I'm going to reveal to you who the real gammas are of this forum

[roger557]

You might remember them. None of them are active, so I don't care. Take note most of them didn't self-type gamma.

One of each:

SEE-Se: Gilly
SEE-Fi: Niffer


LIE-Te: ?
LIE-Ni: I guess Me. There have been some others but they always lay low.

ESI-Fi: Discojoe
ESI-Se: Bertrand

ILI-Ni: Hitta
ILI-Te: Don't remember his nick. His avatar was him in an undershirt. Also probably: crazedrat


I don't support for anyone else that claims to be a gamma to be typed correctly. Hopefully, by diggin' into their posting history, you can ascertain what each of those types truly is in behavior.

[roger557]

Hahahahaha Niffer and I get along really well. I wonder what it means about my ITR with her. Lol. She's definitely Se base.

The original, or the "return"? Because they didn't seem like the same person to me...

[ouronis]

You might remember them. None of them are active, so I don't care. Take note most of them didn't self-type gamma.

One of each:

SEE-Se: Gilly
SEE-Fi: Niffer


LIE-Te: ?
LIE-Ni: I guess Me. There have been some others but they always lay low.

ESI-Fi: Discojoe
ESI-Se: Bertrand

ILI-Ni: Hitta
ILI-Te: Don't remember his nick. His avatar was him in an undershirt.


I don't support for anyone else that claims to be a gamma to be typed correctly. Hopefully, by diggin' into their posting history, you can ascertain what each of those types truly is in behavior.

That's it?

[The Joker The Fool]

How are you so sure that no one else is Gamma on the forum who currently posts here? There was an Italian guy here awhile ago who seemed like a pretty standard ESI.

[roger557]

That's it?

I remember another SEE-Fi guy, one that looked like kevin spacey. His avatar was one dude with cards on his hands. And yeah, that I am sure are those types (nothing seems off), yes, that's it. That's how warped the gamma-mistype phenomenon has been ongoing on this forum.

[roger557]

How are you so sure that no one else is Gamma on the forum who currently posts here? There was an Italian guy here awhile ago who seemed like a pretty standard ESI.

I do not get intertypes triggered with anyone. With the ones on my list, with whom I interacted directly (except the ILI-Te guy), I did.

[roger557]

To be fair, of current users, Tarnished and One might be ILI-Te's.

[Adam Strange]

You might remember them. None of them are active, so I don't care. Take note most of them didn't self-type gamma.

One of each:

SEE-Se: Gilly
SEE-Fi: Niffer


LIE-Te: ?
LIE-Ni: I guess Me. There have been some others but they always lay low.

ESI-Fi: Discojoe
ESI-Se: Bertrand

ILI-Ni: Hitta
ILI-Te: Don't remember his nick. His avatar was him in an undershirt.


I don't support for anyone else that claims to be a gamma to be typed correctly. Hopefully, by diggin' into their posting history, you can ascertain what each of those types truly is in behavior.

It’s so hard to meet some people’s expectations.

I find myself constantly failing to measure up.

SMH.

[roger557]

It’s so hard to meet some people’s expectations.

I find myself constantly failing to measure up.

SMH.

I have nothing against you, but I honestly don't think you're a LIE. First of all, LIE's (and especially LIE-Te's) are men of few words, and you are prone to writing long texts especially talking about past experience (Si). You might be ILE or LSI, since you have good common sense logic, if you are LSI you have an unusual amount of Ne. You're also probably an E5. There is a guy in my town that I bump into sometimes that really really looks like you in one of your younger photos you have posted. I used to think this guy was LIE, due to his ressemblance to you, but after observing him more I realized he is not LIE.

------------------
Take note that my aim not to retype anybody who appears here and I disagree with their selftyping. Merely, I want to cast some doubt on what has become "accepted" that each gamma type is, due to the faulty gamma descriptions written by non-gamma types, and the maybe mistyped supposed exponents of each type that have populated this forum. In case anyone doesn't know, there was a phenomenon that was coined here in this forum of "fake gammas", where supposedly (and I agree) there were a bunch of mistyped people around who weren't really gammas. For some reason, this seems to happen with gammas a lot, more than with other quadras. And the real gammas either don't want to self-type, probably in part due to this phenomenon. So we have a pinch, added to the fact that gammas IRL are less numerous than other types, that there are no gammas.

If anyone wants to learn to identify gammas correctly via VI, feel free to take a look at the gallery in my signature.

[Adam Strange]

I have nothing against you, but I honestly don't think you're a LIE. First of all, LIE's (and especially LIE-Te's) are men of few words, and you are prone to writing long texts especially talking about past experience (Si). You might be ILE or LSI, since you have good common sense logic, if you are LSI you have an unusual amount of Ne. You're also probably an E5. There is a guy in my town that I bump into sometimes that really really looks like you in one of your younger photos you have posted. I used to think this guy was LIE, due to his ressemblance to you, but after observing him more I realized he is not LIE.

------------------
Take note that my aim not to retype anybody who appears here and I disagree with their selftyping. Merely, I want to cast some doubt on what has become "accepted" that each gamma type is, due to the faulty gamma descriptions written by non-gamma types, and the maybe mistyped supposed exponents of each type that have populated this forum. In case anyone doesn't know, there was a phenomenon that was coined here in this forum of "fake gammas", where supposedly (and I agree) there were a bunch of mistyped people around who weren't really gammas. For some reason, this seems to happen with gammas a lot, more than with other quadras. And the real gammas either don't want to self-type, probably in part due to this phenomenon. So we have a pinch, added to the fact that gammas IRL are less numerous than other types, that there are no gammas.

If anyone wants to learn to identify gammas correctly via VI, feel free to take a look at the gallery in my signature.

No problem, @roger557. We’re all doing the best we can with the information available.

FWIW, I think I write a lot on this forum because I don’t share anything about myself with anyone in real life, and so I use this place as a “Dear Diary” kind of thing. I can ramble on here and there are some very smart people who will sometimes comment and I get to learn things. That’s my motivation.

To be frank, I’m both extremely literate and extremely intelligent, so I’m able to put sentences together. I also have an explorer’s impulse to go to new places and meet new people. That’s my method.

When I was younger, I spoke almost not at all. Now, I talk to anyone and am understood by almost no one. That’s my curse.

[VewyScawwyNawcissist]

I have nothing against you, but I honestly don't think you're a LIE. First of all, LIE's (and especially LIE-Te's) are men of few words, .

thats often bc they dont know how to interact socially which then later they translate into their minds that socializing is useless, but not always and maybe not even often. the LIEs i knew always got into conflict
1 is a nazi and got into fights, had to be respectful to some people in power who tend to be assholes on the web and irl to advance himself
2 was too hyper/annoying/in ur face then got drank and someone slapped her, daddy issues that could make her seek attention more perhaps
3 wanted to hang out with me and EIE i refused bc i was afraid of harming her or her harming me but she took it personally and told everyone in the class how selfish i was or smth. she didnt come to school much at some point but only now its hittin me she may have messed up her relations with other people
4 i drew a butt she scratched it perhaps bc it was objectifying - i dont see a girlboss getting around to being liked by a ton of people

LIEs do seem to like to talk extensively if the situation is open to that.

[roger557]

No problem, @roger557. We’re all doing the best we can with the information available.

FWIW, I think I write a lot on this forum because I don’t share anything about myself with anyone in real life, and so I use this place as a “Dear Diary” kind of thing. I can ramble on here and there are some very smart people who will sometimes comment and I get to learn things. That’s my motivation.

To be frank, I’m both extremely literate and extremely intelligent, so I’m able to put sentences together. I also have an explorer’s impulse to go to new places and meet new people. That’s my method.

When I was younger, I spoke almost not at all. Now, I talk to anyone and am understood by almost no one. That’s my curse.

It's all right. You can be a condescending and conceited LSI-Ti with an abnormally good -Ne PoLR

If I'm not mistaken, I am not the first to mention that you are probably not LIE. At least, I recall Bertrand pointing it out as well.

Forgot to mention, that your romantic behavior fits better the aggressor beta style. Gammas NT's are not as forward and seeking like you seem (for reference, anyone can check with the examples I've given).

[roger557]

Before someone pulls the "that's because you don't like them" card, I wanted to point out that I don't particularly like other people I've typed gamma.

[VewyScawwyNawcissist]

Before someone pulls the "that's because you don't like them" card, I wanted to point out that I don't particularly like other people I've typed gamma.

It is written that LIEs are more aggressive as a victim and the roles may appear as if switched

[Not A Communist Shill]

The OP seems about 20 years out of date.

[Averroes]

I’m SEI or Fi-EII

[EUDAEMONIUM]

LIEs are known to be particularly talkative, this lines up well with my experience as well.

[Adam Strange]

It's all right. You can be a condescending and conceited LSI-Ti with an abnormally good -Ne PoLR

If I'm not mistaken, I am not the first to mention that you are probably not LIE. At least, I recall Bertrand pointing it out as well.

Forgot to mention, that your romantic behavior fits better the aggressor beta style. Gammas NT's are not as forward and seeking like you seem (for reference, anyone can check with the examples I've given).

Bertrand was a shithead. If you are taking his opinions for fact, you might be deceiving yourself.

[lookin4waifu]

The original, or the "return"? Because they didn't seem like the same person to me...

I thought they seemed to have similar thought patterns as I do, and I self-type as ILI. It could just be duality though.

[EUDAEMONIUM]

There are no gammas, only betas, LSI and EIE specifically. The deeper you dig, you realize that LSI and EIE are merly inert and contact subtypes of IEI, a type that everyone actually is.

[crazymaisy]

I blocked Bertrand long ago, and still to this day blocked.

[Adam Strange]

I blocked Bertrand long ago, and still to this day blocked.

Smart girl.

[Alomoes]

Curious, you can't tolerate simple discourse?

[Adam Strange]

Curious, you can't tolerate simple discourse?

I have no tolerance for narcissists. I lived with one for eighteen years. That was enough for a lifetime.

[Ibreen]

There are no gammas, only betas, LSI and EIE specifically. The deeper you dig, you realize that LSI and EIE are merly inert and contact subtypes of IEI, a type that everyone actually is.

I’m going to have to start type gating soon

[Tallmo]

I have nothing against you, but I honestly don't think you're a LIE. First of all, LIE's (and especially LIE-Te's) are men of few words, and you are prone to writing long texts especially talking about past experience (Si). You might be ILE or LSI, since you have good common sense logic, if you are LSI you have an unusual amount of Ne. You're also probably an E5. There is a guy in my town that I bump into sometimes that really really looks like you in one of your younger photos you have posted. I used to think this guy was LIE, due to his ressemblance to you, but after observing him more I realized he is not LIE.

If anyone wants to learn to identify gammas correctly via VI, feel free to take a look at the gallery in my signature.

Sorry for off topic, but please don't spread false information. Si is not about past experiences. I don't know were this even comes from.

[myresearch]

Sorry for off topic, but please don't spread false information. Si is not about past experiences. I don't know were this even comes from.

MBTI.

[EUDAEMONIUM]

Well, actually, I want to kind of make an argument for how Si could relate to past experiences, but it requires a dissected view of what experience actually is.

Se is the immediate sensory data that exists around the subject and Si is the interpretation of this sensory data via the subject. Previous (historical) data needs to be established for there to be a self in the first place, because, this isn't observing direct concrete Se details but the subject's interpretation of the detail.

Se sees a lamp, Si sees their idea of a lamp which involves an amalgamation of all the lamps they have seen previously. So there is actually some sort of tie to the past that Si needs to have to operate.

[myresearch]

Well, actually, I want to kind of make an argument for how Si could relate to past experiences, but it requires a dissected view of what experience actually is.

Se is the immediate sensory data that exists around the subject and Si is the interpretation of this sensory data via the subject. Previous (historical) data needs to be established for there to be a self in the first place, because, this isn't observing direct concrete Se details but the subject's interpretation of the detail.

Se sees a lamp, Si sees their idea of a lamp which involves an amalgamation of all the lamps they have seen previously. So there is actually some sort of tie to the past that Si needs to have to operate.

Even in machine learning if you want to teach the machine the lamp, you show them lots of lamps so they can understand what a lamb is. So Se/Ne/Ni/Si or any judgement function also have to relay on that. Human, machine everyone and everything process and recognize things this way.

Se doesnt see a lamp at the first time in their life and recognize that is a lamp without knowing previous lamps.

[EUDAEMONIUM]

Even in machine learning if you want to teach the machine the lamp, you show them lots of lamps so they can understand what a lamb is. So Se/Ne/Ni/Si or any judgement function also have to relay on that. Human, machine everyone and everything process and recognize things this way.

Se doesnt see a lamp at the first time in their life and recognize that is a lamp without knowing previous lamps.

True, what Se sees is a series of lines and contours, objects in 3d space, etc. Si would be the internalization of that. So Se being a static snapshot, Si being the dynamic exchanges between these snapshots. So I'm not quite sure how the other functions would fit, but yes I guess they would all benefit from more information gathered.

I'm saying Si is about making associations from the individuals direct physical experience, which will include their personal history.

[Not A Communist Shill]

“What strikes me is the fact that in our society, art has become something which is related only to objects and not to individuals, or to life. That art is something which is specialized or which is done by experts who are artists. But couldn't everyone's life become a work of art? Why should the lamp or the house be an art object, but not our life?”
― Michel Foucault

[EUDAEMONIUM]

I'm suspicious Roger557 is a secret EIE (we have many here who have yet to be officially verified) because he really knows how to get a response from people.

[myresearch]

I think @roger557 is ILI or EIE. Cant see LIE for him.

[Not A Communist Shill]

“Love is eternal -- the aspect may change, but not the essence. There is the same difference in a person before and after he is in love as there is in an unlighted lamp and one that is burning. The lamp was there and was a good lamp, but now it is shedding light too, and that is its real function. And love makes one calmer about many things, and that way, one is more fit for one's work.”
― Vincent van Gogh

[Tallmo]

Se sees a lamp, Si sees their idea of a lamp which involves an amalgamation of all the lamps they have seen previously. So there is actually some sort of tie to the past that Si needs to have to operate.

This is obviously the old MBTI stuff, and it is completely wrong. Don't read mbti, it's not correct. Why do people keep doing this?

Si doesn't really "see a lamp" at all. It's not conceptual like that. It's only sensing, but experienced from the inside. The physical world is distant and things are seen in a "primordial", "magical" light. Impressionistic or aesthetic if you want to use those words. Colors, materials, wood, the sky have a genuine feel about them. And it is not personal either. The introversion part of Si means that the unconscious has an impact on the sense perception, that's were the magical, primordial feel comes from.

Some paintings by Monet (1, 2) can be used to illustrate Si. They seem to downplay the actual objects and instead the vibrant colors and impression is emphasized. It's like the sense perception has been cut off from the object, and is living it's own, magical life.

I'm not saying Monet is necessarily an Si type. But he can be used to illustrate it.

[EUDAEMONIUM]

This is obviously the old MBTI stuff, and it is completely wrong. Don't read mbti, it's not correct. Why do people keep doing this?

Si doesn't really "see a lamp" at all. It's not conceptual like that. It's only sensing, but experienced from the inside. The physical world is distant and things are seen in a "primordial", "magical" light. Impressionistic or aesthetic if you want to use those words. Colors, materials, wood, the sky have a genuine feel about them. And it is not personal either. The introversion part of Si means that the unconscious has an impact on the sense perception, that's were the magical, primordial feel comes from.

Some paintings by Monet (1, 2) can be used to illustrate Si. They seem to downplay the actual objects and instead the vibrant colors and impression is emphasized. It's like the sense perception has been cut off from the object, and is living it's own, magical life.

I'm not saying Monet is necessarily an Si type. But he can be used to illustrate it.

I was trying to say basically the same thing. I say amalgamation of known objects or things, this would create an impression of the object or thing. I don't agree that it is MBTI or that Si is not personal.

Ni is the abstraction of process, Si is based on individual lived experience. Si could feel "primordial" in that past experiences not fully remembered come back after triggered by some unknown sensory stimulus. For example in Proust's "Remembrance of Things Past" the character bites into a madeleine and it triggers a string of past experiences starting all the way back to an event in their childhood.

[Tallmo]

I was trying to say basically the same thing. I say amalgamation of known objects or things, this would create an impression of the object or thing. I don't agree that it is MBTI or that Si is not personal.

Ni is the abstraction of process, Si is based on individual lived experience. Si could feel "primordial" in that past experiences not fully remembered come back after triggered by some unknown sensory stimulus. For example in Proust's "Remembrance of Things Past" the character bites into a madeleine and it triggers a string of past experiences starting all the way back to an event in their childhood.

This is clearly MBTI and not Socionics/Jung. Sorry but you are mixing up things here.

Si is not based on lived experience in the way you are saying. The sensing is of course lived, we sense things here and now. But what is being sensed is something un-personal, primordial. "Primordial" does not mean that it has been experienced before by the individual, but that it is inherited in the psyche itself. It comes from the collective unconscious. That's the opposite of personal.

Both Se and Si could trigger personal memories of past experiences, such as in the example you are referring to. But that's natural because if you focus on sensation you might have memories of it. But that's not the essence of Si at all.

Both Ni and Si are primordial and non of them are personal. Ni is about symbolism or primordial processes in the unconsious. And Si is a sensation with a primordial quality that comes from the psyche itself, reflecting the environment.

In the same way the inner sensations of comfort, nervous phenomena etc. are not "personal", but belong to the primordial phenomena.

The reason we are even debating this is that MBTI misunderstood what Jung meant by Si from the beginning. This thing about "comparing with past experiences" etc. has been going on for a long time.

[Lycantrope]

MBTI.

mbti teenage horoscope since I don't remember Isabel Myers saying anything about that either.

[WVBRY]

I'm going to reveal to you who the real gammas are of this forum

Ok ok.

[Lycantrope]

"Primordial" does not mean that it has been experienced before by the individual, but that it is inherited in the psyche itself. It comes from the collective unconscious. That's the opposite of personal.

Besides, according to Jung, the type who have slight access to these images once in a while is the Introverted Intuitive types (ILI, IEI). Not Introverted Sensors.