Any ENFjs had positive relations with their dual ISTj? (EIE-LSI)

[Typeless Wonder]

Considering that many people here despise ISTJs, I want to turn the tables a bit and see if any ENFJs have had positive relationships with their ISTJ dual. Even though I'm a woman, I'm starting to believe I'm an ISTJ and not an INFP like I once thought. I think I just didn't want to admit to myself that I don't have as feminine a mindset as I often think I should have. I feel a little bit like a hybrid between those two types when I read type descriptions so I'm really not sure which one I am. One thing is for sure though, I'm shy and not a control freak which goes against everything people say about ISTJs. I do prefer problem solving and working with neutral data and talking about which plan of action to take with other people. I don't work well with people who complain a lot or act manipulative toward me. But I also have this kind of wacky side which I think is more INFP than ISTJ. I only show that side though when I'm around people I know well. Otherwise I tend to be quiet and unassuming. I'm also not an alcoholic. So if you're an ENFJ, does this description fit with what you know about ISTJs or are they the totally over-confident control freaks everyone makes them out to be?

[Angel von Himmel]

Over-confident? ISTjs are some of the most unconfident people I have ever met ... But, that is coming from an ENTp's point of view. For some reason people seem to be under the dillusion that they are confident, but nothing could be farther from the truth.

And no, you do not have to be a manipulative control freak to be an ISTj, just that the majority of them are ... including my father. I can definatelly testify to that fact.

[Rocky]

Typeless Wonder, I think you're an INFP. Even that name seems a little odd for an ISTJ, yet INFPs seem to enjoy wondering around without a type (or maybe they just think about their type a lot and are unsure about it?). Just look at Transigent, he's an INFP but for some reason he doesn't realize it yet. Can you tell me somethingabout you that you DON'T think sounds like an INFP?

[Rocky]

Just look at Transigent, he's an INFP but for some reason he doesn't realize it yet.

Of course, I would like to know why you are so sure...:wink:

Because you're an odd ball.

I remember you saying at some point that you were "definatly" I and "definatly" P, but now you say you are only sure about being N? I know you're an INFP because I have thought that you sounded INFP for a long time and can't really see you as any other type. Then you said that the only reason you weren't sure you were INFP was because you didn't know what Ni was and how it related to you. That's why I described how I see Ni and you pretty much agreed with what I wrote. Here it is again;

I would say I am INFp right now, except that I really don't have a concept of time or predictions. My definition of would have to be slightly "tweaked". (I really wish there were some official "examples" of function usage, rather than just vague descriptions.)

Transigent, I do think you are an INFP. If the definition of Ni is the only thing you are unsure of, then I think I can help you. My Dad's an INTP so I have become very familiar with Ni (most of it which makes me sick, but works for some people ).

One thing with people who are dominanted be Ni is that they are very slow. I don't mean mentally, of course. If you want to associate "Time" with Ni, then you might as well say that they waste time, and don't seem to care. INxPs have a hard time pushing themselves to do something. Also, they seem to develop "routines"; they like to do somethings the same way. For example, they have a habit of turning off all lights/appliances when leaving a room or saying something the same way over and over again. If they do something that they feel comfortable with, they will probably make it a "routine". They also have a habit of telling people what they think. They think they have a good idea of how to do something, and like people to do or think the same way (the INFP version of this may be slightley diffrent, using F as their creativity). Ni's often have a vision for what they want or can think about what happened in the past. Despite this, they can still change their vision. INxPs can also be confused with reality (think INFP Trudy Wagel from Reno 911). Sometimes they think they see something, and convince themselves they saw it, but then realize later they were wrong. They have a hard time seeing what is really there, which can lead to mistakes. Lastley, INxPs can be very idealist and introspective. They are reflective with themselves, which can be why it is hard for them to shut their brains down while trying to sleep (and they seem to sleep a lot).

That's all I can think of right now (and I tried to say that in the best way that I could).

then you might as well say that they waste time, and don't seem to care

True. Hours go by, and days, and when someone asks me what I actually did, it becomes a slight ordeal sometimes when I say "Well, I don't really know?" How the hell am I supposed to know what the f*ck I did? I find this actually one of the most annoying questions.

Also annoying: "plans for the future" questions. How the hell am I supposed to know what will happen tomorrow? For all I know, my arms could fall off, and there goes my football carrer plan, LOL!

INxPs have a hard time pushing themselves to do something.

True. "Tomorrow never dies!"

Also, they seem to develop "routines"; they like to do somethings the same way. For example, they have a habit of turning off all lights/appliances when leaving a room

I try to do this. Nothing sucks worse than being 10 miles away, and suddenly remembering that you left the window open that happens to be right next to the 15 billion plug outlet...

or saying something the same way over and over again.

I hate to do this.

If they do something that they feel comfortable with, they will probably make it a "routine".

Hmm. More time to "zone out" maybe? I am not sure if I do this, but I probably do.

They also have a habit of telling people what they think. They think they have a good idea of how to do something, and like people to do or think the same way (the INFP version of this may be slightley diffrent, using F as their creativity). Ni's often have a vision for what they want or can think about what happened in the past.

I love to get into the conversation of changing "one's self" through contemplation, imagination, and especially "simulating circumstances and analyzing your reactions to those circumstances to see what it is that REALLY bothers you."

Despite this, they can still change their vision.

Does changing it every second count?

INxPs can also be confused with reality (think INFP Trudy Wagel from Reno 911).

Now that show is FUNNY. Is Dangle an ISFj character or what?

Sometimes they think they see something, and convince themselves they saw it, but then realize later they were wrong. They have a hard time seeing what is really there, which can lead to mistakes.

I guess this can be true, but I "don't see it"!

Lastley, INxPs can be very idealist and introspective.

True.

They are reflective with themselves, which can be why it is hard for them to shut their brains down while trying to sleep (and they seem to sleep a lot).

I don't have that problem for some reason. I don't fall right to sleep exactly, but don't have the problem of insomnia.

... INFP.

[HarryBottom]

I haven't seen any ISFJ's here, I don't think. Or ENFJ's for that matter.

[Cone]

Or ESFps, ESFjs, or ESTjs. I can definitely say from experience that ESTjs aren't going to ever get interested in Socionics. Everything I tell her about Socionics, she replies with "well, it doesn't always work out that way."

[HarryBottom]

Well, it depends on how you market it:

SOCIONICS: TROUBLESHOOTING IN THE WORKPLACE

* INCREASE WORKPLACE PRODUCTIVITY WITH ADVANCED KNOWLEDGE OF HUMAN RELATIONSHIPS

* SQUEEZE PEOPLE INTO BOXES TO MAXIMIZE EFFICIENCY OF INTERACTIONS

* LEARN TO REDUCE COMPLICATED HUMAN THOUGHT PROCESSES INTO EASY AND EFFICIENTLY MANAGED SOCIONIC FUNCTIONS

* MAXIMIZE WORKER POTENTIAL BY IDENTIFYING TARGET AREAS FOR GROWTH

* 65% MORE EFFICIENT THAN MBTI CONSULTING FIRMS

* PROVEN TO WORK EFFECTIVELY IN 85% OF CASES

lol, oh gs, that's hilarious.

[indigoroom]

Nope. They are out there guiding the masses Currently in Bulgaria Volen Siderov (ENFj) a very harsh nationalist is raising the people on meetings and stuff.. most people compare him with ******.. he's incredible orator hah it's very interesting for me to observer his actions and extreme idealism.

[Creepy-Jadae]

Theyre rolling their eyes at the obvious temperament bias and moving on =p

-ENFJ

[Creepy-Wackotic]

Well, it depends on how you market it:

SOCIONICS: TROUBLESHOOTING IN THE WORKPLACE

* INCREASE WORKPLACE PRODUCTIVITY WITH ADVANCED KNOWLEDGE OF HUMAN RELATIONSHIPS

* SQUEEZE PEOPLE INTO BOXES TO MAXIMIZE EFFICIENCY OF INTERACTIONS

* LEARN TO REDUCE COMPLICATED HUMAN THOUGHT PROCESSES INTO EASY AND EFFICIENTLY MANAGED SOCIONIC FUNCTIONS

* MAXIMIZE WORKER POTENTIAL BY IDENTIFYING TARGET AREAS FOR GROWTH

* 65% MORE EFFICIENT THAN MBTI CONSULTING FIRMS

* PROVEN TO WORK EFFECTIVELY IN 85% OF CASES

Bloody brilliant!

Nah, those ENFjs are just too kool to bother with psuedo-psych morons like us.

Can't blame 'em.

[Creepy-Jadae]

For a minor bit. I gotta finish some replies but I dont plan on staying. I have to say that youre on of the more interesting posters Ive seen on mbti/socionics boards. But dont let that go to your head =p

[HarryBottom]

Come now, Jadae, you should stay. Stay. Stay. STAY.

[Angel von Himmel]

For a minor bit. I gotta finish some replies but I dont plan on staying. I have to say that youre on of the more interesting posters Ive seen on mbti/socionics boards. But dont let that go to your head =p

Nooo, do not leave ... you are like the dark side of my socionics ying/yang *cries*

[Creepy-pokeball]

I guess I'll add it to favorites and register. But I really dont want to be anyone's ying/yang online Thats a bit much for me lol.

[Lover of the Pen0r]

I am ENFj, bitches!