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Thread: IEE and SLI initial dualization (I hate being in love)

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    Default IEE and SLI initial dualization (I hate being in love)

    Hello. So, as the title infers, I'd like to know more about the IEE and SLI dualization process.

    After some years reading up on Socionics, some months ago I came to the conclusion that I'm an SLI of the Te subtype, since it's the type that best fits my overall behavior. As of right now, I am in the earliest stages of the whole "falling in love" thing with a girl I met at college, who's also in all of the same classes as I am (we're both majoring in psychology), and let's just say that you couldn't spot a more obvious IEE in the wild even if you were trying to. She's scattered, indecisive, pays no mind to some pretty obvious social cues (such as not putting your hands inside your pants while deep in thought), and is overall a very cheerful but kind of naive person. Don't get me wrong though, all of these traits make me swoon hard for her, in ways I can't even begin to describe.

    But anyways, back to the main point. We've become friends over a month ago, right before our first class together started, and over a week later, after pondering on it for a while, I realized that I really enjoyed her company, to the point that I might say that I've fell in love. Thing is, she either doesn't realize it despite my obvious advances and attempts at flirting with her, or she is really good at hiding the fact that she does realize but just doesn't mind, and I don't know what to make of it. She seems weirdly comfortable with physical contact, to the point of it, honestly, creeping me out. I won't go into too much detail, but I can tell with certainty that she's let me touch certain parts of her body that even some of my past partners took months to even think of letting me. However, as is with IEEs (from what I've read), most of these consentments are non-verbal, which basically means that she lets me do whatever I want with her as long as I don't ask about it. I've touched, tickled, and caressed her in places that should raise at least a couple of flags in regards to my interest in her, yet she doesn't even look bothered by it at all, and this keeps bugging me to no end.

    Another thing I noticed is that, despite me openly showing interest in what she likes, she avoids talking about her interests with me the most out of our friend group. She turns to one of our other female friends (whom I honestly can't really infer the type, but anyways) and talks her ear off about the K-Pop bands she likes and whatnot, but when I ask about it (even if it's just an excuse to get to talk more with her), she usually just dismisses it with a quick explanation, without as much enthusiasm when talking about it as she just had. When we're in social settings with multiple people, she treats me normally, but whenever I have the time and offer her company when she's alone, she says I shouldn't mind her.


    Now, I know in parts how IEEs dualize. From what I understand, it's a test of patience, where the IEE won't commit to anyone, because they want to win everyone over, and not ever be left alone should the need for company arise. What I don't get, however, is how their romantic interest is made clear, and I don't mean that in the traditional sense. I'm not expecting her to come to me and set boundaries (and, honestly, I'd hate that), but rather, I want to know which telltale signs I should be looking for that mean things are going smoothly or not, which things she does or says that allow me to have a good grasp on her understanding of our current relationship. I know IEEs are prone to fluctuate a lot in what they feel about things and people, and no way in hell I'm expecting any form of consistent response from her, but I'd like to know what I should be expecting and looking out for, to even know if she's interested in the first place.


    Also, I don't know how much of this matters, but I'm also a girl, and both me and the girl I'm talking about are both bi, just in case same gender relationships influence dualization in any way.

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    Focus on being a great provider and having a stable job because IEE can be a bit selective about their security
    -
    Dual type (as per tcaudilllg)
    Enneagram 5 (wings either 4 or 6)?


    I'm constantly looking to align the real with the ideal.I've been more oriented toward being overly idealistic by expecting the real to match the ideal. My thinking side is dominent. The result is that sometimes I can be overly impersonal or self-centered in my approach, not being understanding of others in the process and simply thinking "you should do this" or "everyone should follor this rule"..."regardless of how they feel or where they're coming from"which just isn't a good attitude to have. It is a way, though, to give oneself an artificial sense of self-justification. LSE

    Best description of functions:
    http://socionicsstudy.blogspot.com/2...functions.html

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    Types can be not as you think. IR can be good or bad - it's not known.
    Duals understand each other instinctively. Mainly do what other one wants by common doing of what they think as appropriate. They need external help the least. For good relations what they need is to be in a compassion to other one and to care to make him feel better, - from both sides.

    "Dualization" is the supporting of weak regions of other one and geting alike for yourself. Through valued regions, mainly.
    There is nothing special to know for concrete types besides basic theory.

    As an advice for good IR I'd say that they have good possibilities to improve support in relations, emotional state of both. You invest efforts and this brings a profit, gratitude and return support - such happens in good IR. As values are same, so both think about what makes the life better similarly (in related to Jung types).

    With duals is a problem of initial difference in views according to strong functions. People are partly different in how to act in the life, from what point they see it. Both have weaknesses where other one is strong, so opinions and behavior of other one may look there naive and kiddy. Own weak regions are adopted to be underesteemated in importance. You feel a sympathy and general interest, but to respect a dual and his opinions takes some time, to understand better his part of truth. In result both may change understanding of some things, to sum own and dual's view - to get wider and wiser understanding. This happens not in a moment, so needs a time to be patient as with kids, to teach each other about other part of truth. By words and seeing what other one does, how he thinks and perceives the life.

    -

    With concrete human, in case you think it's good IR, - talk directly about what you think and want, what you feel. Ask about what you doubt and want to know more. With good IR acting openly gives more chance to improve, than to harm relations.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Peppermint Wind Vane View Post
    Hello. So, as the title infers, I'd like to know more about the IEE and SLI dualization process.

    After some years reading up on Socionics, some months ago I came to the conclusion that I'm an SLI of the Te subtype, since it's the type that best fits my overall behavior. As of right now, I am in the earliest stages of the whole "falling in love" thing with a girl I met at college, who's also in all of the same classes as I am (we're both majoring in psychology), and let's just say that you couldn't spot a more obvious IEE in the wild even if you were trying to. She's scattered, indecisive, pays no mind to some pretty obvious social cues (such as not putting your hands inside your pants while deep in thought), and is overall a very cheerful but kind of naive person. Don't get me wrong though, all of these traits make me swoon hard for her, in ways I can't even begin to describe.

    But anyways, back to the main point. We've become friends over a month ago, right before our first class together started, and over a week later, after pondering on it for a while, I realized that I really enjoyed her company, to the point that I might say that I've fell in love. Thing is, she either doesn't realize it despite my obvious advances and attempts at flirting with her, or she is really good at hiding the fact that she does realize but just doesn't mind, and I don't know what to make of it. She seems weirdly comfortable with physical contact, to the point of it, honestly, creeping me out. I won't go into too much detail, but I can tell with certainty that she's let me touch certain parts of her body that even some of my past partners took months to even think of letting me. However, as is with IEEs (from what I've read), most of these consentments are non-verbal, which basically means that she lets me do whatever I want with her as long as I don't ask about it. I've touched, tickled, and caressed her in places that should raise at least a couple of flags in regards to my interest in her, yet she doesn't even look bothered by it at all, and this keeps bugging me to no end.

    Another thing I noticed is that, despite me openly showing interest in what she likes, she avoids talking about her interests with me the most out of our friend group. She turns to one of our other female friends (whom I honestly can't really infer the type, but anyways) and talks her ear off about the K-Pop bands she likes and whatnot, but when I ask about it (even if it's just an excuse to get to talk more with her), she usually just dismisses it with a quick explanation, without as much enthusiasm when talking about it as she just had. When we're in social settings with multiple people, she treats me normally, but whenever I have the time and offer her company when she's alone, she says I shouldn't mind her.


    Now, I know in parts how IEEs dualize. From what I understand, it's a test of patience, where the IEE won't commit to anyone, because they want to win everyone over, and not ever be left alone should the need for company arise. What I don't get, however, is how their romantic interest is made clear, and I don't mean that in the traditional sense. I'm not expecting her to come to me and set boundaries (and, honestly, I'd hate that), but rather, I want to know which telltale signs I should be looking for that mean things are going smoothly or not, which things she does or says that allow me to have a good grasp on her understanding of our current relationship. I know IEEs are prone to fluctuate a lot in what they feel about things and people, and no way in hell I'm expecting any form of consistent response from her, but I'd like to know what I should be expecting and looking out for, to even know if she's interested in the first place.


    Also, I don't know how much of this matters, but I'm also a girl, and both me and the girl I'm talking about are both bi, just in case same gender relationships influence dualization in any way.
    I'm also an IEE (male) and I've been in a similar situation, where the person was giving obvious signs of interest, and I just pretended I didn't see them. In my case, if the girl gets touchy I let her do that and I like it, but the more someone shows constant interest the less I feel challenged to pursue a relationship with them.
    My interests in someone fluctuate a lot depending on how my intuition sees potential for partnership, and there's a difference between a fling, a friend, and a life partner. So if you just show interest, it doesn't really mean much unless you give hints of what it is you want from me.
    Of course you can advance in the area of the senses, touching, being caring, because I don't feel confident to do that. But in my experience, touching is just a sign of attraction, and not necessarily love or a simple crush. So I let all types of women do the touching and that doesn't make me feel like they love me or anything.

    Another point, intuitives may despise people who have sensing as dominant function, personal experience, and only value the relation after it's gone.

    So my tip for you is offer help where you see the other person is having difficulties, and then back off (but be discrete about it, actually just give them space and time)
    Always give them something related to your strengths and then take it away, or give them time and space, so they can miss you before you actually go away.

    The most plausible possibility is that thia person is not dualized or has not met their duals yet and probably they don't know how much they can enjoy your company, they may not be in touch with their inferior function yet, which is common in college.

    There was a girl who did pretty much what you are doing now, and I just considered her nothing. I never appreciated her. Then after a long time, and a lot of exposure and I realized how much I liked her and how much she was important.

    So be patient, give her time and space, be more of a challenge, offer useful service, and keep being touchy (that definitely helps)

    My SEE in this profile is just for me to throw away stupidities without being questioned
    Last edited by BrainlessSquid; 03-07-2023 at 09:47 PM.
    Sometimes you don't have motivation because you lack purpose.
    Sometimes you don't have purpose, because you lack self-knowledge
    Sometimes you don't have self-knowledge because you lack love
    Sometimes you don't have love because you lack self-love
    Sometimes you don't have self-love because you lack guess what? Ask Gulenko!!

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    Quote Originally Posted by MathHysteriaOfSoul View Post
    I'm also an IEE (male) and I've been in a similar situation, where the person was giving obvious signs of interest, and I just pretended I didn't see them. In my case, if the girl gets touchy I let her do that and I like it, but the more someone shows constant interest the less I feel challenged to pursue a relationship with them.
    My interests in someone fluctuate a lot depending on how my intuition sees potential for partnership, and there's a difference between a fling, a friend, and a life partner. So if you just show interest, it doesn't really mean much unless you give hints of what it is you want from me.
    Of course you can advance in the area of the senses, touching, being caring, because I don't feel confident to do that. But in my experience, touching is just a sign of attraction, and not necessarily love or a simple crush. So I let all types of women do the touching and that doesn't make me feel like they love me or anything.

    Another point, intuitives may despise people who have sensing as dominant function, personal experience, and only value the relation after it's gone.

    So my tip for you is offer help where you see the other person is having difficulties, and then back off (but be discrete about it, actually just give them space and time)
    Always give them something related to your strengths and then take it away, or give them time and space, so they can miss you before you actually go away.

    The most plausible possibility is that thia person is not dualized or has not met their duals yet and probably they don't know how much they can enjoy your company, they may not be in touch with their inferior function yet, which is common in college.

    There was a girl who did pretty much what you are doing now, and I just considered her nothing. I never appreciated her. Then after a long time, and a lot of exposure and I realized how much I liked her and how much she was important.

    So be patient, give her time and space, be more of a challenge, offer useful service, and keep being touchy (that definitely helps)

    My SEE in this profile is just for me to throw away stupidities without being questioned
    This is the best advice I've received up until now, thank you.

    Still, just to confirm if I understood everything, what you're telling me is that I shouldn't be hyper focused on being with her all the time and openly showing that I'm interested at first, which in turn will make her start being more interested in knowing me due to missing my company. If that's the case, I can definitely see it working, but one thing that I need to ask in that case is this: What are the kinds of situations I would be able to help her with? Because I don't really see how to offer her any help in the many areas I know she is lacking without being intrusive or sounding insensitive.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Peppermint Wind Vane View Post
    This is the best advice I've received up until now, thank you.

    Still, just to confirm if I understood everything, what you're telling me is that I shouldn't be hyper focused on being with her all the time and openly showing that I'm interested at first, which in turn will make her start being more interested in knowing me due to missing my company. If that's the case, I can definitely see it working, but one thing that I need to ask in that case is this: What are the kinds of situations I would be able to help her with? Because I don't really see how to offer her any help in the many areas I know she is lacking without being intrusive or sounding insensitive.
    I don't know if you already know this but duality is not an ordinary relation, sometimes it may take a long time to properly develop if one of the parts is not experienced with complementary types. SLI-IEE is probably the hardest dyad to form due to both being result pairs and don juans.

    Yes, you should absolutely avoid being with her all the time, especially if you are forcing this. You should give your best, do your best, and then give time and space.

    Also, duality sometimes implies love and hate (even at the same time). So you have to take the risk of intruding in her subconscious by giving help on her thinking and sensing. But don't give advices nor opinions around logic and senses, instead ask to offer help improving something she's already done. It can be areas where it involves being detail oriented, looks, systems, performing tasks, even chores.

    You can work in groups with her, but be discrete about the possibility of working with them, don't make it sound like you wanted to be with them byt rather, let the opportunity arise.

    When I say you can intrude in her subconscious I mean it can be uncomfortable for her to receive help depending on her level of self awareness and dualization or even independence.

    The most important thing: don't pretend to be someone else, be completely natural in your behavior and don't think too much about what to say, let the words come out of your mouth as though it came from your spirit, and the only way is by stopping to monitor your behavior around her

    As you're still in college, I'm guessing it may difficult to establish relations in a systematic way. But if you two are really duals, just being exposed to the truer versions of yourselves over some time will definitely have a huge impact. Duality is a communication between conscious and unconscious. So it is important to not force things too much, and just be the best person you can be for her, but don't look desperate and don't lower yourself and value your own company as an introvert
    Last edited by BrainlessSquid; 03-07-2023 at 10:38 PM.
    Sometimes you don't have motivation because you lack purpose.
    Sometimes you don't have purpose, because you lack self-knowledge
    Sometimes you don't have self-knowledge because you lack love
    Sometimes you don't have love because you lack self-love
    Sometimes you don't have self-love because you lack guess what? Ask Gulenko!!

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    Quote Originally Posted by MathHysteriaOfSoul View Post
    I don't know if you already know this but duality is not an ordinary relation, sometimes it may take a long time to properly develop if one of the parts is not experienced with complementary types. SLI-IEE is probably the hardest dyad to form due to both being result pairs and don juans.

    Yes, you should absolutely avoid being with her all the time, especially if you are forcing this. You should give your best, do your best, and then give time and space.

    Also, duality sometimes implies love and hate (even at the same time). So you have to take the risk of intruding in her subconscious by giving help on her thinking and sensing. But don't give advices nor opinions around logic and senses, instead ask to offer help improving something she's already done. It can be areas where it involves being detail oriented, looks, systems, performing tasks, even chores.

    You can work in groups with her, but be discrete about the possibility of working with them, don't make it sound like you wanted to be with them byt rather, let the opportunity arise.

    When I say you can intrude in her subconscious I mean it can be uncomfortable for her to receive help depending on her level of self awareness and dualization or even independence.

    The most important thing: don't pretend to be someone else, be completely natural in your behavior and don't think too much about what to say, let the words come out of your mouth as though it came from your spirit, and the only way is by stopping to monitor your behavior around her

    As you're still in college, I'm guessing it may difficult to establish relations in a systematic way. But if you two are really duals, just being exposed to the truer versions of yourselves over some time will definitely have a huge impact. Duality is a communication between conscious and unconscious. So it is important to not force things too much, and just be the best person you can be for her, but don't look desperate and don't lower yourself and value your own company as an introvert
    Yeah, I know duality takes a lot of time to develop, it's mostly just that I'm really impatient when it comes to relationships (which is probably why they end up in disaster). It's kinda funny, really. I know what my problem is, I just don't know how to work on it.

    I wouldn't say that I'm forcing it, at least from my perspective, because whenever we stay together it's usually with other friends around, mostly because I like keeping them company, with or without her around. If it's just us though, it's always because it happened to be convenient for the both of us to be together at that place in time.

    We also do work in the same groups, we decided as soon as we became friends that we'd do group assignments together whenever possible (mostly due to the fact that we're too lazy to befriend more people than the small group we already have), so that's a non-issue right now.

    About the love-hate aspect, I can totally see that. Sometimes when I point things out to her about her sensing (such as food on her face or her teeth, her glasses being dirty, and so on), she acts kind of annoyed, but not in a bad way. It's more of a "I wish I didn't have to rely on you to point that out to me" kind of annoyance. If I correct her or try to help her understand theoretical concepts from our classes from a practical point of view, she also has similar reactions, but those are more pronounced, and she usually just ends up saying she'd rather stick with her own interpretations to not get even more confused (even though she always arrives at the same conclusions I was trying to point her to, which makes me giggle).

    And, yeah, I'm over pretending to be someone I'm not. Either way people will find a way to hate me when it suits them, so being myself is the most efficient way to achieve that result lol. But I get what you mean, not being genuine during something as complex as the dualization process can fuck you over in more ways than one, so I make sure to be as true to myself as I can. Most of my insecurities stem from how she'll react to me being myself, and not from me being myself, if that makes any sense.

    Again, thank you! You've been very helpful.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Peppermint Wind Vane View Post
    Yeah, I know duality takes a lot of time to develop, it's mostly just that I'm really impatient when it comes to relationships (which is probably why they end up in disaster). It's kinda funny, really. I know what my problem is, I just don't know how to work on it.

    I wouldn't say that I'm forcing it, at least from my perspective, because whenever we stay together it's usually with other friends around, mostly because I like keeping them company, with or without her around. If it's just us though, it's always because it happened to be convenient for the both of us to be together at that place in time.

    We also do work in the same groups, we decided as soon as we became friends that we'd do group assignments together whenever possible (mostly due to the fact that we're too lazy to befriend more people than the small group we already have), so that's a non-issue right now.

    About the love-hate aspect, I can totally see that. Sometimes when I point things out to her about her sensing (such as food on her face or her teeth, her glasses being dirty, and so on), she acts kind of annoyed, but not in a bad way. It's more of a "I wish I didn't have to rely on you to point that out to me" kind of annoyance. If I correct her or try to help her understand theoretical concepts from our classes from a practical point of view, she also has similar reactions, but those are more pronounced, and she usually just ends up saying she'd rather stick with her own interpretations to not get even more confused (even though she always arrives at the same conclusions I was trying to point her to, which makes me giggle).

    And, yeah, I'm over pretending to be someone I'm not. Either way people will find a way to hate me when it suits them, so being myself is the most efficient way to achieve that result lol. But I get what you mean, not being genuine during something as complex as the dualization process can fuck you over in more ways than one, so I make sure to be as true to myself as I can. Most of my insecurities stem from how she'll react to me being myself, and not from me being myself, if that makes any sense.

    Again, thank you! You've been very helpful.
    Not all IEEs are ready to be corrected on aspects of the inferior function.
    What you've just said reminds of Love is Blind the season which has Cole Barnett and Zanab. Cole is an IEE and Zanab seems like a SxI, and one of the main reasons for misunderstandings is her constant inspectioning of his inferior Si, to the point that he points out that she's "undervaluing and inferiorizing him" whereas a dualized individual would just recognize that as help from a side of strength that is balanced by his strength in other areas.

    Also she may react negatively to your being yourself or not, it doesn't matter much on the short term. Duals tend to fight and then learn and embrace growth. Her reaction is relative to her only, you can't control that.

    My early experience is that I would either hate you or find you completely useless or boring (for being too realistic, static, and logical, or just focused on the physical) but over time the table turns in your favor.

    Also, you're welcome. It's the first time I see an SLI going after an IEE, it's usually the opposite. So you're peculiar in that sense, pretty interesting
    Sometimes you don't have motivation because you lack purpose.
    Sometimes you don't have purpose, because you lack self-knowledge
    Sometimes you don't have self-knowledge because you lack love
    Sometimes you don't have love because you lack self-love
    Sometimes you don't have self-love because you lack guess what? Ask Gulenko!!

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    Quote Originally Posted by one View Post
    SLIs are also one of the slowest types in romance and pretty much doesn't care as much as the others.
    That's not true. I've found that both SLI and ILI are among the most caring of all types. It's no coincidence that Fi is their hidden agenda: there is nothing they yearn more, than to meet someone they can trust to fall in love with.

    They are just somewhat out of sync with their own emotions and doesn't really "feel" anything until it's too obvious. It takes a lot of maturity for them to properly recognize (let alone accept) their feelings. Remember that love makes just about anyone vulnerable and it takes quite a leap of faith for an introverted and logical type to just give in and take the "risk".

    IEEs... can be emotional whores. They like to go around and please people and gain their hearts, but only at a superficial level. Commitment is something IEEs struggle with. And this is an endless frustration source for their duals.
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    Quote Originally Posted by mikemex View Post
    That's not true. I've found that both SLI and ILI are among the most caring of all types. It's no coincidence that Fi is their hidden agenda: there is nothing they yearn more, than to meet someone they can trust to fall in love with.

    They are just somewhat out of sync with their own emotions and doesn't really "feel" anything until it's too obvious. It takes a lot of maturity for them to properly recognize (let alone accept) their feelings. Remember that love makes just about anyone vulnerable and it takes quite a leap of faith for an introverted and logical type to just give in and take the "risk".

    IEEs... can be emotional whores. They like to go around and please people and gain their hearts, but only at a superficial level. Commitment is something IEEs struggle with. And this is an endless frustration source for their duals.
    Hum some ESTJ can be exactly like ENFP as you describe here.

    This is probably why SLI and EII come together so effortlessly because we both want and look for that profound connection and love
    -
    Dual type (as per tcaudilllg)
    Enneagram 5 (wings either 4 or 6)?


    I'm constantly looking to align the real with the ideal.I've been more oriented toward being overly idealistic by expecting the real to match the ideal. My thinking side is dominent. The result is that sometimes I can be overly impersonal or self-centered in my approach, not being understanding of others in the process and simply thinking "you should do this" or "everyone should follor this rule"..."regardless of how they feel or where they're coming from"which just isn't a good attitude to have. It is a way, though, to give oneself an artificial sense of self-justification. LSE

    Best description of functions:
    http://socionicsstudy.blogspot.com/2...functions.html

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    My contribution to this thread
    IEE love SLI because of their introverted nature but may take them a while (after having dates as many Estj and ISTJ) in the course of their dating career to finally understand the connection they have with SLI in the meantime they maybe friends with them for a long time
    -
    Dual type (as per tcaudilllg)
    Enneagram 5 (wings either 4 or 6)?


    I'm constantly looking to align the real with the ideal.I've been more oriented toward being overly idealistic by expecting the real to match the ideal. My thinking side is dominent. The result is that sometimes I can be overly impersonal or self-centered in my approach, not being understanding of others in the process and simply thinking "you should do this" or "everyone should follor this rule"..."regardless of how they feel or where they're coming from"which just isn't a good attitude to have. It is a way, though, to give oneself an artificial sense of self-justification. LSE

    Best description of functions:
    http://socionicsstudy.blogspot.com/2...functions.html

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    Talking to peppermint over the phone made me realize that I've been dating someone with the same type as hers, which I guess is a dual, for almost a year, but I never made the move to a relationship to her because I thought she was another type other than a dual. Our interaction was fun, effortless, and with a lot of growth, but I simply thought duality was supposed to be even better than that. The girl was constantly giving me all the signs of high interest and I just ignored them completely fearing being disappointed over the long term. Yesterday she said she can't go out with me anymore, and I hope it is not too late.
    Last edited by BrainlessSquid; 03-08-2023 at 11:17 PM.
    Sometimes you don't have motivation because you lack purpose.
    Sometimes you don't have purpose, because you lack self-knowledge
    Sometimes you don't have self-knowledge because you lack love
    Sometimes you don't have love because you lack self-love
    Sometimes you don't have self-love because you lack guess what? Ask Gulenko!!

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    Quote Originally Posted by MathHysteriaOfSoul View Post
    Talking to peppermint over the phone made me realize that I've been dating someone with the same type as hers, which I guess is a dual, for almost a year, but I never made the move to a relationship to her because I thought she was another type other than a dual. Our interaction was fun, effortless, and with a lot of growth, but I simply thought duality was supposed to be even better than that. The girl was constantly giving me all the signs of high interest and I just ignored them completely fearing being disappointed over the long term. Yesterday she said she can't go out with me anymore, and I hope it is not too late.
    That's kind of a bummer, wish you had commented about that with me. I hope you guys can still work something out, even if just for the sake of closure.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Peppermint Wind Vane View Post
    That's kind of a bummer, wish you had commented about that with me. I hope you guys can still work something out, even if just for the sake of closure.
    Thanks! I had an almost instantaneous perception of this fact just after we started talking but I thought it was not so nice to point that out so soon.

    Ps: Anyways, I'm grateful for the time I had with her and for you appearing on this server also. I'm sure good things are coming my way. I remember meeting more people similar to both of you during the course of my life, let's say it's a type I can easily spot. But that girl was my first experience at a close psychological distance.
    Sometimes you don't have motivation because you lack purpose.
    Sometimes you don't have purpose, because you lack self-knowledge
    Sometimes you don't have self-knowledge because you lack love
    Sometimes you don't have love because you lack self-love
    Sometimes you don't have self-love because you lack guess what? Ask Gulenko!!

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    Zack is an SLI bachelor here and he’s all about no drama
    https://youtu.be/KrvJlckck24
    -
    Dual type (as per tcaudilllg)
    Enneagram 5 (wings either 4 or 6)?


    I'm constantly looking to align the real with the ideal.I've been more oriented toward being overly idealistic by expecting the real to match the ideal. My thinking side is dominent. The result is that sometimes I can be overly impersonal or self-centered in my approach, not being understanding of others in the process and simply thinking "you should do this" or "everyone should follor this rule"..."regardless of how they feel or where they're coming from"which just isn't a good attitude to have. It is a way, though, to give oneself an artificial sense of self-justification. LSE

    Best description of functions:
    http://socionicsstudy.blogspot.com/2...functions.html

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    That's not true. I've found that both SLI and ILI are among the most caring of all types. It's no coincidence that Fi is their hidden agenda: there is nothing they yearn more, than to meet someone they can trust to fall in love with.
    I can confirm this , although this doesn't always appear directly on them

    + LII too
    Souls know their way back home

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    Quote Originally Posted by Beautiful sky View Post
    Zack is an SLI bachelor here and he’s all about no drama
    https://youtu.be/KrvJlckck24
    He somehow looks like Arnold Schwarzernegger
    Sometimes you don't have motivation because you lack purpose.
    Sometimes you don't have purpose, because you lack self-knowledge
    Sometimes you don't have self-knowledge because you lack love
    Sometimes you don't have love because you lack self-love
    Sometimes you don't have self-love because you lack guess what? Ask Gulenko!!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Peppermint Wind Vane View Post
    That's kind of a bummer, wish you had commented about that with me. I hope you guys can still work something out, even if just for the sake of closure.
    I forgot to mention that I developed strong feelings for the girl, and everyone who saws us together said we were a pretty good match.
    People always looked at us with a sort admiration, and I don't know what it is that they saw, but once a taxi driver said he could feel our chemistry and couple energy just from hearing us talk from the backseat. I should have paid attention to all the signs, but maybe I didn't want to see them
    Sometimes you don't have motivation because you lack purpose.
    Sometimes you don't have purpose, because you lack self-knowledge
    Sometimes you don't have self-knowledge because you lack love
    Sometimes you don't have love because you lack self-love
    Sometimes you don't have self-love because you lack guess what? Ask Gulenko!!

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    So, funny thing that just happened. I gave my crush a letter during neurology class saying "Thinking about you makes my neurons suffer from excitotoxicity", with a huge heart around it and a sunflower drawn on the envelope. I told her she could only read it at home though, so I hope she understands the flirt when she reads it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Peppermint Wind Vane View Post
    So, funny thing that just happened. I gave my crush a letter during neurology class saying "Thinking about you makes my neurons suffer from excitotoxicity", with a huge heart around it and a sunflower drawn on the envelope. I told her she could only read it at home though, so I hope she understands the flirt when she reads it.
    If I ever received a letter like this one, even If I didn't have any feelings, it would definitely hit me hard in the heart and I would consider the possibility of going out on a date or just take some time to do something cool together.
    That was very cute and I would never expect that from an SLI, which I'm pretty sure you are one at this point
    Sometimes you don't have motivation because you lack purpose.
    Sometimes you don't have purpose, because you lack self-knowledge
    Sometimes you don't have self-knowledge because you lack love
    Sometimes you don't have love because you lack self-love
    Sometimes you don't have self-love because you lack guess what? Ask Gulenko!!

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    Quote Originally Posted by MathHysteriaOfSoul View Post
    If I ever received a letter like this one, even If I didn't have any feelings, it would definitely hit me hard in the heart and I would consider the possibility of going out on a date or just take some time to do something cool together.
    That was very cute and I would never expect that from an SLI, which I'm pretty sure you are one at this point
    That's very reassuring to know, I hope she thinks the same.

    I don't know if it matters much, but I like doing small context sensitive flirts like this, it helps the other person capture the moment and keep it in their memory longer. Like a small time machine they can use to relieve what they were feeling then.

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    Welp, in the end she told me we should stop being friends, because I'm too suffocating to be around, and I was apparently invading her personal space (even though she never mentioned anything of the sort to me). Very fun way to ruin my mood for the next month and a half.

    That being said though, I still want to use this as an opportunity for learning. What she finds suffocating, from my understanding, is basically anything that involves me expressing my Si. How does learning to live with Si work for IEEs?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Peppermint Wind Vane View Post
    Welp, in the end she told me we should stop being friends, because I'm too suffocating to be around, and I was apparently invading her personal space (even though she never mentioned anything of the sort to me). Very fun way to ruin my mood for the next month and a half.

    That being said though, I still want to use this as an opportunity for learning. What she finds suffocating, from my understanding, is basically anything that involves me expressing my Si. How does learning to live with Si work for IEEs?
    Si is an unconscious function for me, so I have difficulty in telling you what I lack and what I need to do about it.
    But from reading the literature I understand that I need to focus more or my body, be aware of its sensations and signals.
    So after my dualization, I started doing new things such as going out just to eat, taking care of my health, sleeping properly, doing manual work, and house chores, and taking care of my appearance to the world, and also my body posture, and how I control it.

    I started the practice of paying attention to my body for extended periods of time, and this has increased my focus and it makes me feel complete. This is so real, that now I live alone and I feel a serene peace of mind most of the time, thanks to this practice.

    Let's say that before dualization, I would literally live in my head most of the time and underrate anything known and traditional. And f**** my health, sometimes I would sleep 3-5 hours a day, have a unhealthy sleep cycle, not give a shit about pleasure and food, ignore or underrate traditiinal people, and always seeking impossible goals, and never satisfied with what I have and no sense of balance in my life.

    Of course I'm still pretty random and unfocused , but at least I know how to supply Si for myself to the point that I decided to live alone and it's been ok. Being aware of my body makes me feel "whole"
    Last edited by BrainlessSquid; 03-10-2023 at 09:51 PM.
    Sometimes you don't have motivation because you lack purpose.
    Sometimes you don't have purpose, because you lack self-knowledge
    Sometimes you don't have self-knowledge because you lack love
    Sometimes you don't have love because you lack self-love
    Sometimes you don't have self-love because you lack guess what? Ask Gulenko!!

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    It's funny how everything you described are all givens for me. I never put that much tought into the fact that I should have at least 8 hours of sleep, or that I should seek out new sensations such as eating out and other stuff like that, it always just came naturally. I know it sounds obvious, but it's kind of funny how lower Si means literally not paying attention to such trivial details.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Peppermint Wind Vane View Post
    It's funny how everything you described are all givens for me. I never put that much tought into the fact that I should have at least 8 hours of sleep, or that I should seek out new sensations such as eating out and other stuff like that, it always just came naturally. I know it sounds obvious, but it's kind of funny how lower Si means literally not paying attention to such trivial details.
    Yeah, it might seem obvious to you, but for me it just seems like a joke from the universe that I have to do these things. Like, how come being aware of my body makes me feel happy and whole? I literally believed there was no point in having one, let alone take care of it.
    I still don't know why we exist physically, but at least I've learned to appreciate being touched and given care
    And please don't mock me for saying these things it took me a lot of work to get to this point
    I'm being too vulnerable at this point
    Sometimes you don't have motivation because you lack purpose.
    Sometimes you don't have purpose, because you lack self-knowledge
    Sometimes you don't have self-knowledge because you lack love
    Sometimes you don't have love because you lack self-love
    Sometimes you don't have self-love because you lack guess what? Ask Gulenko!!

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    Never meant to mock you, on the contrary in fact. I find it fascinating to think about how everyone's minds work differently, and to think that we're able of so much growth from understanding different functions really inspires me to know more people.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Peppermint Wind Vane View Post
    Never meant to mock you, on the contrary in fact. I find it fascinating to think about how everyone's minds work differently, and to think that we're able of so much growth from understanding different functions really inspires me to know more people.
    Yeah, doing work related to you dominant function only gives temporary satisfaction. Extended neglect of the repressed functions tends to give a sense of emptiness, and meaninglessness in life, because the dominant function is a hero that doesn't really feels rewarded enough for saving the day everyday for a whole year, it needs some time out for vacation. That's literally what the inferior function is, a vacation for the hero.

    And yes, understanding others is key to self understanding, growth and satisfaction in life.
    By the way, Si-Ne is the axis of experience and the learning that comes from it, always leading to some sort of progress.
    So Ne without Si would mean traveling without stopping to take some photos and meet the locals.
    Whereas Si without Ne would mean basically taking all the photos and experiencing everything around in all its details and never leaving to meet more places.

    In the end, we're going through the same trip

    I didn't mean to get philosophical but I'm sure you get the point
    Last edited by BrainlessSquid; 03-11-2023 at 12:18 AM.
    Sometimes you don't have motivation because you lack purpose.
    Sometimes you don't have purpose, because you lack self-knowledge
    Sometimes you don't have self-knowledge because you lack love
    Sometimes you don't have love because you lack self-love
    Sometimes you don't have self-love because you lack guess what? Ask Gulenko!!

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    lol this entire thread vibes like "fake news"...almost like someone really bored and desperate to prove something created a sock puppet account and is staging a back and forth dialogue with themselves. Weird.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Alonzo View Post
    lol this entire thread vibes like "fake news"...almost like someone really bored and desperate to prove something created a sock puppet account and is staging a back and forth dialogue with themselves. Weird.
    Yeah, I can see that. Too good to be true
    Sometimes you don't have motivation because you lack purpose.
    Sometimes you don't have purpose, because you lack self-knowledge
    Sometimes you don't have self-knowledge because you lack love
    Sometimes you don't have love because you lack self-love
    Sometimes you don't have self-love because you lack guess what? Ask Gulenko!!

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    Quote Originally Posted by MathHysteriaOfSoul View Post
    Yeah, doing work related to you dominant function only gives temporary satisfaction. Extended neglect of the repressed functions tends to give a sense of emptiness, and meaninglessness in life, because the dominant function is a hero that doesn't really feels rewarded enough for saving the day everyday for a whole year, it needs some time out for vacation. That's literally what the inferior function is, a vacation for the hero.

    And yes, understanding others is key to self understanding, growth and satisfaction in life.
    By the way, Si-Ne is the axis of experience and the learning that comes from it, always leading to some sort of progress.
    So Ne without Si would mean traveling without stopping to take some photos and meet the locals.
    Whereas Si without Ne would mean basically taking all the photos and experiencing everything around in all its details and never leaving to meet more places.

    In the end, we're going through the same trip

    I didn't mean to get philosophical but I'm sure you get the point
    Those are really good metaphors, actually. Couldn't have put it better myself.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Alonzo View Post
    lol this entire thread vibes like "fake news"...almost like someone really bored and desperate to prove something created a sock puppet account and is staging a back and forth dialogue with themselves. Weird.
    Oh no, they found us out! Quick, abort!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Beautiful sky View Post
    My contribution to this thread
    IEE love SLI because of their introverted nature but may take them a while (after having dates as many Estj and ISTJ) in the course of their dating career to finally understand the connection they have with SLI in the meantime they maybe friends with them for a long time
    Not here to blow up anyones ego but I'm more comfortable being around EIIs generally than IEE and it makes me question if i'm an LSE. IEEs seem like they would cheat on you more easily and wouldn't value you as much as a person. It throws me off but I don't mind being proved otherwise.

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    Humanist Beautiful sky's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Amoeba View Post
    Not here to blow up anyones ego but I'm more comfortable being around EIIs generally than IEE and it makes me question if i'm an LSE. IEEs seem like they would cheat on you more easily and wouldn't value you as much as a person. It throws me off but I don't mind being proved otherwise.
    You could be lse
    -
    Dual type (as per tcaudilllg)
    Enneagram 5 (wings either 4 or 6)?


    I'm constantly looking to align the real with the ideal.I've been more oriented toward being overly idealistic by expecting the real to match the ideal. My thinking side is dominent. The result is that sometimes I can be overly impersonal or self-centered in my approach, not being understanding of others in the process and simply thinking "you should do this" or "everyone should follor this rule"..."regardless of how they feel or where they're coming from"which just isn't a good attitude to have. It is a way, though, to give oneself an artificial sense of self-justification. LSE

    Best description of functions:
    http://socionicsstudy.blogspot.com/2...functions.html

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    Quote Originally Posted by Amoeba View Post
    Not here to blow up anyones ego but I'm more comfortable being around EIIs generally than IEE and it makes me question if i'm an LSE. IEEs seem like they would cheat on you more easily and wouldn't value you as much as a person. It throws me off but I don't mind being proved otherwise.
    I think you're not SLI. Maybe some intuitve type, but I haven't intertacted with you enough, just an impression
    Sometimes you don't have motivation because you lack purpose.
    Sometimes you don't have purpose, because you lack self-knowledge
    Sometimes you don't have self-knowledge because you lack love
    Sometimes you don't have love because you lack self-love
    Sometimes you don't have self-love because you lack guess what? Ask Gulenko!!

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    Quote Originally Posted by MathHysteriaOfSoul View Post
    I think you're not SLI. Maybe some intuitve type, but I haven't intertacted with you enough, just an impression
    I don't think you're IEE more ILE to me

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    Quote Originally Posted by Amoeba View Post
    I don't think you're IEE more ILE to me
    Trust me on this one, he's IEE. You notice that very easily after talking to him for more than a minute through the phone.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Amoeba View Post
    I don't think you're IEE more ILE to me
    The reason I said I think you're not SLI is basically because your thought process seems foggy to me, which isn't supposed to happen among duals. Maybe you're my "activator" or "benefactor" or illusionary (even though I don't take ITR descriptions at face value)

    But this is not a "type me thread", so I'll leave it to that
    Sometimes you don't have motivation because you lack purpose.
    Sometimes you don't have purpose, because you lack self-knowledge
    Sometimes you don't have self-knowledge because you lack love
    Sometimes you don't have love because you lack self-love
    Sometimes you don't have self-love because you lack guess what? Ask Gulenko!!

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    Quote Originally Posted by MathHysteriaOfSoul View Post
    The reason I said I think you're not SLI is basically because your thought process seems foggy to me, which isn't supposed to happen among duals. Maybe you're my "activator" or "benefactor" or illusionary (even though I don't take ITR descriptions at face value)

    But this is not a "type me thread", so I'll leave it to that
    No offence but it sounds like weak evidence though. The only other type I get is ILI on tests. I've Taken the Gulenko test and got SLI https://socioniks.net/en/test/. The socionics extended test also gives me SLI - te https://www.sociotype.com/tests/. If you have any other objective measures by which you can type me let me know. But I'm not going to accept some random on a forum say "Oh you're not SLI" without any other evidence or a suggestion on what other type they think I am.

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    Quote Originally Posted by MathHysteriaOfSoul View Post
    The reason I said I think you're not SLI is basically because your thought process seems foggy to me, which isn't supposed to happen among duals. Maybe you're my "activator" or "benefactor" or illusionary (even though I don't take ITR descriptions at face value)

    But this is not a "type me thread", so I'll leave it to that
    No offence but it sounds like weak evidence though. The only other type I get is ILI on tests. I've Taken the Gulenko test and got SLI https://socioniks.net/en/test/. The socionics extended test also gives me SLI https://www.sociotype.com/tests/. If you have any other objective measures by which you can type me let me know. But I'm not going to accept some random on a forum say "Oh you're not SLI" without any other evidence or a suggestion on what other type they think I am.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Amoeba View Post
    No offence but it sounds like weak evidence though. The only other type I get is ILI on tests. I've Taken the Gulenko test and got SLI https://socioniks.net/en/test/. The socionics extended test also gives me SLI - te https://www.sociotype.com/tests/. If you have any other objective measures by which you can type me let me know. But I'm not going to accept some random on a forum say "Oh you're not SLI" without any other evidence or a suggestion on what other type they think I am.
    Really ILI was the type that came to my mind after I started talking to you.
    I have a lot of experience with sensors, and I just feel this lacking of sensing in your communication.
    I don't have strong evidences though and I don't want to battle type you
    But you seem very abstract compared to the SLI I've known
    Sometimes you don't have motivation because you lack purpose.
    Sometimes you don't have purpose, because you lack self-knowledge
    Sometimes you don't have self-knowledge because you lack love
    Sometimes you don't have love because you lack self-love
    Sometimes you don't have self-love because you lack guess what? Ask Gulenko!!

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