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Thread: EIIs, creativity and anxiety

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    Mika's Avatar
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    Default EIIs, creativity and anxiety

    So I'm just gonna pour my heart out here for a moment, excuse me.

    Some time ago I read a description of the EII personality type that said we aren't really creative people. I don't usually mind what others say about me but somehow that phrase really got stuck in my head, I guess it's because I just think socionics is an accurate and interesting theory overall. Anyway, lately it has become awfully difficult for me to sit down and work on my creative projects and it's really, really frustrating.

    Every time I even think about sitting down to paint/write/play piano/whatever I get so anxious I basically freeze. It's like I can't justify myself doing anything artistic or even putting my thoughts on a paper. I keep thinking "Oh, painting and music are Se things. I shouldn't do them, I'm not good at them, they don't come naturally to me. I'm just trying to be something I'm not, how fake. And what if I make art and express myself, wouldn't that be uncharacteristic of me? Am I not the quiet, modest and reserved type? EIIs are quiet, modest and reserved. What if making art makes me frivolous? I don't want to be frivolous. What if I one day fall in love with an LSE and he finds out about my hobbies and finds them off-putting?"

    Now mind you, I've been a fairly confident person all my life, and I'm somewhat aware that my thoughts are probably a little irrational here. But still, as of now they do feel very real and, well, insuperable. I don't know many people IRL who know about socionics so I thought I should try asking here. Does anybody have any advice on how to go about this/has anyone struggled with something similar?

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    What's the purpose of SEI? Tallmo's Avatar
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    Ive met several creative eii. Dont worry. You are overthinking this. The descriptions dont describe you as a whole person, and they can be wrong.
    The decisive thing is not the reality of the object, but the reality of the subjective factor, i.e. the primordial images, which in their totality represent a psychic mirror-world. It is a mirror, however, with the peculiar capacity of representing the present contents of consciousness not in their known and customary form but in a certain sense sub specie aeternitatis, somewhat as a million-year old consciousness might see them.

    (Jung on Si)

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    The Morning Star EUDAEMONIUM's Avatar
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    Frivolous things aren't meaningless, they are often the things that give life more importance. Do we need art? We could survive without it, but we couldn't live without it.

    Your hobbies aren't offputting, it would be odd for someone to find them that way.

    Also one more thing, you shouldn't model your behavior after your type, your type should explain your behavior. If you like doing "Se" things or anything else that supposedly contradicts your type be yourself and let socionics try to explain it.
    The Barnum or Forer effect is the tendency for people to judge that general, universally valid statements about personality are actually specific descriptions of their own personalities. A "universally valid" statement is one that is true of everyone—or, more likely, nearly everyone. It is not known why people tend to make such misjudgments, but the effect has been experimentally reproduced.

    The psychologist Paul Meehl named this fallacy "the P.T. Barnum effect" because Barnum built his circus and dime museum on the principle of having something for everyone. It is also called "the Forer effect" after its discoverer, the psychologist Bertram R. Forer, who modestly dubbed it "the fallacy of personal validation".

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    Humanist Beautiful sky's Avatar
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    Arts are not type related. If you want to paint imagine a 3 year old and the giddiness they feel about sticking their fingers in paint. Adults lose that connection with discovering their fingers and sensations like a child does. Watch some kids finger paint videos and get reinspired.

    Also if you drink coffee may not be a bad time to cut back because you said you’re having anxiety.

    And lastly people are not just Socionics letter the are also a product of culture and environment so you are an EII who likes the arts. Perfect I know many who do!!! Including myself

    As for LSE my husband built me my own painting studio lol
    -
    Dual type (as per tcaudilllg)
    Enneagram 5 (wings either 4 or 6)?


    I'm constantly looking to align the real with the ideal.I've been more oriented toward being overly idealistic by expecting the real to match the ideal. My thinking side is dominent. The result is that sometimes I can be overly impersonal or self-centered in my approach, not being understanding of others in the process and simply thinking "you should do this" or "everyone should follor this rule"..."regardless of how they feel or where they're coming from"which just isn't a good attitude to have. It is a way, though, to give oneself an artificial sense of self-justification. LSE

    Best description of functions:
    http://socionicsstudy.blogspot.com/2...functions.html

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    I’m sorry you’re going through this right now.. I think for many types (esp. a lot of Betas and Deltas), there can often be an uphill battle against the stereotypes that the theory and/or community may hold about you. Part of this is likely because the theory isn’t always consistent (e.g. some theorists say EIIs don’t smile and are severe, whereas others emphasize their friendliness); the other part seems to be a tendency for communities to extrapolate a few individuals’ characteristics onto entire types.


    Anyways though, EIIs can definitely be creative. Exceptionally creative musicians that are commonly typed EII include Elliott Smith and Nick Drake—famous for the way in which they infused profound emotion into their music, as well as their unconventional and groundbreaking approaches to guitar and songwriting. Likely EII directors include Yasujirō Ozu, Abbas Kiarostami, and Hirokazu Kore-eda. Not only are these directors’ works markedly creative, but the former two are some of the most highly praised directors of all time; the latter is one of the most acclaimed working in the world today. Mr. Rogers—a man much more recognized for being kind than creative—even came up with the idea for his TV show, and wrote all of the lyrics and melodies for the show’s songs. So one could say that his creativity was the force that allowed him to impact people’s lives with his kindness; many people can be kind, but few people can tailor that kindness in such a meaningful and wide-reaching way.

    I hope this can be a bit encouraging.. I’ve found the stereotype to be quite baseless in my experience, especially as another EII who writes music, lyrics, poetry, etc. Creativity isn’t necessarily bound by information elements, and even if it were, EIIs have 4D Ni and 3D Ne, so you'd be all good :)

    Lastly, regarding LSE compatibility.. there are numerous examples of LSE singers/actors, as well as EII actors who have married LSEs, so I don’t think your creative pursuits would be unappealing to the type. Even if it were to some, it might be ideal to try to find your real-life dual (i.e. someone who is compatible prior to application of theory as well), rather than one who is perhaps more productivity-focused but less likely to provide relational comfort. A dual relation in which you’re not free to be yourself seems like it would be quite stifling, and I think having the space to be yourself is importantespecially in a dual relationship, which should theoretically provide deep understanding.
    Last edited by aciaradh; 04-26-2022 at 07:21 PM.

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    PinKDiGiT18's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mika View Post
    So I'm just gonna pour my heart out here for a moment, excuse me.

    Some time ago I read a description of the EII personality type that said we aren't really creative people. I don't usually mind what others say about me but somehow that phrase really got stuck in my head, I guess it's because I just think socionics is an accurate and interesting theory overall. Anyway, lately it has become awfully difficult for me to sit down and work on my creative projects and it's really, really frustrating.

    Every time I even think about sitting down to paint/write/play piano/whatever I get so anxious I basically freeze. It's like I can't justify myself doing anything artistic or even putting my thoughts on a paper. I keep thinking "Oh, painting and music are Se things. I shouldn't do them, I'm not good at them, they don't come naturally to me. I'm just trying to be something I'm not, how fake. And what if I make art and express myself, wouldn't that be uncharacteristic of me? Am I not the quiet, modest and reserved type? EIIs are quiet, modest and reserved. What if making art makes me frivolous? I don't want to be frivolous.
    I remember having almost the exact same thought process in my earlier socionics days. And I will say the same thing to you that I wish I could say to myself back then...

    Respectfully...

    NO, NO, NO, NO, NO!

    Please don't let your mind play tricks on you. We EIIs can fall into a rabbit hole with our Ne creative, a single sentence causing us to spiral into thinking of every situation where we could be wrong or inauthentic about our interests.

    I have always been called creative and I own it because for me, creativity is how I express my Fi. I feel most at one with myself when I am producing novel, beautiful work, when my mind is running wild with new writings or music. I feel as though I am demonstrating exactly who I am. For me, that is indispensable; and if you can relate to that sentiment, there is a strong probability that creativity is a language for you as well. We do have a sensory mobilizing function, after all.

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    EIIs can definitely be creative. I've noticed quite a few writers who are EIIs, often developing elaborate characters and expanding upon every possibility they could hold, often with a plot tied up by a moral theme.

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    You make the mistake of letting your personality type define you completely. You can have the same type with someone and still be different people. That says something, don't you think? Also, forgive me for this assumption, but it seemed to me you were trying to replace concepts. Your condition wasn't favorable for creativity at a certain moment, and you explained it to yourself by the incompatibility of your hobbies with your type. It's easy to give up on creativity if one day you don't feel inspired to continue your work. You have to experience it and try something new. I escape the blurred consciousness among like-minded people I've found after watching Kava Culture reviews, or during long walks. Or I try something that I don't do well, and then I think I shouldn't give up writing because I'm very good at it.
    Last edited by carrgordon; 01-18-2023 at 12:14 PM.

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    Humanist Beautiful sky's Avatar
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    You sound like you are dealing with anxiety.
    Art is just doing even just putting a canvas in front of you is art.
    But that you said putting paint on a canvas brings you anxiety means you are probably dealing with anxiety not artist’s block.
    Maybe you are self sabotaging by thinking of doing something before you do it. Why don’t you stop thinking because you are letting your internal emotional world suck you down a black hole.



    Take care and let me know how I can help @Mika
    -
    Dual type (as per tcaudilllg)
    Enneagram 5 (wings either 4 or 6)?


    I'm constantly looking to align the real with the ideal.I've been more oriented toward being overly idealistic by expecting the real to match the ideal. My thinking side is dominent. The result is that sometimes I can be overly impersonal or self-centered in my approach, not being understanding of others in the process and simply thinking "you should do this" or "everyone should follor this rule"..."regardless of how they feel or where they're coming from"which just isn't a good attitude to have. It is a way, though, to give oneself an artificial sense of self-justification. LSE

    Best description of functions:
    http://socionicsstudy.blogspot.com/2...functions.html

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    pasleine's Avatar
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    well, i am not sure what they meant by that because i don't see how that is at all.
    art is a way of expressing your unconscience, it can be an intensely cathartic experience that can really help some people with the things they feel.
    we are quiet modest and reserved, but that is external perception of us. an introvert's mind is very busy and not quiet at all.
    i think i understand the feeling though because i get embarrassed too, it feels...overly self-indulgent and i question my competency too (when it comes to art things).
    all in all though, it's something to indulge in maybe every once in a while and then go back into comfortable reality where you are not so pained all the time imo

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    Eii has creative Ne but Eii is not creative, how?

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