at representing their constituents if those constituents don't have buckets of cash.

    The problem is that every win on either side of the culture war, under such intense polarization that renders the country dysfunctional, is a loss for everyone, because the other side will retaliate by amping up its own extremism.

    Take an issue like free speech. While Trump fights for the free speech of the right wing, he doesn't support it at all for the left wing. He would be fine with cancelling people on the left, just not on the right (unless of course they call out their own side). He would be fine with getting rid of free press entirely and replacing it with his own personal propaganda machine. He just doesn't like it when the left infringes on free speech for those on the right. So basically, he's just as anti-free speech as the extremists on the left.

    The division of the culture war benefits Trump, so he has no interest in ending the extremism across the board. He loves it.
    How is it possible for Trump to be pushing for polarization if he is trying to quash left wing free speech as you say? Since polarization would happen best in theory if both sides would be encouraged to broadcast their extremists views as much as possible.

    In other words, what’s the evidence for Trump trying to increase polarization?

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    Quote Originally Posted by sbbds View Post
    How is it possible for Trump to be pushing for polarization if he is trying to quash left wing free speech as you say? Since polarization would happen best in theory if both sides would be encouraged to broadcast their extremists views as much as possible.

    In other words, what’s the evidence for Trump trying to increase polarization?
    I'm not sure I agree that polarization happens best if people are free to air their views. Something else might happen instead: discussion. (Free) discussion and debate in my opinion decrease extremist views because people feel like they can say what they think and they can work out their views in discourse (which really is part of building views, people learn from conversations and even from debates). If the climate is too dangerous for people to speak, that's when internal anger builds that has little outlet until of course someone like Trump comes along to encourage the unleashing of that rage, which he can play like a snake charmer.

    I'm not sure how much you need. For instance would you agree already from the content of his Tweets and what he says in his rallies (which btw are ONLY for his supporters and not all Americans) is decisive by drawing on people's fear, anger and hatred, and calling out enemies to hatefully chant against whether they are immigrants or muslims or the libs in general or whichever group he wishes to declare the enemy today. The energy that gets fired up is hateful against other people in the same nation.

    Then there are the violent outcomes of Trump's rhetoric. This article has a list of some examples: https://abcnews.go.com/amp/Politics/...ry?id=58912889

    What will be the reaction from the left to this kind of thing? Will they possibly become increasingly less "woke" in response to an increasingly violent right wing that is actually now easy to link directly to racism and hate crimes? Of course not. This will tell the left it needs to double down hard, it needs to become more extreme to fight the extremism. It needs to burn cities and destroy things if need be. It needs to make sure no one is allowed in its society who displays any view that does not meet a standard of moral purity. It needs to grow its dogma to become strong.

    And when it does, Trump likely rejoices, because then he can tell his followers, "see how extreme the left is" and basically paint them as enemies in a holy war. And they will agree with him when he starts turning Homeland Security into the secret police, able to detain people whenever they want. Naturally like both sides blind in the political divide they don't see how that threatens their freedom as well were a left-wing extremist to get into office (how now the set up is already there for them to do one of the worst things in nations ruled by dictators--make people disappear because of their political views). Likewise, the political left doesn't see how their interest in increasing censorship creates pathways to censor their own side for extremism. If the social media giants increasingly censor political speech they can also censor eventually progressives rising in politics who rely heavily on social media to promote themselves. It gives the social media giants too much power over politics. But naturally no one notices the threat as long as it's only working against the other side.

    Trump didn't start all the division, but he used it to win an election and he'll use it again. The closer we get to Nov. the more he seems to focus on the culture war. And surely I am not the only one who noticed how after Trump's election extremism in the US seems to be at an all time high. Who is fanning those flames in every speech and tweet? Could it be the leader of the nation?

    PS. Trump on cancel culture: https://amp.cnn.com/cnn/2020/07/07/p...ngs/index.html

    Some of these examples are about boycotting corporations, however that's kind of part of this too. Corporations are reacting to the political division just as everything is. It affects who they hire, who they fire, what they say and promote, where they put their money, what their culture initiatives are, etc. And that affects all of us, it affects what we can say and do without economic penalty.

    Also many examples are just about if someone said something that he personally doesn't like, because he is a mini-dictator with fragile ego.

    But basically he plays the same game as the left while saying he's against the game. His side won't notice how this is pervasive on their side as well, and of course they can always just see it as necessary: you have to control these left wing extremists so they can't take over (you have to control people).

    CNN btw as far as I know has never really called out cancel culture on the left. It's left-leaning and blind to its own side's failings.

    This vid does a nice summary theory of how Trump plays. He's good at division. He knows how to play division in his favor:

    https://youtu.be/AkYnMDKVwoY

    Like he doesn't say divisive things for nothing. Every time he's doing it he's doing it on purpose for his own ends.

    If Trump were against the division because it threatens the integrity of the entire nation he would attempt to unify the entire nation. Can you really say a president who has declared the other half of the political spectrum (the entire left-leaning half of the nation, over 100 million people) the enemy, does not wish for division, strife and chaos? The very simple fact that his rallies are only for Republicans, that Republicans are the ONLY Americans he represents, says a great deal all on its own.

    ETA. I don't agree with all the political views of the youtuber most likely. The end of the video of reporters asking people to call things out on the spot (you are condemned if you do not call x out) is also not really my cup of tea. And also the tweet about asking the squad "to go back to their own countries" IS racist, which was the entire point. Trump knew it was and he did it on purpose as the rest of the video argues, so to say whether it is or isn't racist is irrelevant doesn't fit with the argument the video is making. On the contrary, it is highly relevant.

    The main area I disagree politically is that I'll vote for progressives like AOC because I don't entirely disagree with the woke movement. It's the extreme end of that moment that would control people that I have a problem with. But I have more of a problem with the center left because of its economic policies and how it is a whore for corporations that are driving increasing income inequality and environmental destruction. And of course the entire right is a sell out to corporations.
    Last edited by marooned; 09-12-2020 at 05:44 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by inumbra View Post
    I'm not sure I agree that polarization happens best if people are free to air their views. Something else might happen instead: discussion. (Free) discussion and debate in my opinion decrease extremist views because people feel like they can say what they think and they can work out their views in discourse (which really is part of building views, people learn from conversations and even from debates). If the climate is too dangerous for people to speak, that's when internal anger builds that has little outlet until of course someone like Trump comes along to encourage the unleashing of that rage, which he can play like a snake charmer.

    I'm not sure how much you need. For instance would you agree already from the content of his Tweets and what he says in his rallies (which btw are ONLY for his supporters and not all Americans) is decisive by drawing on people's fear, anger and hatred, and calling out enemies to hatefully chant against whether they are immigrants or muslims or the libs in general or whichever group he wishes to declare the enemy today. The energy that gets fired up is hateful against other people in the same nation.

    Then there are the violent outcomes of Trump's rhetoric. This article has a list of some examples: https://abcnews.go.com/amp/Politics/...ry?id=58912889

    What will be the reaction from the left to this kind of thing? Will they possibly become increasingly less "woke" in response to an increasingly violent right wing that is actually now easy to link directly to racism and hate crimes? Of course not. This will tell the left it needs to double down hard, it needs to become more extreme to fight the extremism. It needs to burn cities and destroy things if need be. It needs to make sure no one is allowed in its society who displays any view that does not meet a standard of moral purity. It needs to grow its dogma to become strong.

    And when it does, Trump likely rejoices, because then he can tell his followers, "see how extreme the left is" and basically paint them as enemies in a holy war. And they will agree with him when he starts turning Homeland Security into the secret police, able to detain people whenever they want. Naturally like both sides blind in the political divide they don't see how that threatens their freedom as well were a left-wing extremist to get into office (how now the set up is already there for them to do one of the worst things in nations ruled by dictators--make people disappear because of their political views). Likewise, the political left doesn't see how their interest in increasing censorship creates pathways to censor their own side for extremism. If the social media giants increasingly censor political speech they can also censor eventually progressives rising in politics who rely heavily on social media to promote themselves. It gives the social media giants too much power over politics. But naturally no one notices the threat as long as it's only working against the other side.

    Trump didn't start all the division, but he used it to win an election and he'll use it again. The closer we get to Nov. the more he seems to focus on the culture war. And surely I am not the only one who noticed how after Trump's election extremism in the US seems to be at an all time high. Who is fanning those flames in every speech and tweet? Could it be the leader of the nation?

    PS. Trump on cancel culture: https://amp.cnn.com/cnn/2020/07/07/p...ngs/index.html

    Some of these examples are about boycotting corporations, however that's kind of part of this too. Corporations are reacting to the political division just as everything is. It affects who they hire, who they fire, what they say and promote, where they put their money, what their culture initiatives are, etc. And that affects all of us, it affects what we can say and do without economic penalty.

    Also many examples are just about if someone said something that he personally doesn't like, because he is a mini-dictator with fragile ego.

    But basically he plays the same game as the left while saying he's against the game. His side won't notice how this is pervasive on their side as well, and of course they can always just see it as necessary: you have to control these left wing extremists so they can't take over (you have to control people).

    CNN btw as far as I know has never really called out cancel culture on the left. It's left-leaning and blind to its own side's failings.

    This vid does a nice summary theory of how Trump plays. He's good at division. He knows how to play division in his favor:

    https://youtu.be/AkYnMDKVwoY

    Like he doesn't say divisive things for nothing. Every time he's doing it he's doing it on purpose for his own ends.

    If Trump were against the division because it threatens the integrity of the entire nation he would attempt to unify the entire nation. Can you really say a president who has declared the other half of the political spectrum (the entire left-leaning half of the nation, over 100 million people) the enemy, does not wish for division, strife and chaos? The very simple fact that his rallies are only for Republicans, that Republicans are the ONLY Americans he represents, says a great deal all on its own.
    I guess that’s all true. Then again, he still does have to lead the whole nation afterwards, including the left. He has to do it somehow, as it’s his job. And even though it’s difficult it’s technically not impossible to create compromises between opposite poles.

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    Also @inumbra I think BLM is considered pretty mainstream is part of the issue I see here now. Lots of big companies are supporting them. It’s actually pretty extremist left though if its values page is any indication, and most people (including me) haven’t been clued in about this. The stuff on their website is what you’d expect to see on a grassroots radfem company’s website. It’s not small though, it’s like Nike now with the amount of spotlight it’s been getting meanwhile espousing high-level newspeak.

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    I have a idea about where Donald Trump is leading the country, but I'll simply set that aside right now and post something that one of my Astronomy friends sent to me.

    I don't know if Astronomy gives people a larger perspective on human relations or not, but I do remember reading an article in a 1939 issue of Scientific American in which the editor stated that he had postponed publishing an article (on astronomy) from a German author until relations between the US and Germany improved, but since that didn't seem likely in the near future, he was publishing it now.

    We are all Earthers.


    Dear readers,
    If you were a busy astrophysicist at a prestigious institution like New York's Stony Brook University, you'd probably have better things to do than argue with flat-Earthers. Well, Paul M. Sutter is just such a busy astrophysicist at Stony Brook, and this week he indeed spent time arguing with flat-Earthers, in a piece in Space.com—or at least offering suggestions for how the rest of us can avoid arguing with them.

    The good news: 84% of Americans accept that the Earth is round. The bad news is the 16% who live in—or at least have a valid visa for—the land of the counterfactual. The world has always been awash in loony-tune ideas, and in many cases the believers are harmless. So you think the moon landings were faked? Go right ahead. You may disqualify yourself from sitting at the grownup table of informed society, but that's on you.

    But other conspiratorial ideas are more corrosive. For every person who thinks climate change is a hoax, that's one fewer individual pushing for immediate climate action. Pizzagate was just a crackpot rumor about child trafficking at a Washington, D.C. pizza parlor until an armed gunman showed up and opened fire in an attempt to "rescue" the imaginary children. Anti-vaccine beliefs are nothing but conspiratorial rubbish—except that every parent who subscribes to them endangers their children and the wider community.

    Sutter proposes all manner of arguments to respond to flat-Earthers: Note how objects receding over the horizon don't disappear all at once, as they would if they were falling off the edge of the Earth. Note how constellations that are visible in the northern hemisphere are replaced be entirely new ones as you cross the equator. Then there's gravity, which exerts its inward-pulling force equally in all directions, causing an object like a planet or moon that gains enough mass to collapse into a sphere.

    But reasoned arguments typically don't move conspiracy believers. In a sort of logical jujitsu, they use the very evidence mustered against them as further proof of just how cunning the plotters are. So what's the solution—and, more to the point, why even bother?
    Research shows that belief in conspiracy theories springs not from lack of information and certainly not lack of intelligence—it can take a first-rate mind to weave the exceedingly elaborate webs of deceit that believers sees in the world around them. The belief instead comes from a lack of trust—in institutions, in government, in industry, in politicians.

    "Many people don't trust the society around them, most notably the representatives of that society," Sutter writes. "That trust often falls even further when it comes to elite representatives of that society, which includes government officials, members of academia and scientists like me."

    But that trust can be restored. It takes honesty on the part of those in power, yes—something that is often in short supply. But it also takes listening and respect from the rest of us. Anti-vax parents may be wrong on the science, but they're right in their sincere—if misguided—effort to protect their children from what they perceive as harm. Climate change deniers or Apollo conspiracists might be wrong on the facts and the history, but they're right that too often the government and others in power don't give it to us straight. If no less an authority than an astrophysicist can take it easy on the flat-Earthers, maybe everyone can learn a little tolerance. All of us have equal claim to call the Earth our shared home, after all—even if not all of us could properly draw a picture of it.
    —Jeffrey Kluger

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    Quote Originally Posted by Adam Strange View Post
    I have a idea about where Donald Trump is leading the country, but I'll simply set that aside right now and post something that one of my Astronomy friends sent to me.

    I don't know if Astronomy gives people a larger perspective on human relations or not, but I do remember reading an article in a 1939 issue of Scientific American in which the editor stated that he had postponed publishing an article (on astronomy) from a German author until relations between the US and Germany improved, but since that didn't seem likely in the near future, he was publishing it now.

    We are all Earthers.


    Dear readers,
    If you were a busy astrophysicist at a prestigious institution like New York's Stony Brook University, you'd probably have better things to do than argue with flat-Earthers. Well, Paul M. Sutter is just such a busy astrophysicist at Stony Brook, and this week he indeed spent time arguing with flat-Earthers, in a piece in Space.com—or at least offering suggestions for how the rest of us can avoid arguing with them.

    The good news: 84% of Americans accept that the Earth is round. The bad news is the 16% who live in—or at least have a valid visa for—the land of the counterfactual. The world has always been awash in loony-tune ideas, and in many cases the believers are harmless. So you think the moon landings were faked? Go right ahead. You may disqualify yourself from sitting at the grownup table of informed society, but that's on you.

    But other conspiratorial ideas are more corrosive. For every person who thinks climate change is a hoax, that's one fewer individual pushing for immediate climate action. Pizzagate was just a crackpot rumor about child trafficking at a Washington, D.C. pizza parlor until an armed gunman showed up and opened fire in an attempt to "rescue" the imaginary children. Anti-vaccine beliefs are nothing but conspiratorial rubbish—except that every parent who subscribes to them endangers their children and the wider community.

    Sutter proposes all manner of arguments to respond to flat-Earthers: Note how objects receding over the horizon don't disappear all at once, as they would if they were falling off the edge of the Earth. Note how constellations that are visible in the northern hemisphere are replaced be entirely new ones as you cross the equator. Then there's gravity, which exerts its inward-pulling force equally in all directions, causing an object like a planet or moon that gains enough mass to collapse into a sphere.

    But reasoned arguments typically don't move conspiracy believers. In a sort of logical jujitsu, they use the very evidence mustered against them as further proof of just how cunning the plotters are. So what's the solution—and, more to the point, why even bother?
    Research shows that belief in conspiracy theories springs not from lack of information and certainly not lack of intelligence—it can take a first-rate mind to weave the exceedingly elaborate webs of deceit that believers sees in the world around them. The belief instead comes from a lack of trust—in institutions, in government, in industry, in politicians.

    "Many people don't trust the society around them, most notably the representatives of that society," Sutter writes. "That trust often falls even further when it comes to elite representatives of that society, which includes government officials, members of academia and scientists like me."

    But that trust can be restored. It takes honesty on the part of those in power, yes—something that is often in short supply. But it also takes listening and respect from the rest of us. Anti-vax parents may be wrong on the science, but they're right in their sincere—if misguided—effort to protect their children from what they perceive as harm. Climate change deniers or Apollo conspiracists might be wrong on the facts and the history, but they're right that too often the government and others in power don't give it to us straight. If no less an authority than an astrophysicist can take it easy on the flat-Earthers, maybe everyone can learn a little tolerance. All of us have equal claim to call the Earth our shared home, after all—even if not all of us could properly draw a picture of it.
    —Jeffrey Kluger
    I'm going to have to nag you because of that first paragraph. If you didn't want to talk about where you think Trump is leading the country you shouldn't have mentioned it haha.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Aramas View Post
    I'm going to have to nag you because of that first paragraph. If you didn't want to talk about where you think Trump is leading the country you shouldn't have mentioned it haha.
    It's just a placeholder, stating that Trump is a bad person.
    Last edited by Adam Strange; 09-12-2020 at 06:17 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by sbbds View Post
    Also @inumbra I think BLM is considered pretty mainstream is part of the issue I see here now. Lots of big companies are supporting them. It’s actually pretty extremist left though if its values page is any indication, and most people (including me) haven’t been clued in about this. The stuff on their website is what you’d expect to see on a grassroots radfem company’s website. It’s not small though, it’s like Nike now with the amount of spotlight it’s been getting meanwhile espousing high-level newspeak.
    yes I think this argument applies here as well. Why have more center left people embraced it? Because the right is showing why it's necessary through their increasingly on display racism and inciting of racial violence. Also through their stubbornness in which they won't admit that no things are not all equal for everyone in this nation. Everyone after all needs to pull themselves up by their bootstraps and if you can't because you started in a 50 foot hole as opposed to many others who start out in a five foot hole, it's your fault. It's also your fault if you finally pull yourself up a good 10 feet only to be kicked down another 20 by an outside force.

    This is all why focusing on only ones own side is a bad idea because ones own side in an intensely divided nation is what ends up creating the worst in the opposing side. It's like being stuck in a chamber in which water is sent to ricochet off the walls. With each ricochet the wave is more forceful, and eventually its speed and destructive power will rip through and kill everyone in the chamber. Instead of viewing it as a system, one just looks at their end of the chamber enjoying the destruction the wave sends to the other side... until it comes back at them even stronger.

    Anyway I see BLM as a mixed bag. They are correct that all things are not equal and that black people have been screwed over. It's not right, it's not fair, it's inhumane. And it has disadvantaged countless people and destroyed lives. And I agree BLM comes from the position of a group oppressed.

    However, things like white people should give their houses to people of color are views I find extreme and disagree with. For one it seems to assume that there are not a ton of poor white people who can't afford a house to begin with. For two it perpetuates a zero sum game (I believe people like AOC would refer to it as scarcity mindset although not in this context of course). It's the belief in the zero sum game that fuels white fear and causes white people to dig their heels in to keep the existing system. And taking houses from one person to give to another rather than addressing the rampant economic inequality isn't IMO how to solve anything.

    As for your previous post, he may lead the entire nation as president, but he doesn't represent it. He increasingly paints the entire left as enemies. It's like he wants a civil war. He has no interest in compromises between opposites. It's possible sure, but not a possibility he's interested in. He likes pitting half the nation against the other half.

    ETA: I think there may be a narcissism issue in the woke movement (https://reason.com/2020/07/07/narcis...ays-study/?amp), however it would be a mistake to assume the majority of those in the movement are extremists... I imagine most people are simply aware they got a bad deal and it's hurting them and their loved ones.
    Last edited by marooned; 09-12-2020 at 05:34 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Adam Strange View Post
    Dear readers,
    If you were a busy astrophysicist at a prestigious institution like New York's Stony Brook University, you'd probably have better things to do than argue with flat-Earthers. Well, Paul M. Sutter is just such a busy astrophysicist at Stony Brook, and this week he indeed spent time arguing with flat-Earthers, in a piece in Space.com—or at least offering suggestions for how the rest of us can avoid arguing with them.

    The good news: 84% of Americans accept that the Earth is round. The bad news is the 16% who live in—or at least have a valid visa for—the land of the counterfactual. The world has always been awash in loony-tune ideas, and in many cases the believers are harmless. So you think the moon landings were faked? Go right ahead. You may disqualify yourself from sitting at the grownup table of informed society, but that's on you.

    But other conspiratorial ideas are more corrosive. For every person who thinks climate change is a hoax, that's one fewer individual pushing for immediate climate action. Pizzagate was just a crackpot rumor about child trafficking at a Washington, D.C. pizza parlor until an armed gunman showed up and opened fire in an attempt to "rescue" the imaginary children. Anti-vaccine beliefs are nothing but conspiratorial rubbish—except that every parent who subscribes to them endangers their children and the wider community.

    Sutter proposes all manner of arguments to respond to flat-Earthers: Note how objects receding over the horizon don't disappear all at once, as they would if they were falling off the edge of the Earth. Note how constellations that are visible in the northern hemisphere are replaced be entirely new ones as you cross the equator. Then there's gravity, which exerts its inward-pulling force equally in all directions, causing an object like a planet or moon that gains enough mass to collapse into a sphere.

    But reasoned arguments typically don't move conspiracy believers. In a sort of logical jujitsu, they use the very evidence mustered against them as further proof of just how cunning the plotters are. So what's the solution—and, more to the point, why even bother?
    Research shows that belief in conspiracy theories springs not from lack of information and certainly not lack of intelligence—it can take a first-rate mind to weave the exceedingly elaborate webs of deceit that believers sees in the world around them. The belief instead comes from a lack of trust—in institutions, in government, in industry, in politicians.

    "Many people don't trust the society around them, most notably the representatives of that society," Sutter writes. "That trust often falls even further when it comes to elite representatives of that society, which includes government officials, members of academia and scientists like me."

    But that trust can be restored. It takes honesty on the part of those in power, yes—something that is often in short supply. But it also takes listening and respect from the rest of us. Anti-vax parents may be wrong on the science, but they're right in their sincere—if misguided—effort to protect their children from what they perceive as harm. Climate change deniers or Apollo conspiracists might be wrong on the facts and the history, but they're right that too often the government and others in power don't give it to us straight. If no less an authority than an astrophysicist can take it easy on the flat-Earthers, maybe everyone can learn a little tolerance. All of us have equal claim to call the Earth our shared home, after all—even if not all of us could properly draw a picture of it.
    —Jeffrey Kluger
    Adam, I agree with all of that with a caveat. I know one hardcore conspiracy theorist who is mistrustful of 'official' expanations by default. Even when formal institutions are transparent and give him exactly what he wants, he will actively look for things to be suspicious about. He is actively cynical about almost all social interactions and spends considerable time finding secret motivations, even when those motivations would be stupid and counterintuitive. He is not depressed or schizophrenic—actually, he's depressed now because he messed up his life, but he wasn't always.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sol View Post
    USA is the force which spreads this dirt in the world, making people morally crazy and not happy.
    Yeah, especially Hollywood. Pure trash that rots the soul. No wonder 1 out of 4 people in the US is mentally ill.

    Netflix too.. that recent "Cuties" movie fiasco.. smh. These are just some minor examples.

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    Quote Originally Posted by inumbra View Post
    yes I think this argument applies here as well. Why have more center left people embraced it? Because the right is showing why it's necessary through their increasingly on display racism and inciting of racial violence. Also through their stubbornness in which they won't admit that no things are not all equal for everyone in this nation. Everyone after all needs to pull themselves up by their bootstraps and if you can't because you started in a 50 foot hole as opposed to many others who start out in a five foot hole, it's your fault. It's also your fault if you finally pull yourself up a good 10 feet only to be kicked down another 20 by an outside force.

    This is all why focusing on only ones own side is a bad idea because ones own side in an intensely divided nation is what ends up creating the worst in the opposing side. It's like being stuck in a chamber in which water is sent to ricochet off the walls. With each ricochet the wave is more forceful, and eventually its speed and destructive power will rip through and kill everyone in the chamber. Instead of viewing it as a system, one just looks at their end of the chamber enjoying the destruction the wave sends to the other side... until it comes back at them even stronger.

    Anyway I see BLM as a mixed bag. They are correct that all things are not equal and that black people have been screwed over. It's not right, it's not fair, it's inhumane. And it has disadvantaged countless people and destroyed lives. And I agree BLM comes from the position of a group oppressed.

    However, things like white people should give their houses to people of color are views I find extreme and disagree with. For one it seems to assume that there are not a ton of poor white people who can't afford a house to begin with. For two it perpetuates a zero sum game (I believe people like AOC would refer to it as scarcity mindset although not in this context of course). It's the belief in the zero sum game that fuels white fear and causes white people to dig their heels in to keep the existing system. And taking houses from one person to give to another rather than addressing the rampant economic inequality isn't IMO how to solve anything.

    As for your previous post, he may lead the entire nation as president, but he doesn't represent it. He increasingly paints the entire left as enemies. It's like he wants a civil war. He has no interest in compromises between opposites. It's possible sure, but not a possibility he's interested in. He likes pitting half the nation against the other half.

    ETA: I think there may be a narcissism issue in the woke movement (https://reason.com/2020/07/07/narcis...ays-study/?amp), however it would be a mistake to assume the majority of those in the movement are extremists... I imagine most people are simply aware they got a bad deal and it's hurting them and their loved ones.
    Well, generating total chaos and then appearing to be like a cure even as the only option is probably desirable for him. The only way to fully reunite two pieces full of cracks and debris in between them is to fully break them apart then try to rebuild. I don’t think the left and right would have been able to unite themselves anyway, regardless of Trump’s behavior.

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    Quote Originally Posted by xerxe View Post
    Adam, I agree with all of that with a caveat. I know one hardcore conspiracy theorist who is mistrustful of 'official' expanations by default. Even when formal institutions are transparent and give him exactly what he wants, he will actively look for things to be suspicious about. He is actively cynical about almost all social interactions and spends considerable time finding secret motivations, even when those motivations would be stupid and counterintuitive. He is not depressed or schizophrenic—actually, he's depressed now because he messed up his life, but he wasn't always.
    Now, how could a guy with those characteristics mess up his own life, @xerxe?

    For the record, I think that Godel starved himself to death because he was afraid of being poisoned.



    *** Not every sparrow is saved. ***

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    Quote Originally Posted by sbbds View Post
    Well, generating total chaos and then appearing to be like a cure even as the only option is probably desirable for him. The only way to fully reunite two pieces full of cracks and debris in between them is to fully break them apart then try to rebuild. I don’t think the left and right would have been able to unite themselves anyway, regardless of Trump’s behavior.
    the way I see it is the left and the right are supposed to complement one another and work together for the nation and its people as a whole. The current polarization basically means the nation has turned to its own destruction by basically cannibalising itself. It's not that different from a self-destructive person tearing themselves apart and ruining all their prospects.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Adam Strange View Post
    Now, how could a guy with those characteristics mess up his own life, @xerxe?

    For the record, I think that Godel starved himself to death because he was afraid of being poisoned.
    I think that some people are naturally conspiratorial because <insert explanation that involves neurotransmitters>. My acquaintance's condition is also exacerbated by an emotional need to set himself apart from the herd (which is also quite common). Having privileged access to the 'truth' means that you're somehow better and that everyone else is a normie moron.


    *** Not every sparrow is saved. ***
    Correct. I remember one CEO telling me that ~10% of your customers will always find a reason to be unhappy with your product, and that you should basically give them the bum's rush.

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    Quote Originally Posted by inumbra View Post
    the way I see it is the left and the right are supposed to complement one another and work together for the nation and its people as a whole. The current polarization basically means the nation has turned to its own destruction by basically cannibalising itself. It's not that different from a self-destructive person tearing themselves apart and ruining all their prospects.
    RIP I guess. Idk I still don’t think Trump did that much. It was probably inevitable anyway. And I think Trump is probably more capable than most around him of fixing it when all hell breaks loose.

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    Quote Originally Posted by inumbra View Post
    the way I see it is the left and the right are supposed to complement one another and work together for the nation and its people as a whole. The current polarization basically means the nation has turned to its own destruction by basically cannibalising itself. It's not that different from a self-destructive person tearing themselves apart and ruining all their prospects.
    Imagine someone with dissociative identity disorder.. where every identity is violently struggling for control.

    A house divided against itself cannot stand..

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    He's a scumbag, if you think he will lead you to God or anything remotely spiritual, you need to reasses your values.


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    Quote Originally Posted by shotgunfingers View Post
    Yeah, especially Hollywood.
    It's common that mass medias are significantly used for propaganda, controlled by governments and other power/money holders. Individualism predisposes to hating. And "western" medias have much of information to inspire negative emotions to people and to the world, to stimulate primitive instincts and interests.
    The example are "news" which gather all shit from the world, while that may don't even touch your life, and also they miss many of the good what happens near alike intentionally. They create negative emotional states. Why? When people feel badly they unconsciously suppose a lack of resources and are harder to support others - they ruin collectiveness in people. Also it's emotional terrorism to supress the masses psychically - people feel lesser optimism to express own interests and wishes.

    About USA is interesting, that many ones don't notice that individualistic-materialistic ideology of capitalism, propaganded much from that country, and Christianity are in opposing. Individualism is the essence of other - of Satanism. People claim themselves as Christians or having respect to it, and in the same time mainly live by opposited ideology. Due to egocentric and competing attitudes are full of hate to other people, to the world, have the lack of love even to own families. Materialism is also strong and it's far from Christianity ideas.
    When USA says about God it's supposed European tradition of Christianity. It's ignored that capitalism is close to Satanism and what USA does is close to Nazism.

    > No wonder 1 out of 4 people in the US is mentally ill.

    I saw close evaluations of ~20% of people having traits clinically fiting to psycher disoders. That was calculated in USA or European countries in 20th century. It's about formal medics criterias.
    The problem can be wider. I'd say as the criterion of mental health can be taken emotional state: the more harmony with yourself, the healthier - the happier you feel. Strong individualistic attitude is among reasons which predispose to negative emotions to other people and to anything. On human's person level and due to what happens in a society. At least should be so for majority of people, as they psychically are collective beings. Normal people's psyche needs _good_ relations with other people, a state of love with others. Individualism is the problem of many places besides USA and the lack of happiness should be global problem.

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    Serious Left-Static Negativist Eliza Thomason's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by End View Post
    ... those of us below the age of 50 will live to see the great schism healed and ....the one true holy and apostolic church assumes its truest form. One holy church, proclaiming the faith, in absolute opposition to the works of Satan. ...
    Yes all the schisms will be healed by the time of the soon coming era of Peace. There has to be a purge of evil first obviously, and that will happen with the all the difficult events leading up to the ultimate purge in the Three Days of Darkness, which is immediately followed by the dawn of the new and glorious Era of Peace - that time when the greatest prayer of Our Lord and of Christians will finally be realized, "Thy Kingdom come, Thy will be done, on earth, as it is in Heaven." We have only seen tastes of this on earth, in the lives of holy people, like especially in the lives of Saints. Likewise, in the new time, Jesus will reign as King in the hearts of man.

    Your "under age 50" implies you think this is at least about 30 years away. I think it is much, much closer. I think this is the best timeline there is, which I have linked here on The16T before: (includes no dates): https://www.countdowntothekingdom.com/timeline/

    Seal 1 has been open and Seals 2-5 are either already opened or anyone can obviously see they are poised to open. I think this election will be a catalyst for opening those seals. I think BLM, that baby of the Democratic party, will be the key instrument in rapidly opening the 2nd through 5th seals, for sure. I do think the seals will open in rapid succession. Also that is my hope. Because those seals precede the Warning, that great grace of God for all mankind. (In The Warning will all experience shock and awe, and for a few the shock will be too much and they will die of the shock. For that reason I think it will help to have at least a bit of respect for God right now, wherever one's heart is. Any tiny effort to give that respect now I think we will be eternally grateful for.)

    This is all going to happen in whatever God's time is, but I believe the order of events is given us very clearly. But I don't think in thirty years, End. I don't think God is going to allow the slaughter of 11,000 innocents a day to continue much longer, nor so many poor children growing up deprived of the knowledge of God, nor the continued increase of evil in our Godless society. IMO, Justice and Mercy will not allow it.

    We are going to reap what we have sown, soon. Bad things are going to happen. But I truly believe that how we vote in this election has the possibility of easing some of this justice for us in America. Do we want what God wants, or are we against it?

    That is why this election is a major spiritual battle between good and evil. We now have the most pro-life president, ever. He is running against extreme pro-abortionists. This is in a time when the slaughter of the most innocent is more prevalent than ever. How much longer will God allow the slaughter of innocents before he intervenes? Not long, we know. Murder of innocents is one of the four sins that Cry out to Heaven. Obviously they are crying out to Heaven now. The cry of these sins causes God to intervene in the course of human events. He will intervene.

    If anyone thinks LIFE is not the most important issue to God in this election, they have their heads in the sand. Or some dark recess.

    This is imminent, End. You should be praying a rosary every day for peace and blessing around this election, with the rest of the faithful Catholics. Join us. America needs you.
    "A man with a definite belief always appears bizarre, because he does not change with the world; he has climbed into a fixed star, and the earth whizzes below him like a zoetrope."
    ........ G. ........... K. ............... C ........ H ........ E ...... S ........ T ...... E ........ R ........ T ........ O ........ N ........


    "Having a clear faith, based on the creed of the Church, is often labeled today as fundamentalism... Whereas relativism, which is letting oneself be tossed and swept along
    by every wind of teaching, looks like the only
    attitude acceptable to today's standards."
    - Pope Benedict the XVI, "The Dictatorship of Relativism"

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    Guys, it's true. If you don't get good with God and vote for Trump, God's anger will destroy us all. Better yet, now is the perfect time to follow God's path, for only the saved will enter the kingdom of heaven when the rapture hits. And the rapture is coming if you don't vote Trump.

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    Yes and all this seal opening is naturally only happening in the US in response to things happening in the US as though the US is the only place on Earth, nay it is the entire Earth.

    It's as though this is coming from the imagination of Americans...

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    Quote Originally Posted by Grendel View Post
    And randos from the asscrack of Finland and Australia and other irrelevant deserts seem to stick their nose in on american politics even though it's not theirs. You don't see americans nosing in and opinion on their politics. It's everyone else who puts usa in the spotlight. Would be nice if we didn't have to be responsible for everyone and everything for a change.
    USA is the beacon of God and so they all look to us. And it's our responsibility to guide the world. USA is like Pope of the world and the world is watching and we have to do God's work.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Grendel View Post
    And randos from the asscrack of Finland and Australia and other irrelevant deserts seem to stick their nose in on american politics even though it's not theirs. You don't see americans nosing in and opinion on their politics. It's everyone else who puts usa in the spotlight. Would be nice if we didn't have to be responsible for everyone and everything for a change.
    well I suppose American politics take up a lot of space on the world stage and the US interferes greatly with other nations and had great influence on the world forcing people to pay attention to it.. but that doesn't mean all this seal opening has to be so.. American

    Although I may have missed this is the God of America actually operating in America alone

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    Quote Originally Posted by xerxe View Post
    I don't think that feminists and BLM want men to go away. But let's just agree to disagree.
    Not actually go away, of course. You have some usefulness to them. Just, shrink down, and be far, far less of who you truly are.
    Last edited by Eliza Thomason; 09-12-2020 at 08:49 PM.
    "A man with a definite belief always appears bizarre, because he does not change with the world; he has climbed into a fixed star, and the earth whizzes below him like a zoetrope."
    ........ G. ........... K. ............... C ........ H ........ E ...... S ........ T ...... E ........ R ........ T ........ O ........ N ........


    "Having a clear faith, based on the creed of the Church, is often labeled today as fundamentalism... Whereas relativism, which is letting oneself be tossed and swept along
    by every wind of teaching, looks like the only
    attitude acceptable to today's standards."
    - Pope Benedict the XVI, "The Dictatorship of Relativism"

    .
    .
    .


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    Quote Originally Posted by Eliza Thomason View Post
    we are pretty global already. Anything that has a massive impact on us has impact on the rest of the world.
    I also expect any visit from aliens will be in America, I've seen so many American movies about that. It has nothing to do with how for many Americans, America is the center of their world... Nor does it have anything to do with how people have trouble grasping just how big and complex the world is as their world inside their heads is so much smaller

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    Quote Originally Posted by shotgunfingers View Post
    Imagine someone with dissociative identity disorder.. where every identity is violently struggling for control.

    A house divided against itself cannot stand.
    Left and right have never been more fused... both now consume exactly the same things but one side spins it as positive, the other negative. It's almost a parody... debate is just one side stating what the other believes in. Completely absent on both sides is the ability to resist (in the basic sense of refusing to be drawn in the spectacle). Both the left and the right want to believe in the reality of this great struggle over society, but both are just being played by the ruling class (which is really just the government, if we formally recognized all the relevant institutions), which just gets whatever it wants.

    It's hard to say for sure whether anyone will step up and do something, but I think failed state status is assured at this point. (。-ω-)ノ




  38. #78
    Serious Left-Static Negativist Eliza Thomason's Avatar
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    @Nobody you really have a fixation on this rapture thing. It can be an interesting side topic. Why don't you start a thread on it?

    @inumbra, we are pretty global already. Anything that has a massive impact on us has impact on the rest of the world.
    "A man with a definite belief always appears bizarre, because he does not change with the world; he has climbed into a fixed star, and the earth whizzes below him like a zoetrope."
    ........ G. ........... K. ............... C ........ H ........ E ...... S ........ T ...... E ........ R ........ T ........ O ........ N ........


    "Having a clear faith, based on the creed of the Church, is often labeled today as fundamentalism... Whereas relativism, which is letting oneself be tossed and swept along
    by every wind of teaching, looks like the only
    attitude acceptable to today's standards."
    - Pope Benedict the XVI, "The Dictatorship of Relativism"

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  39. #79
    Serious Left-Static Negativist Eliza Thomason's Avatar
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    @inumbra, yes, we love alien lore in our country especially. I don't think "aliens" will have anything to do with this. Except as an invented explanation of the genuinely supernatural.

    Yes it is a big and complex world. Hard to believe that we could end up with a one world government, and one world religion, as is pushed as well as predicted. It will take some force, won't it? Forced equality for all the slaves of the elite rulers.
    "A man with a definite belief always appears bizarre, because he does not change with the world; he has climbed into a fixed star, and the earth whizzes below him like a zoetrope."
    ........ G. ........... K. ............... C ........ H ........ E ...... S ........ T ...... E ........ R ........ T ........ O ........ N ........


    "Having a clear faith, based on the creed of the Church, is often labeled today as fundamentalism... Whereas relativism, which is letting oneself be tossed and swept along
    by every wind of teaching, looks like the only
    attitude acceptable to today's standards."
    - Pope Benedict the XVI, "The Dictatorship of Relativism"

    .
    .
    .


  40. #80
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    My sarcasm has failed

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