SLE-IEE Superego Relations (ESTp and ENFp)

[Eldanen]

I've encountered an example of this relationship. It's funny how quickly it takes place. A couple of my friends started having a heated argument about football. They got very animated and started gesticulating in public. They both huffed and gave up after a moment before parting ways. They were enfp and estp.

[Beautiful sky]

They get along very well and have a lot of fun. Um. They would have problems like I do in superego relations with LSI. I like them a lot but I can't do any Fe so the IEE can't do any Ni. Instead the IEE is social so much so that it would probably annoy SLE, who's dual isn't as much.

[Kim]

They get along very well and have a lot of fun. Um. They would have problems like I do in superego relations with LSI. I like them a lot but I can't do any Fe so the IEE can't do any Ni. Instead the IEE is social so much so that it would probably annoy SLE, who's dual isn't as much.

No, the IEE takes on the introvert role and eventually gets depressed and anxious.

[Beautiful sky]

No, the IEE takes on the introvert role and eventually gets depressed and anxious.

I don't know about that. I dont' take on an extraverted role with LSI, it's just a monotone relations where very little exciting things happen and eventually I seek out extraverts

[Kim]

I don't know about that. I dont' take on an extraverted role with LSI, it's just a monotone relations where very little exciting things happen and eventually I seek out extraverts

Maybe it is different for introverts.

[Beautiful sky]

Maybe it is different for introverts.

So, you're depressed?

[Kim]

So, you're depressed?

No, the SLE and I broke up and now I can be a happily extroverted 7-IEE again.

[Beautiful sky]

No, the SLE and I broke up and now I can be a happily extroverted 7-IEE again.

are you being sarcastic? i can't tell

[Kim]

are you being sarcastic? i can't tell

Aw, no. Not sarcastic. We broke up and he is happily on the prowl for the emo IEI that I never was.

[Beautiful sky]

Aw, no. Not sarcastic. We broke up and he is happily on the prowl for the emo IEI that I never was.

awesome!!!! time to find you a dual


are there SLI 2s? probably yes...hah

time to get you a dual...2s are the best best best for 7s

[Kim]

awesome!!!! time to find you a dual


are there SLI 2s? probably yes...hah

time to get you a dual...2s are the best best best for 7s

I like 1s and 4s. I find 2s to be too clingy and intrusive.

You and Eliza are denying me my favorite 1w9 (4-speckled) SLI dual boytoy by typing me SEE.

[Beautiful sky]

I like 1s and 4s. I find 2s to be too clingy and intrusive.

You and Eliza are denying me my favorite 1w9 (4-speckled) SLI dual boytoy by typing me SEE.

Honestly I've never gave it a very serious shot at typing you. I get upset and fly off the handle but that's it. No confirmation from me.

[Kim]

Honestly I've never gave it a very serious shot at typing you. I get upset and fly off the handle but that's it. No confirmation from me.

So I can have my 1w9 SLI dual? Weeeeeeeeeeee

[Kim]

Uhm, sorry about the derail.

SLE-IEE can work with lots of communication, but it is stressful for both I would say. IEE might get overwhelmed eventually and withdraw.

[Olduvai]

Watch Jase Robertson (SLE) talk with Si Robertson (IEE) about deer hunting and "inner feelings". Also features Jep Robertson (SEI) in a minor role.

[Aylen]

I actually saw that!

The show can be funny so when I can't find anything else to watch, I'll watch a few minutes of an episode.

[SophiaDeep]

lol , fun video to watch and interesting to see the types interaction, though the IEE seems pretty annoying, I guess it's not the healthiest example of the type

[Suz]

LOL the IEE was annoying probably because he was BORED!
That was hilarious!

[Suz]

interestingly this is kinda how things played out with a mentor of mine recently (actually in the past week). I'm thinking he's SLE.

Basically, he's been so micromanaging, disregarding my time constraints and my career goals, and forcing me to do stuff that is totally pointless to my career. It's even more absurd because he's supposed to be there to help me, not the other way around.

So things sort of culminated over the past week, and weighing everything in my mind over the weekend, i've decided i'm outta there. The decision was made even easier by the fact that he's not the one paying my salary. I feel so free now. In retrospect I can see how stifled I became in that environment. I just hope my real supervisors will be ok with this and not demand too much explanation, because i dont know that i can put into words quite how unhappy i became. I also dont want to have to badmouth him to them.

[blackburry]

Watch Jase Robertson (SLE) talk with Si Robertson (IEE) about deer hunting and "inner feelings". Also features Jep Robertson (SEI) in a minor role.

lol.... aw he's pretty funny (Si).. he's the only entertaining one.


I laughed so hard when he popped up from the bushes.

and then walked off and kept talking to the camera and the others were like, "WE still hear you.."

[blackburry]

[Olduvai]

lol.... aw he's pretty funny (Si).. he's the only entertaining one.


I laughed so hard when he popped up from the bushes.

and then walked off and kept talking to the camera and the others were like, "WE still hear you.."

lol, Si is awesome. Witty as hell, I'd love to hang out with him for a day. Too bad everyone on the show (including Willie, his LSE activity partner) is a complete ass to him

[Olduvai]

[scio]

Hi guys!
Just curious on your experiences with SLEs. Anyone can answer this, I didn't mean to narrow it to just IEEs, but I'm extra curious on my fellow type.
I've had to deal with a few SLEs in my life and one I got especially close with. They started using power games quickly and saying that I'm "defective" yet playing it off as a joke. I am ashamed of the fact that I feel quite inept in physical things (I trip places and am unsure of how to use objects---weak Ti etc etc etc)
Obviously I am bad at things the SLE is good at, yet I don't feel the need to criticize them for being good at things they're bad at. I take it as a sign that they're threatened by me, but don't feed into their weird power games. I don't understand how this is an "effective" way to deal with differences? It just seems immature to me. And in the long run it is approaching things in a fear-based manner as opposed to a healthy manner that they can actually excel in things. If I feel inept around the SLE of course I will inevitably be inept... I don't understand their motive in this and how they think this is helpful in any way. I would like to get further insight if anyone has it!

[scio]

Also would the SLE still do this to their dual? Would they not criticize them or would the IEI just take it as a joke and not look deeper into it?

[Eliza Thomason]

Hi guys!
Just curious on your experiences with SLEs. Anyone can answer this, I didn't mean to narrow it to just IEEs, but I'm extra curious on my fellow type.
I've had to deal with a few SLEs in my life and one I got especially close with. They started using power games quickly and saying that I'm "defective" yet playing it off as a joke. I am ashamed of the fact that I feel quite inept in physical things (I trip places and am unsure of how to use objects---weak Ti etc etc etc)
Obviously I am bad at things the SLE is good at, yet I don't feel the need to criticize them for being good at things they're bad at. I take it as a sign that they're threatened by me, but don't feed into their weird power games. I don't understand how this is an "effective" way to deal with differences? It just seems immature to me. And in the long run it is approaching things in a fear-based manner as opposed to a healthy manner that they can actually excel in things. If I feel inept around the SLE of course I will inevitably be inept... I don't understand their motive in this and how they think this is helpful in any way. I would like to get further insight if anyone has it!

I think this question is best put in Beta Quadra and asked of the IEI's! Dual knows best! And IEI will especially understand not only your reaction but also what the SLE is thinking and feeling, and will have the best response. Also, female SLEs are often good for helping you understand the SLE behavior, as they have that extra dose of feminine sensitivity...

SuperEgo relations can be prickly at times! My son is SLE, and he is my only, and I was a single parent for half his childhood. Sometimes I consult SuperEgo articles for direction... I tread carefully. In teen years we had occasional very, very uncomfortable interactions, that, while brief, left me hurting or a long time after. But that makes sense because a teen needs to individuate, that's his job, and one way to do that is to see differences very strongly. Another thing that helps is to try to think like a Beta, so, look at Beta quadra values and try to interact socially in their way.

An example of a more recent discomfort is my son was away for a year and we moved from our old home so he came back to this one and he seemed to have developed a disdain for his old cat. He points out that he never asked for the cat in the first place, and that the cat pooped in the wrong place all the time, which was a problem (the cat is improving!). Well at the time my Mom was here and more needy than ever and she made a lot of messes that needed cleaning and also our cat was here (with my husbands previous 2 resident cats) and our cat was making messes, and maybe it was just too crowded around here for his taste and he ignored the cat and made mild "who likes cats" jokes. I was just scandalized, because it seems so unfeeling to not pet and admire the cat! However, he is most remarkably and unusually patient, entertaining and affectionate with my husband's granddaughters, who just LOVE him, so, he is certainly not an unfeeling person. Just decidedly unfeeling towards this cat.

My Mom has passed, only recently, and my son was very kindly consoling with me at the funeral. When he was here this weekend he noticed that it "smells better around here" (now that we are not tending to my mother)... And he made the (sadly) expected disparaging comment about the cat. Well, this time I decided to challenge him right back (which is not typical of me - my comments tend to be all supportive and not critical, and also, when I am offended, I tend to act quietly offended and hurt and that reaction tends to make him annoyed at my overly moralistic tones)...

So, I decided to respond to the cat-insult in a different way this time, more "merry" and more bold, like a Beta. So, since he had recently taken care of a neighbor's farmette (which included a variety of animals) which was a nice responsibility they entrusted him, and I had been positive and admiring about that new adventure, so I decided to razz him in a way that was boldly critical (vs. my usual "astonished/sufferingly-hurt" response), saying, with drama, "HOW can you BE that way about a CAT! I just DON'T UNDERSTAND why your neighbors picked SOMEONE LIKE YOU to watch their animals!" This I said like I was completely incredulous. And he laughed. He just took on that razzing comfortably - vs. the resentment he seems to feel when I take on a the more-natural-to-me silent, suffering/hurt response.

So bold seems to be the way to go! Also I can tell you from experience that a long-winded IEE-type of explanation about how it feels and how its not right doesn't go over all that well in this SuperEgo relation. I have decided to save such talks for only really really important things. And even then I have to choose word and form carefully. So, liking the cat - not really so important.

Hope that helps. I think the SLE "power games" are more joking. Just think how they are Merry and we are Serious, and so in interacting with them remember we have a tendency to take things too seriously. It's a power game, but - it's a merry one. So your offense should be taken in a merry way, and not a serious way, because a serious response is overkill. And that weighty seriousness just deflates the whole situation, and gee, they were just being merry...

_____

P.S. Consider that in the face of such strong Se, your being tripping-ly inept is like bait for a starving man... how can he not say something about what seems to beg for his attention?? (Remembering, again, he is being "lighter" about this than you, and prefers a merry interaction.)

[Chae]

Their motive... moving things, conquest - that must be channeled into something useful. I find myself using on my rowdy younger SLE brother all the time. Organize this, do that, this is necessary, leave this, and so on. He doesn't care about Ne or Fi and looks down at it but Te seems remotely relatable so that's what I do. Him showing condescension toward my inaccurate verbal acrobatics and cuteness is a fault on his side so I don't take it to heart, it is not a threat to my authority either as I am firm in my strengths... and ignorant concerning my weaknesses All I can do is improve what I'm good at and so should he.
In return to demonstrate leniency, I don't tease him about his shortcomings (as good as my trickster nature permits). We both enjoy mutual time in entertainment matters so gaming, going to the cinema together, that kind of stuff is more of a common ground.

[GuavaDrunk]

Out of curiosity, have you talked to them about this? I'd double-check whether they're not just teasing you, and/or misjudged whether something is a sensitive point that you should not be teased about.

If you trash-talk them in return and they look pleased, then maybe they were just play-fighting.

They could also just be a jerk, obviously.

[ashlesha]

Do you get along otherwise /do you think he's positively predisposed to you overall? Without being there to hear his tone and read his energy it's hard to say whether it's really intended to dig at your insecurities or if he's honestly joking and just isn't picking up on how it affects you. How do you respond?

[Raver]

Having dealt with a fair share of SLEs in my life, I find that if you set boundaries, be assertive and make an effort to be on top of things then they'll leave you alone and are fine to get along with.

However, there is a fine line between teasing and abuse so as long as you are able to recognize the difference then you won't overreact or underreact to the situation at hand. Also, every SLE is different though and requires a different approach as well.

[Adam Strange]

@eliza, you are a saint.

I work with a couple of SLE's, and I have noticed that they both will sometimes challenge someone in what seems to be a perfectly serious manner. This can include calling a person an idiot or criticizing them in some way.
This actually happened today between an SLE and an SLI, and I could tell that things were not headed in the right direction, so I injected myself into the convo with a story of how I was an idiot. I purposely used the same word they were arguing about, and this joke seemed to defuse things.
I believe that SLE' s have a hard time telling when someone liked them or not, and they might use "first offense" to see in an Se way how a person reacts to them. So, the best course of action in these cases is to simply remember that these guys are trying to joke with you, and if you are on their side, you will joke right back at them.
They will like you more for it.

[Eliza Thomason]

@eliza, you are a saint.

Aw thanks. Really I just like to get along with people, and my son of course. I like Socionics because it helps with that.

[scio]

Eliza thank you that was so helpful. I definitely have instances like that with the SLEs I've met. They get frustrated when I internalize my feelings period and constantly want me to just fly off the handle like they would. I am stubborn, and they are stubborn.. so it doesn't go too well. I guess why it is so frustrating is mostly because I just can't be relaxed. I simply just cannot act the way I normally would. My interpretations of them are ALWAYS wrong and so I am always taking something too seriously because in my mind why would you say that if it means nothing?
I think it also just irritates me that playing something off as a joke would just make it lighter. I naturally interpret that as passive-aggressive and maybe even evil. This could be that I'm extra paranoid.
I almost feel like if there were straight up power games going on, I would so much rather lose the confusion and be mean if we are going to act mean. I don't get how words are just words to them and they can say things in the first place that are just upsetting to everyone. The SLE I am close with often says he wishes that I just knew he was kidding. But in my head I just wish he would stop saying hurtful things in the first place..There are too many blurred lines with this and I just get frustrated at how I have to discard my gut reactions about them and just act like I don't care about anything they're saying. They say up and it really means down and I want to actually be honest yet it's too much for them? It makes me feel like I just have to be this wind-up toy around them and follow their lead. It's very dehumanizing.

We are able to get along, though. We actually get along very well but there are frequent miscommunications and they just get frustrating. Don't take the above too seriously, I just needed to vent lol.

[scio]

@Chae Yes we get along very well most of the time because we can talk like thinkers together. We scheme and can make business plans! It's actually fun until out of nowhere he says something really critical of me. All of this is very true, we definitely can do together and it works out nicely.


@GuavaDrunk Just curious as a Beta what is your reaction to this kind of teasing? Do you tell the person to fuck off or do you engage in it too? We have talked about it and he does it less, but I also want to feel like he can be himself and don't want to restrict how he behaves naturally. I'd sooner just work on how I react to him than tell him deliberately to stop. I think a lot of it is he knows how to pick out insecurities well and that's why it seems abusive. I do know he's teasing and he doesn't even think or see why I'd internalize it.

[scio]

@lungs it's definitely intended as a joke but I don't take jokes about me well. Lol I think a lot of it is that I don't find outward teasing funny if it's redundant. I find it to be boring and pointless. I know he doesn't mean it and I still appreciate him very much as a person, especially because I know his intentions ARE good. But it also feels like I'm condoning abusive behavior and I can only see how it will further escalate into something worse (he doesn't know at all when to stop).

[scio]

@Raver I'm not even sure how to distinguish it with him and that's the scary part. I know hes joking only because afterward he'll tell me he is.. but it still feels abusive? I don't get how he can be cruel and not see how damaging it is to someone outside of himself? Fi PolR is scary. There is a fine line and that's exactly why I'm lost. Where do you find them? I've had a few SLE managers

[scio]

Adam that makes a lot of sense. I felt like I couldn't move on from this without a motive in my head of why they play these games. I can't help but see it as "stooping down to their level" and for that I am a self-righteous prick but I'm okay with that. Did these SLEs give any sort of visual cue that they are joking? Like a smile?
It's so funny because that is such a counterproductive way of working. But I definitely see what you mean. It sounds like sort of the inverse of what an INFj does when they meet someone. They figure out quickly who will want to be their true friend by stating their problems up front, basically showcasing their flaws. It's sort of a natural selection of friends, but in this case it is an Se way of doing it.

[GuavaDrunk]

@sockpuppet

Just teasing? Either tease back or make serious eye contact, not a hint of a smile, and say that's not funny. Then just remain deadpan at all the jokes I dislike.

If I'm bothered about specific subjects - list them, tell him to stay away from them, and if he still uses them a/ he's a jerk and untrustworthy b/ deadpan, be unfriendly and unwelcoming in general until at least an apology is forthcoming, then see if I feel like bothering to be friendly again.

it's definitely intended as a joke but I don't take jokes about me well. Lol I think a lot of it is that I don't find outward teasing funny if it's redundant. I find it to be boring and pointless. I know he doesn't mean it and I still appreciate him very much as a person, especially because I know his intentions ARE good. But it also feels like I'm condoning abusive behavior and I can only see how it will further escalate into something worse (he doesn't know at all when to stop).

I get the impression that it's the teasing in general that you dislike though, and there ain't no cure for that imo. It's just incompatibility. Honestly if it bothers you that much I'd save yourself the heartache and distance yourself from him. Ain't no shame in needing something different.

Full disclaimer: teasing people is like my second job. I say words for the sheer entertainment value all the time, so I'm not going to get your general aversion to it. Might help to think of it as a cultural difference.

However, and this is a very important however, I do try to let people know that they can tell me to stop any time, for any reason, and if they do ask me to then *I stop*. So, unfunny teasing is not a 'cultural difference', it's either grossly insensitive or just mean.

If someone repeatedly ignores your clearly-stated boundaries, that *is* a (bad) sign of character. And non-type related.

[scio]

@GuavaDrunk I admire how direct you are. I'm not explaining it well, I LOVE teasing. But it's pointless teasing that I hate. Idk if that makes sense.
If I do something funny or say something stupid I enjoy when people call me out on it and we can laugh about it together. It's the general feeling of being laughed at that I dislike (just like everybody) lol. It's when teasing becomes something you're not in on and it becomes almost humiliating. I like to be teased on specific things, not how I am as a person. If someone's going to flat-out call me defective, I'm gonna take that personally, no matter the situation/circumstance. Stuff like that, like generals, hurt. Also teasing without something to tease I think is pointless. Idk the more I talk about it the more whiny I sound haha but thank you for your feedback! Okay yeah, it's the distinction between funny and unfunny teasing. That's a better way of explaining it. Maybe this is an underdeveloped SLE or something. I can take a joke but I won't laugh if it's not funny

[GuavaDrunk]

@sockpuppet - thanks for clarifying, that was helpful I wouldn't want to be made to feel defective either.

The point stands that if your styles of teasing don't (and/or won't) match, then it's just never going to be fun. :/ Fwiw if you feel laughed *at* on a regular basis that doesn't sound like much of a friendship, period.

But in the end, it's really all up to you.