Results 1 to 34 of 34

Thread: How to make an ESFj happy

  1. #1
    Cosmic Teapot's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2017
    Location
    Germany
    TIM
    SLI-H sp/so
    Posts
    1,246
    Mentioned
    133 Post(s)
    Tagged
    2 Thread(s)

    Default How to make an ESFj happy

    They are so caring and genuinely like to make others comfortable and ask nothing in return.
    I don't want to be a freeloader. So what can I do to repay their efforts?
    What kind of gifts do they like and what would they find obtrusive?
    Where do they need help?
    An ESE friend of mine appreciates books about cognitive science but that's about the only thing I can provide and from my perspective that is nearly nothing.

    Help me @sorrowsofyoungwerther
    Last edited by Cosmic Teapot; 04-21-2017 at 05:19 PM.

  2. #2
    Minde's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2005
    Location
    Amongst the stars
    TIM
    EII/INFj E9w1sp
    Posts
    4,451
    Mentioned
    148 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Cosmic Teapot View Post
    They are so caring and genuinely like to make others comfortable and ask nothing in return.
    I don't want to be a freeloader. So what can I do to repay their efforts?
    What kind of gifts do they like and what would they find obtrusive?
    Where do they need help?
    An ESE friend of mine appreciates books about cognitive science but that's about the only thing I can provide and from my perspective that is nearly nothing.

    Help me @sorrowsofyoungwerther
    I have a very dear ESE friend and she has said she values my ability to get her to relax and slow down. I don't really try, but apparently this happens just by me being calm myself, and listening to her. When ESE are helpful, they seem to really enjoy watching the beneficial fruits of their labor. So if they give a gift, use it in front of them. If they help you get something done, relish aloud your satisfaction with what you did. If they teach you something, use it and tell them about how you're using it.

    They like when they are introduced to new ideas. So talking about random esoteric things can be rewarding for them. Like if you have bits of information you collected, and theories about those bits. Often they'll have their own theories about, well, everything, so they seem to enjoy when you humor them and listen, and add your own input.

    They can talk for forever, so sometimes just letting them talk and express themselves is a gift because not many people are that patient, lol.
    Oh, to find you in dreams - mixing prior, analog, and never-beens... facts slip and turn and change with little lucidity. except the strong, permeating reality of emotion.

  3. #3
    Cosmic Teapot's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2017
    Location
    Germany
    TIM
    SLI-H sp/so
    Posts
    1,246
    Mentioned
    133 Post(s)
    Tagged
    2 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Minde View Post
    I have a very dear ESE friend and she has said she values my ability to get her to relax and slow down. I don't really try, but apparently this happens just by me being calm myself, and listening to her. When ESE are helpful, they seem to really enjoy watching the beneficial fruits of their labor. So if they give a gift, use it in front of them. If they help you get something done, relish aloud your satisfaction with what you did. If they teach you something, use it and tell them about how you're using it.

    They like when they are introduced to new ideas. So talking about random esoteric things can be rewarding for them. Like if you have bits of information you collected, and theories about those bits. Often they'll have their own theories about, well, everything, so they seem to enjoy when you humor them and listen, and add your own input.

    They can talk for forever, so sometimes just letting them talk and express themselves is a gift because not many people are that patient, lol.
    This is so helpful! Thank you

  4. #4
    Exodus's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    TIM
    LII
    Posts
    8,475
    Mentioned
    332 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Minde View Post
    I have a very dear ESE friend and she has said she values my ability to get her to relax and slow down. I don't really try, but apparently this happens just by me being calm myself, and listening to her. When ESE are helpful, they seem to really enjoy watching the beneficial fruits of their labor. So if they give a gift, use it in front of them. If they help you get something done, relish aloud your satisfaction with what you did. If they teach you something, use it and tell them about how you're using it.

    They like when they are introduced to new ideas. So talking about random esoteric things can be rewarding for them. Like if you have bits of information you collected, and theories about those bits. Often they'll have their own theories about, well, everything, so they seem to enjoy when you humor them and listen, and add your own input.

    They can talk for forever, so sometimes just letting them talk and express themselves is a gift because not many people are that patient, lol.
    Yes to all of this.

    Part of the "slowing down" thing means that they get overwhelmed because they try to do a whole lot of stuff all at once. If you can get them to slow down and sort of talk through what the next step is for what they are trying to accomplish without judging them or telling them that it's pointless/dumb, they will appreciate that immensely. Often then they will see that that other more-complicated thing they were trying to do can probably be let go or put on the back burner without any consequence.

  5. #5
    back for the time being Chae's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2016
    Location
    europe
    TIM
    ExFx 3 sx
    Posts
    9,183
    Mentioned
    720 Post(s)
    Tagged
    1 Thread(s)

    Default

    Yeah provide them with some

  6. #6
    Minde's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2005
    Location
    Amongst the stars
    TIM
    EII/INFj E9w1sp
    Posts
    4,451
    Mentioned
    148 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by thehotelambush View Post
    Part of the "slowing down" thing means that they get overwhelmed because they try to do a whole lot of stuff all at once. If you can get them to slow down and sort of talk through what the next step is for what they are trying to accomplish without judging them or telling them that it's pointless/dumb, they will appreciate that immensely. Often then they will see that that other more-complicated thing they were trying to do can probably be let go or put on the back burner without any consequence.
    This often works with LSEs, too.

    All the Ejs can be verbal processors. If I know which type they are and if they seem like they need encouragement, while asking leading questions I can lightly inject their desired IEs into the conversation, enough to add flavor but not so much as to tire myself; or I just hold off on their undesired / allergic reaction ones (like don't indulge in the really flowy Ni stuff with XSEs). That combined with my natural introverted rational temperament usually has a decently good effect. They're happier, which makes me happier, and we all win.



    The nice thing about most Ejs I've encountered, which includes ESEs, is that if they sense you're trying to get along with them in good faith, they usually respond to that with a certain positivity. So even if you're not "offering anything of value" to a ESE, if you sincerely want to find ways to make them feel valued, they will appreciate it.

    You could also just directly ask them what encourages them and makes them feel valued. They might not have thought about it, but this is a great opportunity to listen and let them process.
    Oh, to find you in dreams - mixing prior, analog, and never-beens... facts slip and turn and change with little lucidity. except the strong, permeating reality of emotion.

  7. #7
    Poolside Convo mAAd city's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2017
    Location
    USA
    Posts
    75
    Mentioned
    12 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Hi! I'm pretty sure that I'm ESE! I don't know Socionics too well yet, so these may sometimes not be type-related, but here you go:

    -Most of all, I just like feeling valued and appreciated, even if you're "freeloading." Like, it's totally fine!

    -While I wouldn't want this if it were fake, I do love when people respond well to my humor. I feel like I'm putting on a show every time I teach, using self-depreciating humor and such, and I'm always beaming when people laugh.

    -Doing stuff with me. Like many normal human beings, I don't like cleaning the house. But if I have a cleaning buddy, then it's all good.

    -Being patient when I'm ranting about music or personality theory or some other interest. I can sometimes feel insecure when talking about stuff like that for some reason.

    That's what I can think of immediately. :]
    Always welcome typing advice. :]

  8. #8
    both sides, now wacey's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2012
    Location
    Canada
    TIM
    9w8
    Posts
    3,512
    Mentioned
    140 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    I think first and foremost, you need to understand that your happiness is their happiness. When you feel joy then they feel joy. That is what they are seeking. That is a driving force for much of what they do. So when you are demonstrating your happiness towards them - around them, about them, about yourself, about your life, about the things that make you happy, about your surroundings, about anything really - they will in turn feel happy themselves. The shared experience is very much important for them.

  9. #9
    both sides, now wacey's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2012
    Location
    Canada
    TIM
    9w8
    Posts
    3,512
    Mentioned
    140 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Which brings me to my second point. They are very giving people. I have never met an ESE who was not in some shape, or fashion, tremendously giving. More often then not this will be of a visceral and real nature in a physical object or act of service. This to me indicates something about their personality that shows providing for other people brings them happiness. It must, for why else would they do it? example, I received a large Easter basket full of chocolate and other goodies from a ESE and the only thing asked in return is, did it make me happy? Which goes back to the first thing, your happiness is their happiness.

  10. #10
    Exodus's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    TIM
    LII
    Posts
    8,475
    Mentioned
    332 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by wacey View Post
    I think first and foremost, you need to understand that your happiness is their happiness. When you feel joy then they feel joy. That is what they are seeking. That is a driving force for much of what they do. So when you are demonstrating your happiness towards them - around them, about them, about yourself, about your life, about the things that make you happy, about your surroundings, about anything really - they will in turn feel happy themselves. The shared experience is very much important for them.
    Quote Originally Posted by wacey View Post
    Which brings me to my second point. They are very giving people. I have never met an ESE who was not in some shape, or fashion, tremendously giving. More often then not this will be of a visceral and real nature in a physical object or act of service. This to me indicates something about their personality that shows providing for other people brings them happiness. It must, for why else would they do it? example, I received a large Easter basket full of chocolate and other goodies from a ESE and the only thing asked in return is, did it make me happy? Which goes back to the first thing, your happiness is their happiness.
    QFT

  11. #11
    Rebelondeck's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2016
    Posts
    1,929
    Mentioned
    175 Post(s)
    Tagged
    1 Thread(s)

    Default

    ESEs are happiest when they feel that they're the best, and they feel most content when in control or in a controlled situation; this can have many interpretations. If pleasing someone were the goal, then they're happiest when complemented that their efforts were the best - better than those of others. They like things happening as they would anticipate; if they have any apprehension about outcomes, they would feel happiest when in total control and barking out orders. Most love feeling needed or being the linchpin in activities. They can find happiness in empathy but not all have the well-being of others as a primary objective.

    a.k.a. I/O

  12. #12
    Cosmic Teapot's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2017
    Location
    Germany
    TIM
    SLI-H sp/so
    Posts
    1,246
    Mentioned
    133 Post(s)
    Tagged
    2 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by sorrowsofyoungwerther View Post
    What is very impressive to me is someone who uses their Si to pick up on just the right gift. Its quite fun if they pay very very close attention. I have an EII friend who is amazing at this! She brings me very specific books, gluten free Italian pastries (my favorite and hard to find), and notepads with artistic coverings that are by my favorite artists. I have also known of SLI who are very good at this.

    I suppose the answer is pay attention to the slightest details (patterns in their clothes, artwork in their home) then find something similar. I also love flowers and gourmet food. Most ESEs do. Really anything beautiful, and decadent in life will work. But its the effort we spend on another that makes them feel special.

    I love giving gifts for this reason, I spend a lot of time thinking about just the perfect gift that a person could want. Something frivolous and very specific to them. In general I think ESEs like gourmet items, and high quality items, hand-made items.

    Most of all I love gifts with a hidden meaning or reference that only you and the other person would understand. My LSI bought me a small elephant charm for Valentine's Day. I was so happy he paid close attention- it is what I really wanted.

    From a good friend or family member there is little I would find obtrusive. Although I don't like gift cards. And if it helps any Anthropologie has many thoughtful unique handmade type gifts that a lot of Fi or Fe Ne types would enjoy.
    I'm not good at this but I will do my best! Thanks a lot. Very detailed.

  13. #13
    Cosmic Teapot's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2017
    Location
    Germany
    TIM
    SLI-H sp/so
    Posts
    1,246
    Mentioned
    133 Post(s)
    Tagged
    2 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Rebelondeck View Post
    ESEs are happiest when they feel that they're the best, and they feel most content when in control or in a controlled situation; this can have many interpretations. If pleasing someone were the goal, then they're happiest when complemented that their efforts were the best - better than those of others. They like things happening as they would anticipate; if they have any apprehension about outcomes, they would feel happiest when in total control and barking out orders. Most love feeling needed or being the linchpin in activities. They can find happiness in empathy but not all have the well-being of others as a primary objective.

    a.k.a. I/O
    Thanks for the advice
    but I can't agree with the bolded statements. The two ESEs I know like things to go as planned but disapprove total control.
    Maybe that depends on the subtype?

    Quote Originally Posted by wacey View Post
    I think first and foremost, you need to understand that your happiness is their happiness. When you feel joy then they feel joy. That is what they are seeking. That is a driving force for much of what they do. So when you are demonstrating your happiness towards them - around them, about them, about yourself, about your life, about the things that make you happy, about your surroundings, about anything really - they will in turn feel happy themselves. The shared experience is very much important for them.
    Quote Originally Posted by wacey View Post
    Which brings me to my second point. They are very giving people. I have never met an ESE who was not in some shape, or fashion, tremendously giving. More often then not this will be of a visceral and real nature in a physical object or act of service. This to me indicates something about their personality that shows providing for other people brings them happiness. It must, for why else would they do it? example, I received a large Easter basket full of chocolate and other goodies from a ESE and the only thing asked in return is, did it make me happy? Which goes back to the first thing, your happiness is their happiness.
    I approve this! I always thought the world would be a better place with more super intelligent, cold and rational people but I think more ESEs who are inquisitive and emotionally intelligent would be better

  14. #14

    Join Date
    Nov 2011
    Posts
    257
    Mentioned
    7 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Rebelondeck View Post
    ESEs are happiest when they feel that they're the best, and they feel most content when in control or in a controlled situation; this can have many interpretations. If pleasing someone were the goal, then they're happiest when complemented that their efforts were the best - better than those of others. They like things happening as they would anticipate; if they have any apprehension about outcomes, they would feel happiest when in total control and barking out orders. Most love feeling needed or being the linchpin in activities. They can find happiness in empathy but not all have the well-being of others as a primary objective.

    a.k.a. I/O
    You must be ILI because I was getting a lot of good feelz from this thread, falling in love with ESE, until the post you wrote came along.

  15. #15
    Exodus's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    TIM
    LII
    Posts
    8,475
    Mentioned
    332 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by uncivilized View Post
    You must be ILI because I was getting a lot of good feelz from this thread, falling in love with ESE, until the post you wrote came along.
    He also doesn't understand what an ESE is. They don't care about being "the best".

  16. #16
    Rebelondeck's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2016
    Posts
    1,929
    Mentioned
    175 Post(s)
    Tagged
    1 Thread(s)

    Default

    @uncivilized and @thehotelambush, I also wrote the below article as well as an uncovered article. One can be surprised how types behave under certain circumstances, and not all desires are acted upon because an individual's confidence of success comes into play. Types shouldn't be vilified or idealized; all types have the potential to become saints or killers - the only difference may be their rationales. If a balanced approach is taken and one goes into a relationship with both eyes open, then the potential for disappointment may be reduced. This LII is and has been up-close and personal with ESEs for many, many years and I've seen the best and worst.........

    http://www.socionics.com/articles/impressions_esfj.html

    a.k.a. I/O

  17. #17
    Exodus's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    TIM
    LII
    Posts
    8,475
    Mentioned
    332 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Rebelondeck View Post
    @uncivilized and @thehotelambush, I also wrote the below article as well as an uncovered article. One can be surprised how types behave under certain circumstances, and not all desires are acted upon because an individual's confidence of success comes into play. Types shouldn't be vilified or idealized; all types have the potential to become saints or killers - the only difference may be their rationales. If a balanced approach is taken and one goes into a relationship with both eyes open, then the potential for disappointment may be reduced. This LII is and has been up-close and personal with ESEs for many, many years and I've seen the best and worst.........

    http://www.socionics.com/articles/impressions_esfj.html

    a.k.a. I/O
    Your description sounds much more like a Beta or Gamma rational type than an ESE, there are Se themes all over the place. Beta most likely.

  18. #18
    Syynth's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2016
    Location
    Deseret
    TIM
    INTj-Ti
    Posts
    117
    Mentioned
    5 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Power and status aren't the only reasons to want to be "the best." Other motivations could be security or pride.
    SP/SX
    5w4

  19. #19
    back for the time being Chae's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2016
    Location
    europe
    TIM
    ExFx 3 sx
    Posts
    9,183
    Mentioned
    720 Post(s)
    Tagged
    1 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Syynth View Post
    Power and status aren't the only reasons to want to be "the best." Other motivations could be security or pride.
    There are 9 motivations in total --> enneagram.

  20. #20
    Exodus's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    TIM
    LII
    Posts
    8,475
    Mentioned
    332 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Syynth View Post
    Power and status aren't the only reasons to want to be "the best." Other motivations could be security or pride.
    ok, what about being "in total control and barking out orders"?

  21. #21
    Syynth's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2016
    Location
    Deseret
    TIM
    INTj-Ti
    Posts
    117
    Mentioned
    5 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by thehotelambush View Post
    ok, what about being "in total control and barking out orders"?
    In my experience, ESEs will only "unleash their Se" when they get stressed out, and the source of stress is usually uncertainty about the future (Ni).

    You will have to ask @Rebelondeck what he meant by this.
    Last edited by Syynth; 04-25-2017 at 12:04 AM.
    SP/SX
    5w4

  22. #22
    both sides, now wacey's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2012
    Location
    Canada
    TIM
    9w8
    Posts
    3,512
    Mentioned
    140 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Syynth View Post
    In my experience, ESEs will only "unleash their Se" when they get stressed out, and the source of stress is usually uncertainty about the future (Ni).

    You will have to ask @Rebelondeck what he meant by this.
    Also when they are not getting their own way....

    example: price check discrepancy at the check out; flight delayed and over night in a bad hotel room; some minor domestic household issue.

    ESxJs have their own unique styles of controlling the outcome and demonstrative Se is one of them.

  23. #23
    Poolside Convo mAAd city's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2017
    Location
    USA
    Posts
    75
    Mentioned
    12 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by wacey View Post
    Also when they are not getting their own way....

    example: price check discrepancy at the check out; flight delayed and over night in a bad hotel room; some minor domestic household issue.

    ESxJs have their own unique styles of controlling the outcome and demonstrative Se is one of them.
    Guess I'm not ESE, cause I'm chill with that stuff.
    Always welcome typing advice. :]

  24. #24
    Rebelondeck's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2016
    Posts
    1,929
    Mentioned
    175 Post(s)
    Tagged
    1 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by thehotelambush View Post
    Your description sounds much more like a Beta or Gamma rational type than an ESE, there are Se themes all over the place. Beta most likely.
    Information elements are inadequate predictors of observed behaviour; Socionics can learn a little from MBTI on that issue. Function is an result of interaction between input and output, and not due to a stand-alone IE; in fact Se has no real meaning for me if you read my thread entitled "Cognitive Patterns". That is likely why my descriptions deviate from those to which you may be referring........

    a.k.a. I/O

  25. #25
    Rebelondeck's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2016
    Posts
    1,929
    Mentioned
    175 Post(s)
    Tagged
    1 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by sorrowsofyoungwerther View Post
    I have no interest in hierarchy and status. That is more like my EIE and SLE friends. I also care a lot about my family and home life. I'm also very self-aware. Do you want to interview me for your next profile? We ESEs aren't two dimensional cut outs.
    I would find it unusual that ESEs (or EIEs) have no concept of or do not care about where they stand in their social hierarchies because it has a lot to do with perceived acceptance; I could see SLEs being far more detached even though they may covet what another has but for them, it's likely more about possession rather than position. I would expect ESEs to be rather self-aware and care about family and well-being but how they go about doing this is what I find the most interesting. I certainly don't believe that ESEs are two dimensional cut outs and I tried to present a description that didn't do that.

    a.k.a. I/O

  26. #26
    Rebelondeck's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2016
    Posts
    1,929
    Mentioned
    175 Post(s)
    Tagged
    1 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by sorrowsofyoungwerther View Post
    However there is a side to the ESE that I have never really seen reflected in any profile or description. Many of us are not organized, we don't care for authority, we aren't social climbers.......I think the idea that ESE are agreeable with the status quo or authority, hierarchy makes me look weak and unable to think through our own decisions.......
    My description was limited to one and I used it to explain what I considered underlying driving forces; no description will fit all because experience and environment are likely as big of an influence as type. I equate organized and structured with ones way of thinking rather than environment although many times one leads to the other. I look at abilities to see, work within, and thrive in hierarchy as a key survival skill, certainly not a weakness. An ability to adapt the logic of others is also a strength; Ijs have trouble with that. I'm quite sure that my description does not describe all LII and some on this site may say that I'm not LII after reading it.

    http://www.socionics.com/articles/on_being_intj.html


    a.k.a. I/O

  27. #27
    Feeling fucking fantastic golden's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2010
    Location
    Second story
    TIM
    EIE
    Posts
    3,724
    Mentioned
    250 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Rebelondeck View Post
    I would find it unusual that ESEs (or EIEs) have no concept of or do not care about where they stand in their social hierarchies because it has a lot to do with perceived acceptance; I could see SLEs being far more detached even though they may covet what another has but for them, it's likely more about possession rather than position. I would expect ESEs to be rather self-aware and care about family and well-being but how they go about doing this is what I find the most interesting. I certainly don't believe that ESEs are two dimensional cut outs and I tried to present a description that didn't do that.

    a.k.a. I/O
    I self-type EIE and most people here apparently agree with the typing.

    I dislike social hierarchies. I find the effects of them often are cruel. They lead people to selfish, shallow behavior, even to complete evil.

    What I value is social inclusiveness. I'm quite aware of when someone is not being included, or is in a marginal or vulnerable position, and try to fold them in.

    But for myself, I do "sort" people in terms of how good a fit I think they are with me and whether I really am a good person to be supportive to them. Sometimes I'm not. I recognize my limits.

    I struggle when the person is out of touch with reality, mean, hateful, dangerous, or, above all, willfully stupid or ignorant.

    What might look snobbish about me is that I get really worn down by "low" culture and "low" behavior. I don't generate a lot of hope within myself. I need something to aspire to, and I need to be inspired by beauty and ideas.
    LSI: “I still can’t figure out Pinterest.”

    Me: “It’s just, like, idea boards.”

    LSI: “I don’t have ideas.”

  28. #28
    Rebelondeck's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2016
    Posts
    1,929
    Mentioned
    175 Post(s)
    Tagged
    1 Thread(s)

    Default

    @golden - Because people can work within hierarchies does not imply they they agree with or like them; they just know what is expected in order to survive in them and I'm one of those. I especially dislike social hierarchies because I don't have the tools to fake compliance as expertly as I do in business.

    a.k.a. I/O

  29. #29
    * I’m special * flames's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2016
    Location
    TV
    TIM
    Sx/Sp 2w3
    Posts
    2,810
    Mentioned
    352 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Seems impossible with all their whining
    ・゚*✧ 𝓘 𝓌𝒾𝓁𝓁 𝓃𝑜𝓉 𝒶𝒸𝒸𝑒𝓅𝓉 𝒶 𝓁𝒾𝒻𝑒 𝓘 𝒹𝑜 𝓃𝑜𝓉 𝒹𝑒𝓈𝑒𝓇𝓋𝑒 ✧*:・゚

  30. #30
    Rebelondeck's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2016
    Posts
    1,929
    Mentioned
    175 Post(s)
    Tagged
    1 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by thehotelambush View Post
    ok, what about being "in total control and barking out orders"?
    If things are going well, ESEs can sit back and enjoy; they appreciate things being taken care of by others. If things seem off the rails, confident ESEs with notions of how success can be achieved seem to get very animated and start suggesting what others should be doing. They're quite good at delivering 'guidance' tailored to individual sensitivities and capabilities, but they can become irritatingly persistent/repetitive until they get what they want. The phrase was not meant to suggest that they act like dictators (although some may draw that analogy) but they do seem to like predictability and usually have preferred outcomes in mind, and can aggressively pursue these; many times, objectives revolve around something perceived as for someone else's 'own good'. When ESEs become really stressed, they seem to become quiet and start reflecting and or strategizing - interaction usually stops......

    a.k.a. I/O
    Last edited by Rebelondeck; 04-26-2017 at 01:59 PM.

  31. #31
    Exodus's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2006
    TIM
    LII
    Posts
    8,475
    Mentioned
    332 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Rebelondeck View Post
    If things are going well, ESEs can sit back and enjoy; they appreciate things being taken care of by others. If things seem off the rails, confident ESEs with notions of how success can be achieved seem to get very animated and start suggesting what others should be doing. They're quite good at delivering 'guidance' tailored to individual sensitivities and capabilities, but they can become irritatingly persistent/repetitive until they get what they want. The phrase was not meant to suggest that they act like dictators (although some may draw that analogy) but they do seem to like predictability and usually have preferred outcomes in mind, and can aggressively pursue these; many times, objectives revolve around something perceived as for someone else's 'own good'. When ESEs become really stressed, they seem to become quiet and start reflecting and or strategizing - interaction usually stops......

    a.k.a. I/O
    This is less obviously wrong than what you said before but there's still nothing here that would suggest ESE > EIE for example. (Since you're not really using socionics this isn't surprising.) This sort of extreme dichotomy between quiet reflection and nervous energetic activity is again much more characteristic of Se mobilizing + Ni creative + Si vulnerable. ESEs can be controlling yes, but they are essentially balanced people who have highly consistent energy levels for the most part.

  32. #32
    both sides, now wacey's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2012
    Location
    Canada
    TIM
    9w8
    Posts
    3,512
    Mentioned
    140 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    Patience is not a virtue of ESE, so don't make them wait if immediate action is required.

  33. #33
    Rebelondeck's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2016
    Posts
    1,929
    Mentioned
    175 Post(s)
    Tagged
    1 Thread(s)

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by thehotelambush View Post
    ............much more characteristic of Se mobilizing + Ni creative + Si vulnerable.............
    The models and the definitions of function are indeed where I disagree with Socionics; more fundamental definitions of information and information processing need to be developed first. The IEs seem comprised of behaviours that have widely varied granularities, which won't facilitate the isolation of independent variables. Introducing terms like mobilizing seems to be an attempt allude to function without really defining it; however, they may serve to reduce some granularity in the classifications.

    a.k.a. I/O

  34. #34
    Maybe I'm a Lion
    Join Date
    May 2012
    Location
    USA
    TIM
    ESI-Fi 6w5 sp/sx
    Posts
    393
    Mentioned
    15 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    Default

    In my experience (exgf and aunt), ESEs will find a use for you.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •