Subtypes and Demonstrative function

[Karbonkel]

When it comes to the Meged and Ovcharov subtypes, there is a strange pattern I've noticed. While M&O claim¹ that the demonstrative function is "better" in the contact subtype than in the inert subtype, the way I've seen it play out in real life is quite the other way around. Let me give you some examples that are my personal experiences with the types.

The LSE-Te I've encountered have always been much more militant compared to the LSE-Si in my experience. Te sub can be aggressive and pushy in speech especially, while this quality is absent in Si sub. The latter has a more "caring dad" vibe (when it comes down to the males atleast).

• Example of an LSE-Te: Shapiro RIPS Biden's Jan. 6th Speech - YouTube
• Example of an LSE-Si: Idris Elba Teaches You British Slang | Vanity Fair - YouTube

The ILE-Ne I've seen tend to "spit facts" alot more than ILE-Ti. Ti sub are often a lot more strict and logical in the way an LSI is, strongly attachted to and living by their own point of viev, while Ne sub isn't like this at all.

• Example of an ILE-Ne: How I Got A Dream Trackmania World Record - YouTube
• Example of an ILE-Ti: Bill Gates: The 2021 60 Minutes interview - YouTube

EIE-Fe are much more scattered and goofy than EIE-Ni, the latter ones are edgier.

• Example of an EIE-Fe: Talking about some stuff Ive never talked about.. - YouTube
• Example of an EIE-Ni: Scarlett Johansson Was Starstruck When She Met Judge Judy | The Tonight Show Starring Jimmy Fallon - YouTube

EII-Fi often appears a lot wiser and far-sighted than EII-Ne, who can be rather goofy.

• EII-Fi example: How to Transmit Presence without Speaking | Eckhart Tolle Teachings - YouTube
• EII-Ne example: The Dalai Lama Reveals His Fun Side | CONAN on TBS - YouTube (yes extreme example but still)

SLI-Si appears more levelheaded and down to earth than SLI-Te in my experience.

• SLI-Si example: How Model Suki Waterhouse Gets Runway Ready | Diary of a Model | Vogue - YouTube
• SLI-Te example: Sarah Paulson Reacts to Linda Tripp’s Daughter’s Review of Impeachment: American Crime Story - YouTube

Anyways you get the point by now, the demonstrative function is more visible in the inert subtype. If it's actually stronger than in the creative subtype? I'm not sure about that but I think not. Does anyone has similar experiences with the types and can you explain why this is difference in manifestation is so prevalent? (Please no "hurr durr contact subtypes have to protect the extra sensitive polr of the contact dual so they flex the demonstrative less", people are not born to pair solely with psychological comfort in mind=aka duals.)


1. https://wikisocion.github.io/content..._subtypes.html

[roger557]

Contact subtype sort of "embodies" the demonstrative, but inert subtype values it more.

[Stray Cat]

When it comes to the Meged and Ovcharov subtypes, there is a strange pattern I've noticed. While M&O claim¹ that the demonstrative function is "better" in the contact subtype than in the inert subtype, the way I've seen it play out in real life is quite the other way around. Let me give you some examples that are my personal experiences with the types.

The LSE-Te I've encountered have always been much more militant compared to the LSE-Si in my experience. Te sub can be aggressive and pushy in speech especially, while this quality is absent in Si sub. The latter has a more "caring dad" vibe (when it comes down to the males atleast).

• Example of an LSE-Te: Shapiro RIPS Biden's Jan. 6th Speech - YouTube
• Example of an LSE-Si: Idris Elba Teaches You British Slang | Vanity Fair - YouTube

The ILE-Ne I've seen tend to "spit facts" alot more than ILE-Ti. Ti sub are often a lot more strict and logical in the way an LSI is, strongly attachted to and living by their own point of viev, while Ne sub isn't like this at all.

• Example of an ILE-Ne: How I Got A Dream Trackmania World Record - YouTube
• Example of an ILE-Ti: Bill Gates: The 2021 60 Minutes interview - YouTube

EIE-Fe are much more scattered and goofy than EIE-Ni, the latter ones are edgier.

• Example of an EIE-Fe: Talking about some stuff Ive never talked about.. - YouTube
• Example of an EIE-Ni: Scarlett Johansson Was Starstruck When She Met Judge Judy | The Tonight Show Starring Jimmy Fallon - YouTube

EII-Fi often appears a lot wiser and far-sighted than EII-Ne, who can be rather goofy.

• EII-Fi example: How to Transmit Presence without Speaking | Eckhart Tolle Teachings - YouTube
• EII-Ne example: The Dalai Lama Reveals His Fun Side | CONAN on TBS - YouTube (yes extreme example but still)

SLI-Si appears more levelheaded and down to earth than SLI-Te in my experience.

• SLI-Si example: How Model Suki Waterhouse Gets Runway Ready | Diary of a Model | Vogue - YouTube
• SLI-Te example: Sarah Paulson Reacts to Linda Tripp’s Daughter’s Review of Impeachment: American Crime Story - YouTube

Anyways you get the point by now, the demonstrative function is more visible in the inert subtype. If it's actually stronger than in the creative subtype? I'm not sure about that but I think not. Does anyone has similar experiences with the types and can you explain why this is difference in manifestation is so prevalent? (Please no "hurr durr contact subtypes have to protect the extra sensitive polr of the contact dual so they flex the demonstrative less", people are not born to pair solely with psychological comfort in mind=aka duals.)


1. https://wikisocion.github.io/content..._subtypes.html

When you refer to a person as an ethical subtype, the demo is included in the phraseology, meaning their overall ethical strengths are, organically, of an excellent variety.

The IEE-Fi will exude a strong Fe demo but will clearly exhibit the Fi with a greater preference. The IEE-Ne, due to their comfort in extraversion, will transition into
their extraverted functions rather fluidly and since a person's lead function has the same E/I orientation as their demo, it probably makes sense that their demo function seems stronger than it might actually be

[Disturbed]

In my experience, observations, it's based on what they value more, so I agree with Karbonkel. ILE-Ti tend to not like Te, they tend to not like giving and receiving factual information or thinking much about efficiency compared to ILE-Ti; just as compared to ESI-Fi, ESI-Se tend to be better with Fe if that means seeing other peoples' moods. However, ILE-Ti has better ignoring function than ILE-Ne whether it means fantasizing or knowing when things occurred. Contact subtypes tend to have better ignoring functions.

I don't know my type, but if it's LSI-Ti, then it makes sense that I have bad Te because I really do have bad Te... I'm not great with determining whether and how well myself, anyone or anything else will work, efficiency, or with remember factual information. I tend to give Si matters a lot of attention, but I'm not great with those. If I'm an LSI-Ti, then Si is more valued than in the other subtype; I base my life around it really whether it means aesthetics or comfort or bodily sensations, Si matters strongly and I mean STRONGLY affect my mood and behavior. However, I'm not good at determining what goes on in space around me.

[Toro]

8. The demonstrative function is another strong function that is directed at not allowing the situation to develop in a negative way for oneself and for one's partner. In contrast to the limiting function, the demonstrative function does not warn one's partner about potential consequences, but without extra words the person takes measures for preventing negative development of a conversation or a situation. Despite being a strong function, any active discussion of this aspect is rejected by the person with the wish to change the course towards the strong valued aspects of their type. Since the aspect of demonstrative function corresponds to the aspect of the painful function of dual types, in this manner duals stop the influx of unwanted information and shield each other's painful functions. Any actions against oneself or close people are met by rebuffs from demonstrative function. The demonstrative function is more strongly expressed in people of creative function subtypes.

https://www.wikisocion.net/en/index....del_A#Id_block

[Stray Cat]

In my experience, observations, it's based on what they value more, so I agree with Karbonkel. ILE-Ti tend to not like Te, they tend to not like giving and receiving factual information or thinking much about efficiency compared to ILE-Ti; just as compared to ESI-Fi, ESI-Se tend to be better with Fe if that means seeing other peoples' moods. However, ILE-Ti has better ignoring function than ILE-Ne whether it means fantasizing or knowing when things occurred. Contact subtypes tend to have better ignoring functions.

I don't know my type, but if it's LSI-Ti, then it makes sense that I have bad Te because I really do have bad Te... I'm not great with determining whether and how well myself, anyone or anything else will work, efficiency, or with remember factual information. I tend to give Si matters a lot of attention, but I'm not great with those. If I'm an LSI-Ti, then Si is more valued than in the other subtype; I base my life around it really whether it means aesthetics or comfort or bodily sensations, Si matters strongly and I mean STRONGLY affect my mood and behavior. However, I'm not good at determining what goes on in space around me.

Contact subtypes have stronger demonstrative functions but they may, in fact. spend more time on the ignoring function. Whereas the demonstrative is easy to use, it is the ignoring function that provides the lead function with a more broader perspective.

The ignoring function is the part of the a pie one doesn't enjoy eating. For example, Ni-leads may dislike embracing their Ne function but would do well to ponder on their Ne-ignoring anyway in order to properly master the insights of Ni.

[Karbonkel]

that makes sense, for myself as well for example. I sometimes like to imitate peoples voices or predict what they will say so theres a bit more Fe and Ne in there, also with good likeminded friends i can take on the role of the entertainer and thus get into a Fe and Ne state instead of my usual pensive dreamy Fi & Ni state