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    Default new socionics ego theory

    I have been wondering how some types seem easier to understand then other types. and I came up with this idea of two types of socionics ego: choice ego, and synch ego.

    a choice ego means your two ego functions (program + creative) are not directly in relation to each other. for example, ESIs (and presumably SEE) have been notably hard to type bc Se seems to contradict Fi. this would be a choice ego since it's like choosing one or the other. LSE (and SLI) is another example, since the comforts of Si contradicts the Te need to conserve.

    a synch ego is the opposite; the functions work together, and are harder to separate. example LSI/SLE have Se/Ti, which work together since Ti is the system created, and Se is enforcement of said system.

    choice and synch egos would dualise with one each.

    synch egos would be easier to identify than choice egos, who seem to switch from 2 modes. but fused egos are harder to detect in mirror, since they have a less clear 'preferred mode'. choice becomes from tricky to easier to type when narrowed down, synch starts easy but becomes more difficult.

    choice types: ESI/SEE, LSE/SLI, EIE/IEI, LII/ILE
    fused types: ILI/LIE, LSI/SLE, SEI/ESE, EII/IEE

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    I do have to agree that some people can switch around their values, basically translating their base functions? Sounds a lot more realistic than something that is fixed, after all personalities can shift. People develop at different pastes, and some people have their functions leveled out, making it impossible to restrict them into a single archetype.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Judas View Post
    and some people have their functions leveled out, making it impossible to restrict them into a single archetype.
    you think somewhere out there, someone really has their functions all balanced out and harmonious?

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    Quote Originally Posted by godslave View Post
    i dont understand. can you elaborate

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    Don't forget that introverted functions are not seen, Fi and Ti e.g., and an ESTp is recognized by Fe & Se, and ESFp is seen by Te activation. The creative function might not be used.

    Also:

    Fi is a creation like Ti. One is back tracking deductive logic fitting it as "true or false" to its own system. Fi is a calculus too, of what works for me in what i value. The royal "I"

    Se Fi is going after the goods using Te. Se Ti is working out a system for harmony with Fe driving it.



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    Since you asked for a bit of elaboration here is my two cents , please take it with a grain of salt because I don't know what I'm talking about, it's just my humble opinion.

    Quote Originally Posted by anotherperson View Post
    I have been wondering how some types seem easier to understand then other types.
    That's a subjective assumption. All the TIMs are equally well explained in the theory. However, when you try to translate the TIMs (charts no more no less) to people, you go to a mental process in winch you try to associate TIMs with archetypal images. That's what we call the "Type image" i.e. the subjective representation of a TIM (it's subtle !) the real life type of person if you prefer. In general we have one or two type images that correspond to a given TIM however things get a little tricky when you have to add the subtypes and depending on the socionics school, we might have a lot of subtypes to factor as Type images of the same sociotype.

    and I came up with this idea of two types of socionics ego: choice ego, and synch ego.

    a choice ego means your two ego functions (program + creative) are not directly in relation to each other. for example, ESIs (and presumably SEE) have been notably hard to type bc Se seems to contradict Fi. this would be a choice ego since it's like choosing one or the other. LSE (and SLI) is another example, since the comforts of Si contradicts the Te need to conserve.
    You can't unblock the IEs blocking formula in the Model. The creative function serves the leading function, both IE have to be either a perception or a judgement IE in every block of the Model. I don't see any contradiction between Se and Fi one is an Extroverted perceiving IE and the other is an Introverted Judging IE. Same thing with Si and Te. I don't know where the "Te need to conserve" comes from, that's not what Te is about at all.

    a synch ego is the opposite; the functions work together, and are harder to separate. example LSI/SLE have Se/Ti, which work together since Ti is the system created, and Se is enforcement of said system.

    choice and synch egos would dualise with one each.
    Why would those functions harder to separate than that of the choice ego ? The Ti/Se works for LSI ,it is sound but when it comes to SLE it's not. The creative function is a contact and cautious function more flexible than the leading in the SLE configuration Ti serves Se so there is no enforcement of system here but rather Ti is a mean to an end (Se) which is situational giving the a) perceiving nature of the function and b) the E-P temperament of SLE.

    As for the choice and synch egos dualization, that seems completely arbitrary because you didn't provide the rationale behind it.

    synch egos would be easier to identify than choice egos, who seem to switch from 2 modes. but fused egos are harder to detect in mirror, since they have a less clear 'preferred mode'. choice becomes from tricky to easier to type when narrowed down, synch starts easy but becomes more difficult.

    choice types: ESI/SEE, LSE/SLI, EIE/IEI, LII/ILE
    fused types: ILI/LIE, LSI/SLE, SEI/ESE, EII/IEE
    Again, assumptions followed by what seems to be arbitrary declarations . What does fused egos mean ? What do you mean by "detect in mirror" ? I don't understand.

    Hence my "that's not How the force works". Note that what you said can make a lot of sense for a lot people, it just happens that I don't understand it but again, It's just me.

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    Quote Originally Posted by anotherperson View Post
    Se seems to contradict Fi
    S contradicts/opposes to N only. Each of both S variants to every of both N.
    You don't understand theory basics. To read Jung's book would be useful for you.

    If your experience does not match to theory basics, then the problem is not in the theory but in your inappropriate usages of it.

    For ESI you seem to produce too much of new ideas for a novice. I suspect other type.

    P.S. "Socionics" are ideas of Jung + Augustinavichiute only. For own theory exists viewpoints section.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sol View Post
    S contradicts/opposes to N only. Each of both S variants to every of both N.
    You don't understand theory basics. To read Jung's book would be useful for you.
    do you have a link to jungs book , i dont know the name of it


    edit: NVM found it

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    Quote Originally Posted by godslave View Post
    Since you asked for a bit of elaboration here is my two cents , please take it with a grain of salt because I don't know what I'm talking about, it's just my humble opinion.
    That's a subjective assumption. All the TIMs are equally well explained in the theory. However, when you try to translate the TIMs (charts no more no less) to people, you go to a mental process in winch you try to associate TIMs with archetypal images.
    its an observation ive found in the forums. even with the thread "which types are more likely to confuse for each other". i always wondered why the types were not symmetrical, with each type being roughly correlated to the same amount of mistyping. i guess it could also be of the nature of certain functions, but i decided not to overcomplicate and be overinclusive.

    You can't unblock the IEs blocking formula in the Model. The creative function serves the leading function, both IE have to be either a perception or a judgement IE in every block of the Model. I don't see any contradiction between Se and Fi one is an Extroverted perceiving IE and the other is an Introverted Judging IE. Same thing with Si and Te. I don't know where the "Te need to conserve" comes from, that's not what Te is about at all.
    the contradiction i was mentioning was in motivation. like Te Si for example, i was saying Te needs to be out and doing productive things that are numeric. Si is nonnumeric, its about ones pleasures that do not seem to bring material growth. "converse" comes from Te drive to allocate resources correctly. Granted, i'm not sure in what direction information is going in information metabolism. Se Fi contradicts over one function being about horizontal distance of peoeple (fi), and one is vertical distance of people (se).

    Why would those functions harder to separate than that of the choice ego ? The Ti/Se works for LSI ,it is sound but when it comes to SLE it's not. The creative function is a contact and cautious function more flexible than the leading in the SLE configuration Ti serves Se so there is no enforcement of system here but rather Ti is a mean to an end (Se) which is situational giving the a) perceiving nature of the function and b) the E-P temperament of SLE.
    the idea is being choice egos they both work to serve you. but they dont work in tandem. (like broom + mop) synch egos are more like mop and soap. they work to do the same thing.
    about the Se/Ti explanation, i dont understand.

    As for the choice and synch egos dualization, that seems completely arbitrary because you didn't provide the rationale behind it.
    the choice and synch ego rationalising is a byproduct of how i organised each types into the two categories. why choice and synch egoes would dualise, is beyond me. I dont really get the ITR stuff honestly, i only included it since there appears to be a big focus on ITR in this forum.

    Again, assumptions followed by what seems to be arbitrary declarations . What does fused egos mean ? What do you mean by "detect in mirror" ? I don't understand.
    "fused ego' was the old name for synch ego before i decided to change it. i didnt want to give the impression that a fused ego is somehow worse (i think of rigid body imagery.) i simply forgot to change that instance. "detect in mirror" i meant tell mirror types apart from each other.

    Hence my "that's not How the force works". Note that what you said can make a lot of sense for a lot people, it just happens that I don't understand it but again, It's just me.
    i will admit im not that great at understanding humour nuance. i wanted to ask to avoid over/underreact.

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