Desire for a Dialectic with Catholics in Particular and Anyone in General who's Interested

[Metamorph]

I would like a dialectic, not an argument and not an attempt to convert, with Catholics here. For starters, I confess that Jesus is the Christ and God has risen him from the dead. No witchcraft here. I hope you do the same on this thread.

The place I am coming from, and I swear to the Lord God Himself that I have no other agenda, is that it increasingly appears to me that Christianity, or at least what generally passes for it, is simply some kind of diabolical polytheistic ethnoreligion created to lead Europe and the West astray. This is the perspective I have as a human being living on Earth with the current information I have available, and furthermore, I cannot believe any argument rooted solely in tradition. I already am strongly inclined to disagree that "the West is the best," every day the West in its current state seems worse and worse, though I do not favor some other ethnicity, I simply have criteria that are not ethnic-based which include people and groups from the West and from elsewhere as seeming blessed to me. Furthermore, I think the West has been extremely and horrifically backwards and corrupt for those Middle Ages which Catholics seem to valorize, and that Catholics do seem to be the most well-studied of all Christians seems more like a reductio ad absurdium for Christianity as a whole more than an argument for Catholicism: accepting the admittedly-incomprehensible, pagan-seeming traditions of Catholicism mean accepting all the backwardness of the European Dark Ages. I can only believe what reason combined with my knowledge (world history, natural history, religious texts, etc.) of the world show me. It is not about identity politics for me, it is about things completely outside myself. I think that is probably the ultimate disagreement I have with Catholicism at this point.

I have a few questions to put forth to Catholics:


Do you only believe what do you because of ideals of "Western civilization" and "European heritage?" Then what do you have to say about the following:

There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus. Galatians 3:28

Additionally, I would like to know how you are visualizing Jesus. We've all seen paintings of Jesus, but I suspect paganism far beyond the vague resemblances of Renaissance paintings occurs in typical Catholic visualizations of Jesus, due to the fact it seems rooted in a sort of racial consciousness typically. I think you might straight up be visualizing Odin, Zeus, or Baal (but especially Odin) involuntarily when you think of Jesus and God (which are the same to you,) honestly.


Why do you believe that Jesus is God when Jesus said he does not do those things himself but due to his Father who sent him? I do not see how you get the trinity from this. This appears to be saying that Jesus is distinct from God entirely and you should worship the Father and not him. It explicitly says "I speak not of myself," I don't get how you get Jesus having some kind of divine trinitarian essence from an explicit negation whatsoever.

Believest thou not that I am in the Father, and the Father in me? the words that I speak unto you I speak not of myself: but the Father that dwelleth in me, he doeth the works. John 14:10


I know Catholics like to use one verse in particular to justify the Catholic Church over any other Church. However, it seems like the idea of the gates of hell not prevailing refers to the immortality of the saints (the gates of hell literally just being the grave or death, especially since God-given immortality is both physical and spiritual,) and not that any earthly institution from the time of Jesus would necessarily survive in the way Catholics claim their church did. What other evidence do you have to back up using this quote?

And I say also unto thee, That thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it. Matthew 16:18


Do you still think the Rabbinic Jewish Messiah is the Antichrist? To be fair, I think that is where all the evidence points, which is why I am not generally a fan of Rabbinic Judaism. I do not think Rabbinic Judaism is any more necessary for ethnic Jews than worshipping Ra is for Egyptians or worshipping Zeus is for Greeks or, yes, worshipping Catholicism is for Europeans. Many of everyone's fathers bowed to Baals at some point, that doesn't make it a necessary part of having an ethnicity. I think even my own parents chose wrong (and one is now deceased, the other might have a chance, even the one who died might have a chance but it seems slim though I will not dwell on that since I just do not know yet,) but even if they didn't it wouldn't matter, all that matters is your own choices in life. You know your circumstances and what you believe in your heart, you know how much guilt you actually bear and that it doesn't really matter what your ancestors did all that much except to the extent you can do something about the consequences and maybe even help them themselves if they're alive.


Perhaps the biggest issue to me: Why do Catholics have what seems like so many self-focused practices? C. S. Lewis said "It is better to forget about yourself altogether." How can I forget about myself altogether if I have to self-flagellate (possibly literally,) confess sins, and think about "I I I me me me" all the time as official dogma? From personal experience I can view the self as nothing but an obstacle, and its worship in an Oprah-like sense is perhaps the main thing that leads one astray. However, C. S. Lewis is not actual scripture, so here are some prominent examples of Scripture telling us not to think about ourselves really at all:

I am crucified with Christ: nevertheless I live; yet not I, but Christ liveth in me: and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by the faith of the Son of God, who loved me, and gave himself for me. Galatians 2:20

For you died, and your life is hidden with Christ in God. Colossians 3:3

And others exulting us to forget ourselves entirely in God:

And whoever exalts himself will be humbled, and he who humbles himself will be exalted. Matthew 23:12

This point I almost hate to bring up, because it is the kind of thing that New Ager Antichrist losers pervert into "you are God, do whatever you want" when it's taken out of context. However, the proper context is to die to the world and yourself and live for God only which means your life is God's, not that you are usurping God in any way. Which I think I have made clear enough that that is what the Bible seems to be saying to me and that that is a very different doctrine, I am not just out here saying "I am God" or "I am Truth" or what have you without context in front of people who are corrupted by the Oprah Dragon and led astray. The Devil can pervert literally anything sadly, which is the whole reason for this thread to begin with.


Do you have a refutation of what scholars would, perhaps erroneously, refer to as the "Gnostic" view in light of these types of passages:

In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. John 1:1

Jesus said unto them, If God were your Father, ye would love me: for I proceeded forth and came from God; neither came I of myself, but he sent me. John 8:42

"Gnostic"Interpretation: Jesus was there with God in the beginning and so was everyone else, most people just forgot it because they were led astray by Satan, so Jesus came to remind people. This still does not imply a trinity of divine persons (which I think just sounds like another name for gods.)

Thank you for your consideration!