Enneagram type 8

[sbbds]

I can’t believe I had to go to page 4 to find this thread.

This doesn’t just pertain to enneagram 8. But vulnerability is the key to detoxification and thus growth and success. You can’t move quickly and release sweat well if you’re wearing a chain mail suit. You will create a pressure cooker effect which can be useful too, but it needs to come out somehow, eventually.

[sbbds]

A lion that can roll over to expose its stomach is true power and freedom.

[sbbds]

Reclamation of innocence is the path to growth and self realization for 8s, yes.

I think this works for all “power” or growth etc also.

[sbbds]

I'm not talking about power or anything like that, and I wouldn't even say 8 is about power. Enneagram is very much about growth, but it's also about balance and reaching a higher sense of realization. Since 8s felt like they had to step out of innocence from a young age, or they lack it for whatever reason, it really does shape not just their view of themselves and their actions, but also their worldview and how they approach justice. While I agree it's important for everyone to maintain a level of innocence, since this gives empathy and understanding, it's absolutely vital for 8s to literally reclaim innocence since they see themselves as lacking it. It will improve their self esteem, their view on themselves, their sense of justice, and their approach towards control.

I was mostly talking about power, in general, that’s why I mentioned it. What do you think 8 is about then? Non-innocence? Control?

[Lolita]

She’s just looking for more simplified, stereotypical chickenfeed about typology so she can keep playing her projection of what SLE 8 is like. Role playing.

[sbbds]

She’s just looking for more simplified, stereotypical chickenfeed about typology so she can keep playing her projection of what SLE 8 is like. Role playing.

How old are you?

[sbbds]

Yeah I understand you were "talking about power in general". But why talk about power on an e8 thread if you don't associate it with e8?

The key features of e8 are lust, vengeance, and punitiveness, and they have a huge emphasis on autonomy. The worldview of e8 is devoid of innocence, which is what enhances their lustful and vengeful thinking, and this is why they have to work at reclaiming it.

I am not sure how much more simpler I can put it. This is literally from Claudio Naranjo's book btw.

It does of course, which is why I asked in the way I did too. I decided e8 was a decent representative subset for my idea so I wrote about the topic here rather than starting my own thread.

I didn’t have to ask you, but I was wondering how you’d put it in your own words. It’s called having a conversation lol. Sorry for attempting one.

[Hot Scalding Gayser]

hmm I'd say most 8s would work in law enforcement or as judges, or prison guards- or somewhere you are allowed to control other people's behaviors a lot. Or as a lesser example, even a school teacher as they have a lot of authority too just in a lesser way. I wouldn't see them as actors or writers in movies, more as the directors.

A person simply being 'adorably dominant' wouldn't really count as an 8 to me if there was no real Te/Se skin teeth in the game, as it were. I see this as good intention fear of controlling others so you are not controlled yourself (8's basic fear), since "deviant" people especially would be allow to control others too much if they got out of hand. And why when unhealthy they can probably be very draconian and excessively harsh.

I do see them disintegrate to 5 a lot sometimes by refusing to discuss anything at all personal about them, no matter how small. They are really afraid of this. As obviously, your own emotional vulnerabilities do get in the way of you controlling others. The problem when you are emotionally closed off though- the people you can control is actually way less and it doesn't even give them what their main ego wants anyway- as they can only control the weakest of the weak being that way (and being chained down themselves with those people)

Dunno maybe I'm wrong but yeah like obviously I don't think an 8 would like a job as some sissy artist painting flowers or writing inspirational messages in books. Crime novels tho they would probably write.

[lynn]

I actually know many creative and artistic e8s, especially 8w7s. But this might be just the environment I'm in at the moment.

[Tonatiuh]

I actually know many creative and artistic e8s, especially 8w7s. But this might be just the environment I'm in at the moment.

I become creative if I got a lot of free time, if I get too busy with work it's the first thing that dies.

[lynn]

I become creative if I got a lot of free time, if I get too busy with work it's the first thing that dies.

I was talking about full-time artists. So that's basically their work.

[Tonatiuh]

I was talking about full-time artists. So that's basically their work.

Yes, I assume they are creative too. So switch work with something that's bending the individual out of their true natural shape.

[persimmonism]

I actually know many creative and artistic e8s, especially 8w7s. But this might be just the environment I'm in at the moment.

What kind of creative endeavors do the 8s you know partake in?

[lynn]

What kind of creative endeavors do the 8s you know partake in?

a lot have been into theatre production and stage design, for example.

[inaLim]

8w9 Sx/Sp.

Things that came to mind doing free association:

Take, possess, struggle, surrender.
Consume, devour.
Push. Demand.
Loyalty beyond loyalty. Soul pact. Trust.
Protect. Claim.
Turn (overcome/seduce). Toy (play with).
Passion, fusion.
Naked. True. Raw.

This side is only seen by "The One." To the rest of the world, friends, and family, I probably look 5ish or 9ish.

[inaLim]

Another free association, this time with the other in mind and trying not to think about myself.

Watch. Watch over. See through. Grasp (know, contain). Shelter (from the elements)
Honest. Transparent.
Prepare.
Intensify. Surge. Snowball (avalanche)
Enflame. Forge. Transform.
Backbone. Spine.
Dominate. Empower.
Liberate. Unbind (started thinking of "Prometheus Bound" and Prometheus Unbound" here).
Build/rebuild. Restore (restore to rightful brilliance/greatness/beauty etc).

[Adam Strange]

Enneagram 8 here.

I was hating my life this morning while simultaneously reflecting on the fact that my life is objectively pretty good, and I suddenly realized that the times when I hate my life are often the times when I have to do something that someone else wants me to do, and I don't feel like doing it. I mean, Dammit, nobody tells me what to do. Even I can't tell me what to do.

When I'm doing what I want to do, I'm on top of the world.

Maybe being e8 is strongly correlated with being extremely selfish and self-centered. I need to read up on this.

[lawter]

Enneagram 8 here.

I was hating my life this morning while simultaneously reflecting on the fact that my life is objectively pretty good, and I suddenly realized that the times when I hate my life are often the times when I have to do something that someone else wants me to do, and I don't feel like doing it. I mean, Dammit, nobody tells me what to do. Even I can't tell me what to do.

When I'm doing what I want to do, I'm on top of the world.

Maybe being e8 is strongly correlated with being extremely selfish and self-centered. I need to read up on this.

My apologies if application of the Big Five is considered blasphemous here, but as far as I can tell 8s correlate the least with the trait of Agreeableness out of all Enneagram types[1]. This trait in itself is defined by selfish behavior on the lower ends, as well as competitive sentiments and signs of manipulation. I myself score in the lower regions, though it should be noted that Big Five traits consist of multiple facets, which in and of themselves are grouped into the categories of Politeness and Compassion when it comes to Agreeableness, both of which impact behavior differently despite correlating with one another[2]. Perhaps unsurprisingly, as an 8 myself, I usually score higher on Compassion than Politeness. I do not consider myself to lack empathy as much as my empathy is more honed and directed in the name of what is just rather than being thrown around all over the place as it seems to manifest in other individuals. When I begin to notice exploitation of the weak, especially those that are close to me, I can act in a very empathetic manner and aid the people in need. Though I do think it makes sense for me to have a lower overall score in Agreeableness considering I cannot call myself a particularly unguarded and open person. It may happen that you feel a similar way, which would make sense after all, considering you're also an 8.

[lawter]

I actually know many creative and artistic e8s, especially 8w7s. But this might be just the environment I'm in at the moment.

The sexual 8 is the most artistic 8. In nature, the social 8 resembles a loud and boisterous leader of his people, always pushing to the external. The self-preservation 8 is a very internal creature, with her guard always up and a sentiment of seeking justice for herself alone. The sexual 8 is somewhere in between, in both areas and in neither at once, representing a sort of push-pull dynamic. While this may not be what births this artistic intention, it should be noted that 8s as a whole are a very "creative" type, just not always in the conventional sense. Every successful 8 creates something. Social 8s create movement and dynamism through rallying like-minded individuals and supporters. Self-preservation 8s create enterprises that suit their own needs, being masters of resourcefulness. Though all 8s are capable of all three, sexual 8s themselves seem to be attuned to more artistic creativity. As put by Tom Condon[1]:

Healthy Intimate Eights can be thoughtful and philosophical about matters of the heart, the vagaries and complexities of relationships.
• Sensitive and compassionate, they often have a stronger connection to Two.
• Boxer-poets; people who have a paradoxical combination of aggression and sensitivity.
• This subtype can bring artistic tendencies: the desire to create, express, write.
• Many female Eights have this subtype.
• A nuanced ironic intelligence, especially about relationships.

[Northstar]

Yeah, the subtype descriptions for 8 easily clarified for me that I'm sp-first, not sx-first.

[Averroes]

Sx E8 with ASPD

[Kalinoche buenanoche]

Sx E8 with ASPD

Rip

[Fluffy Princess Unicorn]

A couple of thoughts on Enneagram 8



I actually already covered up all enneagrams, but this one is my favourite video.

feel free to check my channel for more and follow

I ғᴇʟʟ ɪɴᴛᴏ ᴀ ᴄᴏɴᴄʀᴇᴛᴇ ᴊᴜɴɢʟᴇ
AND I'M THE FUCKING KING
2:19

[Fluffy Princess Unicorn]

hmm I'd say most 8s would work in law enforcement or as judges, or prison guards- or somewhere you are allowed to control other people's behaviors a lot. Or as a lesser example, even a school teacher as they have a lot of authority too just in a lesser way. I wouldn't see them as actors or writers in movies, more as the directors.

A person simply being 'adorably dominant' wouldn't really count as an 8 to me if there was no real Te/Se skin teeth in the game, as it were. I see this as good intention fear of controlling others so you are not controlled yourself (8's basic fear), since "deviant" people especially would be allow to control others too much if they got out of hand. And why when unhealthy they can probably be very draconian and excessively harsh.

I do see them disintegrate to 5 a lot sometimes by refusing to discuss anything at all personal about them, no matter how small. They are really afraid of this. As obviously, your own emotional vulnerabilities do get in the way of you controlling others. The problem when you are emotionally closed off though- the people you can control is actually way less and it doesn't even give them what their main ego wants anyway- as they can only control the weakest of the weak being that way (and being chained down themselves with those people)

Dunno maybe I'm wrong but yeah like obviously I don't think an 8 would like a job as some sissy artist painting flowers or writing inspirational messages in books. Crime novels tho they would probably write.

A lot of 8s are entrepreneurs/self-employed. Eg. I took the unorthodox "against the grain" route, carved out my own career. Partly, I didn't like people being in control over me, my schedule, my pay, my time. Sole proprietorship / entrepreneur = control over my own endeavors...what I put into it is what I get out of it. I don't have a cap on my pay, I can increase it via my own endeavors. What I did that through is art, and there is absolutely nothing sissy about it. Part of the reason I was so drawn to it was because it was a challenge for me. I lost interest in my natural talents at a young age because those things were "too easy." I'm also very pioneering in these endeavors, always pushing the boundaries and innovating beyond what others have already done. You seem to have a lot of stereotypes in your mind. Control over your life doesn't even necessarily entail controlling other people. It entails controlling your own resources first. Nobody can hold you by some puppet strings that way (by using your own needs against you, or using them as puppet strings, in a manipulative way). When you're independent, it enables you to be in control.

[Fluffy Princess Unicorn]

The sexual 8 is the most artistic 8. In nature, the social 8 resembles a loud and boisterous leader of his people, always pushing to the external. The self-preservation 8 is a very internal creature, with her guard always up and a sentiment of seeking justice for herself alone. The sexual 8 is somewhere in between, in both areas and in neither at once, representing a sort of push-pull dynamic. While this may not be what births this artistic intention, it should be noted that 8s as a whole are a very "creative" type, just not always in the conventional sense. Every successful 8 creates something. Social 8s create movement and dynamism through rallying like-minded individuals and supporters. Self-preservation 8s create enterprises that suit their own needs, being masters of resourcefulness. Though all 8s are capable of all three, sexual 8s themselves seem to be attuned to more artistic creativity. As put by Tom Condon[1]:

Healthy Intimate Eights can be thoughtful and philosophical about matters of the heart, the vagaries and complexities of relationships.
• Sensitive and compassionate, they often have a stronger connection to Two.
• Boxer-poets; people who have a paradoxical combination of aggression and sensitivity.
• This subtype can bring artistic tendencies: the desire to create, express, write.
• Many female Eights have this subtype.
• A nuanced ironic intelligence, especially about relationships.

Yeah, all that shit is very me. That's actually a lot of why I change my PFPs so frequently: the artistic nature, for one, but for two, the fact that I can never find art that expresses that paradoxical combination of aggression and sensitivity...so I just flip back and forth between them in my PFPs. I'm a walking contradiction, and nothing seems all-encompassing enough to capture something I can stick with...so I find bits and pieces of myself in art, and I change from one partial representation to another. It almost feels like trying to fit a novel into a sentence...it's just not easy to capture my own self in a way that I'm satisfied with as a representation of me. I'm complex, nuanced, diverse.