What physical features do you find attractive?

[Olimpia]

I have to admit, I love his face. Somehow.
Btw, I believe he is most likely SEE-Fi.

 

[chrys]

Traps are the best <3

[Beautiful sky]

I don't know this guy, and I usually refrain from V.I, but he seems "soft" to me (especially his facial expression). Not like a guy with 4D Te+Se.
He actually reminds me more of ESI E9 guys.

No. He's LSE

[huiheiwufhawriuhg]

<3 one of my favorite LSE actors

He is a cutie <3 . I really liked his character in Under the Dome, though he was more SLE there than LSE there.

[huiheiwufhawriuhg]

Traps are the best <3

HOT!

[Olimpia]

What does "Trap" mean in this context, btw?

[Adam Strange]

What does "Trap" mean in this context, btw?

In this context, it means a "convincing transvestite". A person who looks like a woman, but is only discovered to be a male when you get them home. Hence, "trap".

I guess. I could be wrong about this. Chryssie might be a better source of info on this topic.

[chrys]

Yep exactly that! Though I believe you'd consider him a crossdresser rather than a trap given that his physique has qualities of both genders rather than seeming female.

Basically what I like most are male reproductive systems x a female's hormonal makeup, the actual gender and/or sex matters less. I'm still into females, but I'm not naturally attracted to the "ideal" male, if ideal is defined as y'know, someone with lots of testosterone and it shows.

[Olimpia]

Basically what I like most are male reproductive systems x a female's hormonal makeup, the actual gender and/or sex matters less. I'm still into females, but I'm not naturally attracted to the "ideal" male, if ideal is defined as y'know, someone with lots of testosterone and it shows.

When I read this for the first time, my mind was just like .
Haha. May I ask what you define your sexual orientation as, and what you identify your own gender as?

I guess my taste is pretty simple in comparison: Someone who looks and smells like a guy, and has the hormonal makeup of a guy.
I simply want... a guy. Haha.

Women can be beautiful, sure, but I would never want to date one.

[chrys]

When I read this for the first time, my mind was just like .
Haha. May I ask what you define your sexual orientation as, and what you identify your own gender as?

I guess my taste is pretty simple in comparison: Someone who looks and smells like a guy, and has the hormonal makeup of a guy.
I simply want... a guy. Haha.

Women can be beautiful, sure, but I would never want to date one.

Hehe for most people I'll just say "Bisexual" to make things simple, even though the male half represented in that sexuality is subject to way more restrictions than most actual bisexuals. I think the most accurate term for my sexuality is "Femmesexual." Basically the sexual attraction towards anyone with traits that align more with femininity (whether male or female or whatever)... this only applies physically for me though, behaviourally I actually find masculinity and displays of dominance in both males and females very appealing still, so tomboys are still loveable.~

I'm a MTF, or at least am going to be. I'll still refer to myself as male on the internet to the general public just because I don't want people trying to be friendly to me just because I'm "female" and coming to realize I'm not what they expected and getting pissed at me because their ulterior motives of trying to get a gf were completely obliterated. (which tends to happen ._.). At least if I give off feminine vibes through the way I type and my choices of avatar yet also superficially identify as "male", then people who aren't comfortable with or expecting non-gender normative stuff won't even bother or will just ask for clarification on my gender, while those who don't mind and are curious will get to know me and there'll be no problems, so everything is good either way. :3

[Olimpia]

Hehe for most people I'll just say "Bisexual" to make things simple, even though the male half represented in that sexuality is subject to way more restrictions than most actual bisexuals. I think the most accurate term for my sexuality is "Femmesexual." Basically the sexual attraction towards anyone with traits that align more with femininity (whether male or female or whatever)... this only applies physically for me though, behaviourally I actually find masculinity and displays of dominance in both males and females very appealing still, so tomboys are still loveable.~

I'm a MTF, or at least am going to be. I'll still refer to myself as male on the internet to the general public just because I don't want people trying to be friendly to me just because I'm "female" and coming to realize I'm not what they expected and getting pissed at me because their ulterior motives of trying to get a gf were completely obliterated. (which tends to happen ._.). At least if I give off feminine vibes through the way I type and my choices of avatar yet also superficially identify as "male", then people who aren't comfortable with or expecting non-gender normative stuff won't even bother or will just ask for clarification on my gender, while those who don't mind and are curious will get to know me and there'll be no problems, so everything is good either way. :3

Interesting... That is all pretty complex.
So your gender expression is or will be mostly feminine, too?

[Olimpia]

I have found this simple overview in regards to what kind of physical characteristics you'd like your ideal mate/partner to have.
"3" means it is a must-have or very important to you, "2" means it is desirable or a want, "1" means you don't really care for it.
At "Others" you can add more traits that aren't on the general list, but are still important for you.

[3] Attractive face
[2] Attractive hands
​[3] Attractive hair
[2.5] Attractive figure
[3] Attractive smile
[2.5] Muscular build
[1.5] Taller than me*
[2.5] Sexy
[1.5] Thin-med. build**
[2] Med.-large build**
[2] Healthy teeth
[2] Nice eyes
[1.5] Long Legs
[1.5] Fair complexion
[3] Stylish dresser
[3] As attractive as me
Others: No facial hair [2.5], Brown or Black hair [2.5], Broad(er) shoulders [3]

* I am fine with him being as tall as I am, as long as his build is a bit more muscular. Generally I value a muscular physique much more than height.
** I am neither into a Thin or a Large build (I like Medium), but if I had to choose between the two I'd go with Large.

[Persephone]

I have found this simple overview in regards to what kind of physical characteristics you'd like your ideal mate/partner to have.
"3" means it is a must-have or very important to you, "2" means it is desirable or a want, "1" means you don't really care for it.
At "Others" you can add more traits that aren't on the general list, but are still important for you.

[3] Attractive face
[2] Attractive hands
​[3] Attractive hair
[2.5] Attractive figure
[3] Attractive smile
[2.5] Muscular build
[1.5] Taller than me*
[2.5] Sexy
[1.5] Thin-med. build**
[2] Med.-large build**
[2] Healthy teeth
[2] Nice eyes
[1.5] Long Legs
[1.5] Fair complexion
[3] Stylish dresser
[3] As attractive as me
Others: No facial hair [2.5], Brown or Black hair [2.5], Broad(er) shoulders [3]

* I am fine with him being as tall as I am, as long as his build is a bit more muscular. Generally I value a muscular physique much more than height.
** I am neither into a Thin or a Large build (I like Medium), but if I had to choose between the two I'd go with Large.

This seems quite weird and female evaluation oriented (long legs??? Not the first thing I think of when I meet a guy)
Sexy? What is this evaluation?

[Olimpia]

This seems quite weird and female evaluation oriented (long legs??? Not the first thing I think of when I meet a guy)
Sexy? What is this evaluation?

Haha yeah, some seem to be more geared towards women, while the muscular build option seems rather male focused. I have found this overview on some sociology site. I think the list tried to appeal both to men and women.
I am also not sure how sexy can be evaluated exactly. But some people exude a "sultry" aura, I suppose, and that can sometimes show in their looks, like long lashes or something.

[Adam Strange]

Yep exactly that! Though I believe you'd consider him a crossdresser rather than a trap given that his physique has qualities of both genders rather than seeming female.

Basically what I like most are male reproductive systems x a female's hormonal makeup, the actual gender and/or sex matters less. I'm still into females, but I'm not naturally attracted to the "ideal" male, if ideal is defined as y'know, someone with lots of testosterone and it shows.

Sounds like you'd like a girl who's got everything.

[Persephone]

Haha yeah, some seem to be more geared towards women, while the muscular build option seems rather male focused. I have found this overview on some sociology site. I think the list tried to appeal both to men and women.
I am also not sure how sexy can be evaluated exactly. But some people exude a "sultry" aura, I suppose, and that can sometimes show in their looks, like long lashes or something.

Made me smile. I don't think long lashes is something everyone would identify with being sultry. Muscular build is also female focused, the difference is that it is very hard for a woman to get ripped, so what I understand by muscular women is not a Hulk in a skirt, but just a very fit woman. Basically like this http://www.designscene.net/2014/04/s...mmer-2014.html
What is nice eyes? A person will think they are nice and another they are not. In short, a huge part of this is very subjective and actually hopefully it is because tastes differ.

Now I will evaluate one of a persons I had a really huge crush on from my subjective point of view, with comments

[1.5] Attractive face Not attractive in a conventional way
[3] Attractive hands they were twice larger than mine
​[1] Attractive hair He had like 1.5 mm hair on his head
[3] Attractive figure What do you mean by attractive figure? Overall impression?
[3] Attractive smile What is attractive to one is creepy to another
[3] Muscular build I think he was around 11% fat, a lot of sports
[3] Taller than me* that was the case
[3] Sexy I was for sure seeing him as sexy
[0.5] Thin-med. build**
[3] Med.-large build** for sure
[2] Healthy teeth I haven't looked precisely into his mouth but they did not look rotten from the first sight
[3] Nice eyes They actually were very small but very sparkling, very short blonde lashes. What is nice eyes anyway? Again, subjective I guess
[3] Long Legs Sure he was almost 2m
[1] Fair complexion He was white as toilets... I did not really care
[1] Stylish dresser No style, a very common way to dress like neutral t-shirt/jeans
[3] As attractive as me, I surely was seeing him as attractive as me
Others: No facial hair [2.5] He wasn't a very hairy type but I really did not care
Brown or Black hair [0], he was blonde but any other colour of hair would be OK
Broad(er) shoulders [3] for sure knowing the overall build

[yeves]

Traps are the best <3

are @Eris and @rogue traps?

[chrys]

are @Eris and @rogue traps?

xDD nope not at all, they'd most likely be offended by being called such tbh, they wanna be tough masculine Betas AFAIK. Though I know @Eris does cross the gender normative line with his occasional crossdressing.~ I've seen him wearing Satan themed panties and knee high socks before. @~@

I've never met a trap before, though I've dated two femboys.

[yeves]

xDD nope not at all, they'd most likely be offended by being called such tbh, they wanna be tough masculine Betas AFAIK. Though I know @Eris does cross the gender normative line with his occasional crossdressing.~ I've seen him wearing Satan themed panties and knee high socks before. @~@

I've never met a trap before, though I've dated two femboys.

@Eris is the epitome of Satan-inspired masculinity if you ask me

http://www.the16types.info/vbulletin...=1#post1135391

[Chae]

Attraction to specific sexual characteristics: Not my cup of tea, I'm sort of pansexual
I usually go by gut feeling when it comes to (bodily) attraction. Which takes a lot of time to develop anyway - I am generally oblivious.

To get my instant attention, one has to set up and frantically wave a 30 ft tall banner with their body printed on it while screaming their head off.
But yes, once I'm actually looking, I paradoxically have one surefire cause of death - T H I C K T H I G H S. A lot of my duals have em so that's not surprising at all?

Trained or natural, shapely or not, firm or soft, with or without cellulite, in proportion to the calves or not, bigger or smaller than the hips - don't care, they're my aesthetic kryptonite and gorgeous wonders of nature, R.I.P.



I am... fiGUratiVEly... dECEAsed...

On a more serious note, I get how some people are extremely self-conscious and ashamed of them. They fear that the greater the diameter or the softer the tissue, the lower their (often sexual) worth. I always think, if only they would love them like I do - but I can just do as much as praise, hoping that they realize their inherent perfection™ on their own some day. Call me weird and cheesy, coming along someone who says that they accept their big thighs is really wonderful. To me, self-acceptance is the new ~attractive~. People of the T-tribe: media messages (illusory advertisements...), celebrity culture, `health´ propaganda that exploits your insecurities monetarily, they currently matter in this world, but in fact, they are insignificant. Unless your wellbeing is truly concerned, there's nothing to fix, no standard to adhere to. That holds true for your whole body, which doesn't even determine your entirety. Look for messages like these instead, you are loved a lot. But I have to stop lecturing now, oh dear... 100% worth it ♥

[jaein]

mostly i like dark haired guys/women. i don't think i've ever crushed on a blonde—and i don't like "jcpenney model" conventionally attractive, if that makes sense. they're just so nondescript, like human mannequins. i can appreciate their aesthetic beauty but i feel nothing looking at them. that's why i like adrien's nose... it builds character. joaquin's scar too. yes they're still attractive, but with their own individual uniqueness. otherwise i don't have many other preferences... clean shaven perhaps?

i have a huge crush on adrien brody and also joaquin phoenix (younger... he's something else now)

 

Attachment 7966
Attachment 7967

 

Attachment 7968
Attachment 7969
Attachment 7970

also christian bale, especially when he's looking serious... and in his american psycho days. the character turns me off but i like his chiseled lük there.

 

Attachment 7974
Attachment 7973
Attachment 7972
Attachment 7971

as women go, twin peaks era sherilyn fenn. i aspire to be her

 

Attachment 7975
Attachment 7976
Attachment 7977

also morena baccarin, with her short hair

 

Attachment 7980
Attachment 7981
Attachment 7982

I tried to explain this to my sister and she just didnt get it. Im gonna show your post to her maybe it'll click haha

[Chae]

yes, me too! muscular thighs slay me.

in general i find myself intrigued by unconventional physical characteristics, i think it's very appealing to stand out from the typical normative looks. i've never understood the fixation with conventionally pretty faces, i am all about diversity, especially for women. there are so many possibilities for beauty other than Megan Fox lookalike. not to say there's anything wrong with her looks or that she's not attractive, i just tire of the same old beauty standards. it's not even a fair representation of what most women actually look like.

Louder!!

[Chae]

A very important aspect of your argument @hag is probably that these standards make people change their originally beautiful looks in order to attain something completely out of reach, something so specific that it only applies to a select few. 7.4 billion people... and only 30 super models that meet the ideal. I always think that it sounds pessimistic to say that comparison kills but in a lot of cases (plastic surgery, eating disorders) it really does. Beauty has to be limitless and in some parts of the world this diversity is still untouched. But the majority of humanity is caught in a trap.

Numbering people's attractiveness (being a 10 or not et cetera) is just one spin-off. It's so subjective and gendered that it's actually hilarious. We are more than 10 numbers, come on.

Also, as you imply, our natural tastes are modified. Thighs, in our example, aren't actually unconventional. From an evolutionary perspective, they should matter a lot in mate selection. Strength, stamina, sexual prowess, health, speed in case of fight/flight, literal steadfastness: thighs disclose it all. I am disappointed by ads that shame people with larger ones just to gain money, pretending that thin ones make them desirable while the opposite should be and IS the case biologically, the thirst is real on social media. It's the lies that make me angry. The fashion industry, of course, supports these ads by producing pieces that only fit our 30 aforementioned ideal types, although there are exceptions.
You are correct, diversity in women is (self-)policed and we are far away from having real sexual bodies, blame the creation of a fantasy woman in pornography (I plan to write my Bachelor thesis on this topic, to sum it up: The issue is cash). Yes please, the entire body matters. If a person loves ears, toenails, birth marks, shoulder blades, disabilities (yep), asymmetrical breasts, dimples, elbows, stretch marks or whatever, why ridicule their common sense, nothing about that is deviant. Sadly, cultural beauty values are deeply ingrained in our psyche: People think I'm joking when I say that I appreciate six-packs and soft stomachs equally. And get called perverted when stating that knees and veins are lovely parts of the body. If loving what keeps a person alive is perverted, I want to be as perverted as possible.

[Gypsy]

I like men with "sharper"/vulpine facial features. Few examples below.

(I'm not sure how to title my spoilers ...sorry )

Lee Pace (esp. as King Thranduil)

Tom Hiddleston (esp. as Loki)

Cillian Murphy

Gerard Butler as the Phantom of the Opera

Cameron Monaghan (Eehhh look, finally a guy my age lol)

Sebastian Stan

Jensen Ackles

Richard Armitage

Francois TElombre (French alt model)

But I also find these guys attractive. They're kinda "nerdy" looking by some standard but I think they are absolutely adorable.

Adam Driver (Yes, the actor that played Kylo Ren)

Robin Lord Taylor

Cory Michael Smith

And for the hell of it, I'm throwing in one video game character since the animation is so life-like.

Jacob Frye, Assassin's Creed: Syndicate

I'll give a free cookie to anyone who takes the time to VI these guys.

[Gypsy]

Also,

Facial features attract me much more than body. I've had crushes on men of varying sizes and even heights. I had a crush on a guy lat semester who I swear was nearly a foot shorter and was skinny as a twig lol. But I've also had a crush on a guy who was about my height and had a bit of a belly even. He had longish, shaggy brown hair, a bit of facial scruff, soft blue eyes, and though he barely talks he has a very sweet face in contrast to most of the men above who have more "piercing" gazes.

[End]

I try not to focus on physical features past a certain point. Pretty much any girl (i.e. 95 percent if not more) can hit the 6-7 out of ten mark if they put in the effort. As I keep saying because it is absolutely true, there are no "ugly" women, only lazy ones. Ugly women (i.e. those who are below 6 out of 10 appearance wise) are lazy, thus not worth any intelligent male's time. Who the hell dreams of marrying a lazy partner? Anyone? C'mon, we all want a significant other who puts in effort. A relationship, a healthy one, is all about give and take. If one side takes but never gives, well, I wouldn't call that a positive relationship. Sadly it's becoming common and we wonder why society is going to shit. Shit home, shit kids, shit adults, shit society. Not hard to figure out, but I digress.

A pretty enough face, a healthy enough looking body, a set of teeth that is mostly full, eyes that strike one as those seeking a deep well in need of diving into and/or eyes that are deep wells that draw all who look upon them into itself... All is well within the realm of attainment for pretty much any partner. If they do not attain them then something fucked them up. An abusive parent, a crazed SJW, etc. Basically, focus on the more psychological aspects of the relationship. Here's a good one, ask them if they feel "worthy" of you on the first date. Not if they're "good enough", not if they "deserve" you. No, merely that they feel "worthy" of a good Significant Other. I forget the person who did the study but she said that in the instances of the "worthy" people she found the most happy and fulfilling marriages and LTR's. Thus, approach the subject from the angle of worthiness. Be worthy, act worthy, and you stand a greater chance at happiness.

[Joy]

I'm sure I already posted at least a couple of times in this thread, but I can't be bothered to look for it. For me, attraction to personality typically comes before physical attraction, and I can be physically attracted to a wide variety of appearances. If I have a weakness for any particular physical traits, it's for tall, skinny guy (especially if they're geeky!) and girls with perky little B cups. My top turn offs aren't physical traits. Top turns offs are being a shitty person (mean, dishonest, egomaniac, etc.), masculinity, use of hard drugs, and a preference for being sexually dominant.

[Joy]

also, i don't know if this counts as a physical attribute, but by far one of the most attractive things to me is an incredible voice or accent. elegant voices really capture my attention, especially baritones.

You would swoon for @Holon

[Chae]

you're absolutely right! attractiveness is a very nuanced concept, no one can be called objectively attractive, yet our image of beauty has been reduced to a few narrow physical characteristics. physical preferences are strongly influenced by media and trends, much as some will deny it. did you know that black-dyed teeth used to be a popular and attractive look in Japan, decades ago? it's just one example of the capricious nature of what we call "attractive".

it's really sad to see how young women are affected by this unattainable "ideal" of what a women should look like, according to mainstream society. my preteen self definitely struggled with it. teenagers are often physically awkward and still very juvenile, but the only representation i saw of teenage girls in media were unrealistically beautiful (and additionally, too old to be playing 13-16 year old girls. for example Mean Girls, the leading actresses were in their 20's!) which made me feel as if i were ugly, defective somehow, when in reality i was completely fine developmentally. the pressure to look 'pretty' is real and damaging to young girls.

yes, the issue truly is profit. cosmetic brands make millions off of this "ideal" they promote; anti-aging is one particular facet of it. women cannot age with dignity, apparently. they capitalize off of subliminally making women feel insecure with their advertising. however, their advertising is changing to suit cultural trends—it's all about being "empowered" now. same basic marketing technique, but with a different superficial package. here is a good article about it.

i'm familiar with porn discourse. this may be a controversial stance, but i think porn distorts what should be a holistic and consensual experience, reducing it to a mere performance act to be consumed. listen to what porn actresses have to say about the industry, it's terrifying. there is legit rape and bodily exploitation involved. also, the popular "barely legal" category is something i take concern with. teenage girls are not a fetish, nor are they here for the sexual consumption of adults.

You basically summarized Naomi Wolf's "The Beauty Myth". And Andrea Dworkin's "Woman Hating", "Intercourse" and "Pornography: Men possessing Women" (her works are so radical that I was in denial afterwards, but in hindsight, she makes some good points as an insider). And true, what's considered attractive today is ugly tomorrow, and standards nowadays are only a tool of power and the economy. The only profession in which a woman earns more than a man is in porn, that describes all essence. Violent masochism for cash - that translates to many other parts of a female's life. What you describe is all part of rape culture, it hurts everyone involved.

But nobody is to blame because it all has developed a momentum of its own. Blaming doesn't change anything either. The only thing that we can do is spot how gender harms us and abandon gendered practise. A not so distant future promises the abolition of biological sex and reproduction but guess who orchestrates all of this, good ol´ patriarchy.

To me, the gender binary is the root cause, it links everything: racism, sexism, ableism, age and LGBTQIA+ discrimination... But we cannot collectively enforce the binary's invalidness. It's not practical. Starting with oneself is the best strategy; you and I have already started (analyzing the media, questioning the market and social roles...) like many others. We are the ones who bring the balance.

Degendering (aka de-objectification) isn't as difficult as it seems. I recently cut off my hair, trashed all my makeup articles and restrictive/uncomfortable/non-functional clothing. I finally told my parents that I won't marry and have kids, and that I'm not heterosexual. My budget and self-esteem skyrocketed, life is a lot easier now. I begin to stop seeing myelf though the eyes of others. Trivial, but even small steps work. I focus more on my interests and that makes me happy. I'm also working on my body language nowadays. Posture affects cognition and females are taught to make themselves smaller, this is also gendered practise that I currently transform. I see this counter-gender process in others as well and - in tune with the theme of this thread - I think it's very attractive. Treating each other as gendered stereotypes is so damaging, as you say, I don't think it's sexy anymore. Although I try hard to accept the people who have chosen that way. I can't change them, I can handle myself and they can handle themselves.

I don't think these stances are controversial, they resonated with me. I was born in 96... the "see what you did there"-Generation Z is on its way . Although we know very well who raised us and that we are basically our own agenda's target in order to promote new ways.

[ashlesha]

Degendering (aka de-objectification) isn't as difficult as it seems. I recently cut off my hair, trashed all my makeup articles and restrictive/uncomfortable/non-functional clothing. I finally told my parents that I won't marry and have kids, and that I'm not heterosexual. My budget and self-esteem skyrocketed, life is a lot easier now. I begin to stop seeing myelf though the eyes of others. Trivial, but even small steps work. I focus more on my interests and that makes me happy. I'm also working on my body language nowadays. Posture affects cognition and females are taught to make themselves smaller, this is also gendered practise that I currently transform.

*admiration*

[Joy]

To me, the gender binary is the root cause, it links everything: racism, sexism, ableism, age and LGBTQIA+ discrimination...

That's an interesting idea that I hadn't considered before. Why wouldn't it be the reverse? That gender binary is the result of sexism?

But we cannot collectively enforce the binary's invalidness. It's not practical. Starting with oneself is the best strategy; you and I have already started (analyzing the media, questioning the market and social roles...) like many others. We are the ones who bring the balance.

YES! Be the change.

Degendering (aka de-objectification) isn't as difficult as it seems. I recently cut off my hair, trashed all my makeup articles and restrictive/uncomfortable/non-functional clothing. I finally told my parents that I won't marry and have kids, and that I'm not heterosexual. My budget and self-esteem skyrocketed, life is a lot easier now. I begin to stop seeing myelf though the eyes of others. Trivial, but even small steps work. I focus more on my interests and that makes me happy. I'm also working on my body language nowadays. Posture affects cognition and females are taught to make themselves smaller, this is also gendered practise that I currently transform. I see this counter-gender process in others as well and - in tune with the theme of this thread - I think it's very attractive. Treating each other as gendered stereotypes is so damaging, as you say, I don't think it's sexy anymore. Although I try hard to accept the people who have chosen that way. I can't change them, I can handle myself and they can handle themselves.

Nice.

I've got a rather stormy relationship with the idea of gender itself (much less my own). There's this part of me that thinks that people should be free to express their own gender however it feels right for them. There's another part of me that just loathes the very existence of genders. There's also the matter of gender vs sex and what the difference is. Where does one end and the other begin?

[Chae]

That's an interesting idea that I hadn't considered before. Why wouldn't it be the reverse? That gender binary is the result of sexism?

I've got a rather stormy relationship with the idea of gender itself (much less my own). There's this part of me that thinks that people should be free to express their own gender however it feels right for them. There's another part of me that just loathes the very existence of genders. There's also the matter of gender vs sex and what the difference is. Where does one end and the other begin?

Your endorsement is so sweet :3 Well, males and females are not inherently sexist when they are born, discrimination is learned. Sexism was derived from gender roles because they created a power vacuum on the one side and excess on the other (due to the woman's ability to give birth, males created and seized all other positions of influence available). Gender binary first, sexism second. That's why I talked about reproduction reforms, they could really change the game. The current problem is to create artificial wombs that can actually raise a fetus. Fetus creation is possible already but sustenance outside of a natural uterus is complicated.

Sex = what genitals are there?
Gender = what do those genitals imply? (and this is where the whole mess begins)

We've come full circle: eliminating reproduction issues (genital issues, that is) could possibly solve the consecutive gender agony that you describe. Transhumanism is currently a hot topic in science but I don't know if humanity is ready for that without creating even more ruckus Ready or not, some change has to take place asap

[Chae]

*admiration*

Admiration is the emotion farthest from understanding - At first, I admired the bravery of others who started to change their habits as well. But going through that process myself I can say that it shouldn't really be a thing of courage.

Because that implies: You do it because of adversary. It's rather about a loving rediscovery of yourself, which is enlightening.
Going against the big bad society means going against yourself, there's a lot of fear... if you do it for your own sake it becomes fun and not an excruciating act of rebellion.

The society that is hated by one is used as an ally by the other - it depends on perspective!

[Tonatiuh]

Admiration is the emotion farthest from understanding - At first, I admired the bravery of others who started to change their habits as well. But going through that process myself I can say that it shouldn't really be a thing of courage.

Because that implies: You do it because of adversary. It's rather about a loving rediscovery of yourself, which is enlightening.
Going against the big bad society means going against yourself, there's a lot of fear... if you do it for your own sake it becomes fun and not an excruciating act of rebellion.

The society that is hated by one is used as an ally by the other - it depends on perspective!

Banzai Aizen Sama!

[Gypsy]

I like men with "sharper"/vulpine facial features. Few examples below.

(I'm not sure how to title my spoilers ...sorry )

Lee Pace (esp. as King Thranduil)

Tom Hiddleston (esp. as Loki)

Cillian Murphy

Gerard Butler as the Phantom of the Opera

Cameron Monaghan (Eehhh look, finally a guy my age lol)

Sebastian Stan

Jensen Ackles

Richard Armitage

Francois TElombre (French alt model)

But I also find these guys attractive. They're kinda "nerdy" looking by some standard but I think they are absolutely adorable.

Adam Driver (Yes, the actor that played Kylo Ren)

Robin Lord Taylor

Cory Michael Smith

And for the hell of it, I'm throwing in one video game character since the animation is so life-like.

Jacob Frye, Assassin's Creed: Syndicate

I'll give a free cookie to anyone who takes the time to VI these guys.

Anyone wanna do a quick VI of these guys? Mostly because I'm curious...

[Joy]

@Chae, I appreciate not wanting to carry a child in order to have one, and I think I understand the social implications to some extent... But as much as I fucking HATED pregnancy, I wouldn't give it up if I could. It's an experience, and it helped me bond with my children. And from my own personal perspective and value system:

Good reasons to incubate a baby artificially:

1.) Because I can't do it naturally
2.) Because I don't want to do it naturally

Bad reasons to incubate a baby artificially:

1.) Because men are jealous of my baby making abilities and take away my power
2.) Because other people expect me to


Nobody can take my power. I can give it, but they can't take it.


As for things like bras, high heels, hosiery, make up, and all the other uncomfortable, expensive, and time consuming things people do to enhance their natural appearance, I do them when/if I feel like it. I wear men's clothes about half the time and women's clothes about half the time, but I never think of them like that unless I'm having a moment of gratitude that it's so easy for me to wear dress (because they're comfortable) or make up (because it's fun to accentuate my eyes) since I was born with a vagina. When I wear clothes that show off some skin and flatter my figure, it's always for fun or (more likely) power. I don't wear such things because I think they're expected of me. I do what I want.

[Joy]

i like to wear makeup too, and for me wearing a bra is an absolute necessity, i don't have the privilege of going without one. i think if you're doing these things for self-expression's sake (as opposed to conformity, or to meet some imaginary expectation of beauty) then everything is fine! makeup and fashion can be art, as well as profound tools for self-expression. i don't oppose their abolition.

I do think it can be unclear for a lot of people why they're doing such things. I'm pretty sure most women would say they wear make because they want to, not because they thing men want them to. But idk.

also, why did you tell me i'd like @Holon? who is he...

he's a very good friend of mine, and the comment was based on the types of voices you like (:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aTMqpmUGgWE

[malna]

...and my ex horse riding instructor (they're very much alike)

[Mr inappropriate]

ass

[Tonatiuh]

I think I was bottle necked by the OP. I have so much to say but it's hard to find a point from which to start.